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I wonder how many of those who cry to forgive others because of some religious ideology, will actually "forgive" someone their religion opposes? Do we see religious people "forgive" homosexuals?

Aya wrote:Over at Wikipedia, the news post says he was given the Anointment of the sick. My first thought was "Why doesn't that sound good?" and yeah, thats the other name for Last Rites.

Oh well, I respect any guy who survives an assassination attempt, then later forgives his would be killer. Plus, the Pope Mobile pwned.

"Anointing of the sick" is actually the correct term for it. "Last Rites" kind of caught on for the simple reason that it tended to be performed only before death, but it can actually be given at any time. It's just that most Catholics learned that it's given before death, so why ask the priest to come and give something that's only given before death if you don't plan on dying any time soon...

Enforcer Talen wrote:the pope and falwell, both hospitalized. it feels like christmas.

Actually last I saw he was not hospitalized. And again, .

mr friendly guy wrote:I wonder how many of those who cry to forgive others because of some religious ideology, will actually "forgive" someone their religion opposes? Do we see religious people "forgive" homosexuals?

Yes

Despite its stance on gay marriage the catholic church considers homosexual sex to be no worse than masturbation and is forgiven if you confess and do your penance.

As for the pope dying... According to SHark Bait, the new pope is probably going to be an ultra-conservative that makes JP2 look like a liberal pinko

I'm not going to say 'fuck him,' but it is about time he died. Whenever that will be.

Frankly I do think wishing death upon a sick elderly man kind of disgusting. He may not have been perfect, and may have been a bit overly conservative with the whole contraception and gay marriage thing, but he isnt evil.

Alyrium Denryle wrote:Frankly I do think wishing death upon a sick elderly man kind of disgusting. He may not have been perfect, and may have been a bit overly conservative with the whole contraception and gay marriage thing, but he isnt evil.

I don't say he's evil, but why should anyone really live that long? o.O

verilon wrote:

Alyrium Denryle wrote:Frankly I do think wishing death upon a sick elderly man kind of disgusting. He may not have been perfect, and may have been a bit overly conservative with the whole contraception and gay marriage thing, but he isnt evil.

I don't say he's evil, but why should anyone really live that long? o.O

I hope I do.. Shit Ernst Mahyr (sp) died just this last January and he was significantly older than JP2

I want to live forever, just cant stand fundies.

Enforcer Talen wrote:I want to live forever, just cant stand fundies.

he isnt that bad though. Falwell, ok I can understand, but JP2 has done wonders for the catholic church in his tenure. He isnt perfect, no man is. But he isnt malicious.

No, he's not malicious. He's just headless of the conciquences of his actions. He opposses contraception in the Third World which is being devestated by AIDS and has serious overpopulation problems. He's increased the power of conservative groups in the not particularily progressive to begin with Catholic Church and has kept power centralized in his hands. He doesn't need to be malicious to do damage.

Part of the Pope's problem (at least from a publicity with non-fundie Catholics) is that for the past 10 - 15 years (possibly longer, when was the asssaination attempt on him) has been in a slow but steady state of decline, both mentally and physically.

This makes it very easy for the people 'behind the throne' to control him.

Some of the stances he's taken I disagree with completely, but, that being said, he has tried to do good.

I'm not going to judge the man anymore. That's not my place.

Let him die peacefully. If there is a god/supreme power, let them to the judging when he passes to them. And if there isn't, well, his choice, his life, his waste, not mine

Imperial Overlord wrote:No, he's not malicious. He's just headless of the conciquences of his actions. He opposses contraception in the Third World which is being devestated by AIDS and has serious overpopulation problems. He's increased the power of conservative groups in the not particularily progressive to begin with Catholic Church and has kept power centralized in his hands. He doesn't need to be malicious to do damage.

As Solauren has said, for a long time he has basically been a puppet. ANd frankly, even if he DID support contraception oin the third world, it wouldnt do any fucking good because the people in the third world are focused on daily survival, and safe sex is pretty low on the list of priorities. Most cant read and many dont even make enough money in a yar to be able to afford a pack of trojans. They struggle to eat daily, and dont know what a retrovirus even is. ANd they are spread to far apart for sex education to be effective.

Africa is a shithole, and it will remain a shithole regardless of what the catholic church does.

ANd to be VERY callous... maybe AIDS will solve the overpopulation problem(I am only half serious please dont kill me)

Knowing what I know about ecology, populations if they expect to survive level out once they reach their carrying capacity. The population of Africa judging by their massive problems with starvation have probably reached that some time ago, and exceeded it. The population is due to crash from SOMETHING, and then hopefully level out.

Actually the Catholic church has been amazingly progressive as far as churches go in the last 100 years, at least here in the US. When was the last time you saw a church change their position on an issue without splitting(Evolution in the catholic church... of hell, vatican 2)

The catholic church.. hell they even encourage dissent within their church on issues that have not been infallibly defined(basically church policy) evidenced by active debate within the church I visit, and the balanced views they present in their literature(which I have read) on abortion rights.

So leave the catholic church alone. They actually have a church structure that works better than protestant denominations

The pope has been undermining Vatican II, not reinforcing. He gets no points for the Church being progressive when he has been dragging things backwards.

Yes, Africa is a shithole. Sabotaging efforts that could reduce how much of a shithole it is doesn't get you a pass. And the Third World includes places less fucked up than Africa.

Being less fucked up than some Protestant denominations doesn't get them a pass either.

Thank you Alyrium, it's good to see a more balanced view on the matter to be honest, I got very nervous reading peoples comments here, it was almost as if the Pope had been some sort of all cpervasive evil. Instead of a man that has his faults yes but he has also done a lot of good in his time.

Still I hope him a speedy death as I think he has earned it, rather than a long drawn out and bitter slide. It's time for him to die, peacefully.

And thats all I'm going to say on the matter really, I recognise the potential I have to go overboard here, and come across as an idiot so I'm going to avoid falling into the trap

Imperial Overlord wrote:The pope has been undermining Vatican II, not reinforcing. He gets no points for the Church being progressive when he has been dragging things backwards.

Yes, Africa is a shithole. Sabotaging efforts that could reduce how much of a shithole it is doesn't get you a pass. And the Third World includes places less fucked up than Africa.

Being less fucked up than some Protestant denominations doesn't get them a pass either.

DOes the "He is mentally disabled and has been for some time" not sink in?

For anyone such as myself who are incredibly skeptical because of the date, you can simply go to CNN.com and it's all there by the way. The pope's gonna die on April 1st.....

I nominate myself to be the next pope, I know jack shit about cahtolicism but I believe I would look nice in the hat.

Aly, that he's mentally ill doesn't give him a pass on what he did before that.

Do I wish him pain? No. I want a nice swift, clean death so the all the hard line conservative fucktard cardinals he appointed can get on with the job of electing his successor.

The pope had a heart attack!
April fools!
Except it's not april first yet (here)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4399189.stm

The news is reporting Heart Failure.

Oh the sweet, delicious irony.

Someone at work here honestly believes its an april fool's joke

MSNBC says he's now in a coma.

Oh, man, now if Ralph Reed gets run over by a truck it'll be the best week ever...

Not to say that I'm not hard at work, but MSNBC just said that reuters just said that the Vatican just said (it's like telephone!) that the pope isn't into a coma. To clarify, MSNBC said that the Associated Press and Italian News were reporting that the pope was in a coma. Yay for IPTV!

Imperial Overlord wrote:Aly, that he's mentally ill doesn't give him a pass on what he did before that.

Like, say, opposing the Communists in Poland at great personal risk?