Something big

[23 November 1939]

The scale just blows my mind on these. AT-ATs were large enough...

I do like the power trunking. Nice, practical detail. What about landing zones? Are weapons and mass (supplemented by shields, perhaps) enough to flatten an area? Or are other methods required?

And, stepping back, I like the logic of the Stormtroopers as assault marines (ala the Pacific War) with ground-effect units to penetrate and destroy theater shields. Any thoughts on mobile and fixed defenses against such assaults? We saw on Hoth the limits of muddling through. Presumably the Empire has something better.

A question on the barge. The WIP pic titled barge3.jpg appears to have two, possibly three, vehicles inside. One is clearly an AT-SE. What might the other(s) be?

[fractalsponge1]

Landing zones would probably be prepped by seismic charge or turbolaser, if no suitable clearing was at hand. Ground stability for walkers would be important, but not so much for the ship, which depends largely on repulsorlift.

Simplified dorsal wings; the old arrangement was a leftover of when I thought the dorsal hatches would be a lot bigger than the configuration I ended up going with.





The interior vehicles are an AT-SE in storage configuration, and a mockup of a repulsortank/IFV.

Mobile and fixed defenses would be surface-to-orbit artillery, firing under the cover of theater shields. I think the main difference between the Rebel setup on Hoth and an Imperial version would be scale and numbers, and probably mobile forces better than snowspeeders to attack penetrations. This was one of the main design rationalizations I had for the AT-SP - the enemy sheltering under the shield knows where you're going to attack, and so will mass artillery and AFVs to throw back a walker assault. What's needed then would be a massively survivable and well armed assault vehicle to make the initial penetration, and establish enough of an undershield perimeter to bring repulsorlift and infantry into action. It wouldn't need to be particularly mobile.

[23 November 1939]

Many thanks for answers on all points. I always forget seismic charges, and I agree about ground stability being more of a requirement for walkers (although, perhaps, less for Juggernauts?). On the defensive, heavy mobile reserves would have to be essential, I suppose. A shield wide enough to be useful, and which did not leave the shield generator targetable from the edge, would have quite the perimeter. I am now imagining a Kursk-like battle, waged with Star Wars level ordnance. Those aforementioned seismic charges do suggest anti-walker land-mines are more practical than my OT-centric views allowed for. Although, that in turn suggests the counter of *more* seismic charges to clear potential mine-fields. The sappers will be busy.

I like the dorsal wings. I imagine the techs who have to maintain her are also suitably grateful. The engines, meanwhile, bring a definite "life" to her. Again, kinda scary to contemplate the scale. One can see a professional explaining to a Moff that while they might be able to, somehow, get an AT-SP aboard a Star Destroyer, they have no way to get said AT-SP off without grounding the ship since they cannot just "squeeze in" the landing barge. When she's finished, I'd be curious to see a worm's-eye view of her from the inside.

[fractalsponge1]

AT-SPs have no business deploying off Star Destroyers. They would require specialized dropships that would only fit into much larger (or more specialized) ships, or would walk off grounded Acclamators and the like. Really, even an A6 would likely be far too large for ISDs and the like as we have seen them configured. The volume is there, but the configuration of the bays required is not.

[fractalsponge1]

Preview of panel style and detail density.

[23 November 1939]

I really like this one. So easy to forget just how big it is supposed to be. It feels like a whale or a shark. It *looks* fast - something I've never really thought of canon Sienar/Cygnus designs.

AT-SPs have no business deploying off Star Destroyers. They would require specialized dropships that would only fit into much larger (or more specialized) ships, or would walk off grounded Acclamators and the like. Really, even an A6 would likely be far too large for ISDs and the like as we have seen them configured. The volume is there, but the configuration of the bays required is not.

Definitely a point. I was picturing someone like Furgan, deciding that he wasn't going to put up with any back-talk from the common soldiery. The idea that a 1600 m of capital ship would not be enough to deploy a surface-assault unit, while logical, still leads to a slight double take. I get the *why*, but it still reminds me of the scale of Star Wars. A mile of Star Destroyer would be easy to lose on a planet, without air or orbital assets. A lot of squishy people in the way of these things. From a certain point of view, walkers are rather comforting. They offer an alternative to BDZ when confronted with theater shields.

[Lord Revan]

tbh Venators were capable of landing and that's canon (we see them both in the Corusant shipyard and at background in Kashyyk), they're "only" 400 meters shorter then ISDs with roughly the same build IIRC, I dout it's the size and more that ISDs aren't designed to land.

[fractalsponge1]

Update:

[fractalsponge1]

Update!

[23 November 1939]

Again, liking where this one is going. The radiator panels on the back (at least I presume they are, from earlier works) really add something. Too early for me to have an opinion on the turret arrangement. I presume this one is not intended to have a secondary gunship role but with Imperial designs you just never know.

tbh Venators were capable of landing and that's canon (we see them both in the Corusant shipyard and at background in Kashyyk), they're "only" 400 meters shorter then ISDs with roughly the same build IIRC, I dout it's the size and more that ISDs aren't designed to land.

Quite true. Ditto for the Victory, and even the Aclamator is within shouting distance (half a mile is half a MILE ) I'm just remembering when the AT-AT, which is deployable from the ISD, was the behemoth to end all behemoths. Technologically and militarily, plenty of reasons for there to be bigger designs. Just amusing to look at something and say, "yep, too big for an ISD." We all remember when the ISDs were reeling in blockade runners. Apples to oranges, of course. But on a visceral level... Kinda fun to see how far things have come since that opening sequence. And, of course, as much as anything, I was tickled to imagine a dimwitted Moff who needed a droid to count past 10, trying to put the biggest walker he could find aboard the largest capital ship he might have to hand (which is how my ramblings, and Fractal's and your patient responses, got kicked off).

[Zen]

Long time lurker and just recent member.

First I would like to thank Fractal for all the amazing renders and the thorough reasoning behind the designs. it is always refreshing to read the intimate details balancing loadout with reactor size and the according design requirements.

Secondly I would like to thank many of the regular posters for adding interesting perspectives and material to the discussion. Going beyond the simple whizz-bang and digging deeper into the mechanics of the universe.

On the point of scale, given that this is a craft meant to drop hardware into a live zone, will she be well covered by simple and light point defences? Reasonable shields to provide survivability while dropping but nothing really needed to hit back hard? Perhaps the craft would be outfitted with some seismic charges, as 23 November 1939 had mentioned, for the purpose of making its own landing spots?

At any rate I am looking forward to seeing this design fleshed out and perhaps a composite piece featuring these and those recent large-scale material craft you designed dropping your ground forces into battle.

[fractalsponge1]

I don't plan on giving this ship more than point-defense. There's not that much reactor volume compared to cargo, and what's there is probably going to go to shields and engines.

Bridge position:

[fractalsponge1]

Wings:

[fractalsponge1]

[23 November 1939]

It is all starting to look fairly substantial. Hadn't noticed before, but I really like the look of the lower wings, particularly where they meet the hull.

[fractalsponge1]

[fractalsponge1]

[fractalsponge1]

OK, just did a big family move to California, so updates will be sparse while I get organized again. Found time to finish the outer main door:

[Zen]

Hope the move went smoothly, this is the second large move you have undertaken while posting in this thread no?

Regarding the design of the ship, the fore and flanks [in front of the dorsal wings at least] appear to be covered fairly well; there appears to be, however, a bit of a fire-arc shadow from mid-ship through to rear. Keeping the side clean and going with hull mounted turrets, it is going to be a little tough to provide cover in that large, disembarking, zone.

Looking forward to seeing how this progresses [and to more of those space-occupation diagrams, for the mega-lander it was most illustrative].

Cheers,

Zen

[fractalsponge1]

Update:

[fractalsponge1]

Mockup of internal layout:


Multiple levels on rails, collapsible into the ceiling for large loads like a juggernaut (shown) or heavy walker. With the platform down, the bottom level can handle AT-STs as well. Should be enough for any company of light or medium vehicles.

[23 November 1939]

Very interesting to see the internal layout in greater detail. On the earlier posts, enjoy the look of your standard quad-gun, particularly the aft-most mount, and the details on the lower bank of the engines. Very gritty.

Given the scale, what is the in-universe explanation for the Lambda/Sentinel-style head/neck? Real-world, it is a classic, so no complaints. Just curious what one might do with that space and why a modest increase in deck-space, relative to a squatter design ala the Aegis-class, was accepted.

[fractalsponge1]

In universe, I'd say it was built to handle just the crew and some passengers, and the lambda-style head is sufficient for that, while at the same time reducing overall vehicle mass profile relative to a filled-out form. You don't need a lot of decks to carry troops, since they'd be deploying with their vehicles from the main bay.

[fractalsponge1]

Ship is basically finished. Did the interiors and fixed the texture blotchiness:

[Lord Revan]

is that upper hangar meant for fighter cover for the landing?