SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Pollux » 2010-07-06 01:43pm

Kartr_Kana wrote:
Pfhor OOB wrote:5 Light Carriers ($300 per) [$1500]
3,000 Fighercraft per craft
SDNW4 Ruleset wrote:A Hull size's carrying capacity is equivalent to half its cost. For example, a Medium Hull ship of $80 cost can carry $40 worth of craft (that's 400 basic Fighter hulls or 80 basic Gunboats as a max exclusive capacity)
Those light carriers can only carry $150 worth of fighter/gunboat vessels. So 1500 fighters per carrier.
Pfhor fighters might be really cheap, at 20 per dollar (and therefore crappy). Though Pollux should make a special note of that if it's true.
Pfhor fighters are indeed 20/$1, and proudly shitty, thank you very much. :P

This fact was in previous incarnations of the OOB, due to a misinterpretation of the rules on my part, but got removed in the latest update.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Coyote » 2010-07-06 01:46pm

PeZook wrote:Well, excess energy means we can indulge in inefficient behavior from time to time.

Like putting teeth and glowy eyes on our combat frames.
Oh, no, the robots have probably observed that things like teeth and glowy eyes have an unnerving effect on biologicals and thus serve an important psychological warfare purpose. :wink:

(Actually, they may purposefully design some units to maximize the 'uncanny valley' effect for different reasons-- to put someone off their game during negotiations, or to freak out adversaries in combat).
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Simon_Jester » 2010-07-06 01:56pm

Darkevilme wrote:Construction commencing year 3400.

Economic mobilization level: 10%

8th battlegroup construction: $3360 total.
x2 $1200 Dominion class. Leaves yards: 3404, trials complete 3405.6
x3 $1200 Rampant class. Leaves yards: 3403, trials complete 3405
x8 $640 Predator class, leaves yards: 3400.8, trials complete 3401.2
x16 $320 Wayward escort, leaves yards: 3400.2 trials complete 340.3

Fleet reinforcement plan: $3040
x15 $2400 Principality class. Leaves yards: 3401.6, trials complete 3402.2
x8 $640 Predator class. Leaves yards: 3400.8 trials complete 3401.2
Darkevilme, I take it that the reported dollar figures are totals for all ships of that class under construction? As in, you are constructing eight Predator class vessels, each of which costs 80$?
PeZook wrote:
Kartr_Kana wrote:Why are the Chamarrans such a big deal to the Collectors? Is it cause they're from "some place else" or just cause they're cat people?
They're human-based cat people bred for some strange purpose by an outside force.
They make us curious.
But the Diaspora remains the core of our research.
So, curiosity killed the... OW!
[is struck by rock thrown by outraged Chamarran ambassador]
Norade wrote:
Akhlut wrote:Are one-liners considered inefficient?
Of course not, they're the single most efficient way to deliver witty puns and make people laugh before you do horrible things to them.
Or, for that matter, make people laugh after you do horrible things to someone else, whether you're going to do anything horrible to them or not.

Unit 7 no doubt has fond memories of getting away with killing dozens of people in brutal fashions and getting away with it by the appropriate use of one-liners...
Coyote wrote:Oh, no, the robots have probably observed that things like teeth and glowy eyes have an unnerving effect on biologicals and thus serve an important psychological warfare purpose. :wink:

(Actually, they may purposefully design some units to maximize the 'uncanny valley' effect for different reasons-- to put someone off their game during negotiations, or to freak out adversaries in combat).
Wouldn't be surprised. That may explain why the robot the Pendletonian spoke to was built to look like a rather attractive woman... but spoke in a man's voice.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Darkevilme » 2010-07-06 02:04pm

Simon_Jester wrote:
Darkevilme wrote:Construction commencing year 3400.

Economic mobilization level: 10%

8th battlegroup construction: $3360 total.
x2 $1200 Dominion class. Leaves yards: 3404, trials complete 3405.6
x3 $1200 Rampant class. Leaves yards: 3403, trials complete 3405
x8 $640 Predator class, leaves yards: 3400.8, trials complete 3401.2
x16 $320 Wayward escort, leaves yards: 3400.2 trials complete 340.3

Fleet reinforcement plan: $3040
x15 $2400 Principality class. Leaves yards: 3401.6, trials complete 3402.2
x8 $640 Predator class. Leaves yards: 3400.8 trials complete 3401.2
Darkevilme, I take it that the reported dollar figures are totals for all ships of that class under construction? As in, you are constructing eight Predator class vessels, each of which costs 80$?
Indeed, this is the total for each run being displayed.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Teleros » 2010-07-06 02:51pm

Been updating the Altacar Empire on the wiki. Got a few pics & bios up, plus planned construction:

FY 3400 (£1890)
  • Altacar System: 1 Rapid Response Squadron (£80 + (£55 * 2) + (£25 * 4) = £290), construction finished end of August 3400, trials finish end of December 3400.
  • Aestil System: 2 Dreadnoughts (£350 * 2), construction finished January 3403, trials finish January 3404.
  • Turaer System: None
  • Kasimir System: None
  • Typhern System: None
  • Dammos System: 2 Hunter class Frigates (£25 * 2), construction finished end of March 3400, trials finish end of May 3400.
  • Avanna System: 2 Supercarriers (£375 * 2), construction finished January 3403, trials finish January 3404.
  • Varda System: 2 Hunter class Frigates (£25 * 2), construction finished end of March 3400, trials finish end of May 3400.
  • Callista System: None
  • Tyress System: 2 Hunter class Frigates (£25 * 2), construction finished end of March 3400, trials finish end of May 3400.
FY 3401 (£1705)
  • Altacar System: 2 Defiant class Carriers (£200 * 2), construction finished January 3403, trials finish October 3403.
  • Aestil System: None
  • Turaer System: 3 Fearless class Cruisers (£95 * 3), construction finished end of September 3401, trials finish end of March 3402.
  • Kasimir System: 6 Challenger class Battleships (£150 * 6), construction finished end of March 3402, trials finish end of October 3402.
  • Typhern System: 1 Dauntless class Battlecruiser (£120), construction finished end of December 3401, trials finish end of June 3402.
  • Dammos System: None
  • Avanna System: None
  • Varda System: None
  • Callista System: None
  • Tyress System: None
There are currently no plans to expand the Royal Marines or Altacar Guard; the rest of the £2400 defence budget is being spend on maintaining existing forces, R&D, and so on and so forth.

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Steve » 2010-07-07 12:10am

Hrm, due to the whole semi-unreal time bit I think I'm going to stop putting dates on my posts. I'll lay out time progression where necessary, that's it.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Steve » 2010-07-07 12:58am

Uh, A-Wing, on the foothold thing.... I would think Lochley's Retreat Naval Station, which is actually on a major hyperlane through the Outback, would be considered a hell of a lot more of a "foothold" close to the ESR's borders than a system that can only be reached through a series of hyperspace maneuvers and a 2 day voyage through shoal space as the fastest route.

Not that I disagree with the logic behind the opposition or your intent to butt in. 8) This is how things are supposed to work, after all....
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American Conservatism is about the exercise of personal responsibility without state interference in the lives of the citizenry..... unless, of course, it involves using the bludgeon of state power to suppress things Conservatives do not like.

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by A-Wing_Slash » 2010-07-07 01:29am

Steve wrote:Uh, A-Wing, on the foothold thing.... I would think Lochley's Retreat Naval Station, which is actually on a major hyperlane through the Outback, would be considered a hell of a lot more of a "foothold" close to the ESR's borders than a system that can only be reached through a series of hyperspace maneuvers and a 2 day voyage through shoal space as the fastest route.

Not that I disagree with the logic behind the opposition or your intent to butt in. 8) This is how things are supposed to work, after all....
My bad on that. I just went back and made a slight change to the wording at the end of my post that I think will clear things up a bit. What I was trying to go for, though, was not necessarily that anyone in a position of power thought that the annexation of Pendleton would be a threat, but rather that the media had been drumming up a hysteria, given that Pendleton's physically closer to our easternmost border than anything else New Anglia has, regardless of actualy travel times involved. Combined with the public's anger that some one else's navy has to clean up a mess so seemingly close to its borders, the president has to be seen as doing something, if for no other reason than public pressure. Sorry if that came off as belligerent, I'm not as good as I'd like to be when it comes to writing fiction.

That being said, I do have two legitimate, if minor concerns. Even though Pendleton itself might not have any strategic value, any Anglian annexations in the general direction of the ESR set of warning lights because of the shift in Anglian thinking they might represent. In addition, that Tarkington fellow does not seem to be a big fan of those who believe in a republican form of government.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by A-Wing_Slash » 2010-07-07 01:38am

Steve wrote:Pendleton is in X-17, the Gap spans X-17 and X-18, the Bannerman side of the Gap is part of a web of minor hyperlanes that eventually connect to the main New Anglia-Imperium hyperlane through the Outback at the system Lochley's Retreat.

The ESR's access to the Outback would logically be by a hyperlane from U-18 or V-18 to AA-22 in the Outland Commissions or to the Hiigarans. If it goes through X-18 we could say it intersects with the Anglia-Imperium hyperlane, though perhaps not at Lochley's Retreat (heck, you could also have a small naval station at the system where the two lanes intersect).
A hyperlane between V-18 and the Hiigarans sounds good to me, and jives well with what your Silver Moon Sisters said a little while back. If its alright with everybody I'd like to have this lane intersect the Anglia-Imperium lane somewhere in X-18 to the southwest of Lochley's Retreat, and I'd like to put a really small naval base at the system where the two intersect (namely Burlywood, which I mentioned in my last two in game posts).

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Steve » 2010-07-07 02:14am

That works.

As for Tarkington, his vitriol for Republicans ends at the Anglian border. He regards those within the Empire as traitors attempting to dismantle centuries, millennia, of national tradition (or, if they're Trill, ungrateful aliens who were saved from eventual extinction and permanent enslavement by the Dilgrud by the "blood of our Kings and their Subjects", recall now that two distinct Kings were slain at the frontlines of the 1st Dilgrud War). Though i can certainly see why people would feel he's like that and I have no objection to him being presented as such.

The same thing with your feelings toward the Anglian move over Pendleton. The move really is motivated entirely by Anglian exasperation with Pendleton over the centuries, not any plan for aggressive conquest, but your side can't possibly know that for sure. New Anglia is powerful enough that the ESR being wary of their plans for annexation is perfectly understandable.
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"No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism." - Sir Winston L. S. Churchill, Princips Britannia

American Conservatism is about the exercise of personal responsibility without state interference in the lives of the citizenry..... unless, of course, it involves using the bludgeon of state power to suppress things Conservatives do not like.

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by K. A. Pital » 2010-07-07 07:56am

Coyote recently PMed me, so to avoid further confusion among players, I think I'd explain the Commune's diplomatic stance in easy terms.

The Supreme Soviet allows foreign diplomats to operate on Commune territory even if relations are set to "dislike" or "suspicious", except for monarchies and capitalist dictatorships. Their representatives cannot enter the Commune.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Steve » 2010-07-07 08:02am

Stas Bush wrote:Coyote recently PMed me, so to avoid further confusion among players, I think I'd explain the Commune's diplomatic stance in easy terms.

The Supreme Soviet allows foreign diplomats to operate on Commune territory even if relations are set to "dislike" or "suspicious", except for monarchies and capitalist dictatorships. Their representatives cannot enter the Commune.
Well fine, we didn't want diplomatic relations with you anyway. Nyah! :P :P :P :mrgreen: :wink:
”A Radical is a man with both feet planted firmly in the air.” – Franklin Delano Roosevelt

"No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism." - Sir Winston L. S. Churchill, Princips Britannia

American Conservatism is about the exercise of personal responsibility without state interference in the lives of the citizenry..... unless, of course, it involves using the bludgeon of state power to suppress things Conservatives do not like.

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Teleros » 2010-07-07 09:18am

Right, thought I'd get see if we can't get some more of that foreign relations chart coloured in. I'll just do a "missing relations" for the Altacar Empire for now, but there are quite a few empty rows & columns on it ATM...

Diplomatic & Trade Relations:
  • CmdrWilkens' Severian Republic
  • TimothyC's Kryptonian Empire
  • Ryan's Interstellar Union of Worlds
  • Akhlut's Union of Four Stars
  • Lonestar's Grand Dominion
  • Shep's Shepistani Republic
  • Bluewolf's United Corporate Front
  • Moby's Cevaucian Ascendancy
  • Coyote's Central Alliance - Unknown ATM, is this intended?
  • A-Wing_Slash's Empire Star Republic
  • Oskuro's Orks
  • Flameblade's Covenant of the Void
  • KlavoHunter's Sultanate of Klavostan
Diplomatic Relations Only:
  • Ryan's Interstellar Union of Worlds
  • Akhlut's Union of Four Stars
  • Moby's Cevaucian Ascendancy
  • A-Wing_Slash's Empire Star Republic
Stas Bush wrote:The Supreme Soviet allows foreign diplomats to operate on Commune territory even if relations are set to "dislike" or "suspicious", except for monarchies and capitalist dictatorships. Their representatives cannot enter the Commune.
I find it hard to believe that the Commune doesn't maintain some sort of official contact with nations it is hostile towards. Some neutral meeting ground perhaps?


Edit: I realise of course that I may have just been lazy or slipped up & forgotten to update the chart for the Altacar Empire, apologies if that's the case.

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Thanas » 2010-07-07 10:10am

Stas Bush wrote:Coyote recently PMed me, so to avoid further confusion among players, I think I'd explain the Commune's diplomatic stance in easy terms.

The Supreme Soviet allows foreign diplomats to operate on Commune territory even if relations are set to "dislike" or "suspicious", except for monarchies and capitalist dictatorships. Their representatives cannot enter the Commune.
Would this also be the case for an independent faction among the Sassanid Empire which practices communism due to necessity and whose one leader refuses to use noble titles?
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Coyote » 2010-07-07 10:35am

Teleros wrote:Right, thought I'd get see if we can't get some more of that foreign relations chart coloured in. I'll just do a "missing relations" for the Altacar Empire for now, but there are quite a few empty rows & columns on it ATM...

Diplomatic & Trade Relations:
[*]Coyote's Central Alliance - Unknown ATM, is this intended?
Yup. The CA is totally an outside context reality from another dimension. Ported in and waaayy out in the boondocks they are a large-ish and advanced society that has no known ties to anyone here, and aliens the likes of which have not been encountered before.

I just decided to be different. :mrgreen:
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by K. A. Pital » 2010-07-07 10:48am

Teleros wrote:I find it hard to believe that the Commune doesn't maintain some sort of official contact with nations it is hostile towards. Some neutral meeting ground perhaps?
I said it does. For all, except monarchies and capitalist autocracies. And why bother with them anyway?
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by PeZook » 2010-07-07 10:55am

Because without contact, you can't play them off against each other? :D
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by RogueIce » 2010-07-07 11:02am

Stas Bush wrote:Coyote recently PMed me, so to avoid further confusion among players, I think I'd explain the Commune's diplomatic stance in easy terms.

The Supreme Soviet allows foreign diplomats to operate on Commune territory even if relations are set to "dislike" or "suspicious", except for monarchies and capitalist dictatorships. Their representatives cannot enter the Commune.
Am I in the latter? I am not, strictly speaking, a dictatorship. Though one could probably make such an interpretation if they wished, given the 'balance of power' is firmly in the Executive camp.

Just wondering so I'll know for future reference.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by K. A. Pital » 2010-07-07 12:22pm

Formalities matter. If you're technically a republic, you don't have kings, right? ;)
PeZook wrote:Because without contact, you can't play them off against each other?
Perhaps that is the way of the Collectors; the Commune is more straightforward, but also more devious in a certain way :) you'll see.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Teleros » 2010-07-07 12:46pm

Stas Bush wrote:
Teleros wrote:I find it hard to believe that the Commune doesn't maintain some sort of official contact with nations it is hostile towards. Some neutral meeting ground perhaps?
I said it does. For all, except monarchies and capitalist autocracies. And why bother with them anyway?
Because they (monarchies etc) are other nations with their own armed forces that you might not, say, want disrupting the invasion plans for your neighbours next Tuesday? Or in RP terms, just look at the trade agreements between the Altacar Empire & the rest of the galaxy and tell me you wouldn't want an official reason to send people into what is probably the busiest international marketplace / travel hub in the game (complete with its own Mos Eisley, no less :P )?

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Simon_Jester » 2010-07-07 01:31pm

Teleros has a point, Stas.

Even if there's not much diplomatic contact, you do at least need some ability to interact with their government on an official basis, besides the Space-KGB agents I just know you've got sneaking around the place. Refusing to talk to them at all is as foolish as Trotsky's "No war, no peace."

I mean, if nothing else, think about the plight of Commune citizens in those societies (given your very broad definition of "Commune citizen"). Having a consulate in nations ruled by ideological enemies forces them to acknowledge your existence and makes it easier for you to arrange evacuation of new would-be members of the Commune to Commune-held space, rather than allowing them to be suppressed or liquidated by reactionary regimes.
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by PeZook » 2010-07-07 04:28pm

Stas Bush wrote: Perhaps that is the way of the Collectors; the Commune is more straightforward, but also more devious in a certain way :) you'll see.
Actually, no, that's not our way. We simply have no contact with anyone and sit in the middle of Shoal space, making the irritation treshold for people wanting to invade us severely higher than normal :D

As a side note, I think I'll introduce another diplomat.

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Akhlut » 2010-07-07 05:09pm

What the hell is it with you primates and breasts?

She's clearly a subprime speciman, anyway: she has to falsify her plumage color in order to entice mates! She's also too thin to properly lay eggs and not get health complications.

Man, you mammals have fucked up priorities.
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Coyote
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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Coyote » 2010-07-07 05:11pm

It's the cute little East German belt buckle design. She sports it well.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

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Re: SDN Worlds 4 Commentary Thread I

Post by Darkevilme » 2010-07-07 05:59pm

I've only just realized something. Is there any particular reason that ship troop capacity for warships is bought at a ratio of $1 buys you $0.12 of troops? and this is the best case of elites with elite equipment.
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