SD.Net World Redux Comment Thread VII

[PeZook]

Man you assholes cannot design soldier kits. I also like how Zor was able to pull a new design out of his ass so quickly

"Us" assholes? How about blaming it on the people who actually drew the damn things, huh?

Apparently, huge and bulky air filtration systems are manly now. Helgan women can filter poison with their chests

[Lonestar]

You know what mine is? Basically a Future Force kit with sealable gloves to the uniform, boots are sealed in, and in the event of an CW attrack a gas-mask-hood you can pull out of a pocket, pull over your head, and seal it to the top of your uniform. The uniform fibers themselves have filtering components to defend against agents. You slide your body armor over that. Inside your uniform is a small generator for a micro-climate conditioning subsystem(NBC stuff being hot). No bloody "lol upper chest plates", hard to move in stormtrooper armor, and Skimask helemts. There's a PDA with each kit, but no out of control electronics that some folks must think they are cramming in there.

[CmdrWilkens]

Also for the record I am going to be moving forward with my "Storm" battalions mostly when I get around, probably after the moonshots, to completely re-organizing my Army. Right now its the only reason I haven't put a lot of my AF and Army shit up on the wiki because I'm waiting to figure out how the re-organizaiton will look...and what shit I'm gonna need to buy.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

I have my doubts I will get down to even implement a future soldier program until 2025-2030. For now, I'm only aiming for something similar to what Lonestar is aiming for, though since I operate mostly in the desert, that integrated aircon unit will have to be uprated.

[Shroom Man 777]

I like Loinstar's design for an elegantly simple form of body armor. I like the hoodie gas mask idea particularly. And the sealed gloves and boots. Really simple, really elegant and no doubt very effective.

Would it be possible to integrate those camel-back hydration systems IN the uniform so that when you pull the hoodie-mask up, the water "straw" will be right at your mouth INSIDE the mask, rather than connecting your water canteen to your face mask from the outside?

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

I like Loinstar's design for an elegantly simple form of body armor. I like the hoodie gas mask idea particularly. And the sealed gloves and boots. Really simple, really elegant and no doubt very effective.

Would it be possible to integrate those camel-back hydration systems IN the uniform so that when you pull the hoodie-mask up, the water "straw" will be right at your mouth INSIDE the mask, rather than connecting your water canteen to your face mask from the outside?

I don't think soldiers would like to run around with a straw in your mouth or near it.

[K. A. Pital]

Unless you get very autocratic.

1) But we are autocratic - at least we, but I think Byzantium is a monarchy with the Monarch really in power, not just spending money and shit.
2) The heavy booster programme here actually culminated in a real working 1980s generation booster the Energia with enormous liftoff potential. The base is even easier than a ship, it just lays there on the ground waiting for folks to come there.
3) PeZook already noted that gravity is less here, more bang for the buck. I was thinking about 10-20 tons to Moon, but it's actually greater due to lower gravity.

P.S. CATO people can expect some more stuff from me with the space - the Igla hypersonic fighter prototype, the various moon ships, more Spiral MiG-105 plane renders, et cetra. I mean pics.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

I mean, it's been 40 years since the USA went to the moon, and there are no moonbases yet. Yeah yeah, political will and all that, but...where is the driving urge for one here, anyway? Besides "leaders think it'd be cool" which is nice, but doesn't get you budgets. Unless you get very autocratic.

And hell, we're not even at our moon yet. With maybe what, four to five years or actual manned spaceflight experience at best? I'd say moonbases, or long-term space habitation is...quite a long ways away. Unless we just pull technology and knowledge out of out ass, any pretense at realism be damned.

The technology to land things on the moon and building stuff there already existed to some extent back in the 70s what with space stations getting constructed. Multiple launches to the moon to slowly off load stuff onto the moon and then set at least a Lunar camp is well within possibility back then.

But.. the US chose not to exploit its success and instead chose to dismantle the whole Apollo program entirely.

And Byzantium is a constitutional monarchy, with control over foreign, defence ministry. Police, and what not are under the control of the Prime Minister and the cabinet, and the Senate.

[Shroom Man 777]

I don't think soldiers would like to run around with a straw in your mouth or near it.

It's a minor annoyance and they would be grateful of an ergonomic source of water when donning oppressively hot NBC gear. Like that scene in Jarhead when the Marines were forced to play football in NBC gear to demonstrate their effectiveness.

Then the Marines went all Shroomanian and decided to get naked and act gay in front of the press.

Anyway, a straw near the mouth is no more or less annoying as a headset with a mike near your mouth.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

I don't think soldiers would like to run around with a straw in your mouth or near it.

It's a minor annoyance and they would be grateful of an ergonomic source of water when donning oppressively hot NBC gear. Like that scene in Jarhead when the Marines were forced to play football in NBC gear to demonstrate their effectiveness.

Then the Marines went all Shroomanian and decided to get naked and act gay in front of the press.

Anyway, a straw near the mouth is no more or less annoying as a headset with a mike near your mouth.

Erm Shroom, it's very different. Try falling down with a straw in your mouth, and you might risk choking the person, if the damn thing breaks.

And no one has the mike in your mouth. It is at the side, or it is a small one that is highly sensitive.

[Ryan Thunder]

You know what mine is? Basically a Future Force kit with sealable gloves to the uniform, boots are sealed in, and in the event of an CW attrack a gas-mask-hood you can pull out of a pocket, pull over your head, and seal it to the top of your uniform. The uniform fibers themselves have filtering components to defend against agents. You slide your body armor over that. Inside your uniform is a small generator for a micro-climate conditioning subsystem(NBC stuff being hot). No bloody "lol upper chest plates", hard to move in stormtrooper armor, and Skimask helemts. There's a PDA with each kit, but no out of control electronics that some folks must think they are cramming in there.

So, uh, you do realize that its kind of hard to seal plate armour, right? Which would sort of imply that there's an undersuit not much unlike your own. Then the armour suit goes on top of that. Alternatively, the power suit goes on top of that, and it has its own hard armour.

My plan is to deploy the suits with a test platoon, then SpecOps will get them, then the rest of the army. That's all once development is finished, mind, which won't be for a very long time.

Really, the project is nothing more than dickwaving at this point.

[Shroom Man 777]

The straw is bendy and soft and won't be IN your mouth all the time. It's probably not that long too. You'd have to reach your tongue out or pucker your lips up to reach it.

Maybe you can somehow manipulate it from outside the mask or something.

The gas masks used in Desert Storm DID have straws in them, and you could actually connect the mask to a canteen to sip the water in. Except that the connection tube was crappy and broke a lot.

I wonder what real-life servicemen, like Coyote, know about hydration systems in NBC units.

[Ryan Thunder]

The straw is bendy and soft and won't be IN your mouth all the time. It's probably not that long too. You'd have to reach your tongue out or pucker your lips up to reach it.

Maybe you can somehow manipulate it from outside the mask or something.

The gas masks used in Desert Storm DID have straws in them, and you could actually connect the mask to a canteen to sip the water in. Except that the connection tube was crappy and broke a lot.

I wonder what real-life servicemen, like Coyote, know about hydration systems in NBC units.

If breakage is a problem, make the straw out of kevlar.

[RogueIce]

I wonder what real-life servicemen, like Coyote, know about hydration systems in NBC units.

Camelbaks can hook up to the same thing with their tubes. They have an adapter for it.

[Beowulf]

The MCU-2/P, current issue for the USAF, has a rubber straw in front of the mouth that you can grab ahold of with your lips in order to drink out of, when you have a canteen attached. The canteen gets attached through a couple inch long tube, so it's not constantly attached, but rather only when you want to drink.

[Ryan Thunder]

Czechmate, where the fuck are you getting all your hardware from? You're pretending to have hardware that's as good as mine and about four or five times more numerous. You had better have a damned good reason why.

Did you forget that Emmeria is a fucking duchy, or something?

[Beowulf]

Well, for one thing, he's got a much more sensible OOB. He's got a bunch of light fighters, and doesn't have any 5th generation fighters that are insanely expensive to develop (yet). Beyond that, essentially every aircraft you operate is used exclusively by you, resulting in you necessarily needing to have paid for development of everything. Which is expensive.

[PeZook]

Except he operates a similar number of 4th gen airplanes and five times the aircraft carriers as France on 1/5th the budget, if we go by his figures.

[Ryan Thunder]

Well, for one thing, he's got a much more sensible OOB. He's got a bunch of light fighters, and doesn't have any 5th generation fighters that are insanely expensive to develop (yet). Beyond that, essentially every aircraft you operate is used exclusively by you, resulting in you necessarily needing to have paid for development of everything. Which is expensive.

The same way none of you had to consider that somebody needs to pay for the development of the F-15 or MiG-whatever, I shouldn't have to consider the cost of developing my G4 heavy fighters, or G3 tanks, or G3 IFVs, when they're what I'm starting the game with. Oh, sure, I should have to pay for building them and shit, but the cost of R&D is already done with and paid for in full.

I did however assume the cost of my G5 heavy fighter development, which was a major setback in the beginning.

He's still out of his fucking mind. A military that size on the budget he's allowed is going to be absolutely scum-at-the-bottom-of-the-shitcan quality.

Also, by the way, if we're using Coyote's points system (the same one I used) the Emmerian air force all on its fucking lonesome is too large (120% too large, in fact), even if we double it as suggested. That's assuming he has nothing else.

Get it?

[Lonestar]

So, uh, you do realize that its kind of hard to seal plate armour, right? Which would sort of imply that there's an undersuit not much unlike your own. Then the armour suit goes on top of that. Alternatively, the power suit goes on top of that, and it has its own hard armour.

My plan is to deploy the suits with a test platoon, then SpecOps will get them, then the rest of the army. That's all once development is finished, mind, which won't be for a very long time.

Really, the project is nothing more than dickwaving at this point.

It's moronic. Remember, we haven't even hit 2020 and you idiots are doing "lol FUTURE EVIL BADGUYS" suits.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Except he operates a similar number of 4th gen airplanes and five times the aircraft carriers as France on 1/5th the budget, if we go by his figures.

And considering France has an economy equal to mine...

And how it manages his acquisition budget is way beyond me, because it would have taken ages to pay off all that stuff, and his economy is about the same size as my home country.

[Ryan Thunder]

It's moronic. Remember, we haven't even hit 2020 and you idiots are doing "lol FUTURE EVIL BADGUYS" suits.

It won't be moronic when 6.8 MESS struggles to penetrate my body armour at short range...

[K. A. Pital]

Well, for one thing, he's got a much more sensible OOB. He's got a bunch of light fighters, and doesn't have any 5th generation fighters that are insanely expensive to develop (yet).

Yeah, his navy and airforce are the pinnacle of sensibility. Although, considering he should be extensively militarized, maybe to an extent of over 10% of GDP wasted on the military... which is itself not that realistic (not to mention other people reacting to such a militaristic jackass existing anywhere near them)...

Beyond that, essentially every aircraft you operate is used exclusively by you, resulting in you necessarily needing to have paid for development of everything. Which is expensive.

Miratia has a small airforce, a really small one. It also has virtually the same GDP as Emmeria. Ryan's new fighter is most likely something like a more modern Shafagh, with a flyoff 30 million + cost, which isn't too much. Iran with twice the GDP may have a similar or greater level of Shafagh procurements. His designs are also most likely something similar to rough Chinese or Mid East copycats from advanced Crimson/MESS equipment. So, his OOB does make some sense. Considering he also doesn't have a Navy to speak of, that's perfectly reasonable to have invested into the airforce.

Ryan's military may be a cheapass military, but so is Emmerias. And Czech building Kirov-like CGNs? He should have fucking bankrupted himself, end of story.

[Steve]

There seems to be quite a consensus for forcing Czech to tone his OrBat down.

Of course, there's also the fact that he has yet to respond to my queries over his plan to attack a signatory of the Treaty of Hasiyah, thus a nation that has a mutual-defense pact with Cascadia. Given his lack of remarks at all lately, I'll give him benefit of the doubt and figure he's got limited net time or something like that, but I really do want to get that sorted out.

[Ryan Thunder]

Beyond that, essentially every aircraft you operate is used exclusively by you, resulting in you necessarily needing to have paid for development of everything. Which is expensive.

Miratia has a small airforce, a really small one. It also has virtually the same GDP as Emmeria. Ryan's new fighter is most likely something like a more modern Shafagh, with a flyoff 30 million + cost, which isn't too much. Iran with twice the GDP may have a similar or greater level of Shafagh procurements. His designs are also most likely something similar to rough Chinese or Mid East copycats from advanced Crimson/MESS equipment. So, his OOB does make some sense. Considering he also doesn't have a Navy to speak of, that's perfectly reasonable to have invested into the airforce.

If you're referring to my Falcons, you could pit them against F-22 Raptors in equal numbers with a reasonable chance of victory. Not guaranteed of course, since the Raptor would win more by virtue of being stealthier and more maneuverable, and thus denying detection and/or weapons lock more often. My planes could handily out-shoot them in a missile lobbing contest, though.

Everything else is comparable, perhaps improved in some ways, but generally not quite as good as the real high-end stuff. We have a thing for experimentation, as well, which often yields hilarious results, like the Archer...

Ryan's military may be a cheapass military, but so is Emmerias. And Czech building Kirov-like CGNs? He should have fucking bankrupted himself, end of story.

Not right now it isn't. Based on what he put up there, he must think that the points limit set out by Coyote was for each individual branch of his military... And that's if we double the original numbers so he gets 420 points instead of 210. His airforce alone is more than 500 points.