SD.Net World Redux Comment Thread VII

[K. A. Pital]

If he's entering the battle, his best bet is going almost ground low right after Baerne's MiG-31s complete their first pass over Costa (I can't call it anything else, their turn radius at Mach 3 is going to be extreme, heheh) and snooping for idiots who'd think that if they evaded Baerne's high-flyers they're safe. And then kill anything which is stupid enough to get caught. Getting into the fray under Baerne's intense missile salvo is stupid - and not necessary, Baerne's MiG-31s would complete their pass over Costa in minutes like I said. It's hard to imagine anything but lots of BVR combat and missile shots, not a very good time to enter the fray. They'd leave in a few minutes again.

P.S. Looked at the scale of Costa. Basically, Baerne's MiG-31s would complete the run over their territory in 8-10 minutes, and these are after they take out the first Embraer AEW&C craft. In 20 minutes after their detection, they would be gone - and the enemy would still have planes to sortie, if his airfields aren't already charred waste from Kh-31 salvos.

It's really ridiculous - no in-depth defenses, no IADS, and a territory smaller than some of the satellite nations incorporated in the UCSR? And Beowulf thinks this nation has a shot at inflicting extremely heavy losses against MiG-31s which are penetrating it's airspace at full speed? That's ridiculous.

[Beowulf]

Stas:

It's quite apparent that you paid no attention to the One Week War. You talk about Shepistani nukes, and how F-106Hs are just cannon fodder. Shepistan had no nukes (except the one that the tested, which fizzled). F-106Hs pack one of the most powerful fighter radars in the new world, and have datalink capability, so they can pass tracks to other aircraft. They are capable of reaching speeds equal to that of the MiG-31 (high M2+), and maintaining that speed. They are as capable of performing the mini-AWACS roles as a MiG-31. There's a reason why they were so deadly in the One Week War. They also aren't old frames. Assuming they were bought at the end of the production run from Shepistan, they would have been built in the mid-90s. They aren't going to fall out of the sky from airframe fatigue.

Baerne did not and still does not have any mention of medium ADA vehicles in his OOB. He doesn't not have the capability of achieveing air supremacy. He doesn't have the planes to do so. He was explicit: 40 MiGs took part.

The planes sortied from 6 airfields. Assuming each has two runways, and planes can take off in flight formations (4 aircraft at a time. Yes, it's doable). That's 48 aircraft per launch cycle, and assuming the same minute to line up the next group (which is radically over estimate), it's 3 minutes tops for all to launch.

Hedgehog mortars are considered to be marginal against heavy torpedoes. Timing is critical, and if it's wire guided at that point, then the controller can move it out of the path of the mortar bombs. As for the submarine, yeah, sure, it probably did take place further out than: mouth of the harbor. I didn't say it did.

Sure, mercenary Raptors could be used, but they'd take a while to get to Baerne. They're not in the picture for this first attack.

[Master_Baerne]

Baerne did not and still does not have any mention of medium ADA vehicles in his OOB.

Well, actually...

[Coyote]

Oh, by the way, just a friendly reminder to everybody that Miratia's been experimenting with small nukes purchased from San Dorado prior to their joining with CATO. You never know whether or not some part of our armed forces will have a couple.

Was that RP'ed in-game?

[Shroom Man 777]

Mercenary F-22s can provide air cover for Baernish ground forces, if that's the case.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

A question: Can a banana republic with less economy than even Baerne started out be able to purchase such aircraft? Even if the economy is at a stated size, the gross inefficiencies are so high, government revenue is going to be downright pathetic.

[Coyote]

There seems to be no end of flyspeck nations that miraculously seem able to afford F-22s, MiG-31s, and nuclear carriers. And nuclear weapons.

[Shroom Man 777]

Those F-22s are secretly Shroomanian in origin, with "former" SAF pilots, operating in a way that they'll be plausibly deniable.

Mercenary Aces have been mentioned in game previously. Mercenary Aces have been deployed in Baerne. Baerne made use of them in his post. They can provide cover for the Baernish ground forces.

[Ryan Thunder]

We have. Any intervention on behalf of Baerne would increase the enemy losses, but wouldn't necessarily reduce Baerne's losses.

If you do intervene, you would basically encounter the same as he did - some 40 to 60 sortied fighters and interceptors depending on the time of arrival, with new ones sortied every minute. All Su-30MKI would probably be sortied, and as prime combatant they are rather dangerous. The F-106Hs would be taking heavy casualties from MiG-31s' R-77s and on the ground, radar stations and airfields with planes would be experiencing unpleasant fire in the face of Kh-31Ps.

Depending on how many craft you commit, you can kill several dozen enemy craft in the air fight and maybe, if you brought ATG machines, participate in the carnage against the airfields after the first intense battle dies down, Baerne's MiG squadrons return home and he sends another wave in several hours or so.

You will suffer your own losses in case you are commiting planes which are fourth generation combatants into this aerial bloodbath. With 4+ generation you might escape almost unscathed. Depends on what you actually do.

I deployed three squadrons, for a total of 16 Falcons and 32 Lightnings.

That means 12 Falcons and 24 Lightnings in the air with air superiority loadouts. Falcons are 5th-generation fighters, Lightnings are 4th. The Lightnings are there for two reasons; 1. to keep the opposition off the Falcons, and 2. Extend their radar range and thus ease the tracking issues that come with BVR combat.

The Falcons are somewhat less maneuverable F-22 Raptor analogues, packing ten AAM-2 missiles each, plus a 'defensive' 30mm gun. Their targeting computers and radar are good enough to shoot them all off at different targets simultaneously, if they like. They're armoured enough to do ground attack missions in a pinch, but I don't want to risk them for it at this point, so they're flying high and fast. I also don't want to risk them at short range, so they're keeping their distance.

AAM-2 missiles are virtually equivalent to AIM-120 Slammers. A fire-and-forget, actively radar-guided missile, suitable for BVR combat.

The Lightnings are somewhat less maneuverable F-16 analogues with ten pylons (including the wingtips), but since the AAM-1 missiles are rather small, two of the pylons on the sturdier fuselage can be fitted with attachments that let them carry an extra two missiles, so they're carrying twelve AAM-1's and a 'defensive' 30mm gun each.

The AAM-1 missile is a sort of a cross between one of the recent Sidewinder missile derivatives and a Sparrow. They're infrared-guided, medium range missiles for use against evasive targets, in any event, and their seeker can track the target up to 90 degrees off-axis. The seeker is smart enough that it can differentiate between its target and a new heat source, provided that it can still see the one its chasing.

You could confuse it by maneuvering the heat source its chasing really close to a second, similar heat source, but that would seem to me to be rather difficult to pull off. And it'd just end up choosing one and going after that, too.

The question is: did you co-ordinate the attack with Baerne?

If you didn't, I expect lots of friendly fire

Of course if you did, it changes the stakes significantly, since your Lightnings are essentially Mig-31 analogues, right?

Those particular fighters probably aren't expecting us, if that's what you mean.

They might resemble them outwardly, but they're more like F-16s in terms of capability.

This particular part of the engagement occurs while the two forces are approaching each other but not within range to start shooting each other yet. The Falcons lob sixty missiles at the Costans, using data from the Lightnings to assist in guiding them. Going off of data (albeit from Wikipedia), AAM-2s should have a P-hit of around 90%, provided that they have energy to maneuver if the target is evasive, with a 'hit' being defined as the target setting off the proximity fuze. Then the whole lot of them book it back to the Baernish capital for a quick refueling before heading to the North Annex for rearming. I was hoping that would be sufficient measures to avoid a friendly fire incident.

Oh, by the way, just a friendly reminder to everybody that Miratia's been experimenting with small nukes purchased from San Dorado prior to their joining with CATO. You never know whether or not some part of our armed forces will have a couple.

Was that RP'ed in-game?

I honestly don't recall. I spoke to Siege and the other FTO members about it, IIRC. I've allocated some $250 million to pay for the experimentation, as well.

[Siege]

Oh, by the way, just a friendly reminder to everybody that Miratia's been experimenting with small nukes purchased from San Dorado prior to their joining with CATO. You never know whether or not some part of our armed forces will have a couple.

Was that RP'ed in-game?

I honestly don't recall. I spoke to Siege and the other FTO members about it, IIRC. I've allocated some $250 million to pay for the experimentation, as well.

I'm not sure if it was in the thread, but certainly PMs were exchanged on the subject. He's a member of the FTO, so it's pretty much expected that he bought into the joint nuke program. After delivery the bombs are his to do with as he pleases (within reason, obviously), though I'm not sure that artillery would be a good way to employ them. Then again, Miratia is known for its... unconventional warfighting ideas.

You might want to make a few posts on the subject though, just so that anyone with funny ideas isn't too surprised when you annihilate their tank horde with a nuclear time-on-target barrage .

[Shroom Man 777]

Miratia and Baerne were, until recently, both FTO. I am sure there are avenues for inter-military communications available for both powers.

[Beowulf]

Can nobody manage to get OOC information from mixing with IC information? No one (I repeat for emphasis), no one knows that Klavostan is a Tian Xia puppet. Best you can get is a vague suspicion. It has done essentially nothing to advance the interests of Tian Xia.

[Shroom Man 777]

Well, Prime Minister Shroom can be rambling on vague suspicion too. As many vague suspicion as he wants. He IS after all insane.

(And Mr. Gero isn't any better either.)

I suspect our dearly beloved Prime Minister actually drinks bottled breastmilk exclusively because he suspects that the Canissians are sapping his precious bodily fluids with fluoridinated water.

[Beowulf]

Well, Prime Minister Shroom can be rambling on vague suspicion too. As many vague suspicion as he wants. He IS after all insane.

(And Mr. Gero isn't any better either.)

I suspect our dearly beloved Prime Minister actually drinks bottled breastmilk exclusively because he suspects that the Canissians are sapping his precious bodily fluids with fluoridinated water.

So why does anyone actually listen to PM Shroom? Especially when he's verifiably wrong: Tian Jiao isn't a puppet. It's a sovreign part of Tian Xia. The crazed Duke of Tian Jiao was removed from his position.

[Shroom Man 777]

Oh. Right. I mistook that part.

And I edited a bit on Klavostan.

For all we know, the Klavostanis are MESS puppets too, no thanks to those damn dopplegangers!

Edited Tian Xia.

Worse with Tian Jiao. It's outright MESS-owned, Tian Xian, with an utter sycophant of a leader.

There. It's no longer a MESS puppet. It's MESS-owned and Tian Xian. As if that makes it any more pleasant to hear.

[Raj Ahten]

Hello Everyone. I know it’s been awhile but I’m thinking of rejoining the game after a long absence. Real Life commitments limited my time but now I think I can get involved in this again. I must say though that I have virtually no idea of what has transpired since I had to give the game up. Just from reading a very small amount, things seem to have gone to hell on Frequesue. My foreign policy nightmares may have come to be reality!

My absence can be attributed in game to internal political problems in Indhopal, resulting from anything from the indigenous population being at loggerheads with the central government, to an economic collapse brought about by all the damn wars in the region, to a refugee crisis or all of the above.

A concern of mine at this point is that my military would be outdated and that I've simply acquired the wrong sort of things for Indhopal's needs in the past. That, however, can be fixed over time. I just hope all my neighbors haven't been turned into foreign puppets......

One question I have to ask is how many years/months in game have I missed?

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

1. Well, there's not much left of the FTO.
2. It's 2015
3. You are still welcome back to the game.
4. Matters in Frequesue have gotten interesting lately.

[Raj Ahten]

4. Matters in Frequesue have gotten interesting lately.

That would seem to be an understatement. Nukes everywhere, warfare and outside influences running unchecked. What ever happened to the old neighborhood?

Just getting back up to speed on local events is going to take awhile. Being bored shouldn't be a problem though.

[Beowulf]

Hello Everyone. I know it’s been awhile but I’m thinking of rejoining the game after a long absence. Real Life commitments limited my time but now I think I can get involved in this again. I must say though that I have virtually no idea of what has transpired since I had to give the game up. Just from reading a very small amount, things seem to have gone to hell on Frequesue. My foreign policy nightmares may have come to be reality!

My absence can be attributed in game to internal political problems in Indhopal, resulting from anything from the indigenous population being at loggerheads with the central government, to an economic collapse brought about by all the damn wars in the region, to a refugee crisis or all of the above.

A concern of mine at this point is that my military would be outdated and that I've simply acquired the wrong sort of things for Indhopal's needs in the past. That, however, can be fixed over time. I just hope all my neighbors haven't been turned into foreign puppets......

One question I have to ask is how many years/months in game have I missed?

Well, I invaded one small shithole (Mortimer's Claim) to supply humanitarian aid, and thus the FTO fell apart. San Dorado/Coilerburg joined CATO. So to your north is a puppet of CATO, to your south is a secret puppet of the Emperor. The Vineyards joined the MESS as an observer (keeps them from having to fight in a MESS war). The former Duke of Tian Jiao conducted a coup in Klavostan (with Klavohunter's permission), thus making it a TX puppet. CATO's established a fleet base in the north. Various MESS countries are setting up detachments in Tian Jiao, as well as their existing detachments in the Vineyards.

I offered to help setup a new FTOish organization, but was unsuccessful. Baerne instead also joined CATO, then proceeded to invade his neighbor to the north. Ryan Thunder refused, and hasn't yet done anything. King Brandon was interested, but was the only one. So instead, President Shinra and the Huang Di offered him Observer status in the MESS, which he accepted.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

4. Matters in Frequesue have gotten interesting lately.

That would seem to be an understatement. Nukes everywhere, warfare and outside influences running unchecked. What ever happened to the old neighborhood?

Just getting back up to speed on local events is going to take awhile. Being bored shouldn't be a problem though.

I actually kind of look forward to the Raj's usual venomous proclamations against outside influence. There hasn't been enough of that for a while.

[PeZook]

Holy cow, I throw off a reference to Mr. Rodgers and people pick up on it like crazy!

[Raj Ahten]

Hello Everyone. I know it’s been awhile but I’m thinking of rejoining the game after a long absence. Real Life commitments limited my time but now I think I can get involved in this again. I must say though that I have virtually no idea of what has transpired since I had to give the game up. Just from reading a very small amount, things seem to have gone to hell on Frequesue. My foreign policy nightmares may have come to be reality!

My absence can be attributed in game to internal political problems in Indhopal, resulting from anything from the indigenous population being at loggerheads with the central government, to an economic collapse brought about by all the damn wars in the region, to a refugee crisis or all of the above.

A concern of mine at this point is that my military would be outdated and that I've simply acquired the wrong sort of things for Indhopal's needs in the past. That, however, can be fixed over time. I just hope all my neighbors haven't been turned into foreign puppets......

One question I have to ask is how many years/months in game have I missed?

Well, I invaded one small shithole (Mortimer's Claim) to supply humanitarian aid, and thus the FTO fell apart. San Dorado/Coilerburg joined CATO. So to your north is a puppet of CATO, to your south is a secret puppet of the Emperor. The Vineyards joined the MESS as an observer (keeps them from having to fight in a MESS war). The former Duke of Tian Jiao conducted a coup in Klavostan (with Klavohunter's permission), thus making it a TX puppet. CATO's established a fleet base in the north. Various MESS countries are setting up detachments in Tian Jiao, as well as their existing detachments in the Vineyards.

I offered to help setup a new FTOish organization, but was unsuccessful. Baerne instead also joined CATO, then proceeded to invade his neighbor to the north. Ryan Thunder refused, and hasn't yet done anything. King Brandon was interested, but was the only one. So instead, President Shinra and the Huang Di offered him Observer status in the MESS, which he accepted.

Damn, what a mess. It's going to take awhile just to figure the implications of all that. BTW anyone know where the hell the map went ?

Anyway at least the CFR is too much of a shithole for anyone to care about that much it would seem. I'll certainly have my work cut out for me.

[RogueIce]

So, Rogue, how does one redirect a search term on the ol'Wiki? I want to make it so that simply typing "Canissia" (or mispellings like "Cannisia") directs to the formal "People's Royal Republic of Canissia" and so on.

Make a page just called "Canissia" and then put in the following:

#REDIRECT [[Royal People's Republic of Canissia (RPRC)]]

That's all you need. And don't bother with the misspellings. That's just pointless. If people can't search right, that's their damn problem, not ours.

And why the heck did you put the acronym into the title? You didn't really need to.

[Shroom Man 777]

Hey Shin, are you creating the carrier in your own country or contracting CATO guys to help out?

[Shinn Langley Soryu]

Hey Shin, are you creating the carrier in your own country or contracting CATO guys to help out?

The HMS Asuka Langley Soryu, formerly SNS Jupiter, was purchased from the Shinra Republic in 2013. All CATO's involved in is retraining Langley Navy personnel to actually operate the thing.