[Star Wars 888] Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Formless » 2010-10-15 08:04pm

Bakustra wrote:Jesus Christ, man, just let it go.

You know I would have made a post anyway, just to accept the apology. I'm not an asshole just for the sake of it. And for a fact, I really do hate this whole "lets act like our secret website doesn't exist" game. Last I checked, dishonesty was against the rules here.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Broomstick » 2010-10-15 08:05pm

Phantasee wrote:Well, let's be honest, if you became as successful as him, wouldn't you want to forget you were from a shit hole like Indiana?

Hey, I grew up in Detroit, by that standard Gary IS a step up!
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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Bakustra » 2010-10-15 08:07pm

Phantasee wrote:Man, Bakustra, you're an even bigger MJ fan than I am! In fact, you've probably got me and SW88 beat!


In this case, it's because I'm more of a Disney fan.

[spoiler=Formless, stay out]Phant, he may know about the plan. We might have to move to step seven ahead of schedule.[/spoiler]

Formless wrote:
Bakustra wrote:Jesus Christ, man, just let it go.

You know I would have made a post anyway, just to accept the apology. I'm not an asshole just for the sake of it. And for a fact, I really do hate this whole "lets act like our secret website doesn't exist" game. Last I checked, dishonesty was against the rules here.


Oh god, oh god, what have I done to offend thee? Nobody is denying that the website exists, just that it's a clique of people that seek to kick people out of the Testing Clubhouse or whatever. Well, okay, but Jaerimuse don't count.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Star Wars 888 » 2010-10-15 08:07pm

Dalton wrote:Don't presume to dictate to me how I should do my job.


Take it as a suggestion, given that I can't exactly make you act benevolently. Besides, are you saying that you don't want to be a benevolent despot?


Ah, I see, more lawyering. Do you think this helps your case? Do you believe that trying to claim the Admin is using a logical fallacy will make his ban-power useless? I think you'll find that your tactics here are less than useless, because this isn't where I have to prove that you are a trolling douchebag. That's already been proven in other threads, and based upon the evidence that I've seen, I have rendered judgment. See, this here is where I tell you that you are going to be banned, very soon, because you think you can throw the rules in my face and continue trolling this board.


I was defending myself. You clearly got angry at me for comparing you to a slave owner, and I'm explaining that it wasn't intended to be that. If you want to, ignore the accusation of you using a strawman and focus on my point; that is, that making a claim and stating that it's "self evident" can be used for practically any absurd claim (and no, I'm not claiming that your point is absurd, simply that your evidence has been used to back up absurd claims).

Also, I sincerely don't want to troll, since I dislike people who troll. If you were to simply tell me what I'm doing that apparently makes me a troll in your eyes, then I can stop. I'm not trying to troll, but it's hard to stop trolling when you aren't told HOW you're trolling. For all I know I could be trolling because I'm using run on sentences (which I'm not), or because I'm posting too much, or making too much threads, or using improper grammar (which I'm not) or any other multitude of reasons.


Back it up. Show me the rule. You want to be a lawyer? You want to put words in Mike's mouth? Show your evidence.



(note: please don't get mad at me or accuse me of lawyering for posting this, since you told me to do it)

Posting Rules #5 says that the best way to counter a mean person is to have a better argument than them. I'm pretty much, with a few exceptions, the only poster in this thread (not forum, but this thread) that's actually made ANY argument, so I followed the rules.

Debating Rules #5 says to back up your claims. I did, you, at the risk of sounding rude, didn't. Again, not lawyering, I'm pointing out the facts that you're requesting me to.

Aministrative Rules #6 says that you can insult the staff during a debate, but not on their performance on their duties. This doesn't really apply since I haven't actually insulted you, but what I'm trying to say is that I haven't actually broken any of the rules.

Oh please, enough of your pithy "woe is me" martyr crap. You've been a net-negative drain on the collective IQ of this board since you joined. That 29 page thread I linked to above, again, had more than one moderator call for your head, a part I noticed you conveniently ignored. In fact, the more "noble" and self-sacrificing you become, the more I am going to flame and insult you for being an obnoxious, sniveling toadie.


Only one moderator called me out on that thread and then left the thread. You still haven't explained how I'm a troll. For other trolls like darkstar, people were super eager to call him out, point out every one of his logical fallacies, destroy his arguments, etc. Yet for me, my arguments haven't actually been challenged.

BTW, are you calling me a troll for this thread or the other thread?
Last edited by Star Wars 888 on 2010-10-15 08:13pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:08pm

Formless wrote:
Bakustra wrote:Jesus Christ, man, just let it go.

You know I would have made a post anyway, just to accept the apology. I'm not an asshole just for the sake of it. And for a fact, I really do hate this whole "lets act like our secret website doesn't exist" game. Last I checked, dishonesty was against the rules here.

Are you suggesting there is a 'Spacebattles Clique' here? Because then we've got a senior mod involved in that one (Alyeska) as well as people like Ford and (I believe) Rye.

Or maybe there's a 'Librium Arcana Clique'? You've got Mayabird (IIRC) and Lady T in that one.

My point was:
Phantasee wrote:So what if some people from here post there?[...]What does that have to do with anything I do here?

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby General Zod » 2010-10-15 08:08pm

Formless wrote:
Bakustra wrote:Jesus Christ, man, just let it go.

You know I would have made a post anyway, just to accept the apology. I'm not an asshole just for the sake of it. And for a fact, I really do hate this whole "lets act like our secret website doesn't exist" game. Last I checked, dishonesty was against the rules here.


So is dragging on shit from other boards if you really want to play it that way. It's not all that secret anyway since some people have it in their sigs.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Formless » 2010-10-15 08:10pm

Bakustra wrote:Oh god, oh god, what have I done to offend thee? Nobody is denying that the website exists, just that it's a clique of people that seek to kick people out of the Testing Clubhouse or whatever. Well, okay, but Jaerimuse don't count.

Oh, for the love of fuck, are you guys going to ever stop beating around the bush? This is HoS, not Testing. The fact that that website even exists, that Phant was point blank denying its existence, and the circumstances around which it was created, speaks for itself. Or we can look at all these little in jokes that this and other threads in Testing regularly spout like, hmm, "Jaerimuse". Don't see a pattern? Sorry, but I think you do and think you can deny it just for your own amusment.
Last edited by Formless on 2010-10-15 08:13pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:11pm

What fucking 'clique', asshole? Are you going to say there's some terrible, "secret" clique every time we have a few posters that also post on other forums? Christ, there's probably a "Goon Clique"! And that whole "HPCA Clique", with Stuart, Shep, Gandalf, Simon_Jester, etc.

Shit, Gandalf is on NT, HPCA, Spacebattles, and SDN! Maybe even LA!

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Bakustra » 2010-10-15 08:13pm

Star Wars 888 wrote:Only one moderator called me out on that thread and then left the thread. You still haven't explained how I'm a troll. For other trolls like darkstar, people were super eager to call him out, point out every one of his logical fallacies, destroy his arguments, etc. Yet for me, my arguments haven't actually been challenged.

BTW, are you calling me a troll for this thread or the other thread? The other thread


The other thread what? Don't leave me hanging, this is fascinating stuff. I need to know about the other thread!

Phantasee wrote:
Formless wrote:
Bakustra wrote:Jesus Christ, man, just let it go.

You know I would have made a post anyway, just to accept the apology. I'm not an asshole just for the sake of it. And for a fact, I really do hate this whole "lets act like our secret website doesn't exist" game. Last I checked, dishonesty was against the rules here.

Are you suggesting there is a 'Spacebattles Clique' here? Because then we've got a senior mod involved in that one (Alyeska) as well as people like Ford and (I believe) Rye.

Or maybe there's a 'Librium Arcana Clique'? You've got Mayabird (IIRC) and Lady T in that one.

My point was:
Phantasee wrote:So what if some people from here post there?[...]What does that have to do with anything I do here?


What major websites don't we have a clique for?

Oh, I'm pretty sure that I'm the leader of the Lurker Clique, but really, it's like herding cats so I never bother with any of that leadership garbage.

Formless wrote:
Bakustra wrote:Oh god, oh god, what have I done to offend thee? Nobody is denying that the website exists, just that it's a clique of people that seek to kick people out of the Testing Clubhouse or whatever. Well, okay, but Jaerimuse don't count.

Oh, for the love of fuck, are you guys going to ever stop beating around the bush? This is HoS, not Testing. The fact that that website even exists, that Phant was point blank denying its existence, and the circumstances around which it was created, speaks for itself.


No he wasn't, he was denying that it was some sort of monolithic entity like you're presuming, which if you've followed it at all, is a hilarious statement. The "circumstances around which it was created"? When are you going to stop beating around the bush yourself?

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Formless » 2010-10-15 08:15pm

Yes, lets keep acting like "monolithic entity = clique". Or, we can stop burning straw men.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:16pm

Personally, I'm offended by the accusation that I'm part of some clique. I mean, here I am, siding with SW88 to the best of my ability, and Formless attacks me for this! I was hounded by a real clique in junior high, and they really were a monolithic entity out to get me (and a few others). The last thing I'd do is join one just to hurt others.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:18pm

Bakustra wrote:What major websites don't we have a clique for?


I know for a fact at least several posters here have their very own YouTube accounts where they not only post in the comments, but also post videos. Dooey Jo for one, and I believe one of the Rouges posted some fireworks videos, and that guy who does the Star Trek episode reviews. So you've got some ringleaders in that clique right there, ready for their crucifixion.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Star Wars 888 » 2010-10-15 08:19pm

Adding on to my thread (it's past the editing time), and note that I'm not trying to lawyer around, given that I was requested by a mod to back my claim up:

Here's an exact quote from Mike Wong:

Do not call it "self evident", restate it in different words, force the other person to prove your claim is not true, or use other weasel techniques to avoid backing up your claims.



I've backed up all my claims. Now I'm politely requesting any mod that thinks I'm a troll to explain why, because I sincerely don't want to be a troll, and am still relatively new to this forum and forums in general.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Bakustra » 2010-10-15 08:21pm

Formless wrote:Yes, lets keep acting like "monolithic entity = clique". Or, we can stop burning straw men.


Dude, so what if there are groups of people with in-jokes and a shared forum they hang out at? You're insisting that this is some sort of negative thing, and that it relates to the poor reception you got. So I'm assuming that you believe that the "clique" is hassling you. Really, if there was a "clique" like you described, I wouldn't have gotten too many laughs myself! Honestly, bud, lay off the paranoia juice for a little bit.

Phantasee wrote:
Bakustra wrote:What major websites don't we have a clique for?


I know for a fact at least several posters here have their very own YouTube accounts where they not only post in the comments, but also post videos. Dooey Jo for one, and I believe one of the Rouges posted some fireworks videos, and that guy who does the Star Trek episode reviews. So you've got some ringleaders in that clique right there, ready for their crucifixion.


Don't act so innocent yourself. I know about the nefarious, monolithic and in-jokey Facebook Clique.

Star Wars 888 wrote:Adding on to my thread (it's past the editing time), and note that I'm not trying to lawyer around, given that I was requested by a mod to back my claim up:

Here's an exact quote from Mike Wong:

Do not call it "self evident", restate it in different words, force the other person to prove your claim is not true, or use other weasel techniques to avoid backing up your claims.


You're leaving me hanging, man, and not in a sexy way, either. What about the other thread? I've got to know!

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Star Wars 888 » 2010-10-15 08:24pm

Bakustra wrote:
Star Wars 888 wrote:Adding on to my thread (it's past the editing time), and note that I'm not trying to lawyer around, given that I was requested by a mod to back my claim up:

Here's an exact quote from Mike Wong:

Do not call it "self evident", restate it in different words, force the other person to prove your claim is not true, or use other weasel techniques to avoid backing up your claims.


You're leaving me hanging, man, and not in a sexy way, either. What about the other thread? I've got to know!



I want to see you beg for it more. ;)


Seriously though, it was the What if the Empire Invaded Modern Day Earth thread.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Formless » 2010-10-15 08:24pm

Phantasee wrote:Personally, I'm offended by the accusation that I'm part of some clique. I mean, here I am, siding with SW88 to the best of my ability, and Formless attacks me for this!

Lie. I have not mentioned your behavior with regards to SW88 at all. You just made that up on the spot right here and now.

I was hounded by a real clique in junior high, and they really were a monolithic entity out to get me (and a few others). The last thing I'd do is join one just to hurt others.

There were several that hounded me when I was in the same. Guess what, they would have denied it too, but they were still cliques, and they were by no means monolithic entities. But I guess we can't judge people by their behavior, now, can we?

Bakustra wrote:Dude, so what if there are groups of people with in-jokes and a shared forum they hang out at? You're insisting that this is some sort of negative thing, and that it relates to the poor reception you got.

Oh, yay, more strawmen. What I keep saying is negative is the fact that you can't post in a specific part of this board that is supposed to be open to anyone here without said herd of jackels giving you shit for every little misstep, and that they appear to be looking for a new easy target a la Colefax.

Now, can we stop playing games here and discuss this with honesty?

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby PhilosopherOfSorts » 2010-10-15 08:27pm

What I want to know is how "Micheal Jackson was a good person because he donated a lot to charity" = "Its morally wrong to make fun of Micheal Jackson." Hell, other people have given more to charity (as has been stated in this thread) and they still get made fun of and criticized, so why should MJ get special treatment?

Also, Star Wars 888, when Dalton tells you to shut the fuck up, its usually a good idea to listen.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:30pm

I didn't say you attacked me for defending SW88, I said that's what I entered the thread for and you've been going after me for being part of some clique in this completely separate tangent that has nothing to do with 88 over there.

Listen man, nobody is looking for a 'new easy target'. Shit, even Colefax is part of the clique you appear to have a hard on for! Nobody is giving you shit for every little misstep, do you see how much shit I get for breathing in Testing? I can't make a thread without jaeriusmuse bringing up my (painful and recent) motor vehicle accident. Christ, I just got out of physical rehabilitation for that today and they're making jokes at my expense already!

But I don't let it get to me! I follow Bakustra's (and Aaliyah's) advice: I dust myself off and try again.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:31pm

PhilosopherOfSorts wrote:What I want to know is how "Micheal Jackson was a good person because he donated a lot to charity" = "Its morally wrong to make fun of Micheal Jackson." Hell, other people have given more to charity (as has been stated in this thread) and they still get made fun of and criticized, so why should MJ get special treatment?

Also, Star Wars 888, when Dalton tells you to shut the fuck up, its usually a good idea to listen.

Even deceased people have the right to the pursuit of happiness. It's in your Constitution, FFS!

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Bakustra » 2010-10-15 08:32pm

Star Wars 888 wrote:
Bakustra wrote:You're leaving me hanging, man, and not in a sexy way, either. What about the other thread? I've got to know!



I want to see you beg for it more. ;)


Seriously though, it was the What if the Empire Invaded Modern Day Earth thread.


My standards are way too high for you, sir.

What about it? You were going on about "the other thread" two posts ago when you were talking about being considered a troll. What about it were you going to say?

Formless wrote:
Phantasee wrote:Personally, I'm offended by the accusation that I'm part of some clique. I mean, here I am, siding with SW88 to the best of my ability, and Formless attacks me for this!

Lie. I have not mentioned your behavior with regards to SW88 at all. You just made that up on the spot right here and now.

I was hounded by a real clique in junior high, and they really were a monolithic entity out to get me (and a few others). The last thing I'd do is join one just to hurt others.

There were several that hounded me when I was in the same. Guess what, they would have denied it too, but they were still cliques, and they were by no means monolithic entities. But I guess we can't judge people by their behavior, now, can we?

Bakustra wrote:Dude, so what if there are groups of people with in-jokes and a shared forum they hang out at? You're insisting that this is some sort of negative thing, and that it relates to the poor reception you got.

Oh, yay, more strawmen. What I keep saying is negative is the fact that you can't post in a specific part of this board that is supposed to be open to anyone here without said herd of jackels giving you shit for every little misstep, and that they appear to be looking for a new easy target a la Colefax.

Now, can we stop playing games here and discuss this with honesty?


Yes, you can. For Christ's sake, just shrug it the fuck off and calm the fuck down and dunk your head into a barrel of fuck-water. Fuck.

You know what? Had you simply backed off, you'd have been forgotten, much like many other missteps and bad routines. But now that you've blown this up, you will probably make this a self-fulfilling prophecy, because you go up like Pele when pricked too hard. So many people will laugh over this and use you for material. You have a chance to break the cycle, though: let it be. When you find yourself in times of trouble, mother Mary may not come to you, speaking words of wisdom, but you should still let it be. Let it be, yeah, let it be. And there will be an answer, as people's memories fade and I mess up the meter, let it be.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Ghost Rider » 2010-10-15 08:32pm

Star Wars 888 wrote:
Bakustra wrote:
Star Wars 888 wrote:Adding on to my thread (it's past the editing time), and note that I'm not trying to lawyer around, given that I was requested by a mod to back my claim up:

Here's an exact quote from Mike Wong:

Do not call it "self evident", restate it in different words, force the other person to prove your claim is not true, or use other weasel techniques to avoid backing up your claims.


You're leaving me hanging, man, and not in a sexy way, either. What about the other thread? I've got to know!


I want to see you beg for it more. ;)


Seriously though, it was the What if the Empire Invaded Modern Day Earth thread.


You mean the thread wherein you made up your own rules, back pedalled when presented evidence you didn't want to hear or situations that did not follow your particular world view and then declared that because it's your topic you can make up whatever rules you wanted?

But continue, dumbfuck. It's always nice to watch fucktards trying to demonstrate intelligence.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Star Wars 888 » 2010-10-15 08:35pm

PhilosopherOfSorts wrote:What I want to know is how "Micheal Jackson was a good person because he donated a lot to charity" = "Its morally wrong to make fun of Micheal Jackson." Hell, other people have given more to charity (as has been stated in this thread) and they still get made fun of and criticized, so why should MJ get special treatment?


1. Did I say that it was ok to make fun of those other people? No, I didn't.
2. I was saying that it's immoral to make fun of someone for unsupported claims especially when said person is dead. Constructive criticism is ok.
3. The purpose of this thread was to try and dispel the rumors about Michael Jackson. Making fun of him is off topic and not related to the thread.

[/quote]

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Formless » 2010-10-15 08:36pm

@ Phantasee: Admittedly, I don't follow Testing daily like some here (and never claimed to either), so I haven't noticed that.

Edit: added the @
Last edited by Formless on 2010-10-15 08:37pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Phantasee » 2010-10-15 08:36pm

Oh man, Bakustra, I forgot that MJ owned the rights to the Beatles' catalogue. Seriously, between you, me, and SW88 we could have our own private usergroup (NOT A CLIQUE) right here on SDN!

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Re: Dispelling rumors about Michael Jackson

Postby Star Wars 888 » 2010-10-15 08:38pm

Ghost Rider wrote:

You mean the thread wherein you made up your own rules, back pedalled when presented evidence you didn't want to hear or situations that did not follow your particular world view and then declared that because it's your topic you can make up whatever rules you wanted?

But continue, dumbfuck. It's always nice to watch fucktards trying to demonstrate intelligence.


When did I change the rules of that thread? Show me evidence and examples. If anything, it's the other side that changed the conditions from "do they succeed" to "can they survive and make some nations and make space stations">

Oh, and good try at joining a bandwagon. Did you even read this thread?


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