Alien Covenant

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby LadyTevar » 2017-05-17 02:18am

One joke I've heard is that Ridley Scott got the plotlines of "Blade Runner" mixed up with Promie and Covenant. David's little beef with his 'dad', his treatment of the humans, etc.

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Shroom Man 777 » 2017-05-17 11:22am

Joun_Lord wrote:But we got the answer and it sucks, same with the answer of who the Space Jockeys were. Not some completely alien creature or eldritch abomination, nah just a bunch of Shaq sized pale Mark Strong looking humans, thats fucking it.


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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Khaat » 2017-05-17 12:06pm

Q99 wrote:Maybe the reason all the corporate people in the other movies are so willing to participate in get-the-xenomorph plan that gets them killed is they're a product of this negative eugenics programs whereas space haulers and prisoners and space marines are largely outside of it.

Or it's a commentary on the presumption of "safe" exceptionalism in society - they act stupid because their culture has shielded them from consequences of significance. The "truck drivers" on the Nostromo actually live with actual immediate, potentially deadly consequences, Burke and Weyland (& academics) personally never did.

And "blinded by arrogance" is a running theme: Burke thought he'd get off LV426 with alien-impregnated Ripley and Jordan with time to clean it up later, just as Weyland expected "come to me, my child!" from the Engineers.

Hells, in Prometheus, David specifically asked, "How far would you go to get your answers?" before infecting Charlie. Charlie took that for hyperbole, rather than the direct question he should now (after returning from an alien ship, with alien life on board) realistically expect it to be - discounting all the time he spent querying David about androids. At least Charlie was drunk at the time.

I don't think this carries through for AvP or Resurrection, which seemed to be horror movies with the standard tropes, though there were instances of presumption of personal immunity (even among some of the "monsters"). Some of these were rightfully violated, like the love interest in AvPR getting killed - it is a monster movie!
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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby JI_Joe84 » 2017-05-21 11:46pm

I finally got to see it last Friday. I kind of liked it, kinda saw where David was going especially at the last just kinda has me wondering cause the guy looked like the other David,what was his name?, How did he have time to make himself look exactly like him? Did he download​ his self into the other David?
I was kind of glad when the captain got a facehugger. The others not so much, except the idiot that saw alien puff balls and decided to fuck with them, I mean I know being on a alien planet with vegetation and breathable air would be incredible but you would expect some common sense. You can't just go romping around will nilly and not expect some kind of microbial infection trouble. Jeezus..

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Q99 » 2017-05-22 01:25am

Alien 1 had quarantine procedure, they just broke it after Dallas seemed fine and the alien was dead. It'd be interesting to see an alien movie where quarantine was 100% followed...

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Darth Nostril » 2017-05-22 02:29am

Q99 wrote:Alien 1 had quarantine procedure, they just broke it after Dallas seemed fine and the alien was dead. It'd be interesting to see an alien movie where quarantine was 100% followed...

You mean Kane (John Hurt) who went into the alien derelict and wound up with the facehugger on him. Dallas was the captain of the ship who went into the air ducts to flush the alien out with a flamethrower.
Also quarantine procedure was not followed at all, the android, Ash, deliberately broke procedure to let the infected crewmember on board. (As per his secret programming - crew expendable.)
After that it lied about Kane's condition, lied about the medi-scan results and did everything it could to keep the crew in the dark about the situation.

If it hadn't been for the reprogrammed android then Ripley would have got her way, quarantine procedures would have been followed and the whole cluster fuck would never have happened.
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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Q99 » 2017-05-22 05:47am

Been way too long since I watched that, thanks ^^

Anyway, yea- key point, they had a way to short circuit the whole chain of events, it was just circumvented.

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Raesene » 2017-05-23 03:51pm

Left the cinema at the time the first alien emerged out of the back of the crewman.

Kept away from spoilers until I watched it, didn't keep me interested in anything the characters were going to do (even after seeing them find Shaw's dogtag and picture) and I wasn't interested in a rehash of aliens ripping humans to pieces.
Reading through the thread now I don't think I missed anything except more stupid potential colonists who an hour or so after landing on a foreign planet start smoking after walking around without any idea about the planets ecosphere or perform similar acts.

At least I got to see the Star Wars trailer again on the big screen.

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Q99 » 2017-05-24 03:36am

One thing I'm hearing others note is apparently Alien Covenant has a lot of focus on the violation of women.

Which, of course, contrasts with the original Alien which opens up with the violation of a man, the original facehugging and chestbursting scene.

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Joun_Lord » 2017-05-24 08:14am

Q99 wrote:One thing I'm hearing others note is apparently Alien Covenant has a lot of focus on the violation of women.

Which, of course, contrasts with the original Alien which opens up with the violation of a man, the original facehugging and chestbursting scene.

In some ways yeah though this is a bit of a carry over from Promi. Women do arguably get it the worse, Shaw being impregnated by the trilobyte, Shaw being used for vaguely sexual experiments and killed off, Daniels apparently going to suffer the same fate, and women seemingly the main focus of the hallway quasi-slasher film chases.

Thats not to say men don't get violated too, Shaw's boyfriend getting black gooed date raped by David being a notable example in Promi, but maybe its just me and being kinda bored as fuck watching Covenant wondering when the purple wort wort aliens were going to show up to fight Jesus allegory Doomguy but it seemed that women were getting it worse. It seemed less equal opportunity violence and violation then other Alien movies.

All and all Covenant seems to follow more normal horror movie cliches then other Alien films. Panicky "female hysteria" that exists only to make the situation worse and show woman as emotional, female wandering off alone to be killed, and the tried and true and only appealing to teenage boys death of a woman after a nudey shower scene. Maybe its nostalgia goggles but I don't really remember the other Alien movies hitting the cliche points so hard. There was stupid characters but both men and women. There was TnA but it wasn't quite so blatant as some people snogging in a shower. There was tits in Alien Resurrection but I doubt anybody was really getting off on that particular scene.

I dunno, Covenant seems so damn lazy. But I'll admit I did not like the movie so perhaps I'm looking for shit to bitch about. Just wasn't a good prequel to Alien and not a good sequel to Prometheus

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby NecronLord » 2017-05-24 11:48am

Alien is of course, famous for largely having been written for 'male' protagonists with only surnames, then with each character being read for by both male and female actors.

Though notably, the scene with Ripley undressing before getting in the space-suit locker was a Ridley decision - in the script Roby (later Ripley) darts into the suit locker and pulls the suit on over his/her work-clothes. As was the decision to have Lambert's death be via penetration with the tail - that was even shot with an extra instead of Veronica Cartwright, and she was surprised to see that cut in the premier.

So this isn't really new for Ridley, if you want to make that argument.
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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Q99 » 2017-05-24 07:23pm

There's also the all about Riply surviving vs all about David causing everything angle.

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby JLTucker » 2017-05-26 08:56pm

I saw it and thought it was good. Prometheus and Alien 3 are far better, though. I enjoyed the religious angle in Covenant quite a bit. I'll post more later.

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Re: Alien Covenant

Postby Guardsman Bass » 2017-05-27 08:04pm

I saw it, and thought it kind of sucked. Visually it looks great, including the ship, the planet from orbit and the ground, and the xenomorphs themselves. But -

1. The plot's straightforward, but the third act aboard the ship feels really weird. The whole sequence where the xenomorph gets out even though the one guy never got successfully implanted with a facehugger and goes through the ship before they vent it into space (Act III) feels completely tacked-on. I can totally imagine a version of that film that doesn't include that, and goes straight from them getting back into space to them going back into hypersleep before the "It's David!" reveal and the ending of the film.

Maybe that's what Ridley Scott was talking about when he admitted that fan complaints influenced this film. The funny thing is that it's a great sequence even thought it does feel tacked on.

2. So, it's definitely got to be alternative continuity, right? David genocided all the Engineers on their own homeworld (which incidentally was also a visually good sequence), and the movie takes place in 2104. There's only 18 years for David's creation to spawn hundreds of eggs, get loaded on a Space Jockey ship, and crash on to LV-426 in time for the Nostromo to show up in 2122.

3. The movie is so David- and Walter-centric that I can't remember much about the other characters besides Daniels despite seeing it only a few hours ago. Ridley Scott seems to think David is really interesting, but I don't. He's just a mad robot creating monsters because he has a god complex and hates humanity.

4. Lots of character-stupid in this one, as others pointed out already. No masks or anything quarantine-related in terms of precautions (contrast that with Alien, where Ripley was going to keep them quarantined until Ash broke it himself), so they could readily suck up the alien spores.
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