(RAR) Fix Mega City One

SF: discuss futuristic sci-fi series, ideas, and crossovers.

Moderator: NecronLord

User avatar
Cykeisme
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 2416
Joined: 2004-12-25 01:47pm
Contact:

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by Cykeisme »

Guardsman Bass wrote:
madd0ctor wrote:Where does the infaltion drive come from?
Automation and technology makes some jobs rise in productivity, at least theoretically leading to higher wages in those jobs. Other jobs don't have productivity rises, but since costs of living often tend to go up over time, and the non-productivity-rising jobs have to pay enough to keep their people from leaving and going to do other jobs, the costs of having those jobs goes up even without productivity gains.

It's a problem in Economics called "Baumol's Cost Disease".
I'm not familiar with the term, but wouldn't that situation have the opposite effect, driving wages down?

If there's still the same number of people looking for that type of job, but fewer positions open, then the competition is fiercer among job candidates. Thus, the companies can afford to pay less, because the "job market" is saturated. Sort of like an extension of supply and demand.

I thought that was already happening with certain kinds of jobs, too.
"..history has shown the best defense against heavy cavalry are pikemen, so aircraft should mount lances on their noses and fly in tight squares to fend off bombers". - RedImperator

"ha ha, raping puppies is FUN!" - Johonebesus

"It would just be Unicron with pew pew instead of nom nom". - Vendetta, explaining his justified disinterest in the idea of the movie Allspark affecting the Death Star
User avatar
Guardsman Bass
Cowardly Codfish
Posts: 9281
Joined: 2002-07-07 12:01am
Location: Beneath the Deepest Sea

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by Guardsman Bass »

I think you misunderstood. With Baumol's Cost Disease, it's not that there are fewer positions but the same number of people - it's that there are the same number of positions and people required, but the String Quartet has to pay higher wages in order to get people to play in it as opposed to going off and doing higher paid jobs somewhere else. They have to raise their wages without any real increase in "output", which means that prices usually have to go up.
“It is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.”
-Jean-Luc Picard


"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood
User avatar
The Grim Squeaker
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10314
Joined: 2005-06-01 01:44am
Location: A different time-space Continuum
Contact:

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Guardsman Bass wrote: I don't think Mega City One's 90% unemployment rate makes sense (even aside from the fact that if they're not looking for jobs, they're technically not unemployed). With that much cheap labor, there should be companies using people to do all kinds of random tasks, even if it basically consists of the whole "monitor the robots to make sure they don't screw" type of thing or the 21st century equivalent of telemarketing/sweat shop labor.
That government stipend must be pretty generous and unconditional, sort of like how the unemployment rate in the Persian Gulf countries is really high among citizens because the oil-rich governments give them money (and their economies are built on the backs of imported labor).
.
The MegaCity 1 stiped is EXTREMELY generous, and unconditional. (It applies to all adult citizens as I recall, including those in the Iso-Cubes). It's around 2,000 Credits a month (which is mainly used on pure luxury). Housing as I recall (Judge Dredd RPG) is provided free, media and entertainment are free or massively subsidized, as are most services.
The RPG described it as being equivalent for any citizen to be able to indulge in a wide variety of constantly changing hobbies (including such things as flying, cosmetic surgery, extreme sports, immersive video games, etc' ), along with providing an indulgent and very high standard of living in terms of luxuries and (again, heavily subsidized) entertainment, some travel and food.
Think of the typical sterotypical american upper middle class family in exurbs.
Photography
Genius is always allowed some leeway, once the hammer has been pried from its hands and the blood has been cleaned up.
To improve is to change; to be perfect is to change often.
User avatar
NeoGoomba
Sith Devotee
Posts: 3269
Joined: 2002-12-22 11:35am
Location: Upstate New York

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by NeoGoomba »

This thread has been really goddamn interesting to me, and really makes me want to read some Dredd (especially after just watching the awesome Urban Dredd film. What would be a good tpb for me to start with, having never read any of it?
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know...tomorrow."
-Agent Kay
User avatar
The Grim Squeaker
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10314
Joined: 2005-06-01 01:44am
Location: A different time-space Continuum
Contact:

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

NeoGoomba wrote:This thread has been really goddamn interesting to me, and really makes me want to read some Dredd (especially after just watching the awesome Urban Dredd film. What would be a good tpb for me to start with, having never read any of it?
The Classics:
The Cursed Earth. The Judge Child. The Day the Law Died. The Dark Judges.
Image
Source
The Pitt.

Followed by: The Apocalypse War. America (A very different story). Origins. Necropolis (+ "The Dead Man"). Tour of Duty.
Photography
Genius is always allowed some leeway, once the hammer has been pried from its hands and the blood has been cleaned up.
To improve is to change; to be perfect is to change often.
User avatar
Guardsman Bass
Cowardly Codfish
Posts: 9281
Joined: 2002-07-07 12:01am
Location: Beneath the Deepest Sea

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by Guardsman Bass »

The Grim Squeaker wrote:The MegaCity 1 stiped is EXTREMELY generous, and unconditional. (It applies to all adult citizens as I recall, including those in the Iso-Cubes). It's around 2,000 Credits a month (which is mainly used on pure luxury). Housing as I recall (Judge Dredd RPG) is provided free, media and entertainment are free or massively subsidized, as are most services.
The RPG described it as being equivalent for any citizen to be able to indulge in a wide variety of constantly changing hobbies (including such things as flying, cosmetic surgery, extreme sports, immersive video games, etc' ), along with providing an indulgent and very high standard of living in terms of luxuries and (again, heavily subsidized) entertainment, some travel and food.
Think of the typical sterotypical american upper middle class family in exurbs.
That makes sense, then. Only a tiny fraction of the overall population would even be in the work-force, doing jobs either because they really like money, power, or civic duty.

So does the rampant crime happen simply because people have a ton of free time and get bored, or because of the frequent calamities that disrupt public order and leave everything in chaos to be sorted out all over again? I tend to think that people would more likely figure out stuff to do with their time, even if it's the equivalent of spending 12 hours a day in super-immersive video games playing with other people - like MMORPGs and Second Life on steroids. That's what old people who have retired generally do, if they're not decrepit and have the money for it.

I wonder if the place would have higher birth rate compared to now. The combination of greater automation and more free time means that people could more easily raise children. They probably need that if the mega-city is getting hammered over and over again.
“It is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.”
-Jean-Luc Picard


"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood
User avatar
Solauren
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10193
Joined: 2003-05-11 09:41pm

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by Solauren »

Question: Close to Memory + Personality Flash-Imprinting Technology is Mega City One?

Cause to me, it would seem the solution would be to take the best 30 judges (i.e Dredd and Anderson both come to mind), and mass produce them. Say a force equal to 5%of Mega City's Population.

Option #1
Then use this force to sweep up all the drug dealers and other offenders, and then take control and legalize the production of all narcotics in megacity, with centralized distribution centers.

Option #2
It also occurs to me that, if they have the technology, mandatory resettlement to other planets to set up colonies without a lot of automation, so people have to work to do.

Option #3 -
Set up and stick as many people as possible into 'the Matrix' or something similar.
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
User avatar
madd0ct0r
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 6259
Joined: 2008-03-14 07:47am

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by madd0ct0r »

Solauren wrote:Question: Close to Memory + Personality Flash-Imprinting Technology is Mega City One?

Cause to me, it would seem the solution would be to take the best 30 judges (i.e Dredd and Anderson both come to mind), and mass produce them.
it's been tried, and always results in hilarity.
"Aid, trade, green technology and peace." - Hans Rosling.
"Welcome to SDN, where we can't see the forest because walking into trees repeatedly feels good, bro." - Mr Coffee
User avatar
The Grim Squeaker
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10314
Joined: 2005-06-01 01:44am
Location: A different time-space Continuum
Contact:

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

madd0ct0r wrote:
Solauren wrote:Question: Close to Memory + Personality Flash-Imprinting Technology is Mega City One?

Cause to me, it would seem the solution would be to take the best 30 judges (i.e Dredd and Anderson both come to mind), and mass produce them.
it's been tried, and always results in hilarity.
That, and they do clone many ofthe best judges rather extensively. ((Joseph) Dredd himself, along with Rico Dredd, are clones of the founder of the justice system, Fargo Dredd)
Photography
Genius is always allowed some leeway, once the hammer has been pried from its hands and the blood has been cleaned up.
To improve is to change; to be perfect is to change often.
User avatar
FaxModem1
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 7700
Joined: 2002-10-30 06:40pm
Location: In a dark reflection of a better world

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by FaxModem1 »

How much of the galaxy is actually settled? They do have colonies in the solar system, but what about outside it? Could they make colony ships and send thousands or millions to settle other solar systems?
Image
User avatar
The Grim Squeaker
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10314
Joined: 2005-06-01 01:44am
Location: A different time-space Continuum
Contact:

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

FaxModem1 wrote:How much of the galaxy is actually settled? They do have colonies in the solar system, but what about outside it? Could they make colony ships and send thousands or millions to settle other solar systems?
The overall galaxy is quite densely populated , with a lot of other alien species and empires; And competition from the other mega cities, most of which have their own space programs. It's not quite as bad as "Old Man's War" , but colonies are far from being viable for relocating the majority of the population (as opposed to a small percentage of the population growth).
Photography
Genius is always allowed some leeway, once the hammer has been pried from its hands and the blood has been cleaned up.
To improve is to change; to be perfect is to change often.
User avatar
Guardsman Bass
Cowardly Codfish
Posts: 9281
Joined: 2002-07-07 12:01am
Location: Beneath the Deepest Sea

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by Guardsman Bass »

The Grim Squeaker wrote:
FaxModem1 wrote:How much of the galaxy is actually settled? They do have colonies in the solar system, but what about outside it? Could they make colony ships and send thousands or millions to settle other solar systems?
The overall galaxy is quite densely populated , with a lot of other alien species and empires; And competition from the other mega cities, most of which have their own space programs. It's not quite as bad as "Old Man's War" , but colonies are far from being viable for relocating the majority of the population (as opposed to a small percentage of the population growth).
It seems like they might benefit from O'Neill Cylinder-style colonies, assuming they can afford them. They could put up a couple of those in the solar system without encroaching on alien space.
“It is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.”
-Jean-Luc Picard


"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood
User avatar
FaxModem1
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 7700
Joined: 2002-10-30 06:40pm
Location: In a dark reflection of a better world

Re: (RAR) Fix Mega City One

Post by FaxModem1 »

So, essentially, make a bunch of cylinder space stations and have judges there acting as sheriffs? That and the non-lethal deputy robots seem to be the best solution until the Earth is habitable again.
Image
Post Reply