Best/Worst military forces in Science Fiction

[Stark]

Judging an entire military by one conceit is ALSO pretty funny. That's like saying Zeon is militarily incompetent because they use INEFFICIENT BIPEDAL ROBOTS and ignoring their conquest of 90% of the Earth's surface.

Of course, the S:AAB guys are basically a chain of failure, but using evidence and not OMG TEH PILOTZ would be a step up. There's a reason this thread is just arguing Halo canon and nitpicking SW bullshit and not a discussion of scifi. :v

[PeZook]

Wait, do you mean to say that using expensive, hard to replace personnell they're constantly short on for ground missions is not an example of incompetence? Systemic incompetence, even, since it's not a one-off desperate move taken to accomplish the one crucial mission...

They don't have any particular success despite that, either, so placing them amongst the "top three best forces in sci-fi" is clearly ridiculous.

[Stark]

Repeating yourself doesn't change anything. S:AAB is full of stupidity and failure and incompetence all operational and strategic levels, but you're too lazy to even look. You'd rather just repeat a dramatic conceit and look smug.

I'm not arguing with your conclusion. Your reasoning is just crap.

[Ahriman238]

This may sound like a stupid question, but 12 pages in have we so much as established what we mean by "best" military in science fiction? The most powerful, the most effective, most efficient, most accomplished? Most in line with our present understanding of tactics and doctrine?

The Culture is one of the least militant societies ever, and if they got serious they'd casually whip most of the options mentioned here.

[Stark]

Do you want me to link to Connors post about this? I couldn't be bothered either posting examples or responding to him further becauseneres clearly little interest beyond EWOKS RULE and MA5b HAS IRONZ.

[Ahriman238]

I know the topic was raised, but did anyone actually agree to anything?

[Stark]

The only person that replied agreed with me, so I like to think the matter was settled.

[Stofsk]

In a way, this thread's topic is a little broad and I can understand why discussion got dragged down quagmire-esque as people began nitpicking and defending against nitpicks (I'm as guilty of it as anyone else).

Someone mentioned the Space Patrol from Lensman ages ago. The theory is that they accomplished all their objectives, responded to their enemy's actions and strategies and developed countermeasures and counterstrategies, and in the end were wholly victorious. Stark's already mentioned GUNDAMU so there are at least a couple nominations for 'best' sci-fi military. Reinhard's Empire from LoGH is another possibility.

[Stark]

Since a lot of drama is driven by heroes, and thus the military has to fail, maybe it's best to start with media where the protagonists are military. Lensman is about Lensmen, Gundam is about fighter pilots, and they are often successful. S:AAB is a good example of the opposite; military characters who often fail to achieve their objectives.

[PainRack]

Its going to be hard to establish "best", but I reiterate, UN Freehold series has to be the worst military force in science fiction ever. Incompetent personnel, incompetent doctrine, no command worth mentioning and no means of addressing/reviewing the system.

[Tandrax218]

Since no one has elaborated what "best " means in this thread i will stick with Above and beyond.
They seem ok to me, and have less flaws than federation.

Oh and english s not my native language, so i appologise about interpunction or anything related to writing.

[evilsoup]

Why do you think they are the best?

[Tandrax218]

If we are to judge an army from what is shown in the series, or film or game , then i stick to the above. That army is capable of almost every mission that our present armyies are capable. When i look at federation for instance i see a tone of flaws. from ship desigh to tactics. I know that there are some stupid things in the show like pilots fighting on ground but i think its cuz they are the main characters. that kind of stuff happens in evey show: kirk fighting hand to hand on a planet even though he is a captain and he should not leave the bridge....
And at the end of the show they have a good chance to win the war ( AaB army).
+ i have said that its my own oppinion on the mater.

[Stark]

Do you feel that their constant failures are more a result of poor intelligence? How do you explain their clear qualitative superiority over the enemy and yet the long and high loss course of the war?

[Simon_Jester]

Since no one has elaborated what "best " means in this thread i will stick with Above and beyond.
They seem ok to me, and have less flaws than federation.

Oh and english s not my native language, so i appologise about interpunction or anything related to writing.

Frankly, most of your mistakes look more like someone typing with a busted keyboard and missing some of the keys than they do like someone who has actual unfamiliarity with the English language. Some things, like substituting "cuz" for "because" or complete rejection of the use of the "shift" key for proper nouns and the pronoun "I" sound... um.

[Tandrax218]

Do you feel that their constant failures are more a result of poor intelligence? How do you explain their clear qualitative superiority over the enemy and yet the long and high loss course of the war?

As i saw it the corporation that wanted to colonize the planet that was sacred to the Chigs was responsible for a lot of intelligence reports, but they did not want to pass the info to the army/navy/core.... so you get a long and costly war. + there is the part that the show was intended to have more than 1 season so they dragged the war a bit... But with better intel they could have steamrolled the Chigs and find out why the war started.

And if you look at the technology that the Terrans use here, its pretty starightforward and effective at what it does.

[Batman]

Let me get this straight-Tandrax218 thinks S:AAB is the best because...they don't suck quite as much as the Trek UFP.

[sandbagger]

I'm going to have to go with the armed forces of the Honorverse as among the best.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honorverse

With the Special Corps taking top honors. They have James Bolivar "Slippery Jim" "The Stainless Steel Rat" DiGriz working for them. And no military organization can top that.

http://www.iol.ie/~carrollm/hh/n02-.htm


On the other end. I'm going to have to go with the guys guarding Sil in Species. As being among the worst. And the US Army in the Return of the Living Dead series.

[Ford Prefect]

Big Boss is not impressed by these pretenders.

Militaires Sans Frontières is covering all the angles.

[Crazedwraith]

Please, Big Boss places all his faith in giant walking nuclear death tanks. That can and were taken out by a lone man on foot with a stinger missile.

[Stark]

Are we back to 'judge entire military force by single element I don't like' already? That's like saying Zeon sucks because a) they use STUPID ROBOTS OMG BUILD TANKS LAMERS and b) those robots were defeated by A HIGHSCHOOL BOY.

The phrase 'a stinger missile' makes you look pretty dumb, too.

[Crazedwraith]

Gosh, my ever so serious analysis of Ford's ever so serious post has been poo-pooed. Whatever shall I do?

[Stark]

Sorry was your post a joke or are you now butthurt someone laughed at you? I guess you've just got nothing to add to the thread!

What do we do about military forces that achieve their objectives but are clearly shown to be wrong? All kinds of scifi has the military taking over a situation from the protagonists and trivially destroying the threat to mankind, but is decision is often shown to be short sighted or prejudiced. Is this 'good' or 'bad'?

[aussiemuscle308]

1. no i've not read all 12 pages
2. Star Trek: We're going to war, lets send in all our scientific ships with families on board.
3. Stargate: We've got guns and they've got sticks. lets give up without firing a shot (We do this everytime encounter hostile alien).
4. Star Wars: tactic #1, rush at each other and shoot (kinda like space-chicken, blink and die).

[Batman]

3. Stargate: We've got guns and they've got sticks. lets give up without firing a shot (We do this everytime encounter hostile alien).

Which-never actually happens.