Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

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Who has the cooler ships?

The Empire
47
68%
The Alliance
22
32%
 
Total votes: 69

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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Darth Fanboy »

great pictures and review

Tristan is one of my favorite sci fi ship designs ever.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Thanks - one of my favorite things about doing this is I'm really noticing all these shots, because I'm on the lookout for them. The fact that some of the shots are re-mastered is a further bonus - for example, the shot of Tristan and Galga Farmr (with Skirnir's prow in the shot) is DVD exclusive - the original version just had Tristan.

That said, in Episode 46 (the episode that wraps up this battle) there's an objectively bad shot (few and far between throughout the series, which is why they're so noticeable) that wasn't fixed.

Look at this shot of the Galga Farmr:-

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Compare to this shot from a later episode:-

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Horrible, eh?

And then of course, this was just amusing:-

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Familiar?

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:)
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Darth Fanboy »

whoa, and on such a nice ship too. I guess they're entitled to one miscue every once in a while.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Chris OFarrell »

Spoiler
Recaputed Iserlohn?

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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Darth Fanboy »

Some of these shots Vympel has posted has me thinking something I really didn't put much thought into while watching the series, is there an obvious tactical advantage to the cross formation that we see so often? I assume its so that both the Z and Y axis are covered when approaching an enemy but I'm no Yang Wenli.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Simon_Jester »

Darth Fanboy wrote:Some of these shots Vympel has posted has me thinking something I really didn't put much thought into while watching the series, is there an obvious tactical advantage to the cross formation that we see so often? I assume its so that both the Z and Y axis are covered when approaching an enemy but I'm no Yang Wenli.
One possible advantage is sensor resolution; if the ships combine sensor pictures to get a "very large array" effect, you want long lines of ships extending in multiple directions out from the center, like the telescopes on the real Very Large Array.

Given some of the ranges I've heard thrown around, this would be absolutely essential for getting any kind of fire control solution on enemy ships at extreme range. Then again, questions of range, speed, and overall performance in LoGH are kind of schizophrenic, what with ships varying between "collision distance" (Overture to a New War) and "open fire, range is X light-minutes" (don't remember the source).
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Given some of the ranges I've heard thrown around, this would be absolutely essential for getting any kind of fire control solution on enemy ships at extreme range. Then again, questions of range, speed, and overall performance in LoGH are kind of schizophrenic, what with ships varying between "collision distance" (Overture to a New War) and "open fire, range is X light-minutes" (don't remember the source).
I've always found LOGH battles to be fairly consistent - battle begins at extreme ranges (multiple light seconds, not minutes) and then one side or the other may decide to 'charge' the enemy formation, breaking through and destroying its cohesion. An order that's given in the series often is for the cannons to be put in 'short range battle' mode.

The longest "open fire" range ever stated in the show is the Lutz Fleet during the battle with Maquis Littenheim during the Imperial Civil War - Littenheim opens fire on Lutz from an unreasonably long range, and Lutz orders a hold in return fire until they get within 6 million km (20 light seconds).

A range of 6.4 light seconds is mentioned in the battle between the Yang Fleet and 11th Fleet. After doing sufficient damage to the centre of the enemy formation, he sent in Guen van Hugh to split their fleet in two, then they surrounded them and pounded them to dust.

There are others, but my memory will be refreshed as I go through the battles. I think the question of weapons range in LOGH is determined by when you detect the enemy*, with the limit of weapons "lethal" range being in excess of 6 million km (Littenheim's fire was ineffective againt Lutz fleet's shields). Jamming is endemic in LOGH and active sensors like radar are compromised by 'electric wave interception' technology. Means of detecting the enemy is largely passive - thermal sensors, reconaissance ships and satellites, etc. There's an episode where Yang is talking about the end of the 'push button wars' in this context.

*Yang saw the 11th Fleet at 6.4 light seconds then opened fire, the 11th Fleet only knew Yang was there when it detected the energy wave coming in - makes sense, 6.4 light seconds means 6.4 seconds until the beams from Yang's fleet get there.

EDIT: For some reason I had 12 million km in my head when I wrote this. Its 6 million. Edited.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Elessar »

Great job on the coverage of the retaking of Iserlorn. It was enjoyable seeing how the fortress could actually be taken when there is a refreshing number of sane and competent minds on both sides of the battlefield. Disabling the Thor Hammer through timing rather than blood was always one of the more impressive tactical achievements.

I also wanted to say that this thread is one of the most valuable in this forum. I look forward to each and every post... it's been years since I watched the series myself (when I was a fair bit younger) and just reading the synopsis makes me realize how much I content I missed on the first viewing. They really packed it full of detail, and your posts are doing a great job at unraveling it all.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Crossroads Inc. »

Given such a huge show, you forget a few things... I was re watching Ep 60 through 70 as a refresher, and in 67 I came across the speech given after the events of the "Uprising"
on Heinessen. Spoiler
There is a part of me that feels Reinhard specifically went back to war with the remains of the Alliance just to force Yang's hand into another hopeful engagement with him. In terms of what was left of the alliance, there was little to no need for further military action, at least not on a wide scale action like what happened. They could have easily bided their time and let the Alliance areas integrate into the Empire. but Reinhard desperately wanted to meet Yang on the field of battle, and so there needed to BE battle for that to happen. I don't know if this is a failing on his part, or just a reflection of the thinking of people in the Empire as a whole. I mean after all, many of the top brass were 100% Certain that Yang was setting himself up to take over the Alliance in a military coup, they simply could not conceive he would want to settle down and lead a quiet life.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Invasion of Fezzan

High Admiral Reuenthal’s call for ‘reinforcements’ triggered the main Imperial operation to invade Alliance space via the Fezzan Corridor.

The Imperial Force

The forces for the Fezzan Corridor operation were defined at the same time as Admiral Reuenthal’s forces were:-

• High Admiral Mittermeyer would lead the Fezzan-bound fleet, and invade Alliance territory.

• The second formation would be led by Admiral Müller, who had recovered from his wounds.

• Duke Lohengramm would command the third formation personally, placing each of the fleets led by Vice Admirals Aldringen, Brauhitch, Carnap Grünemann and Thurneysen under his direct command. Aboard the supreme flagship Brunhild, Chief of Staff High Admiral Oberstein would be present, together with Chief Adjutant, Rear Admiral Streit, Adjutant, Lieutenant Rücke, and Chief of the personal guards, Captain Kisling. Private Secretary Hildegard von Mariendorf would also be aboard, and would be treated as if she were a Commander.

• The fourth force would be led by Admiral Steinmetz. If the Fezzan Corridor became sealed after the invasion, it would turn around and re-open it.

• The fifth force would be led Admiral Wahlen, and would have the responsibility of connecting the Fezzan Corridor and Imperial territory.

• The fleets of Admirals Fahrenheit and Bittenfeld would stand by in reserve. Both were very strong in offensive operations, and would be used when it came time to deliver the death blow to the Alliance Fleet.

• Admiral Eisenach would support the Iserlohn Fleet. Though he had yet to distinguish himself in battle, he was highly competent in rear guard duty, diversionary operations, and land battle support.

• Admiral Kesler was Capital Defense Commander, whilst Admiral Mecklinger would be in chare of rear support. Both would remain on Odin.

Start of the grand deception

Both the Alliance and Fezzan were oblivious to Duke Lohengramm’s true intentions. Both believed that more Imperial fleets were being dispatched to the Iserlohn Corridor, in response to Reuenthal’s request. Indeed, Adrian Rubinsky even had a video recording from Imperial Fleet HQ, with Duke Lohengramm ordering Mittermeyer, Steinmetz, Wahlen and Müller to launch.

Lohengramm even indicated - in the same recording - that he would join them at Iserlohn if they needed more reinforcements.

On 9 December 789, the fleets of Mittermeyer, Steinmetz, Wahlen and Müller launched from Odin.

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Liftoff

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Lübeck and Salamander

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Fezzan is taken

The arrival of Mitteremeyer’s fleet in the Fezzan Corridor - more than 20,000 ships - was a complete surprise.

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The apex of Fezzan’s orbital elevator

As the Imperial Fleet landed, Rubinsky realized he had been completely outwitted by Lohengramm, and that Boltik had gone over to his side. Kesserling, Rubinsky’s illegitimate son, was killed in an ill-conceived assassination attempt. He had believed that Rubinsky’s time was over, and in his absence he would gain control over Fezzan.

Rubinsky decided to imitate Job Trunicht – he would hide in safety until the time came to retake Fezzan.

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Beowulf, landed next to the base of Fezzan’s orbital elevator

The Imperial forces targeted the Landesherr’s office, the Alliance High Commissioner’s office, the Space Navigation Office, the Public Broadcast Center, the Central Traffic Office, the Orbital Elevator Control Center, the Goods Circulation Control Center, Police Headquarters, Ground Traffic Control Center, and the Hydrogen Motive Power Center.

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AFVs pour out of Imperial ships

The first three were the most critical targets – the data in their computers was valuable. Massacre of civilians, pillaging, and violence towards women was strictly forbidden on Mittermeyer’s orders.

Julian Mintz and Machungo, his guard, rushed to the Alliance High Commission, urging the High Commissioner to erase everything in the Commission’s computer.

By the time Mintz was done erasing the files, the entire Commission had been abandoned, except by High Commissioner Henslow, who begged Mintz to keep him safe. To buy them time to escape, Mintz set up a time-switch activated automatic firing device for a rifle. On the Imperial force’s arrival, they were held up for valuable minutes, fearing an ambush if they entered too hastily.

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An armored vehicle’s cannon responds to the rifle fire

Julian decided on finding an independent merchant to take them away from Fezzan and back to the Alliance.

Having subdued Fezzan, Mittermeyer set up a temporary command post at the Hotel Vltava. He proved himself an able administrator by keeping the economy running relatively freely, with citizens being encouraged to go about their normal lives. Price gouging was strictly forbidden. In maintaining public order, two Imperial soldiers were publicly executed by firing squad for raping a Fezzani woman, with Mittermeyer personally present, to the applause of the Fezzani crowd.

Müller’s Fleet arrived at 1500 hours on the same day.

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Lübeck lands next to Beowulf

Mintz, Machungo, and Henslow contracted the services of Marinesk, a Fezzani merchant and captain of the merchant ship Berezka, to get them off Fezzan.

On 30 December 798, Duke Lohengramm himself landed on Fezzan, his assembled troops proclaiming “Sieg Mein Kaiser!”. Lohengramm mused that they were impatient.

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Brunhild landing

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On 31 December, a New Year’s Eve Party was held on Fezzan with Reinhard and his assembled officers. Mittermeyer remained for 2 hours after the clock ushered in Imperial Year 490 (Space Year 799), and then his fleet departed for Alliance space.

Free Planets Alliance Response

News that Fezzan had fallen to the Empire created a panic. The government tried to control the media (hoping to release the news at the best time), but to no avail – ships from Fezzan had already spread the news.

In the midst of the crisis, Job Trunicht withdrew from the High Council. National Defence Committee Chairman Islands was left to manage affairs. The Council decided that they would fight, with Admiral Bucock being given the task of getting the Alliance in a position to sign a peace treaty. Bucock agreed, and headed to the Strategic Planning Centre to speak to formulate a strategy with Admiral Dawson.

Apart from the Yang Fleet, the only Alliance Fleet still intact was the 1st Fleet, commanded by Vice Admiral Paetta (who had received the position after Admiral Kubersly’s promotion).

At the same time, new fleets were formed from various sources (defence fleets, patrol fleets, worn out fleets, and untested new fleets). In this manner they were able to collect a total of about 20,000 ships. This collection of ships became the 14th and 15th Fleets, commanded by Vice Admiral Lionel Morton and Vice Admiral Ralph Carlsen, respectively.

With such little strength, they would be unable to put up a defence at the Alliance side of the Fezzan Corridor. Bucock’s strategy, therefore, would be to draw the Imperial fleet deep into Alliance territory, wait until their supplies ran low, and attack from behind, causing enough damage to force a withdrawal.

It was Rear Admiral Chung Wu-Cheng, the newly-appointed Chief of the General Staff Office (after the former chief, Ozman, suffered an aneurysm from overwork) who suggested that Yang be recalled from Iserlohn Fortress – his fleet, and his skill, would be invaluable in extracting a peace treaty. Chung likened his being left at Iserlohn to ‘putting freshly baked bread in the refrigerator’ – the approach of the enemy via Fezzan had rendered Iserlohn’s strategic value to the Alliance meaningless. Further, if a peace treaty could be achieved, the return of Iserlohn to the Empire would undoubtedly be a treaty condition.

They decided to give Yang a general order that “The Fleet General Staff Office will take all responsibility. You shall take whatever action you feel is best”. Yang would surely not be too keen on protecting Iserlohn himself, and take the hint.

Admiral Bucock was promoted to Fleet Admiral before the fleets left Heinessen.

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Alliance shuttles bear the officers up to their fleets in orbit

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Job Trunicht watches the launch, surrounded by Earth Church members

The Empire enters Alliance space

On 8 January 799, Mittermeyer’s Fleet exited the Fezzan Corridor into Alliance space, with no opposition present.

On 20 January 799, Reinhard, on Fezzan, received the report that High Admiral Reuenthal had retaken Iserlohn (communications were suffering from some time delay, since they had to be relayed through Odin). With the news that Yang had abandoned Iserlohn, Reinhard’s view that Yang sought to kill him in battle was confirmed. In any event, Reinhard took it as a good sign for the beginning of his campaign. Notwithstanding Yang’s intentions, the Duke would still lead the battle by himself – he reasoned that he fought his own battles distinguished him from the high nobles, and it was also the reason why the soldiers followed him. Mariendorf’s entreaties for him to avoid “meaningless battle” and return to the capital were rebuffed.

On the same day that Reinhard departed Fezzan, the Black Lancers and the Fahrenheit Fleet arrived and made planetfall. They were to join the operation to invade the Alliance after a short break. With them was Boltik, ready to assume control over Fezzan as temporary viceroy.

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Königstiger on approach

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Admiral Fahrenheit’s flagship, the Asgrim, prior to retracting its antennae for landing

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Reinhard and his staff about to board Brunhild, flanked by the Forkel and the Salamander

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Liftoff

Imperial Preparations for Battle

On 30 January, the Imperial fleets gathered in the Holbit system, including the Black Lancers and the Fahrenheit Fleet.

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The fleets gather

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Brunhild, with Beowulf, Salamander, Lübeck and Forkel

Although some ground troops had been left on Fezzan, the combined fleets still totaled 112,700 warships, 41,900 support ships, and 16,600,000 men.

At a staff meeting on Brunhild, High Admiral Mittermeyer noted that the Holbit System was likely the limit of where the Alliance could allow them to advance. According to information obtained on Fezzan, no inhabited planets were located between the Holbit to the Rantemario system. Therefore, to avoid damage to citizens, the Rantemario system was chosen as the location for the decisive battle, with Reinhard’s consent.

Reinhard decided on a ‘two headed snake’ battle formation. He would command the front ‘head’ of the snake. Steinmetz would command the fleet behind the front ‘head’. Mittermeyer would command the ‘body’ – if the Alliance fleet tried to split them up, they would surely attack the middle – in which case Mittermeyer would be at the front of the battle. Müller would be the fourth group, whilst Wahlen would command the other ‘head’ of the snake. Fahrenheit and Bittenfeld would remain in reserve.

Again, Reinhard ignored pleas – this time from Admiral Müller- for Reinhard to remain in the rear and watch his forces from a position of safety. In any event, the snake formation had no ‘rear’.

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The Imperial plan

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Mittermeyer comments to Müller

Alliance Preparations for Battle

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The Rio Grande, with unidentified flagships visible in the background

Fleet Admiral Bucock chose the Rantemario system as the last line of defence. If the Imperial fleet got past Rantemario, they would proceed through the Jamseed and Kerim systems on their way to Heinessen. Every inhabited system had been authorized to surrender to Imperial forces unconditionally if attacked - and there were many inhabited planets along the way from Rantemario to the Barlat system (Heinessen’s star system).

Though they knew the Yang Fleet was on the way, Yang would have to drop off Iserlohn’s civilian population on a safe planet – the Alliance commanders figured they could not count on him to arrive at Rantemario until 15 February – 15 more days.

Though it was in their interests for the battle at Rantemario to occur as late as possible, Yang would be followed by High Admiral Reuenthal. Therefore, the ideal situation was for the battle to occur after they had joined up with Yang, but before Reuenthal joined up with Lohengramm.

Worse, there was nothing to stop another Imperial fleet attacking Heinessen whilst the battle took place. In preparation for such a contingency, civilians on Heinessen were being moved to safety.

The Alliance fleet was in an impossible situation. Because of the time constraints, the battle would realistically begin with their being at a significant disadvantage. The Alliance fleet had a total of 32,900 warships and 5,206,000 men. The Alliance fleet was therefore outnumbered by over a 3 to 1 margin. Further, the Imperial Fleet was highly experienced and had high morale, whereas the Alliance fleet had been hastily thrown together.

On 1 February, the Imperial Fleet commenced its journey to Rantemario.

The Battle of Rantemario

At 1240 hours on 7 February 799, the Alliance fleet received data on the Imperial fleet formation for the first time. The Imperial Fleet’s route would take them just through the orbit of the second planet in the Rantemario system.

The formation was recognized for what it was, but Bucock had no options – Duke Lohengramm had them cornered tactically. They would have to attack the mid-section of the Imperial fleet, with the intent of destroying them, fleet by fleet. The key was for the mid-section to be destroyed before they could be surrounded by the left and right wings of the enemy formation.

8 February

The next day, with the Imperial fleet 5.25 light seconds from contact, Fleet Admiral Bucock was discussing their opening moves with Chung when a section of the Alliance fleet opened fire, without orders to do so. It was a natural consequence of a hodgepodge fleet.

His hand forced, Bucock committed all ships to the attack at 1345 hours.

After 30 minutes, Mittermeyer ordered his entire fleet to advance together, a simple provocation, to see how the enemy would react.

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Mittermeyer advances

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Rio Grande in battle

Bucock recognized it as an intimidation tactic and urged his staff not to be fooled. Nonetheless, the sighting of Beowulf unnerved elements of the fleet.

In particular, Rear Admirals Marinetti and Zarnial ordered an all out attack.

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Marinetti’s flagship Rustam goes all out, launching missiles and firing its cannons

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Zarnial’s flagship Belenus

Surprisingly, the concentration of firepower put a crack in Mittermeyer’s formation.

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Beowulf under pressure

Emboldened, Marinetti and Zarnial charged to press their advantage, with no regard for their losses. Close quarter combat ensued, including ramming attacks.

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An Imperial cruiser collides with a friendly battleship, and is then rammed by an Alliance battleship

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”This is ridiculous!” – Mittermeyer on the recklessness of the Alliance attack

Mittermeyer, frustrated, ordered a retreat to disperse the enemy attack – the small portion of the Alliance fleet attacking would soon reach their limit.

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Neither Bucock or Lohengramm had any illusion about the reason for the Alliance’s temporary success

Reinhard characterized Mittermeyer as a bull fighter, currently reserving his strength and waiting for a good chance. In any event, he decided it was time to attack, just in case Mittermeyer was really having trouble.

”This is like a tiger getting confused because an untrained hunting dog is barking fiercely at it. If they try their best, we’ll be completely crushed.” – Chung

Bucock decided to reign his forces in, and gave the order for them to return to formation at 1500 hours.

The moment Marinetti and Zarnial began to retreat, Mittermeyer’s fleet turned to pursue. At the same time, the rest of the Imperial fleet made its move.

Bucock ordered the entire fleet to retreat to the orbit of the first planet in the solar system.

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The Alliance beats a retreat as the Imperial fleet moves to surround them

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Brunhild in battle

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Forkel’s forward cannons

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Lübeck’s dorsal cannon

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The Alliance fleet is battered

At 1600 hours, Admiral Wahlen ordered his fleet to concentrate their fire on the enemy’s right wing, with the intent of splitting the Alliance fleet from there.

By 1900 hours, Admiral Buteney’s fleet on the right wing had been reduced from 840 ships to 130. With 80% losses in just three hours, it was no longer able to act as part of the formation.

In response, Bucock ordered the 14th Fleet to plug the gap. Concentrating all his fire on the tip of Wahlen’s wedge formation, Vice Admiral Morton succeeded in doing so by 1945 hours.

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The 14th Fleet concentrates its fire on Wahlen’s wedge formation

Wahlen then spread out his fleet to wear down the right wing gradually.

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At 2000 hours, Admiral Fahrenheit commenced an attempt to sneak around the enemy’s rear, leaving the Alliance right to Wahlen.

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Asgrim

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Fahrenheit’s planned final position, with Wahlen’s fleet elongated against Mouton also visible

Unfortunately for Fahrenheit, the energy released by the wreckage of both fleets was being pulled in by the Rantemario star, catching his fleet in a “space current” going between the Imperial fleet and the Alliance, from the 3 o’clock to 9 o’clock position.

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Fahrenheit’s fleet is caught in the current

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A fast battleship about to be destroyed by an energy discharge

Initially, Fahrenheit ordered a full speed advance through the current – but it was stronger than he thought, and his fleet took some losses from ship debris and energy discharges. As things stood, the fleet’s monitors were unstable, and they risked being pulled into the Rantemario star. Fahrenheit gave up on the idea – with victory assured, he saw no need to waste lives to hasten it. Fahrneheit pulled his fleet back, and concentrated on long range fighting.

At this stage, Bucock realized that his strategy of splitting the Imperial fleet had completely failed. Their only hope would be to survive and wait for the arrival of the Yang Fleet. So Bucock would concentrate not on victory, but in staving off defeat for as long as possible.

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Bucock confers with Chung

At 2130, Admiral Bittenfeld was getting impatient for action – the Black Lancers had not yet been committed. He wryly decided to move his fleet beside Duke Lohengramm’s fleet – not to ‘advertise our presence’, as his subordinates suggested, but to wait at a place where he could “hear Duke Lohengramm better”.

Also – if the Black Lancers were ordered to cross the energy current, then they would cross ‘upstream’ – from the right wing. Bittenfeld’s move was executed at 2145 hours.

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Brunhild firing away

By this point, Duke Lohengramm realized that like High Admiral Merkatz, Fleet Admiral Bucock was an old man who would not be defeated easily. Though victory was inevitable, Reinhard was concerned with the fatigue of the troops – it had already been ten hours since the beginning of the battle. The fleets were ordered to pull back to reorganize their formation – during which the crews could eat and sleep.

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And Hildegard von Mariendorf, too

9 February

Battle recommenced at 0900 hours the next day.

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Battle is rejoined

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The fleets pound away at each other

Bucock ordered his fleet to concentrate on defense – his ships even hid behind the wreckage of destroyed ships to shield themselves from enemy fire.

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An Alliance destroyer descends from behind wreckage to fire cannons and missiles before ducking back to avoid return fire

Chung suggested another strategy – the fleet launched its Spartanian fighters, whilst all battleships and carriers in the fleet were placed under central command.

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A carrier launches Spartanians

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Beowulf

Mittermeyer declined to send out Valkyries in response. He figured that doing so would make the battle chaotic, and the Imperial fleet wouldn’t be able to fire freely – which was probably the enemies’ aim. He restricted his fleet’s reply to capital ship cannon fire from Rear Admiral Droisen’s and Rear Admiral Sinzer’s fleets.

Advancing to attack the enemy fighters, elements of their fleets went too far, and came under withering cross fire from the Alliance fleet.

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A destroyer is caught in a cross-fire

When they attempted retreat, the Alliance pounced – with Spartanian strafing and capital ship fire attacking only the Imperial ships’ engines.

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A cruiser’s engines are lanced

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Disabled battleship

In this way, the Imperial fleet was unable to fire without hitting their own disabled ships in front of them. Mittermeyer, impressed, pulled Droisen and Sinzer back. Engineering ships were sent forward to rescue the disabled waships by 1045.

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Engineering ship collects a cruiser. The ship in the background has picked up two.

Mittermeyer reported to Duke Lohengramm:- “Our victory is still inevitable. But the enemy is still under control and in good order.” High Admiral Oberstein advised that they needed to deal a heavy blow and cause critical damage to the enemy.

Lohengramm then sent a message to Admiral Bittenfeld:-

“It’s your turn. Hang the enemy commander’s beret on the Black Lancer’s spear and deliver it to me.”

With a whistle from Bittenfeld, the Black Lancers surged forward at 1100 hours.

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Noting the Black Lancers move, all the other Imperial fleets present implemented an all out attack – Mittermeyer noted “We can’t allow the Black Lancers to take all the best meat from the prey.”

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Rear Admiral Bayerlein’s battleship, the Heorot, advances on Mittermeyer's orders

Bittenfeld ordered the Black Lancers right through the energy current at full speed. The Alliance responded with concentrated fire at their calculated exit point at 1120.

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It was not enough – Bittenfeld exhorted his fleet forward. With a massive display of firepower, the Alliance formation was thoroughly smashed.

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Black Lancer fast battleships push forward

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Königstiger leads the way

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An Alliance destroyer goes up

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As does a battleship

All battleships and carriers under central command were destroyed. The shattered remnants requested permission to retreat.

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The Black Lancer’s handiwork

Bucock, beaten, left the bridge for his quarters, saying he needed time alone.

In his quarters, he pulled out his service pistol and a notepad, ready to commit suicide. Admiral Chung came in and urged him to reconsider. He referred to Admiral Merkatz’s perseverance after his own defeat - and had also taken the pistol’s energy pack in any event.

Bucock argued that with the fleet destroyed, there was no reason for him to live. Further, he had to take responsibility for all of the deaths under his command. Chung responded that the Yang Fleet still existed. More importantly, he noted that when the war was over, the Empire would hold a trial for war criminals – and if he killed himself, then the officers under his command could be used as scapegoats. Both he, Chung and Admiral Dawson had to live, even if only to die before a firing squad later.

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At this point, in the Imperial rear, where repair operations on damaged ships were ongoing, an approaching fleet was detected by the engineering ship Overhausen, of Müller’s fleet.

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Overhausen is attacked by an unidentified fleet

The attack from the rear sent the Imperial fleet into a panic. Mittermeyer ordered an immediate halt to the advance against the Alliance fleet, to prepare for an enemy attack to the rear. Wild speculation ensued amongst the Admirals - that the forward fleet had been a decoy, and the real aim had been to cut off their path to Imperial space from the rear. With the Imperial fleet 2,800 light years into Alliance territory, the situation was ripe for fear to cause confusion and disorder, notwithstanding the victory.

Bucock, who had returned to the bridge, took his chance. The remnants of the Alliance fleet opened fire in unison as they retreated.

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Duke Lohengramm took charge of the situation – sending a message to the entire fleet:-

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“What are we afraid of? If there are new Alliance forces, we’ll just crush them one by one. Do not panic! Retreat in order! Even if they cut off our rear, we’ll just crush the Alliance and take Heinessen, and then return to the Empire through Iserlohn. That is all.”

Mittermeyer apologized for his conduct, and for the fleet’s disorder. Lohengramm accepted his reaction as only natural – they would proceed with caution. Both agreed it was the work of Yang Wen-li.

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It was indeed the Yang Fleet. As the Alliance remnants retreated towards Barlat, and the Imperial fleet withdrew in the other direction, Yang lamented his tardiness – he had been half a day too late. Worse, if he had informed Admiral Bucock, he could’ve fought differently, and prevented many deaths.

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Hyperion and Triglav

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The screen shows the Imperial fleet moving away as Yang moves to join Bucock

The Yang Fleet hurried for Barlat as well, before Reuenthal arrived. On the way, the Airged Lamh detected a single Imperial destroyer approaching. It was Ensign Julian Mintz, who had successfully escaped Fezzan and succeeded in capturing the patrol ship, after their merchant ship had been boarded.

Aftermath

Yang had prevented the total destruction of the Alliance Fleet, but only a small fraction of the original force was left. Two hours after his arrival on Heinessen, Yang was promoted to Fleet Admiral. At the age of 32, he was the youngest Fleet Admiral in Alliance history.

In addition, Rear Admirals Murai, Attenborough and Fischer of the Yang Fleet were all promoted to Vice Admiral. Commodore Patrichev was promoted to Rear Admiral.

For his actions in capturing an Imperial destroyer and saving the Alliance High Commissioner, Ensign Mintz was promoted to Lieutenant Junior Grade, and became something of a public hero in his own right.

The Imperial fleet traveled 2.4 light years to the Gandharva System, to take the second planet, Urvashi. When all the Alliance territories were to fall, Urvashi was to be the Empire’s primary base in Alliance territory.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Made some changes:-

To the skirmish between Eihendorf's and Attenborough's fleet, I corrected the name of the Alliance space carrier from Amltat to the correct Ameretat.

To the Battle of the Fortresses, I amended Muller's name to the appropriate Müller, and Lubeck to Lübeck. I also noted Patolicken's battleship's name as the Langenberg - I'll need to make these changes to numerous earlier entries as the whim takes me.

I also noticed an interesting inconsistency - in the Battle of the Fortresses, Mittermeyer's subordinate admirals - Bayerlein, Droisen, Buro, and Sinzer clearly wear the uniforms of Vice Admirals (two bars). Yet in the later Battle of Rantemario, we see all of them again - with the uniforms of Rear Admirals (one bar). An annoying inconsistency. I'm not sure which is correct.

EDIT: never mind, I just checked ahead at Episode 53. Rear Admiral is correct by preponderance of evidence and dialogue. Editing Battle of the Fortresses accordingly.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

More changes. Looking at the Battle of Astarte again, I noticed I had no bloody pictures of Patroclus, Leonidas or Pergamon - so I added them. Furthermore, I added images from one of the info-dump episodes of the Battle of the Dagon System, where we get a look at the battleships of the Alliance and the Empire during that battle.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Added pictures of Rear Admiral Fogel's battleship Watzmann and Rear Admiral Erlache's battleship Heilenheim to the Astarte entry.

All the pictures I've added to that entry lately :)

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I got Admin rights on the LOGH wiki and quickly set about improving it by replacing screenshots, adding entries, deleting/ fixing some wrong classifications, etc. The guys who made it are moving it to a different, non-wikia format now so I've stopped until they complete the move, which commenced today. I was getting on quite the roll!
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Darth Fanboy »

Alliance ships continue to grow on me, I havent watched any LoGH for a while (needed a break after all the watching I had done in a short span) and where once I would have said Lohengramm or Mittermeyer would have been my favorite character, I think i'm fully switched over to the Yang Wenli camp now.

Well, him and Dominique...yow.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Connor MacLeod »

I suppose I shoudl get my ass around to watching that. I probably could contribute something worthwhile to the dscussion then.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by wautd »

Episode 95isch:
Spoiler
Man, pretty much the whole series there's a buildup where is insinuated that Reuentall will rebel, but when he actually does it's way to sporadic for my taste. The rebellion itself was also way too short and I found the 2 battles one of the most boring of the whole series. His character deserved more in my opinion. Such a letdown.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Spoiler
I thought Reuenthal's ill-fated rebellion and death was tragic. However, the battles were weak - and I think I know why. Way too much narration. Seriously, the narrator never stopped talking. But I wouldn't have had Reuenthal perish in any other way - he was loyal to the end, he rebelled purely out of pride, and I think he knew that he had no chance of winning. The numerical disparity was simply too great. Even though the battles were weak in terms of excitement, they did both cement how awesome both he and Mittermeyer were at command. Reuenthal's injury and the way he directed his fleet back to Heinessen regardless is one of the most badass moments in the series - and the battle also gets credit for giving Wahlen a cool line re: his cybernetic arm
In the meantime, made some changes to the Alliance Civil War. I had misidentified the 11th Fleet flagsip - its Leonidas II, not Abai Geser. Abai Geser is Commodore Stocks ship, which is this, a modified standard battleship design with extra antennae:-

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Which has now been added.

Its really an inexcusable error, if I had checked the names properly on the relevant miniatures I wouldn't have made the mistake. :(

EDIT: also corrected the name of Erlache's flagship to the correct Heidenheim.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Further change- noted Fahrenheit's standard battleship name as Darmstadt. Found it on a more complete Japanese fansite, accurate in every other detail.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Further change to Reuenthal vs Iserlohn - the name of the Alliance battleship with the pennant no. 109-A is the Oxiana, and the pennant no. 27-B is Ljubljana. Screenshots of both being destroyed were present in the entry, so might as well name them if I know, right? :)

EDIT: they're named in the episode, but until recently I didn't have confirmation which number applied to which ship.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by wautd »

In the grim, dark future, there is only was.

And based on episode 104, Microsoft is still kicking around too :lol:
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by wautd »

... and finished with the series. Unless maybe the prequelcif it's any good.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

The prequel Gaiden are good fun, with the exception of Spiral Labyrinth (14-episode arc about Yang Wen-li). Its very boring, and doesn't really go anywhere. Only brightspot is flashbacks of battles of Bruce Ashbey, the Alliance's previous great Admiral, and some old-school Imperial and Alliance warship designs (i.e. around 60 years prior to the events of the main series).

Central Anime has done DVD rips of most of Season 2 of the Gaiden (you can always tell because they're in .mkv) but Season 1 (which is the stronger season, IMO) is still in laserdisc rip, so far.

Basically, I recommend them. The stories aren't as strong, but if you want to see more battles and the adventures of Reinhard & Kircheis (with the exception of Spiral Labyrinth that's what they all focus on) then you can't go wrong. They run from Reinhard as a junior officer fresh out of academy to the 3rd Battle of Tiamat, after which he's gifted with Brunhild - though "Dishonor", one of the Season 1 arcs, is set between My Conquest Is a Sea of Stars and Overture to a New War.

One bad spot about Season 2 is that the animation is all in the 'remastered' style used for several shots throughout the DVD remaster. Whilst its fine for characters and such, it doesn't work as well for the space battles, and IMO its simply not as good as the 'standard' animation used for space battles.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by wautd »

Yeah, just started it and it looks very promising what with the Byzantine politics and all.

And tanks in japanese sci-fi anime? Heresy!
Must be because they're space Germans :mrgreen:
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Uraniun235 »

It's not unheard of. The old Matsumoto space opera anime also lacked walkers.
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Re: Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Battles (Spoilers)

Post by Vympel »

Besides, the FPA has tanks too. But remember we saw their (wheeled) AFVs multiple times throughout the series. The firepower of the Alliance one in particular in Episode 14 was impressive (completely blows up an entire house in one shot).
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