Old Imperial Armour 1, 2, and 3 analyiss/discussion thread

[Connor MacLeod]

This is where I start covering the Imperial Armour supplements, including the Forge World ones. Given the size of hte newer ones, I'll probably cover those independently. The "older" versions are small enough to warrant combining in one thread.

The "Old" forge world IA stuff is from the early 2000-2002 period (and I believe out of print.) To be honest, the Imperial stats tend not to differ much from what is already presented in the latter IA books, so you may wonder why I bother with these. Well, there are two reasons:

1.) these older ones cover some vehciles from other races and give them stats (Orks, Eldar, Tau) that the latter IA books don't cover quite as extensively (yet)

2.) there are details in these earlier books different frrom the latter, and details not present (such as a Short story by Gav Thorpe in the old IA1.) That's why I'm covering them.

Note that since many stats will simply carry over to the newer IA1 book I won't repeat them. Instead I'll merely say "same as new IA!" or something like that, rather than waste time duplicating stuff I know (or remember) as being redundant. I'm just covering the obvious differences (or data not included) between old and new ones.

PAge 6
Leman Russ Conqueror
Weight: 62 tonnes.. Length/width/height same as in in the newer IA1.

Barrel length: 2.42M

ARmour: 45-200mm

Max speed: 34 kph on road, 24 kph off road

Conqueor has coaxial storm bolter.

Main ammo: 36 rounds.

Fording depth. 1.9m


page 6

The Conqueror was first used to equip the Tech Guard on Gryphonne IV supporting the War Griffons Titan Legion during the Relief of Castra Septus. The conquerors kept up with the Titan's advance...[/qutoe]

This suggests that the Conquerors are meant to be as fast as a Titan. Logically, this would include Warhound titans, as they are the ones most often in need of armour supportt.

Page 7

Although lighter armed, the Conqeuror is far more mobile, and makes an excellent tank for the spearhead of an armoured attack, supported by Armoured Fist squads which can keep up.

I find it odd that the Conqueror is meant to be far more mobile than a standard Russ, yet its speed isn' tmuch different (slightly worse, at least on road) than the Regular Russ.

I also find it odd that the Conqueror is notable for keeping up with "armoured fists" - ie Chimeras, suince thats something a normal Russ can do - any tank really - if the Chimeras slow down. Which in turn suggests that a Conqueror should be able to keep pace with a Chimera.

Page 8

Thunderer Siege tank stats:

Weight : 52 tonnes.. (other stats stil the same as IA1 new version)

Barrel Length: 1.75m

armour: 45-200mm

MAximum speed: 32 kph on road, 22 kph off road.

Fording depth: 1.9m



Page 10

Destroyer Tank Hunter:

Weight: 52 tonnes (other stats same as new IA1)

Barrel length: 5.04M

Armour: 45-200mm

Maximum speeD: 50 kph on road, 36 kph off road

Ammunition: 20 shots/powerpack

Fording depth: 1.9 m


Page 10

Destroyers are usually deployed well back, in hiding, weapons trained ready to ambush enemy armoured columns. After a couple lof long-range shots the Destroyer will change firing positions to avoid return fire should they have been spotted.

This would tend to suggest that Destroyers are limited to "line of sight" targeting, and implies they may be longer ranged than other tanks.

Page 12
Vanquisher stats:

weight: 64 tonnes (other stats same as IA1)

Barrel length: 6.5m

armour: 45-200mm

Maximum speed: 30 kph on road, 18 kph off road.

Vanquisher Battle cannon has coaxial storm bolter.

Ammo: 28 round capacity

Fording depth: 1.9m.


PAge 14
Stygies -pattern Russ

Weight: 63 tonnes (same stats otherwise for dimensions as IA1)

Barrel length: 5.7m

Armour: 45-200mm

Maximum speed: 32 kph on road, 19 kph off road

Same ammo and fording depth as other vanquisher.


Page 14

The Stygies VIII Vanquisher utilises a version of the vanquisher cannon that, whilst lacking the immense length of the Gryphonne IV guns to generate shell velocity, utilises a slightly smaller calibre shell with increased barrel rifling. Secret knowledge, jealously guarded by the Adeptus Mechanicus on Stygies VIII, is used for better gun stabilising and reocil dampening after each shot to counteract the worst effects of the weapoon's violent kick.

Differences between Vanquisher patterns in their weaponry.

Page 16
Executioner stats:

Mass 63 tons. (other dimensions same as IA1 new)

Barel length: 1.92m

Armour: 45-200mm

Max speed: 30 kph on road, 18 kph off road.

ammo: 12 shots on photonic hydrogen cell

Fording depth: 1.9m


Page 20

While a true Baneblade uses much more powerful rocket-propelled shells in its main battle cannon, a second generation Baneblade (as the Adepts of mars refer to these tanks) uses only stnadard battlecannon ammunition.

Baneblades use rocket propelled ammo (as do, we learn, Basilisks in later IA1.) This tends to suggest the ability to utilize rocket assisted artillery in tank weapons is not unheard of and can be scaled (after all, they can miniaturize it down to bolters, as well as up to baneblade battle cannons, so it could be for the intermediate tanks like the Russ as well.) This would, in turn, help explain why tank rounds can generate such insane momentum (or range) without knocking the tank aorund.

Page 20

The original Baneblade deisgn has improved internal armour bracing, greater engine performance and transmission, superior comms and tactical logic engines and all manner of secondary systems which are far superior to those of the second-generation war machines.[

Internal systems of a Baneblade.

Page 21
Baneblade stats:

Mass: 316 tonnes (all other dimensions same)

Barrel length (Battle cannon): 5.40 m

Armour: 80-220mm

Armament: "mega battle cannon" with coaxial mounted autocannon. 22 ropunds for MBC

Fording depth: 3.10 m


Page 22

The remote controlled sponson weapons are replaced by crewed versions, targeting eq uipment and logis engines are more primitive and the capacitors or engine are lss efficient.

Comments on "counterfeit Shadowswords and how they differ from "True" Shadowswords.

Page 23
Shadowsword statS:

weight: 308 tons (other stats the same still)

Barrel length (volcano cannon) 9 m

Armour: 80-220mm

Ammo supply for Shadowsword: "Unlimited; gun charged by engine through generator."

Fording depth: 3.10 m

Page 24
Salamander Command stats:

Weight: 32 tonnes

barrel length: 1.2 m (flamer?)

Maximum speed: 70 kph on road, 55 kph off road

Main ammo (flamer) 20 shots.

Fording depth: 1.2m

Page 26

Salamander scout vehicle

Weight 33 tons (other stats like in IA1 new)

Barrel lenght (autocannon) 2.7m

Armour: 80-150mm

Max speed: 100 kph on road, 78 kph off road.

main ammo (autocannon) 160 rounds.

fording depth: 1.2 M

Page 28

Chimera stats


All stats except following same as in IA1 (new)

Barrel length (heavy bolter) .9m

ammo: 900 rounds.

Fording depth: amphibious.

[Ford Prefect]

This would tend to suggest that Destroyers are limited to "line of sight" targeting, and implies they may be longer ranged than other tanks.

Destroyers have a hull-mounted turbolaser (as I recall). They probably have to-the-horizon range, especially given that there is a White Dwarf article that implies that lascannons have a similarly long effective range.

[Ryan Thunder]

This would tend to suggest that Destroyers are limited to "line of sight" targeting, and implies they may be longer ranged than other tanks.

Destroyers have a hull-mounted turbolaser (as I recall). They probably have to-the-horizon range, especially given that there is a White Dwarf article that implies that lascannons have a similarly long effective range.

For what little it's worth; they're very short-ranged on the table top compared to most artillery.

A Basilisk's Earthshaker gun, which is at the lower end of Imperial artillery IIRC, often has a 120" range, while a lascannon has a 48" range, and a battle cannon goes up to 72".

Now, these ranges don't convert to anything (or don't seem to, anyways), as I think you may know already, but it does seem to indicate either (A) so-called 'conventional' Imperial weapons have a pretty long range, or (B) lascannons have a pretty short range.

[Ford Prefect]

Strictly speaking, even though a laser should be able to hit everything you can see*, ballistic weapons have the bonus of being ballistic, and can avoid having the curvature of the planet get in the way. I mean, I suppose if you've got a really big laser you can just try shooting through the bits of crust in the way, but even the imperium isn't quite that silly.

*More or less. Obviously their are mitigating factors in regards to beam intensity and so on.

[Teleros]

I mean, I suppose if you've got a really big laser you can just try shooting through the bits of crust in the way, but even the imperium isn't quite that silly.

Well, not just to go after an enemy tank . Sounds like something an ork would try though .

[Connor MacLeod]

Its not a hull mounted turbolaser, its called a "Laser Destroyer". Titan weapons only show up on superheavies. Its somewhere between the two I think (a specialized weapon and supposedly a "harder to produce" one now, making Destroyers supposedly rare - YAY more GRIMDARK!)

As far as the range thing goes.. I guess that depends on the source, since we've seen examples of tank guns doing indirect fire (At least against some targets) so it may depend on alot of factors. Hell, Imperial "tank vs tank" battles (like we see in the Ghosts) seem to rely on close range duelling - same with orks sometimes (probably something to do with durability vs firepower.)

[Connor MacLeod]

Another update.. alot more numerical stuff

Page 35

Units raised on Krieg do not follow the standard organisations of the Imperial Guard, with a "Division" being made up of two armoured regiments each of between six and eight armoured comapnies. Each division also includes supporting infantry and artillery elements.

Krieg's troop structures at least as per the "old" Imperial armour books. How much of this holds over in the new stuff is probably variable. Given this seems to apply to "armour" and "armoured fist" groups rather than infantry or siege regiments, it could be.

Interesting that the Kriegers, who are perhaps the most "trench warfare" oriented of the Guard, seem to have considerable flexibility in their organization (they include organic armour and artillery as well as mechanized infantry.) They also seem to use a "division" organzation rather than a "regiment."

PAge 35

Note the replacement barresl on both the Battle Cannon and Demolisher cannon...

...barrels would usually be expected to last between 20-30 thousand rounds.

the lifespan of barrels on Krieger Baneblades, but presumably may apply to other vehicles. This is probably quite impressive, given that as far as I can tell, the Abrams has a "lifespan" of some 4,500 rounds, or about 1/4-/1/5th.


Page 50

Trojan stats:

Weight: 3.3 tonnes (error?)

(other stats the same still)

armour: 80-90mm

Maximum speed: 80 kph on road, 60 kph off road.

Fording Depth: amphibious.



Page 50 - Trojan variants include: dedicatd communications vehicles, ambulances, mobile kitchens, engineering vehicles (mine sweepers/bridge layers)

Page 54
Earthshaker platform stats:

Same as in IA one save the following:

Weight: 21 tonnes, gun shield armour 60mm.

Barrel length: 9 m calibre: 12.5cm

muzzle velocity: 410 mps

-note the muzzle velocity and calibre differ from the newer IA suppelments (which go with MV's of around 800+ mps and 132mm calibre)

Page 56
Hydra stats:

Weight: 38 tonnes (other stats same as IA1)

Barrel length: 4.8m

Max speed: 65 kph on road, 50 kph off road.

Armour: 80-150mm

Fording depth: 1.5m

Page 56

the Hydra's turret is equipped with tracking and targeting euqipment, and a remote turret, ,whcih means that once it is locked on to an aircraft, the guns will remain aimed at the target regardless of any evaseive manoeuvres it may attempt.

[/quote][/quote]

Hey, automation and sophisticated targeting systems on guard vehilces. how world war 1/2....

Page 60
Manticore stats:
Weight: 38 tons (rest same as IA1)

Armour: 80-150mm

Max speed: 60kph on road, 45 kph off road.

Fording depth: 1.5M

Page 62

Manticore platform stats:

Same as IA1 save:

Weight: 23 tonnes.

Missile length: 4.3m

Armour: 60-80mm

Page 64- Medusa fording depth: 1.5m

[The Dark]

Another update.. alot more numerical stuff

Page 35

Units raised on Krieg do not follow the standard organisations of the Imperial Guard, with a "Division" being made up of two armoured regiments each of between six and eight armoured comapnies. Each division also includes supporting infantry and artillery elements.

Krieg's troop structures at least as per the "old" Imperial armour books. How much of this holds over in the new stuff is probably variable. Given this seems to apply to "armour" and "armoured fist" groups rather than infantry or siege regiments, it could be.

Interesting that the Kriegers, who are perhaps the most "trench warfare" oriented of the Guard, seem to have considerable flexibility in their organization (they include organic armour and artillery as well as mechanized infantry.) They also seem to use a "division" organzation rather than a "regiment."

It's variable (or retconned) - in IA5, they don't detail higher than company level, but the discussion of DKK tactics mentions a regimental organization.

A Krieg Infantry Company has 10 platoons plus a heavy weapons platoon, plus an HQ squad and two grenadier squads in Centaurs. The other 715 men are pure foot infantry. The TO&E for this (paper) company is:

1 Captain
11 Lieutenants
75 Watchmaster (sergeant equivalent)
653 Other Ranks

3 Centaur Carriers

11 Mortars
9 Lascannons
8 Heavy Bolters
8 Heavy Stubbers
5 Autocannon
2 Heavy Flamers
19 Flamers
19 Grenade Launchers
18 Plasma Guns
18 Melta-Guns
18 Hellguns
712 Lasguns
32 Laspistols

Each platoon has a heavy weapons squad. 1 & 6 use Heavy Stubbers. 2 & 7 use Heavy Bolters. 3 & 8 use Autocannon. 4 & 9 use Lascannon, and 5 & 10 use Mortars. The heavy weapons platoon has 3 Heavy Stubbers, 6 Heavy Bolters, 3 Autocannon, 7 Lascannon, and 9 Mortars. The last 3 Stubbers are mounted on the Centaurs.

It's possible to mount a platoon in a Gorgon, but its description states they're not commonly used except during major offensives.



A field artillery company has 3 batteries of four guns each, all with a Centaur to tow. Each battery also has an HQ mounted in a Centaur. There are 4 ammo trailers hauled by Trojans, an Atlas recovery vehicle, a Trojan comms vehicle, and a company HQ in a Centaur, for a total of 12 guns, 22 vehicles, and an estimated total of 135 personnel.
IA6 (Vraks 2) probably has a little bit more about Death Korps organization, but I don't have a copy of that one.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Is there a reason why the second generation of baneblades are inferior to the original designs? Or did they decide to streamline the production process?

[Sea Skimmer]

the lifespan of barrels on Krieger Baneblades, but presumably may apply to other vehicles. This is probably quite impressive, given that as far as I can tell, the Abrams has a "lifespan" of some 4,500 rounds, or about 1/4-/1/5th.

The M256 tank gun has a varying life depending on what ammo is used, from about 280 rounds firing the latest M829A3 sabot to about 1000 rounds with M865 training sabot ammo. The original M829 sabot was not nearly as hot a round and let the barrel last about 600 rounds. 280 rounds looks shitty and it kind of is, but when you consider the accuracy and lethality of modern tanks guns, it hardly matters. A tank will be destroyed long before it can find targets for 280 rounds of sabot, even with only 33% accuracy that’s still enough to wipe out an entire Soviet tank regiment. In the entire Gulf war we destroyed maybe 2000 Iraqi tanks by all means on the ground, the collective barrel life of about 7-8 of the 2,000~ M1 tanks deployed for the war. Not one Abrams fired off its basic load of ammo.

If you saw a figure that quoted 4,500 rounds, that’s probably in reference to the life of the gun with multiple relinings. Work is currently underway on a new 120mm tank gun and new ammunition for FCS with the goal of a 1,500 round life between relining, IIRC they’ve now reached around 1,300 rounds in firing trials.

Hey, automation and sophisticated targeting systems on guard vehilces. how world war 1/2....

Sophisticated? Interesting conclusion to make on essentially zero data, for all we know it could be using a pecking pidgin with chaos powers that let it see through clouds for tracking.

As it is so basically described it really does only requires WW2 technology, SCR-584 radar as capable of autonomous target acquisition and tracking with sufficient accuracy to control four separate 90mm AA guns in 1942. It wasn’t small, but you probably could pack it into freaking 300 ton tanks which only have 220mm thick armor. If you replaced the computer with a 1950s computer that would be certain.

The ZSU-23-4 was also essentially mid 1950s technology by US standards, abet the more backward Soviets took until 1964 to get it into service, in part because they wanted it to engage a target while scanning for others, which required packing in two separate radars. No one puts such systems on real life tanks because of numerous practical (traverse/elevation/ROF/emission control limits) and cost related issues, but US tanks do have a proximity fused HEAT round for engaging helicopters.

No question exists in any case that the design mentality behind 40K tanks is stuck in WW1, even if the technology might not be. Side sponsons, multiple main gun barrels, high profiles, wrap around tracks, relatively thin armor on general massive vehicles. Those features all make sense for shooting up soft targets in slow moving trench warfare against an enemy lacking in effective anti tank weapons, and are all disadvantages for mobile warfare.

[Connor MacLeod]

Sophisticated? Interesting conclusion to make on essentially zero data, for all we know it could be using a pecking pidgin with chaos powers that let it see through clouds for tracking.

Sorry, I should have specified that other sources (the redone IA1, 40K apocalypse, etc.) specify that Hydra turrets are indeed automated (operated by a "machine spirit" in Apocalypse and an "automated turret" in the revised IA1)

[Connor MacLeod]

Is there a reason why the second generation of baneblades are inferior to the original designs? Or did they decide to streamline the production process?

Basically some Forge Worlds are known to specialize in some designs and they don't share (other than Mars, which has eveything, and Mars is picky who it shares with) so they have to rely on alternate means of developing them (which can result in varying quality.) There may be some "streamlining/mass producing" about it though too, but its mainyl variation in quality (like most IG tech really) though I dont think the variation is significant enough (at least for performance.)

[Connor MacLeod]

Last installment for the old IA1 book.. I really liked the short story.. wish I'd been able to get more solid calcs from it


Page 66

The comms set was squawking nonsense as he pressed it hard against his ear, trying to listen over the clanking of tracks and the rumbling of the big overcharged engine of the Vanquisher.

Vanquisher tank with "overcharged" engines. Its worth noting that regular Russ tanks aren't overcharged, as a rule,a nd certainly not Vanquishers. (This means this particular Vanquisher will be faster than a regular Vanquisher.)

Page 66

"This is Serpent Three," the voice on the other end crackled. One of the Salamander Scout vechiled reporting in. "We have sighted enemy mechanised formation six miles to the west of your position."

..

"What is their course and strength?" Vorto demanded...

"Several Predators, Rhinos, two Land Raiders, heading south-east at roughly thirty, three-zero, miles per hour," Serpent three told them.

...

The Traitor Marines would be moving behind them soon, cutting them off from the main army following up a day behind them.

...

There was a bluff a couple of miles to the Southwest, if they could beat the Traitor column there, they could probably hold them off.

..

"Serpent Squadron, keep them in view, let me know of any change."

..

"Red Company, turn by squadron, bear 200 degrees. Acclerate to full battle speed!"

..

"Mechanised company Lucius, we are adjusting course to 200 hundred degrees" he told the following infantry formation. "Follow us at battle speed and send forward your Destroyers."

Leaving the comms-mic dangling on its cord, Vorto clambered back out of the turret again and watched as the company drew to a shuddering halt, slipping and sliding in the treacherous sands. Prime squadron, his three assault Conquerors, churned around and set off again, followed by the three standard Leman Russ of Secundus Squadron.

A CSM force (Predators, Rhinos and a couple Land Raiders) are travelling at 30 mph to the southeast. They are currently west of the Guard force (Conquerors, Russes, and some Vanquishers, as well as Salamanders and Chimeras). They are converging on a bluff (southeast for the CSMs, South west for the Guard). The CSM are 6 miles away, the guard "a few miles" (2-3 miles).

We also know (later) that the engagement doesn't actually happen for a few minutes after they get there. This really isnt enough to give us "accuratE" estimates, but we can make some assumptions. Assume a 2 mile cannon range (optimum), which is reasonable (Given Necropolis mentions 1 km "point blank" range and 4-5 km ranges for tank guns, at least.) we can infer some minimum speeds.

If the range of engagement is 2 miles, this means the CSMs crossed 4 miles at 30 mph. which took ~8 minutes to do. IF we assume the Guard formation covered 2 miles in this time This comes out to 24 kph... which is the minimu offroad speed for a Russ. This is a nice lower limit, but we know the Russes are faster. If it were 3 miles rathr than 2, its 22.5 Mph, or 36 kph, which is faster.

If we assume a 3-4 mile "optimum" range (about what the upper limit below I figured below is), the CSM forces crossed 2-3 miles, which is between 4 and 6 minutes. At 2 miles, this is between 20 and 30 mph off road speed. At 3 miles distance its 30 to 45 mph off road max speed. The actual value should probably fall somewhere in the middle of those values. Its also indirectly hinted that the Guard forces may be roughly as fast (or nearly as fast) as the CSM forces.

given that a Russ probably has 2-3 mile range I would guess at an off road speed of around 20-30 mph in this instance, but that's purely conjecture on my part (but reasonable conjecture I think.) I really wish I'd been able to pin these down much better (or ranges, for that matter.)

Page 67

Well standard on paper, the hand-picked crews had tinkered and modified the tanks over the last three months of war, and he expected a tech-priest would have a heart attack if one ever saw some of the changes they'd made.

Illegal modifications to the tanks to make them better. Such as the aforementioend engine imrpovements to make them faster. This indicates that alot of Guard Tech is "under-powered" deliberately, probably for reliability/maintenance purposes, but that it can be "improved."


Page 67

Finally, Triplus Squadron followed, his two executioners and another Vanquisher. He was rocked to one side as his driver, Krondil, brought Old Relentless onto the new course and they lurched forward again, the grinding of gears shuddering through the tank's hull.

Gazing out from the turret of Old Relentless, Vorto could see the enemy column approaching, or rather the trail of sand cloud left in its wake. His tanks were at the edge of the small cliff-like bluff, but far enough back so that they were hull down, only their turrets presenting a target to the incoming Traitor Marines. The two Destroyer tank hunters were drawn up on his right, while the shorter ranged Conquerors were even further eastward at the far end of the bluff, ready to counter-attack across the plain below with the infantry in their Chimeras.

It was a tense few minutes as the dust cloud approached closer. To the left and right of the sand bank he could see smaller trails from the recce vehciles as the yshadowed the Traitor's advance. They wouldn't be much use in a tank battle, but he had warned their crews to be ready to dart forward and pick on any surviving crews or any of the Traitor Marines that may disembark from the Rhinos.

Another half a minute ticked by. Vorto resisted the temptation to check that the other crews were ready and loaded. They were well trained, forged in battle for several months now, and he knew the gunners were already picking their targets from among the hazy shadows within the sand cloud.

Concentrate fire on the Land Raiders for the first salvo," he told the other commanders over the comm link. The Marine tanks were tougher than his Leman Russ, and their targeter-assisted lascannons would pick them off one-by-one if given the chance. A whine of turret motors drew his attneiton to his left as Secundus Two adjusted its aim slightly. In front of him, the long Vanquisher cannon dipped slowly, compensating for the shortening range of the enemy.

... [Short prayer to emperor follows]

..If they failed here, the whole counterattack would falter, three months of hard fighting could be wasted in the next few minutes.

"Targets in optimum range," he heard Bagrazi reportt. Even as he opened his mouth to speak, three puffs of smoke spread into the approaching dust and a moment later the edge of the bluff exploded into shrapnel, flinging dirt and rock across the front of the Leman Russ to his left.

"Open fire!" he bellowed, not needing the comm unit to be heard by the other commanders. With an almighty roar the company fired. Shells whined into the distance, accompanied by the searing white-hot plasma burst sform the Executioners.

It took a couple of minutes after the Guard forces arrives/

We also know they were in "optimum" range, but in practice they could have fired at a longer range.

Alternately, we know they were in line of sight (or, above the horizon, about 7-8 km for a Russ) before the engagement began, meaning that the engagement range after a few minutes couldn't have been much more than 5-6 km, once you account for the time that passed before they fired.

At the very minimum (as above) we can assume a good 2-3 km range for "optimum", and thats not likely maximum, as the Predators can engage them with their (less powerful) autocannons at htis range.

Also note that the time of travel for the shots was about a second or so, which reinforces the idea its at least several miles.

Page 68

a moment later a bolt of laser energy spat ouf ot he dust, tearing through the turret of one of the Executioners, ,detonating the plasma cells in a fireball that sent a wave of heat washing over Vorto. He didn't want to look, but he found himself checking to see if any of the crew had gotten out. In the billowing black smoke and tangled metal he coudl see three burning skeletons, flesh stripped from them by the blast. Of the commander there was no sign, ,disintegrated by the plasma detonation.

Page 68

The engine of the Leman Russ roared into full life now like the bellowing of an angry god. He was glad for the improvements made by Durango, the driver, as he pushed Old Relentless into top gear.

Again, note that the tank engines are "improved.

Page 68-69 while moving (possibly at top speed still) the Vanquisher and other Russes open fire on the Space Marine vehicles.

Page 69

Old Relentless' next shot followed the previous one almost exactly, slamming a Chaos Marine off his feet before smashing out the back end of the Land Raider.

Vanquisher shot overpenetrates both a CSM and a CSM Land Raider.

Page 69

Shells from the remaining Conquerors took instant revenge, a near-simultaneous blast smashing into the side of the now lone preadator and ripping through armour, rocking it sideways across the sand.

One of the Conquerors was just destroyed by the Predator that the other two Conquerors destroyed, the shells from the Conqueror manage to exert enough momentum to knock the tank sideways. Wether it was from teh shell's impact or an explosion, is up for debate. Either way, it just reinforces the idea of just how much punishment is needed to damage an Imperium (or Chaos) tank (as we know from Honour Guard, Strom of Iron, Dawn of War, Necropolis, Dark Apostle, etc.)


PAge 75

He cut loose with his afterburners and the achripelago of reefs and coral islands shot past beneath the blunt body of this Thunderbolt in a blur.

Thunderbolts have afterburners.

Page 75

Sure enough, the Ork fighters, trailing their distinctive fossil fuel emissions, dived even more sharply to follow him.

Ork fighters running on "fossil fuel" emissions. Its implied here that Imperium fighters don't.

Page 75

An island appeared on the scanners: it was only twenty clicks away.

Scanner range of at least twenty kilometers. This is presumably an active scanning range, as it can map out terrain (an island.)

PAge 76

Marauder Payload: 2000 kg (10 x 200 kg high explosive bombs.) This seems (subjectively) a bit low, but this may be compensated for by the (arguably) higher "per bomb" yields of 40K explosive tech.

Page 76

They [marauders] are often based on orbiting spacecraft, and can operate in the vacuum of space just as well as in a planet's atmosphere. In prolonged campaigns naval airfields will be established on the ground. Due to the Marauder's long range these can be far from the frontline, safely away from enemy attakcs, even on another continent!

"operate just as well in space as in planetary atmosphere" implies similar performance in both enviroments (or at least the capacity to - it doesnt mean they do or it is wise to always do so.)

Also mention of deployment options and strategies for fighters in war zones. Note the implied inter-continental range.

Page 78

- Marauder Destroyer has a 1000 kg bomb payload (5 x 200 kg high explosive bombs)

Page 79

Tech-priests added tracking and sensor systems, which enabled the Destroyer to fly and fight in the dark at heights as low as 100 metres and speeds exceeding 1500 kph

[/quote]

Marauder Destroyers have sensor systems, and can night-fly very low to the ground at supersonic speeds.

[Connor MacLeod]

A few quotes I forgot to add for IA1... addendum

Page 24

The 21st Kriegs Panzer was committed to the Oxide Deserts of Quatara to defend important industrial faiclities and the coastal ports serving those faiclities from a suspected Ork invsion from the planet's second continent.

..

Fierce fighting took place over the featureless oxide plains. Characteristically battles occured at vey long ranges as all vehicle movement was marked by tall dust columns, with no cover to disguise an attack.

The implication is that the battles occured between targets that would be "at the horizon" or nearly out of line of sight - all you could make out were dust columns. This either suggests a sort of indirect fire or very long range direct fire was employed, though we don't know the kinds of vehicles doing it. Range-wise, if we're tlaking a Russ or Chimera chassis, the range is liekly around 6-8 km or so if at the horizon.

Page 27

"Souped-up engines: Because they operate so far in front of the main units the crews of Salmander scout vehicles often overcharge the engines of their vehicles in order ot make a swift escape shoudl they encounter strong enemy forcecs. Imperial commanders tend to overlook such breaches of regulations given the dangerous missions lightly equipped scout units often have to perform."

This is from the Salamander entry and makes its way into later IA books. What makes this particular quote interesting is the fact that its the scout crews and not the Techpriests that overcharge the engines, despite being a "breach of protocol." This indicates that the engines are normally capable of higher performance but are deliberately downgraded (or "Governed" as I mentioned earlier.) Which meshes perfectly with the Gav Thorpe short story.

It also indicates that despite absurd orders given from above, commanders in the field will ignore them in the face of practicality or logic (which works given the distances and difficulties in communication in the Imperium.) In fact, the implication would be that engine modification is a fairly common practice. Its quite likely then that other vehicles may similarily be "overcharged" unofficially as well (which may account for cases of Tanks moving faster than some sourcees, like IA, suggest.)

Page 28

The Forge world of Gryphonne IV produces its own unique Chimera variant, armed with twin-linked heavy bolters.

Some Chimeras apaprently have twin heavy weapons rather than singlesin their turrets (presumably you could fit in twin autocannon, twin lascannon, etc.)

PAge 54

Whilst the Imperial Guard are famous for their tanks, they are not always required to conduct mobile battles. Many Imperial guard regiments man static defensive positions, or permanantly garrison stron gpoints guarding important static locations, such as starports or bridges.

When manning a static defensive position, mobility is not needed. The Earthshaker artillery gun is mounted upon a cruciform firing platform rather than the more common Basilisk chassis.

The Guard can and does appear to practice mobilitary warfare, although they still embrace other aspects of warfare also (siege warfare, defensive warfare in static positions, etc.) according to circumstance, regimental traditions/specialization, or both.

It also suggests that the Earthshaker on a static platform is not neccearily always different/less powerful than one on a Basilisk (which may be why some Basislisks are anchored down before firing, like in Storm of Iron)

[Ford Prefect]

Some Chimeras apaprently have twin heavy weapons rather than singlesin their turrets (presumably you could fit in twin autocannon, twin lascannon, etc.)

I'm not so sure about that, at least not without changing the size of the turret itself. Twin-linked heavy bolters are significantly smaller in comparison to twin-linked lascannons; autocannons are probably larger as well (roughly 120mm, given statements comparing them to modern tank guns). Admittedly, there is considerable variation possible in size for all these weapons.

[TheMuffinKing]

Some Chimeras apaprently have twin heavy weapons rather than singlesin their turrets (presumably you could fit in twin autocannon, twin lascannon, etc.)

I'm not so sure about that, at least not without changing the size of the turret itself. Twin-linked heavy bolters are significantly smaller in comparison to twin-linked lascannons; autocannons are probably larger as well (roughly 120mm, given statements comparing them to modern tank guns). Admittedly, there is considerable variation possible in size for all these weapons.

What if they are mounted in a remote operated turret? Accounting for variations in size, they could fit fine in a modified turret on a chimera. As to autocannon statements, keep in mind that modern autocannon have ammo capable of penetrating t-54's along the frontal arc and t-72's around the sides and rear. Not that that really matters, just throwing that out there.

[Connor MacLeod]

The IA old sourcecbook thread is back now, ,this update deals with Eldar and Dark Eldar stuff - the
stats n stuff from the older edition IA2. This stuff is worth noting/commenting on because its older, and it covers alot of non-Imperial stuff as well (like Orks.) which IMHo is quite useful.

I have to note the masses of many of the vehicles are, personally, odd, but this may be Eldar "supertech" at work

Page 10


Wave serpent stats:

Length: 11.25m, Height: 3.62M, wingspan 7.31m

Estimated weight: 10 tonnes

Barrel length (this example) 2.5m - example has twin bright lances and twin shuriken catapluts.

Ammo capacity: 4000 shots (estimated) from powerpack for lancees.

armour: 10-15mm material unknown.

Combat Speed: 80 kph Estimated max speed: 320 kph.

Transports: 10 troops


Page 13

A night spinner is seen opening fire by an Imperial augur probe

caption for an image of the Night Spinner grav tank.. I'm not sure what an "augur probe" is supposed to be, though. It may be a targeting/sensor system on a vehicle, or some sort of surveillance/recon device, the existence of which has been mentioned before.

Page 14
Scorpion stats:

Length: 18.43m, height: 6.8m, wingspan 10.31m, estimated weight: 70 tonnes. Barrel length: 10.31m

ARmour: 12-15mm material unknown. combat speed: 60 kph, estimated max speed: 280kph

Armament: twin linked pulsars, Bright lance. Main ammo: 1000 shots estimated.


Page 14

The holo field uses image distortion to protect it from direct hits.

A holo-field fractures the image of a moving scorpion. To the naked eye an active holofield will appear as a sudden swirl of colours. Gunners report it is very hard to target a holo-field protected target with any degree of certainty of knowing if or where a shot will hit. Even the most blessed targeting and tracking devices can be blinded by the disruptive energies.

This seems to suggest that alot of "targeting/tracking" systems (automatic ones even?) are largely optical in nature, perhaps automatic. Though we know from titan and Capship examples that holofields can disrupt pretty much any kind of sensor, even psyhchically.

PAge 14

The Scorpion's Pulsars are huge weapons, using similar technology to that of a Bright Lance, but each weapon is 4 or 5 times the size. Each shot from a pulsar has been proved capable of cutting through the thickest armour, ,of slicing a Leman Russ battle tank clean in two, or destroying a building with a single shot.

Comment on the capability of a Scorpion Tank's weapons. Blowing a building up in a single shot (which basically means creating an explosion with a laser pulse) should at least be equal to a large bomb (high MJ low GJ range, at bare minimum, probably significantly higher.)

Cutting a russ in half assuming a 15 cm diameter beam (conjectural, but not unrasonable) assuming iron and 90% empty means affecting 3 tons of mass, which depending on if it melts/vaporizes its way through could be single or double digit GJ, minimum.

Page 14

Even whilst flying at high speeds, jinxing and weavin, popping up from cover for onyl the briefest second, the Scorpion can still lock onto a target and fire with letahl accuracy.

Ability to pop up and fire its guns within a second. This suggests they should be capable of vertical accelerations of a better part of a gee (or more).

Page 15 - Note that Engines of Vaul are protected by an "energy field" called an Eldar field (like a Wave Skimmer it seems) I find it odd that wave skimmers and such can have shielding, ,but Eldar craft ()and starships) are described as not having a void shield/power field analogue., I'm guessing this is more game mechanics and balancing than logic, although one could reconcile that such devices (At least for craft) may impose undesirable volume constraints.

PAge 15

A targeter struggles to penetrate the disruptive holo-field of a scorpion.

image of the tank (and eldar troops advancing). No idea what the targeter is attached to, though/

Page 16
Cobra tank

Length: 18.43m, Height: 8.8m, wingspan: 10.31M
Est. Weight: 70 tonnes Barrel lenght: 15.6m

Armour-12-15mm material unknown.

Combat speed: 60 kph Estimated max speeD: 280 kph

Armament: distort cannon.

Page 16

The blasphemous technology behind the distort cannon is capable of tearigna hole through time and space, allowing the Immaterium to flood our plane of existence with terrible destructive force.

this implies that the inherent nature of the warp is rather dangerous/destructive to realspace matter, even aside from the whole psychic/supernatural/demonic/hell based dangers. Given the known corrupting/mutating properties of Chaos against organic matter this may not be a surprise.

PAge 17 - Again, Cobra tanks have Eldar fields (energy fields) protecting them as well as perhaps holofields.

PAge 18
Nightwing stats:

Length: 12m Height: 4.37m Wingspan: 15.43m

Estimated weight: 5 tonnes empty

armour: 8-10mm material unknown

Max recorded speed: 3600 kph Swept wing: 2300 kph Extended wing)

PAge 20
Vampire raider stats:

26 m long, 7.1m high, 13.2m wingspan.

Estimated weight: 56 tonnes empty

8-10mm armour, mateiral unknown

Max recorded speed: 3200 kph

Can carry 30 troops.

Page 20

Capabel of travelling at many times the speed of sound and as agile as a bird of prey..

Eldar Vampire Raider described above. Highly supersonic, possibly even hypersonic.


Page 20

Like the Nightwing the Vampire Raider is capable of operating in the hard vacuuum of space just as well as in the atmosphere.

Dual purpose. Likely explains its supersonic/hypersonic capability.


Page 22
Raven stats (Dark Eldar)

9.18m long, 3.6m high, 11.62 m wingspan

Est weight: 4 tonnes empty.

Page 23

garrison taken under air attack from alien flyers which appeared from nowhere, avoiding our augur's and Hydra battery sensors.

Imperial Guard base attacked. Note they possessed "augurs" and that the Hydras are possessed of sensors.


Page 24

Dark Eldar Razorwing stats

9.18 m long, 3.6m high 15.1 m wingspan

Est weight: 7 tonnes empty.

[Connor MacLeod]

Finishing off IA2 this time around... with some Orky vehicles too...

Page 26
Ork Gunwagon:

9.73m long, 5.25 m high, 4.9m wide, Estimated weight of 32 tons. Barrel lenght (Kannon) 2.5M

ARmour 20-100mm

Estimated max speed: 60 kph on road, ,45 kph off road.

Main ammo (Kannon) est 30 rounds, tho varies by design.


Page 26

All [ork Vehicles] are characterised by a crude functionality, and many vehicles seem to be directly inspired by those used by his Divine Emperor's forces.

This half implies that ork vehilces are "cruder' (by design and possibly performance) than Imperial vehicles. That they copy the Imperials is no surprise considering hwo they are looted.


PAge 26 - mention of Ork vehicles "mass produced by slave labour in captured Imperial factories." Furtther cnofirmation of the use of slave labor in construction and in the use of captured/looted Imperial designs.

Page 26

Wrecked vehicles are a common sourcec of parts. It has been noted that a wrecked vehicle which Imperial forces might consider beyond repair can often be salvaged by a determined Mekboy. During prolonged campaigns it is not uncommon for the same vehicle to be idnetified as destroyed many times.

Again, we see the Orks do make use of salvaged Imperial vehicles.

Page 26

No provision is made for comfort, or the equipment common on Imperial vehicles; like medical supplies, targeters or even electrical components such as headlights. No examples have been found with any communication devices.

Targeters, comm devices and electrical compnents (like headlights) are considered "common" equipment on Imperial vehicles.

Page 28
Battlewagon stats

15.3 m long, ,5.2m high, 8m wide. Est mass: 160 tons

Barrel length (zzap gun in this case) 2.25m

Armour 20-100mm

Estimated max speed: 60 kph on road, 45 kph off road.

Main ammo: 30 rounds for main weapon.

PAge
Grot bomb launcha stats

6.8m long, 3.3m high, 2.3m wide 2 ton est. mass

ARmour 0-10mm

Max speed (Est): 80 kph on road, 65 kph off road.

Page 34
Bommer stats:

14.2m long, 3.75m high, 17.9 m wingspan 13 ton estimated mass.

Armour: 20-50mm Max recorded speed 1900 kph

Payload 1400 kilos.

PAge 35

Misile lock[On an Ork bommer]

Again this is an image in the book, and it evidedntly indicates that Imperial fighters use air to air missiles.

Page 36
Fighta-Bommer stats:

11.8m long, 3.75m high, 13.3m wingspan, 11 ton mass (est.) empty

ARmour: 20-50mm

Max recorded speed: 2100 kph

Payload 800 kilos.

[Connor MacLeod]

Now we start the IA3 older version.. this has orks, tau and some other Imperial stuff.. some of it will seem recognizable...

Page 4

The most potent is the large, dorsal mounted turbo-laser or battle cannon. This is the aircraft's main armament, used for attacking ground targets but also capable of damaging enemy space ships if required.

Thunder haw's topside weapon. The "battle cannon" as well as the turbo laser seem to be titan scale weapons, but its implied they could also take on a capital ship (albeit as a backup role) suggesting considerable firepower being packed in it. One does presume, however, ,that this "battle cannon" varies from the ones that Russes carry. It may be comparable to a Baneblades but somehow I doubt it.

Page 5

Thunderhawk stats:

Length: 26.6m Wingspan 26.65 Weight 76 tons

arrmou: 51-70mm (2 ceramite layers, 1 Titanium/plasteel layer, 1 adamantium layer, 1 Thermoplas layer, Equivalent of 240mm of conventional steel

Max speed: 2000 kph-atmospheric

Transporrt: 30


Page 8

Its [Land Raider PRometheus] advanced targeting and locking systems give it an advantage, especially against notoriously difficult targets like skimmers.

The Missile platform of the Land Raider.

Page 9
Land Raider PRometheus stats:

mass: 71 tonnes. 10.36m long, 6.1m wide, 4.11m tall

Armour: 91-95mm (2 ceramite layers, 1 titanium/plasteel layer, 1 adamantium layer, 1 thermoplas layer. Equivalent to 365mm of conventional steel)

Max speed: 51 kph on road, 48 kph off road.

Fording depth: fully submersible to 36.57m

Page 10 Land Raider Helios stats:

(Same dimensions as Prometheus) Mass: 73 tons

Armour (sameas Prometheus)

MAx Speed (Same as Prometheus)

Transports (6)

Main ammo: 18 missiles

Same Fording Depth as Prometheus.

Page 12
Atlas ARV stats:

(Same as forgeworld IA new version save...)

MAx speed: no tow: 34 kph on road, 24 kph off road

With tow: 20 kph on road, 12 kph off road.

page 14

The Alpha pattern Leman Russ hull, whislt originiating from Mars is produced on many Forge Worlds across the galaxy.

..

Alpha Pattern tanks are often favoured as squadron command vehicles, with the extra space being given over to communication and sensor equipment.

Leman Russ tanks seem to carry sensor and communication equipment, which would (in theory) go against the idea that they are "primitive WW2 like" tanks in all respects (They are only WW2 like tanks in some respects, such as elements of their design.)

Page 14

Most Leman Russ hull are cast plasteel, whilst the Alpha Pattern is constructed from individual riveted plates. Though this does not seem to have any detrimental effects on the tank's capacity to resist enemy fire.

This is a curious statement as I am under the impression that "riveted" plates would not neccesarily be as effective as other methods of construction for tanks (like welded or cast). One may infer that either they have different methods of riveting that can provide more durability than what we could achieve with riveting, or they may indeed form a trade off with the Alpha pattern over others (being able to "resist" fire doesn't neccearily mean that it is of fully equal capacity. After alll Russes can vary in terms of armour quality and thickness and other traits.) we know from the aforementioned quote the Alpha pattern provides more internal space, ,after all.

PAge 14

The engine comparement is of an older pattern, more commonly seen on Destroyers and Thunderers, easily identifiable by its two horizontal exhausts.

Engine area on a Alpha pattern is different from other pattern hulls.

PAge 17
[Maximillian Wisemann's BAneblade - Lucius pattern Baneblade]
Weight: 319 tonnes

Barrel length: (Battle Cannon): 5.9m

Armour: 80-230mm

Page 20
Stomrsword stats:

WEight: 302 tonnes. Length: 13.5m, width 8.4m, height 5.65m

Armour: 60-220mm

Barrel length (siege cnanon) 4.1 m

[Master of Cards]

Leman Russ tanks seem to carry sensor and communication equipment, which would (in theory) go against the idea that they are "primitive WW2 like" tanks in all respects (They are only WW2 like tanks in some respects, such as elements of their design.)

In the Guants Ghost series The Leman Russ tanks ae described as better then the enemy tanks because they have auspex scopes.

[Connor MacLeod]

Part1 of the update comeback... forgot to post this as a finish-up to the old Imperial armour books..



Page 26

Battle Fortress stats:

Mass: 200 tonnes (varies by design)

15.3M long, 6m wide, 7.2m tall Ground clearance: .45m

Max speed: 55kph on road, 40 kph off road

Page 27

looted rhino stats:
mass: 32 tonnes approx 6.1m long, 4m wide, 2.6m tall .45m ground clearance

Armour: 30-60mm (may vary)

MAximum speed: Varies

Fording depth: 1.2m


Page 26

Orks use all kinds of captured and recovered vehicles, either looted from battlefields or buitl in Ork controlled Imperial factories. These vehicles will have anything "un-Orky", such as weapons, radios, sensors, etc. removed, and replaced with the Ork equivalents. GRadually, Mekboyz will add more and more modifications until the vehicle no longer resembles the original but becomes a new type of battlewagon.

Note that orks "loot" factories as well as vehicles (And technically "loot" populations as well.. ther eis nothing the Orks cannot and will not loot.)

Of further interest is that "radios, sensors" and so on are removed frfom Imperial vehicles, implying these are fairly standard elements. The fact that "Ork" equivalents exist is also interesting, though what they may be I shudder ot think.

It is also worht noting that performance wise, the Orks do get better performance out of Imperial vehicles than the Imperium does, but the "WAAGH" effect can only be invoked to a certain extent here - the performance would have to logically fall SOMEWHAT within Imperial performancee parameters, even if the Orks strain the vehicles to their performance limits (which they probably do, relying on the WAAAGH effect to keep it from fucking them up.) This in turn suggests that Ork vechicles give us an "upper limit" benchmark of what Imperial vehicles can be capable of.


Page 28
Tiger Shark stats:

14.1m long, 2.31m high, 20.9 m wide. Est mass: 25 tons

Armour: 35mm material unknown

Max recorded speed: 2100 kph

Maion ammo: 8000 rounds burst cannon, 12 missiles,

Payload: 14 gun drones.

Page 29
Barracuda stats:

11.4m long, 3.25m high, 12.5m wingspan

Est: mass: 7 tonnes

Armour: 35mm material unkonwn

Max recorded speed: 2100 kph

Main ammo: 8000 rounds pulse cannon, 8 missiles

Payload: 4 seeker missiles (optional)

Page 29

its electronic systems are very advanced though, and it tends to achieve target locks quicker than the Thunderbolt.

Tau Barracuda's systems. Its implied that Imperial Thunderbolts carry automated targeting gear (albeit less sophisticated, usually, than TAu.)

Page 33
Sky Ray stats:

3.8m long, 3.14m high, 7.1m wide Est Mass: 12 tons

Armour: 35-120mm, material unknown

Combat speed: 50 kph

Estimated max speeD: 100 kph

- Note above the "estimated Max speed" that is much higher than what the IA3 suppelment provides. I've heard higher values (150 kph or so) from the White Dwarf Magazines for the Hammerhead, but I have never personally seen this.

Page 34

The Vampire hunter is a super heavy gunship, capable of taking on the heaviest enemy units, including Titans and will only be deploed into the fierecest battlefields against the largest targets.

Vampire hunters are Titan-killers. Interestingly they are as large/massive as many of the larger Imperial fighters (and Thunderhawks.)

Page 35
Vampire hunter stats:

26 m long, 7.1m high, 26.4m wingspan

58 tonne estmiated mass

armour: 8-10mm, material unkonwn

Max recorded speed: 3100 kph


Page 36 - PHoenix:

12.6 m long, 3.4m high, 14.75m wingspan

estimated mass of 6 tons

8-10mm armour, material unkonwn

3100 kph max recorded speed

Void Dragon phoenix has similar stats.


Page 38
Scythed hierodule: (Barbed Hierodule, page 39, same)

approx weight: 6 tonnes.

Length: nose to tial: 15m

Shoudler width: 3.4m

height: 5.8m

scythe length: 4.2m

Average speed: 7 kph

Est: maximum speed: 22 kph

Estimated armour: 4-80mm (babed heirodule has 4-90mm armour)

Note the speed of the "hierodule."

Page 40
Harridan: 11 tonne mass (approx)

Length: nose to tail: 28m

Wingspan: 38.4m

Height: 5.5m

Scythe length: 6m

Average speeD: 100 kph

Estimated max speed: 200 kph

Estimated armour: 4-50mm

PAge 41

Prior to the Horus Heresy the Dreadclaw was the most advanced assault boat in service. It was equipped with an advanced Machine Spirit similar to that of the Land Raider tank and was capable of landing on a designated target without any intervention from the passengers and then acting in general support totally autonomously.

...

When interfaced with the array of navigational augurs and logic engines, the Machine Spirit began to develop a dangerous level of self-awareness, bordering on the psychic.

Drop ship/shuttle with complicated systems (a flying Land raider in other words. ) It is interesting to note that its "self awareness" is noted to be bordering on psychic, as we have examples of machines or computers (Titans as well as others) being affected by the Warp (or interacting with it.) Which ought to say something about the Imperium's computer tech (and just why they are so worried.)

Page 44
Warhound titan stats:

412 ton mass. Height: 14m at rest, 12.1m long, 11m wide

Armour: 60-120mm (layered ceramite and adamantium)

Maximum speed: 58 kph on road

Stride length: 8.25m

(Titans have 4 servo skulls.)

Curiously, Warhound armor is implied as thick as tank armour, but preusmably of higher quality.

PAge 46

Dawn splashed vivid yellow and purple through the magnified, narrow oblong of the main gunnery sight. Forehead pressed up against the binocular visor as sweat trickles down.

...

"Trident two Delta, Trident one Delat (Lieutentant Heller in the squadron command tank). Prepare to move, five minutes on my mark..."

..

Through the magnified view of my cross hairs I scan the damage of previous battles.

Gunnery sight. Its not specified whether this may or may not be computerized or not.


Page 46

Behind me I feel Ivinsky move, throwing open the hatch and jumping onto his seat for a better view 'up top', scanner in hand.

Russ tank on Armageddon.