Doctor Who S5E9 "Cold Blood" Spoilers

[Crazedwraith]

Well that had me flashing back to RTD finales. Dramatic voice overs promising doom. The only difference is they actually killed a companion this time. And a very dramatic finale revelation. Such a pity the rest of the episode was rather nonsensical.

[Captain Seafort]

Such a pity the rest of the episode was rather nonsensical.

Thoroughly agreed, although I thought the entire scene around Rory's death was abysmal. Why didn't they pick him up and get him into the Tardis? The reasoning for Amy forgetting him was very badly handled - they'd have been much better of saying that it was because he was a time-travelling too, rather than the bullshit "he's part of your personal universe". The Doctor trying to get her to remember him was utter nonsense - she should have either remembered him or not, no "if you concentrate really hard" stupidity.

The only moderately interesting twist was the apparent explosion of the Tardis causing the cracks, and it might provide a decent explanation as to why they've been turning up near the ship. Unfortunately I can see this degenerating into a stupid "stop the explosion and everything fixes itself" season finale.

[Crazedwraith]

Rory dying might have been more shocking if they'd hadn't already done in the previous story. Given the precedent of A,y's Choice I wouldn't be surprised if the Season finale resurrected Rory again.

[NecronLord]

Yeah, I'm betting we'll see Rory more. Not that this is a bad thing. The one-doctor one-girl style is getting old.

[Darth Nostril]

Was I the only one who just knew the Doctor was going to pull a piece of the Tardis out of the crack the moment he mentioned shrapnel?

[Teebs]

I thought the episode started off badly but got better as it went on. I agree with the previous comments about Amy's forgetting being stupid.

When the Doctor said that anything the light touched would be removed from history, I half expected them to move the evil warrior woman towards the light and drag Rory away.

Edit: Also, if the light is that dangerous, how can the Doctor put his hand in it?

[Srelex]

Edit: Also, if the light is that dangerous, how can the Doctor put his hand in it?

Maybe him being a Time Lord gives him some protection from the Timey-wimeyness, or something?

[Gramzamber]

So in 1000 years the Silurians and humans come together in peace and harmony as implied by the narration.
What, about the time all humans are on starships because Earth was rendered uninhabitable? Huh?

I like how Ambrose gets all the blame for humans "not being ready" to come together with the Silurians when that Silurian dumbass was ready to march her troops for war regardless of the fate of her sister.

Oh and here's a paradox even for Doctor Who: The time crack thingy erases you from history, you were never born.
But Rory saved the Doctor from a death ray blast moments before, if he was never born shouldn't the Doctor be dead?

[Srelex]

But Rory saved the Doctor from a death ray blast moments before, if he was never born shouldn't the Doctor be dead?

I'm reminded of one actual decent quote from Voyager: "My advice in making sense of temporal paradoxes is simple: Don't even try."

[El Moose Monstero]

Dull stuff. I was actively bored to the point where I was thinking about finding something to read whilst it was on. Something about the way it was presented, particularly with the pointless sitting around the conference table, which lets face it, contributed nothing to the plot in the end, really just sucked anything good out of it. For me, I think these episodes have been the low point of the series - the rest, though I gripe, had something good within it. The starwhale episode had genuinely good bits, the dalek episode had the odd moment of humour amongst what was a pretty piss poor episode, the angels two parter had potential, but these...just...nothing. Bland in the extreme, and they even made an ass job of Rory's death, which as was noted comes right on the back of him being dead previously, so it had no emotional impact whatsoever. Also, since I don't think they've got the balls to leave him dead, a big red reset button is inevitable. Ugh.

[Haruko]

As I can't help myself, I gleaned some spoilers in this topic and read that Rory dies. Well, I was expecting Rory to salvage negotiations by making such an epic sacrifice that the Silurians go "holy fuck, that sacrifice just made me change my god-damned fuck-all-the-apes" mind. Oh well.

[Teebs]

Oh and here's a paradox even for Doctor Who: The time crack thingy erases you from history, you were never born.
But Rory saved the Doctor from a death ray blast moments before, if he was never born shouldn't the Doctor be dead?

I suppose it must just make people forget them. I would say that makes no sense, but then neither does a space crack that deletes people.

[TC Pilot]

I dunno, I didn't think it was that bad of an episode. The fact that they did the whole "Hey, there's the two of you over there" in the last episode followed by Rory's "wtf? I saw my future self" bit, on top of Rory not only dying but Amy actually forgetting him (as oppossed to just dumping him off at some later point like they've done in previous seasons), showed to me that at least they're trying. I also liked that the humans actually took some initiative and came up with their own plan to deal with the Silurians after they killed the prisoner. I also laughed some at how all the soldiers basically just told that general "screw you, I'm outta here" when that leader (though who the fuck was he, anyway?) activated the decontamination process.

On the other hand, I'm pretty sick of the whole "I'm mutating!" bit. So alien venom is reconfiguring your DNA?

[Asdeed]

Psycho lizard general, "others of our species have survived?"

Doctor, "the humans attacked them. They died, I'm sorry."

What a wonderfully impartial retelling of The Silurians, Sea Devils and Warriors of the Deep.

[Gramzamber]

It seems that in the world according to the Doctor, humans aren't allowed to fight against anything or defend themselves in any way. If they do then they are clearly unenlightened and immature.

[Straha]

What a wonderfully impartial retelling of The Silurians, Sea Devils and Warriors of the Deep.

Fucking wholeheartedly agreed.

This episode was shit. There was nothing enjoyable. The script was boring and paint-by-numbers. The lady scientist was there just so the Doctor could blabber to her and served no purpose. The mutation thing was RETARDED. The Silurian scientist turning out to have a heart of gold pisses me off because this is a man who VIVISECTS PEOPLE and KEEPS THEM ALIVE WHILE DOING IT. In fact everything pisses me off about this episode.

Except the death of Rory. That doesn't just piss me off, it makes me angry as all fucking shit. The one thing making Amy an interesting, and unique, companion was that she was engaged to another man. The story there was not "Doctor + Amy do shit, while Amy has love for the Doctor that can never be worked out satisfactorily" it was "Doctor and Amy, who was engaged to a man, had second doubts, fell for the Doctor but through that realized she loved her fiance, and brought him aboard the TARDIS so they could be together." The only damn reason I tolerated the Doctor/Amy/Rory thing was because I thought it could be VERY interesting, like it was in Amy's choice, and it could be used to go over ground that Doctor Who hasn't run roughshod over before. I was going to respond to Thanas in the last thread to say that Amy was actually a quite interesting character who could be used all sorts of ways. Now, she might as well be Martha for all I care.

Except now Rory has been fucking ERASED FROM FUCKING TIME, and forgotten with absolutely no good reason (if Amy can remember the Clerics why can't she remember Rory?). It's rare that I see an episode that isn't just bad, but is so bad it damages the fucking franchise. This is one of those fucking episodes.


Oh, and the music was terrible too.

[Ford Prefect]

What a wonderfully impartial retelling of The Silurians, Sea Devils and Warriors of the Deep.

To be fair, in The Sea Devils at least, that fat Royal Navy dude was a real ass about the whole thing. Even as a kid I basically totally blamed him for the whole thing - the Sea Devils were pretty amicable to the idea of peace up when the Doctor suggested it.

[mr friendly guy]

I am going to give this one a three and a half.

Bad things in it

1. The Doctor took his sweet time using the sonic screwdriver to deactivate the ray guns. He could have done is several scenes earlier. I can appreciate he wants to be brought to who ever is in charge to negotiate, but still.

2. That scientist who wanted to vivisect people turned out to be a nice guy as well. What gives. Maybe Silurians medical technology is sooooo much better that they can dissect you while still alive with minimal pain, and that the humans complaining about it afterwards was hallucinating from sedatory drugs or some shit. The point is, they should have made an attempt to explain the inconsistency away.

Or better yet, have the guy still be an arsehole but opposing the military junta because "thats not the way things are done", ie he believes civillians should call the shots.

3. You can remember things which have been erased because you are a time traveller. Except when the plot doesn't want you to for the purpose of trying to generate false drama.

It would make more sense that the TARDIS protects you from alterations, see "The Five Doctors." Easily solved and you can have the Doctor surprised when Amy does forget. None of this bullshit personal history thing.

4. "Humans killed others of your kind."

Ok assuming we won't mention warriors of the deep since that was set in the 22 nd century and hasn't happened yet.
With the Sea Devils the human in charge was a dick because the Sea Devils were quite willing to negotiate, so that is not totally unfair.
That leaves the Silurians which was a bit lopsided in the telling, because the moderate Silurian had been killed leaving the extremists in charge who tried to wipe out humans with a biological weapon. I sure hope that was in a deleted scene in some shit.

Or better yet, have the Doctor explained the Silurians tried to wipe humanity out and the humans defended themselves. Then have the general chick says pity that they failed. That would set things up and just show how far "round the bend" she was.

5. You are mutating mate.

WTF. What is this, Marvel comics? That just says it all.

Just leave it as a venom and thats that.

Good things

1. The new sonic screwdriver can deactivate ray guns. Cool.

2. The conflict between Ambrose and that Silurian bitch.

Its like a Greek tragedy playing out. This was the nice scene which really does it for me (as well as the sonic screw driver deactivating ray guns).

Personally if it was me I wouldn't have killed her, because we lose our only bargaining chip, especially given KILLING HER IS WHAT SHE WANTS. But I can understand how the mind games would work, which is what made this scene so effective.


Complaints which don't seem that bad

1. If Rory was erased shouldn't the Doctor be dead? Not if he was going to be able to deactivate the ray gun in the first place. What that general chick was almost dead and had barely enough strength to raise the ray gun. Rory panicked and jumped in the way. His death would have been pointless except to showcase the crack in time erasing things.

2. The negotiations were boring / pointless?

WTF? Ok negotiations aren't entertaining as a rule, however I thought they highlighted what would be the logistical difficulties of relocating the Silurians and the solution. They manage to do this in quite a short span of time so it wouldn't drag out screen time and become boring.

3. Rory's death.

Well I didn't find him endearing as a character, and the "love triangle" shit doesn't seem to work on Doctor Who. So have him written out of the story already. Oh wait, they did.

[mr friendly guy]

It seems that in the world according to the Doctor, humans aren't allowed to fight against anything or defend themselves in any way. If they do then they are clearly unenlightened and immature.

Uh, in the real world humans aren't allowed to kill prisoners of war either. Unless you are the Taliban or AQ, in which case those organisations like to do it in front of video cameras. And it was stupid to kill the prisoner because thats what she wants as the catalyst to start a war.

If you are referring to the drill which would have cut off their air pockets, we run into two problems.
1. as it stands it was quite a disproportionate response, given that it threatened much higher numbers of Silurians (which most were hibernating and we have no freaking idea how many of them supported the actions of their military) vs the few humans involved in this episode.

2. The Doctor most probably realised it wouldn't work because he warned them not to try and bluff the Silurians. That seems believable given what a few of them awake managed to achieve in the previous episode, and the Doctor only managed to hold them off because they had a Silurian hostage, which is currently now dead. In other words you end up pissing them off with little gain, especially given that the Silurians called the human bluff, in like under a minute.

The Doctor's belief that he can do things with non lethal weapons (when he told Ambrose not to bring the lethal stuff) in the previous episode got irritating because you might still need weapons in case Plan A fails. However I don't think that attitude actually applies to this episode.

[Captain Seafort]

With the Sea Devils the human in charge was a dick because the Sea Devils were quite willing to negotiate, so that is not totally unfair.

He also left out the minor detail of who exactly blew up the Sea Devils. By reversing the polarity of the neutron flow.

Well I didn't find him endearing as a character, and the "love triangle" shit doesn't seem to work on Doctor Who. So have him written out of the story already. Oh wait, they did.

To be fair, they only kept the "love triangle" for two and a bit episodes, then resolved it (in the best episode of the series by a good margin). Rory at least made things a more interesting that the usual Doctor-companion stuff, and I have the horrible feeling that they're going to go back to the RTD-esque "companion pining for the Doctor" shit. One good thing about the end-of-series reset button they've signalled a mile off is that it should get rid of that, if it develops.

[Revy]

I couldn't stand Rory myself, I was actually glad they got rid of him. The deal with Amy forgetting is stupid though, after all the Doctor remembers him. A bigger issue than Rory maybe saving the Doctor from getting zapped is the whole Prisoner Zero fiasco - without Rory and his mobile with pictures of Zero's disguises, the Doctor shouldn't have been able to get Zero recaptured, ergo planet Earth gets incinerated. Obviously the cracks don't affect the continuity of events, they only alter people's memories. Which seems a bit daft, but there you go.

The fact that Amy at the end saw only herself waving instead of her and Rory only serves to highlight the whole 'History can be changed' thing the Doctor was thrilled about in the Angels episode. In all likelyhood the Doctor will prevent the TARDIS blowing up or whatever so that the cracks never happen and Amy can go back to marrying him or whatever. Blegh, I hope not. Have some damn guts and actually blow up the TARDIS. They keep killing the Doctor after all, but the TARDIS is always there.

[PREDATOR490]

In absense of a Poll: 1

Utter stupidity from the entire script. The fault of that entire situation rests with the Doctor.
What a fucking surprise the woman who is losing members of her family to the Silurians ends up getting pissed off. Its even more hilarious the script goes out and CONDEMNS her for this action and she accepts it. I'm sorry but thats just bullshit. The correct response was to go to the Doctor and beat the living shit out of him for being a hypocritical sanctimonus dick.

The 'good' scientist - Excuse me. This is the guy that was about to DISECT people while they were awake.

The military commander - She was bringing out her army anyway but lets just blame it all on the mother cause she isnt the 'best of humanity'

The stupid Silurian hostage - It was obvious she wanted to die to incite a war yet the Doctor is surprised she gets killed.
How the hell was she supposed to be transported down ?
As soon as they released her its likely she will either attempt to kill the humans as she indicated she would or end up getting killed in the process. Of course the simplest solution would have been getting the Rory and Co. to just say thats what happened.

Oh no, instead the script has the woman kill the Silurian after being provoked... yet somehow the woman is at fault and the scourge of humanity ?
I am absolutly disgusted at the Doctor's attitude in this situation.

Not to mention his hilarious retelling of the previous encounters with the Silurians. Do you REALLY think its a good idea to go mentioning them when its obviously going to inflame the already volatile situation ?
Additionally, the Doctor knows that humans have ended up killing the Silurians in the past yet he STILL left the humans in charge of the hostage. What a fucking moron.


As for the finale:

This salvaged it a bit from the stupidity of the Silurians but not by much. It appears that this crack thing only erases the MEMORY of the individuals but not their actual history so in theory everything Rory has done has still occured. Thus pushing the Doctor out of the way still happens etc.
Although.. since part of that history is going to be based on memory... Amy just forgets Rory's part in Amy's Choice ?
Is Amy still getting married, eh ?
That said, the Doctor could have logically thrown the body of the Silurian in and undone the entire situation... if she is erased from memory she cant raise her army ?

Fuck this stupid plot device.


I predicted Rory would get the shaft. It was the same thing with all the other situations where the Doctor gets 1+ companions and now we have the ability to have the Amy + Doctor relationship. I noticed the wedding ring was left behind and I was expecting Amy to see it and think the Doctor was proposing.
I'm a bit pissed off the Doctor just magically decided to give up talking about Rory after the jolt. Uhh... what happened with trying to make her remember, how about asking if she still remembers him at least... ?
Nope, one jolt and the plot moves on without a moments pause to look back... what the fuck ?


Pulling out a bit of the TARDIS... I was expecting it to be a bit of a Dalek but I suppose the TARDIS makes sense. Then again, it will be the Daleks that are responsible I suspect. This crack thing seems woefully stupid but it seems Amy is going to get exposed more to it and start forgetting more stuff. I do get the impression a reset button is going to be pushed in relation to this crack + Rory being dead. Although, I have my doubts wether that piece of TARDIS actually signifies the destruction of it or just a piece that got knocked off somehow.

End result: 45 minutes of worthless shit and the Doctor being an idiot.

[mr friendly guy]

The fault of that entire situation rests with the Doctor.

Huh?

What a fucking surprise the woman who is losing members of her family to the Silurians ends up getting pissed off.

No one was surprised she was pissed off. Or else the Doctor wouldn't try to reassure her.

Its even more hilarious the script goes out and CONDEMNS her for this action and she accepts it.

It condemned her for killing the Silurian and giving ammunition to the extremists, as opposed to condemning her for simply being pissed off. Its not unreasonable that she accepts it because at that point the plot had made everything better and the Doctor and crew was no longer held hostage but in a position to negotiate. It was a "oh fuck what have I done moment." At that point in time and at the end of the episode, how many members of her family actually did die? None, but they had already killed their hostage.

This is the same type of logic why we debate not killing some of these terrorists after trial to try and avoid making them martyrs and giving propaganda for their cause. It may not necessarily be the correct answer, however its quite a bit more complicated that you make it out.

I'm sorry but thats just bullshit. The correct response was to go to the Doctor and beat the living shit out of him for being a hypocritical sanctimonus dick.

How is he a hypocrite when his companion also disappeared in the previous episode yet he didn't suggest that the prisoner should be killed.

The 'good' scientist - Excuse me. This is the guy that was about to DISECT people while they were awake.

That was stupid. Especially when they could have simply written him to help out the Doctor without having to be "good." He just has to oppose military rule.

The military commander - She was bringing out her army anyway but lets just blame it all on the mother cause she isnt the 'best of humanity'

Thats funny, I could have sworn he blamed the mother for killing the prisoner and nothing else. But whatever.

The stupid Silurian hostage - It was obvious she wanted to die to incite a war yet the Doctor is surprised she gets killed.

Because she didn't kill herself. Maybe because he expected too much from the humans. Especially at that point both sides were at the negotiating table, which means that things were proceeding as how he envisaged, even if it was done through an act of plot rather than his own machinations.

How the hell was she supposed to be transported down ?

I don't know, maybe the same way they captured her. Freezing her with the fire extinguisher then restraining her and wait for her to thaw due to some biological babble with her being cold blooded.

As soon as they released her its likely she will either attempt to kill the humans as she indicated she would or end up getting killed in the process.

Fire extinguisher. Previous episode. Remember that scene.

Of course the simplest solution would have been getting the Rory and Co. to just say thats what happened.

Maybe Hizbollah should also tell Israel that its soldiers tried to escape and killed their captors so they had to shoot them from point blank range? Like who is going to believe that story when you could have simply restrained her the same way you captured her, with a fire extinguisher.

Oh no, instead the script has the woman kill the Silurian after being provoked... yet somehow the woman is at fault and the scourge of humanity ?

She was undoubtedly provoked. However I am pretty sure we don't kill our prisoners of war just because they taunt us. I am also pretty sure the best way to avoid it is not to actually enter her cell giving that she was sort or praying or something when Ambrose entered.

So she was at fault for killing the prisoner in scene like the tragedies, which was well done. However she didn't derail negotiations, because the Doctor convinced the leader to help them at the end, in other words he bought the Doctor's argument. The negotiations were derailed by the Silurian general who was stopped when the Silurian leader helped the Doctor.

I am absolutly disgusted at the Doctor's attitude in this situation.

Why? Because he realised it wasn't just one human vs that Silurian, but there would be more casualties if both sides went to war?

Not to mention his hilarious retelling of the previous encounters with the Silurians. Do you REALLY think its a good idea to go mentioning them when its obviously going to inflame the already volatile situation ?

Lying might not be too helpful, especially if there was a peace treaty they would eventually find out about it.

Additionally, the Doctor knows that humans have ended up killing the Silurians in the past yet he STILL left the humans in charge of the hostage. What a fucking moron.

Because all humans are soooo alike. Did you miss the scene when the Grandfather, the one who thought he was actually dying refused to kill the Silurian after her taunts?

[Eternal_Freedom]

Meh. THis was a mediocre episode to my mind. The events of the episode where largely overshadowed by Rory getting killed and the Doctor finding a bit of the TARDIS as "shrapnel."

Rory's death was interesting. Apart fromt he whole "Try and remember him" bit. I agree that a reset button is looming with regard to Rory and the cracks.

Heck, if the TARDIS exploding is whats causing them, then maybe that's what this "Pandorica" shit is, someone else's name for the TARDIS. And it is getting annoying how everyone seems to know what's behind the cracks except the Doctor (Prisoner Zero, the Angels etc)

As for the rest of the episode, like I said, mediocre. it worked as well as a NuWho second half of two parter can be expected to work

[NecronLord]

Vivisectionist Lizard pissed me off. "I don't kill the children... I just suspend their higher brain functions and watch them age" - what? This is a good thing? WHAT?