Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

SF: discuss futuristic sci-fi series, ideas, and crossovers.

Moderator: NecronLord

Post Reply
User avatar
AirshipFanboy
Youngling
Posts: 94
Joined: 2005-11-06 04:39pm

Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by AirshipFanboy »

Somewhere in the ass-end of the Star Trek galaxy's Delta Quadrant, an alien scoutship encounters a dystopian world reminiscent of George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty Four.

Now, a faction of the alien's government wishes to overthrow Planet Orwell's totalitarian societies and construct less miserable ones in their place. You have been hired by this faction as an outside consultant; however you feel about this agenda, your job is to submit a proposal on how to accomplish this.

Details inside!
Planet Orwell
Peopled by bumpy-headed humanoids, planet Orwell is mired in the early atomic age and divided between a trio of totalitarian superpowers perpetually at war. This stalemated war is maintained by the dictates' of the nations' leaders, who wish to maintain a climate of fear and poverty that allows them to maintain their positions.

While one may rightly argue that Orwell's society is unrealistic and/or unsustainable, this RAR assumes that the aliens - called "Lim-Lims" have been quietly observing the world for the past eighty earth years, during which it has largely maintained the current status quo. So far its societies have given no indication that they will fizzle out, collapse, reform themselves, self-destruct, or otherwise change without outside intervention.

Assume that the society of Planet Orwell is a near carbon copy of that described in Nineteen Eighty Four, except the people are all zebra-striped humanoids with bumpy foreheads. For those without a copy of the book, its Wikipedia page provides extensive information on Orwellian society.

The governing parties of this planet have been in power long enough that some of the long-term planes alluded to by its villain have been carried out. Citizens in each of the three powers each speak Newspeak-like constructed languages, their old tongues forgotten. To keep their population sexually frustrated, they receive annual mandatory injections which make it impossible for them to have orgasms. Breeding is their enforced patriotic duty, carried out at the demand of their masters.

The various Inner Parties are mostly content with their planet's current state of political and technological stagnation, and so they haven't bothered developing it much. However, none of the fancy-superweapons the three governments were theoretically developing have come to fruition; the planet is mostly limited to 1960s military technology. Domestic industrial and agricultural technology has regressed to a point under the Parties' administration, but gradually leveled out to a comfortable state of inefficiency. Their soldiers might have assault-rifles and giant battleships, but the fields are plowed by donkeys. Well... okay... space donkeys.

The supernations of Planet Orwell - let us call them Gob, Rupe, and Nalt, all have medium range ICBMs stockpiled. They can launch satellites and have filled their orbital space with downward-pointing spy satellites. Because all three nations want to keep their population under as much surveillance as possible, they all quietly allow their rivals to keep satellites in orbit. They seem to have no interest in manned space flight, sending probes to other planets in their system, or studying anything beyond their own world.

Planet Orwell has a population of about 3 billion; ten percent of which are slaves and refugees residing in the disputed territories which the three nations fight over. The remainder are divided roughly evenly between the three super-nations.

Each super nation has around a dozen cities which hold the administrative apparatus for the nation; each of these "capitals" bears a quartet of 300-meter high pyramidal ministries that direct and control the surrounding area. Each "capital" appears to be roughly equal in importance and may represent a redundant command node for the super nation; it is unsure exactly where the Inner Parties of each country meet.
Your Clients
Both the crew of the scoutship who discovered this planet and your clients belong to the Lim-Lim Federation (LLF), an interstellar democratic polity with technology roughly on-par with that of the mid 24th-century Federation.

You have been hired by the Orwellian Hellhole Study and Reform Group (OH SARG), a sort of think-tank/research council/political movement interested in improving conditions on Planet Orwell for its natives. Specifically they would like to:

<> abolish the state of perpetual war
<> disrupt the hegemony of the ruling parties
<> improve standards of livings for the mass of the planet's citizens
<> halt the perpetual censorship and re-writing of history
<> allow the locals to scream in ecstasy while bonking each other again
<> ...and other generic do-gooder stuff like that.

Your Mission, Should You Choose to Accept It

This is a tall order, and Oh Sarg is unsure how to procede. So, they've hired you to make a proposal on how to best accomplish these goals, within the resources of the Federation. This proposal will be put on Oh Sarg's website, advocated by their spokespeople, and submitted (repeatedly) to the LLF Senate. Because disrupting another planet's society is not something the Senate will undertake lightly, Oh Sarg is asking its consultants for one or two types of proposals.

You may submit an ideal proposal - what you think the absolute best way to proceed is given the capabilities of the LLF. You may use whatever method you desire, be it infiltrating their governments, establishing a proxy state, bribing the leaders toward better behavior or flattening the planet and then rebuilding it. Keep in mind that the general goal is to make life less craptastic for the planet's citizens.

Or you may submit a practical proposal - one you think the LLF's political leadership is likely to approve. Keep in mind that the general public may prove less than willing to expend a huge slice of its GDP rehabilitating a primitive world, or absorb large casualties in a planetary invasion. If your plan is self-funding, with no loss of life, so much the better. Also, many in the LLF Senate may have moral objections to plans which kill many Orwellians; anything morally repulsive to a 21st century Canadian is probably equally repulsive to a Lim-Lim.

If you feel the ideal proposal is a practical one, you may note that in your response. Also, feel free to submit a proposal you might not personally think is optimal for purposes of discussion. It would be fun to have different types of proposals to read and talk about.
Your Clients' Empire
The Lim-Lim Federation has about two dozen major planets with populations over a billion. Their homeworld of Quoitseldwerp is a hundred light years rimward of the Ocampa homeworld, so Voyager never passed it by. It takes one month at cruising speed to move from the core of the LLF to Planet Orwell.

Assume that the Lim-Lims look like Warcraft trolls with flexible, feather-like antennae. With extensive (albiet reversible) surgery, one might be able to pass for an Orwellian. Their average lifespan is about 300 years, which makes themselves and their leaders much more inclined to think in the extreme long-term. A few other species have joined the LLF, but it is much less diverse than the UFP.

The LLF has a fleet of 500 military starships, along with 4000 private civilian ships larger than a runabout. Most of these ships are busy doing other things at any one time. Their fleet ships are built for speed and structurally resemble the TOS Enterprise - an example of wonky convergent evolution. For fun, their ships are painted with bright pastel colors, in wavy patterns.

Lim-Lim ground troops are equal in per-capita firepower to those of an early 21st century army. Sizable garrisons protect their major planets, but because of a scarcity of ships the LLF could move at most 100,000 troops at once. Without chartering lots of civilian ships, they could move 20,000 just with their troop ships.

The LLF's only known existential threats are the solitary Borg Cubes that sometimes try to assimilate them; their fleet is more than adequate to handle the Kazon raiders, Viidian organ-snatchers and Talaxian sponge merchants that pester them. Planet Orwell is not near any other spacefaring power, so no one really cares what the LLF does with it.

The LLF has tractor beams, replicators, transporters, and holodecks, but no cloaking devices.
Their anthropologists make use of "Duck-blinds" (like in TNG: Who Watches the Watchers?) but they don't have holographic invisibility suits (like in Star Trek: Insurrection).

For those with ethical objections to transporter use, assume that Lim-Lim transporters do not take people apart and built copies, but rather teleport their payload via... er... sparkly unicorn magic. The 300-meter high pyramidal fortresses that house Orwellian ministries can be penetrated by transporter beam.

A sort of prime directive is usually followed by the Lim-Lims; they generally leave pre-warp planets alone unless given a good reason to muck with them. Over the past eighty earth years, they have observed Planet Orwell extensively from orbit, and have sent surgically-altered undercover anthropologists to the surface for brief surveillance missions. They know at least as much about Planet Orwell in general as a reader of Nineteen Eighty-Four knows about Oceania, but also know much more about the mundane details of the local cultures.

As far as anyone knows, the Orwellians and their leaders are unaware that they are being observed from afar.

Keep in mind that many of the open questions Orwell's book left about Oceanian society will be unanswered by Lim-Lim anthropologists - for example, it is possible that all three super-nations are in fact under the control of the same entity.

Likewise, as the planet reached its current state decades before the Lim-Lims discovered it, details about its past history are almost totally obscure. Lim-Lim anthropologists predictably debate over how much of Planet Orwell's unusual society is due to the native's biology and how much is due to social conditioning, but so far the "social conditioning" faction has been winning the debate.
Let the Games Begin
This concludes your extensive briefing; your clients await your recommendations. Should you have further questions on the nature of this mission or the resources available to you, I shall do my best to answer them. And, of course, discussion of your fellow consultants' plans is more than welcome.
User avatar
Rabid
Jedi Knight
Posts: 891
Joined: 2010-09-18 05:20pm
Location: The Land Of Cheese

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Rabid »

Before answering... I never really watched more than a few episodes of TNG, and none of TOS or DS9, so...

What means are available to subvert an Orwellian ? Can you implant a chip or something in their brain that would allow you to magically switch their allegiance from "The Party" to "You", while leaving no exterior sign, physical or behavioral of the change, except, maybe, for the other people whom allegiance you have changed ?

If what I said before is possible, it would be interesting to create a network of informers, coming from all the strata of the Orwellian Society (proles, exterior and inner party, soldiers, scientists, etc...).

With the informations and intelligence gathered, you could try to establish a movement seeking to change Orwellian's society.

The next step would be to gather enough intelligence about the three Superpowers' Inner Parties in order to know who to "strike", and how, to gradually switch their allegiance to you while making sure they aren't uncovered and killed/"vaporised"

Ideally, you would want to have at least 2/3 of the Inner Parties and Military High Commands loyal to you before making any real move.

When this threshold will be attained, you will have two solutions, one subtle and one particularly unsubtle, with more or less equal chances of success ; and a third solution, which will take more time to be finalized :

- Subtle political maneuvering in order to crush the opposition and remove them from any position of power, leaving in these positions only people loyal to you.
- Unsubtle political purge of the un-loyal elements. Use them as a propaganda scapegoat to gather popular support. If an armed conflict emerge from this "civil war", you may or may not directly assist your puppets, depending on political consideration in Orwellia and Back Home.
- OR you could try to continue converting the Inner Parties and Military High Commands until everyone is loyal to you.

If and when your loyal agents have gained power, it will only be a matter of time, persuasion and perseverance toward the people in order to slowly undo all those centuries of social conditioning.


Ideally, with this plan, the only resources you have to spend are :
- A ship or a station permanently in orbit of the planet, or around/on its moon in order to avoid detection, to monitor all data and intelligence forwarded to you by various means by your informers.
- Teams of infiltrated Spec-Ops trained Lim-Lims to do the jobs you can't expect a local to do.
- This ship will be equipped of a medical bay in order to "convert" abducted people in agents loyal to you.
- It will also be equipped of a replicator factory in order to manufacture local-seeming armament, munitions and supplies you will ship to the cells that need them for their operations.
- A reserve of high-tech material aboard the ship for special occasions/operations.
- Personnel aboard the ship/station will have to be regularly rotated in order for them not to develop a god-complex or something like that. Personnel on the ground will be continuously monitored, and it will be understood that if they were to be captured, their bodies will vanish into thin air as if they never existed.
- Resources for manufacturing or food can be acquired locally once your cells are firmly established.



TL;DR : Basically, what I'm suggesting here is to establish local cells of "Freedom Fighters" and back them up until they gain power, at which point you will use them to change the politico-social situation of Orwellia toward your desired state.



Edit : this was the "realist" plan, which may take 10, 50, 100 or more years to complete. The "ideal" is : gather enough ships and resources to convert to your cause the whole of the Inner Parties and Military High Commands to your cause in less than 6 months/1 year.
Silvertongue
Redshirt
Posts: 27
Joined: 2011-10-25 03:11pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Silvertongue »

My quick answer.

Propose to disable the surveillance mechanisms.The surveilance mechanisms as effective as 1984s in the novel would have to be functionally mroe high tech than their military, or other tech.

Disable the mechanisms with orbiting platform that periodically burn out cameras, hack computers, microwave data storage centers, jam radio comms etc.
You'll want an AI, or a dedicated staff to run the platform.
While your at it, arrange for a few collisions to create a debris field that makes surveillance satellites hard to keep up for long.

Re-enable the orgasm. The anti-orgasm drugs probably only work under careful conditions. Spread a virus to change those conditions. Maybe one that causes antibodies to attack the drug.

The revolutions will take care of everything else. Seriously, this is something you have got to let them do themselves.
A few strategic disappearances via transporter of the rulers, possibly even with surgical replacements will help things along a little quicker.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Just beam down Captain Kirk and watch the chaos. Give him a few days, and he'll have taught the locals to love again (via seducing all the Inner Party women), beat up the goons from the Ministry of Love, revealed Big Brother as a fraud, and given a speech to all the locals about the importance of freedom. Problem solved.

Seriously, though, Silvertongue's plan seems fundamentally sound. I definitely agree that the revolution ultimately has to come from within. Otherwise, you're just replacing one despotism with another.

Some improvements I might make to that plan, though:

-Hack into the transmissions to the public and broadcast anti-Pary information. Or hell, just random things to cause chaos. Imagine, during a party rally, a global broadcast of comedy programming mocking Big Brother interrupting the speeches. :)

-Beam down agitators to incite the proletariate. The book seems to suggest that a revolution will only become possible if they are motivated enough to rise up. And while agitators among the local public may disappear before they can get far, our guys can just be beamed out of a tight spot and dropped somewhere else.

Edit: when the revolution does take off, their will likely be an armed crackdown. Having a force standing by to provide support would be good. How much we can do this depends on how much we wish to reveal ourselves to the locals (Prime Directive issues), but at the very least, we could probably make sure various forces mysteriously disappear. No one has to know what caused that convoy of warships to disappear. No one has to know that tank battalion in the wilderness got hit by a photon torpedo instead of ran into a mine field. No one needs to know that airplane didn't crash, but was beamed into orbit. With the sorry level of tech. the Party had, one scout ship can fuck up their troops with impunity.

We'll also need a reconstruction plan for when the revolt is over.
Cesario
Subhuman Pedophilia Advocate
Posts: 392
Joined: 2011-10-08 11:34pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Cesario »

Plan A (ideal):
Knowledge is power. Send a ship back in time to observe the conditions that led to the rise of the Orwellian superstates.

If a key individual can be identified as the root cause, remove him from the equation with a phaser to the head, ensuring no one will ever have to live in this nightmare of a world to begin with. If such a simple solution does not present itself, Q shows up to lecture us about not mucking with the timeline, or we discover our own time agents were accidentally responsible for this nightmare, move on to plan B.

Plan B (practical):
Hack into the Orwellians' communications system. Use their own comm system to broadcast the history of Earth (or the local equivalent utopian planet that used to be a nuclear bombed out hellhole). Give the people an idea of what can be accomplished, and the concrete steps needed to acheave these ends. Maintain control over the Orwellian telescreens to keep broadcasting encouragement to the masses and prevent the Party from monitoring their population with them.

The party won't be able to maintain control over their population while their communications systems aren't working for them. They won't even be able to control their military in any effective fassion. Meanwhile, the local governments formed by people who stepped up in the crisis of being cut off from the government will be informed by the information we're piping in through their telescreens. By the time we leave, there will be fully formed factions of idealistic fledgeling utopias ready to stand against the totalitarian regimes.

While we're at it, we could also disarm all their nuclear weapons just to be nice, and prevent the Party from launching a petty suacide pact in retaliation for losing their power.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Time travel is a bad idea.

I mean, one of three things will occur:

1. You'll end up in an alternate timeline. You've done jack shit in the original universe.

2. You'll end up causing the future you came from. Nothing changes.

3. You'll manage to change the future. You have now erased an entire reality. But you have no way of knowing if those changes will even be an improvement.

Plus, yes, Star Trek has various factions that may counter such interference.

All around, a horrible idea.
Cesario
Subhuman Pedophilia Advocate
Posts: 392
Joined: 2011-10-08 11:34pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Cesario »

Alternate universe theory is contradicted by cannon. That isn't how Trek time travel works.

Making things worse isn't much of an option given that we've got an honest to god distopia here. Even nuclear annihalation of the planet would be an improvement.

If we cause the future we came from, we're no worse off.

I accounted for all that when I suggested plan B. It doesn't save all the billions who've been living in this hellhole throughout their history, but it will work.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Time travel doesn't nessissarily work by creating an alternate timeline, but that very clearly did happen in the last film.

Nuclear annihalation would not be an improvement. A distopia can be reformed more easily than an extinct species can be brought back to life.

Also, your argument presumes that only this world is effected by the changes to the timeline.
Cesario
Subhuman Pedophilia Advocate
Posts: 392
Joined: 2011-10-08 11:34pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Cesario »

1) No, it clearly did not happen in the last film. We see changes even prior to the time travel event from the prime universe. The Enterprise mission patches being just one of many. That suggests that rather than create the alternate universe, they just showed up in one rather than the past of their own timeline.

Also of note, we never see the original timeline going on about its business after the time travel event. There's no evidence that the original timeline survived the time travel event. Young Spock's utterance of the phrase "alternate universe" needs some context, and not the context of the out of universe people writing the film who utterly ignored how time travel works in Star Trek due to being too cowardly to do a real reboot.

2) Resurecting an extinct species is actually pretty trivial. And it means that billions won't have suffered under the distopian regime. I choose to define that as an improvement, even in the face of extinction.

3) This is an isolated world. The only vector for any changes are the guys who've been observing them for the past 80 years. Did they do anything notworthy beyond observing them and getting me on the project to fix this clusterfuck?
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Simon_Jester »

Cesario wrote:1) No, it clearly did not happen in the last film. We see changes even prior to the time travel event from the prime universe. The Enterprise mission patches being just one of many. That suggests that rather than create the alternate universe, they just showed up in one rather than the past of their own timeline.

Also of note, we never see the original timeline going on about its business after the time travel event. There's no evidence that the original timeline survived the time travel event. Young Spock's utterance of the phrase "alternate universe" needs some context, and not the context of the out of universe people writing the film who utterly ignored how time travel works in Star Trek due to being too cowardly to do a real reboot.
Cesario, time travel works inconsistently in Star Trek- we have cases where changes to a person's causal past cause them to become a different person, to cease to exist entirely, or give them a chance to go back and set right what went wrong. It's very hard to say what the 'right' way to pitch time travel in Star Trek should be, and the alternate universe method works as well as any other.
2) Resurecting an extinct species is actually pretty trivial. And it means that billions won't have suffered under the distopian regime. I choose to define that as an improvement, even in the face of extinction.
So... the intelligent species you're dealing with doesn't have a right to a say in this decision to destroy them, but it's okay, because you promise to create new members of their species later? Or am I misunderstanding your huffing and puffing about resurecting [sic] an extinct species?
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
Cesario
Subhuman Pedophilia Advocate
Posts: 392
Joined: 2011-10-08 11:34pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Cesario »

Once they got to the point of "a boot stomping on a human face forever", which this species has, this isn't murder. It's mercy killing.

Though you will note, that still isn't my main plan, since I think we can do better.
Simon_Jester
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 30165
Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Simon_Jester »

Honestly, I don't think blowing the place up is an answer, even as Plan Z. Orwellian dictatorships strike me as being inherently unstable, like a lot of other taken-to-logical-extreme societies. Exterminating the whole species when they're no threat to anyone but themselves sounds like grotesque overkill.
This space dedicated to Vasily Arkhipov
Cesario
Subhuman Pedophilia Advocate
Posts: 392
Joined: 2011-10-08 11:34pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Cesario »

I agree with you under most circumstances, but the dystopia posited in the OP is not inherently unstable. All evidence we have is that it's stable.
User avatar
DudeGuyMan
Jedi Knight
Posts: 587
Joined: 2010-03-25 03:25am

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by DudeGuyMan »

This should be easy work with just a few ships and the right mindset. I liked Cesario's plan B.

Shitting up their surveillance, censorship, and propaganda abilities and then actively broadcasting counter-propaganda should bring a "really shouldn't function anyway" state like that to it's knees without just handing victory to the people.

Beam all their nuclear warheads into the sun, fuck with their government by beaming important officials away, shoot down all their satellites. Do everything possible to hobble them without actually kicking them over. Sabotage the production of anti-orgasm serum. Or better yet, conspire to replace it with Space Viagra just to give them a kick in the pants.

This society is a house of cards and a sustained campaign of unstoppable sabotage will collapse it with ease. There's no need for direct military intervention at all, unless you want to minimize casualties during the ensuing chaos and feel you can do so without compromising your goals.

Credit your mischief to a shadowy "resistance" and ten years after the formation of a new society there will be forty different groups all claiming it was them all along.
Silvertongue
Redshirt
Posts: 27
Joined: 2011-10-25 03:11pm

Re: Orwell vs. Star Trek (RAR)

Post by Silvertongue »

DudeGuyMan wrote:This should be easy work with just a few ships and the right mindset. I liked Cesario's plan B.

Shitting up their surveillance, censorship, and propaganda abilities and then actively broadcasting counter-propaganda should bring a "really shouldn't function anyway" state like that to it's knees without just handing victory to the people.

Beam all their nuclear warheads into the sun, fuck with their government by beaming important officials away, shoot down all their satellites. Do everything possible to hobble them without actually kicking them over. Sabotage the production of anti-orgasm serum. Or better yet, conspire to replace it with Space Viagra just to give them a kick in the pants.

This society is a house of cards and a sustained campaign of unstoppable sabotage will collapse it with ease. There's no need for direct military intervention at all, unless you want to minimize casualties during the ensuing chaos and feel you can do so without compromising your goals.

Credit your mischief to a shadowy "resistance" and ten years after the formation of a new society there will be forty different groups all claiming it was them all along.

Your plan seems to be to release space 4Chan on them. This isn't criticism. I'm actually disturbed at how effective this would be. FSM help us if space 4chan ever comes about.
Post Reply