Doctor Who S05E08: "The Hungry Earth" [Spoilers]

[Stark]

Yeah, it weakens all his past conflicts by saying 'lol I never kill anyone'. He tries to mediate, but he was never going to let the sea devils start world war 3, so they lose.

Ironically his 'no guns' thing generally only works because of the OTHER people with guns who die to buy him time for his outrageous plan. Morality!

[Ford Prefect]

Eccleston could sell a 900 year old alien having a tiff over housekeys with his 19 year old bogan flatmate without it being absurd or weakening the character.

He's a pretty good actor.

I think Eccleston was the definitive Doctor of this generation. He had a look and feel that managed to be appropriate but totally different. Tennant and, from what I've seen, go for familiar styles based on previous Doctors. I don't think there's anything wrong with this in principle, but it doesn't feel anywhere near as fresh as Eccleston did. But I imagine that doesn't really bother a lot of new fans, because they never watched the original series.

Anyway, call me when the second episode features the Sea Devils kcking the shit out of the Silurians.

Yeah, it weakens all his past conflicts by saying 'lol I never kill anyone'. He tries to mediate, but he was never going to let the sea devils start world war 3, so they lose.

Ironically his 'no guns' thing generally only works because of the OTHER people with guns who die to buy him time for his outrageous plan. Morality!

It's also pretty hilarious because past Doctors have resorted to violence. I mean obviously there was Pertwee, who could not go an episode without kicking the shit out of some guy, but I remember Hartnell and the Sensorites, and they told him that they would probably need weapons going into this tunnel system. And Hartnell even says 'well normally I don't do the gun thing, but better safe than sorry and lol these things are pretty cool'.

[Setesh]

Having finally watched the episode I have to say it seems like they have two different scripts and mix and match at whim. In one script the Doctor is a cold bastard no one trusts and won't lift a finger to help someone in trouble. In the other he's the obvious always right good-guy everyone trusts immediately.

Now the Silurians, I thought not to bad at first, except for the breasts, the head looked reptillian enough. Then her face is revealed to be a mask and I thought WTF!!!!!. Breasts I could see as possible (silly but possible) if they (like mammals) evolved from a Therapsid, several species having mammaries but were otherwise reptillian. Or they could be engineered, the Silurians having engineered creatures as guards, warriors, and in the first appearance, quickly altered a virus used as pest control against early primates to target humans. But the human features of her face ruined it for me.

New Who still suffers from a problem its had from the beginning, the episodes are too rushed. While the 30min segment style of the original was occasionally frustrating, it did keep people tuning in and aloud for better storytelling.

[Themightytom]

Blech. This episode sucked balls yet I was forced to give it a 5 because I liked the quote..

The doctor was Epic Useless in this episode, starting starting with dashing across the room to avoid the potholes and leaving AMY to try to rescue the older guy. Smooth Dr, leave the 130lb kid in a skirt to save the larger gentleman from Armus. Also this is doctor Who. if the doctor of all people sees a mysterious hole in the ground in a room where a man disappeared why THE HELL would he let anyone near it??

And what was that shit with the long drawn out "Don't let me go
!" "Never!" crap and then letting her go? Grab the bitch by the forearms you douchbag and maybe cross your arms for better leverage, stop fondling her hands.

Then you waste the only eight minutes you have setting up a perimeter of electronic devices without making sure the computer monitor controlling it all has a UPS back up. Well done.Would it have killed you to move the TARDIS into the church and run things through it?

You Lost The Kid???
Nice job asshat, you just got done chastizing his mom for trying to protect him after you lost your OWN friend, and you reassure her with "Its ok, they could have killed them on the spot but they took them so there's hope!"

http://www.tardis.wikia.com/wiki/File:St--4c74.jpg
weren't THEY taking prisoners?

I was going to find a picture of cannibals but honestly they're all too gross. The point is the doctor still had no idea who he was dealing with I HOPE because if he DID know, he was somehow one step behind them the while time. He's so busy posturing and rallying people to no purpose he isn't even paying attention to whats going on around him. When he was telling the female scientist it was probably a small tribe I was scratching my head trying to figure how the fuck a small tribe managed to build a drill and three transports along with a forcefield generator that could challenge the TARDIS. Surprise surprise, there's a city.

[Thanas]

Eccleston could sell a 900 year old alien having a tiff over housekeys with his 19 year old bogan flatmate without it being absurd or weakening the character.

He's a pretty good actor.

I think Eccleston was the definitive Doctor of this generation. He had a look and feel that managed to be appropriate but totally different. Tennant and, from what I've seen, go for familiar styles based on previous Doctors. I don't think there's anything wrong with this in principle, but it doesn't feel anywhere near as fresh as Eccleston did. But I imagine that doesn't really bother a lot of new fans, because they never watched the original series.

I completely agree with this. Ecclestone had screen presence. He did not need to wear outrageous clothing or stuff, he was just there. Tennant meanwhile was good with Rose, dreadful with Martha, acceptable with Donna and the less said about the others the better. As for the new one, he just underwhelms me. Same with the new companion.

BTW, why is there a companion anyway these days? Is there any function they currently do that cannot be done by a random character of the week?

[Setesh]

BTW, why is there a companion anyway these days? Is there any function they currently do that cannot be done by a random character of the week?

If the writers knew how to write there would be. The companion is supposed to develop a relationship with Doctor to provide a human viewpoint that changes as the newer audience members get to know the doctor along with them. (and provide someone for the Doctor to spew exposition to) The problem is the writers tend to focus on things like screwdriver wank and technobabble instead of drama and storytelling so Amy is fairly pointless. Except for the first two stories she is just eye candy.

[Crossroads Inc.]

BTW, why is there a companion anyway these days? Is there any function they currently do that cannot be done by a random character of the week?

If the writers knew how to write there would be. The companion is supposed to develop a relationship with Doctor to provide a human viewpoint that changes as the newer audience members get to know the doctor along with them. (and provide someone for the Doctor to spew exposition to) The problem is the writers tend to focus on things like screwdriver wank and technobabble instead of drama and storytelling so Amy is fairly pointless. Except for the first two stories she is just eye candy.

Agreed, see "The Deadly Assassin" for a Who episode that was brilliant, exciting, well done, and had NO Companion in it.


Back to the Silurians...
At the end of part one, when we see the Huge immense City, I started to think about something.
Showing us that city, which is bound to have thousands, hundreds of thousands, Millions? of Silurians... It could give this two parter a Slight chance to redeem itself. Because something that would really really make this a bit better, is if the Doctor actually meets some of the Cities "civilians" and, shocks of shocks, they turn out NOT to be mad war driven people bent on Humanities destruction. Imagine how refreshing it would be for the Doctor, chased by guards into the city, to hear "Quick over here!" and be taken into some no name house and protected by some downtrodden Silurian's. Imagine how refreshing it would be if the crux of part two was a Power mad military leadership, and a Civilian populace who actually Didn't want the upcoming war!

Imagine how that would add GASP empathy to the Silurian's! it would give true conflict, especially if the Doctor has to do something nasty to stop them!

As it is, given how Nuwho has been I am waiting for the stomach churning moment when the whole city turns out to be flat one dimensional background people all going "Death to Humans!"

[Gramzamber]

Well as long as it doesn't end with the Silurians all being destroyed by someone else, and then the Doctor sits on his pedestal and pontificates on how evil destroying them all was.
You know as with the Sycorax or Daleks.

[Thanas]

BTW, why is there a companion anyway these days? Is there any function they currently do that cannot be done by a random character of the week?

If the writers knew how to write there would be. The companion is supposed to develop a relationship with Doctor to provide a human viewpoint that changes as the newer audience members get to know the doctor along with them. (and provide someone for the Doctor to spew exposition to) The problem is the writers tend to focus on things like screwdriver wank and technobabble instead of drama and storytelling so Amy is fairly pointless. Except for the first two stories she is just eye candy.

I know the reason for the companion existing in the first place. What I meant was that the function is not important anymore. We the audience know the doctor. From that viewpoint, the companion becomes redundant unless she has a special skillset that the doctor does not have or that there is some other reason (sounding board, interest) for her to be kept around.

[Setesh]

I know the reason for the companion existing in the first place. What I meant was that the function is not important anymore. We the audience know the doctor. From that viewpoint, the companion becomes redundant unless she has a special skillset that the doctor does not have or that there is some other reason (sounding board, interest) for her to be kept around.

Ah but you missed the point of 'newer audience' in the response. Part of the companions point is to give an easier in road for first time viewers, not returning viewers. The current writers just can't grasp the potential of the companions to have a side story all their own that contributes to, rather than acting as filler to the story. Zoe/Sarah Jane/Ace/Rose went off to have her own adventures within the story, Amy walks around looking concussed.

[Ford Prefect]

I completely agree with this. Ecclestone had screen presence. He did not need to wear outrageous clothing or stuff, he was just there. Tennant meanwhile was good with Rose, dreadful with Martha, acceptable with Donna and the less said about the others the better. As for the new one, he just underwhelms me. Same with the new companion.

BTW, why is there a companion anyway these days? Is there any function they currently do that cannot be done by a random character of the week?

To be honest I'd like to see another Eccleston-type Doctor, with that understated leather jacket look, but ... Eccleston already did it. If, by chance, I ended up as showrunner on the new series I'm not really sure where I would take the twelfth or thirteenth Doctors in terms of look and feel. I mean, I'd like to get away from the whimsy of Tennant and Smith and back to the 'darker' Doctor that Eccleston portrayed (I know that they tried to do 'bad Tennant' but I thought it was laughable when they tried to pull 'I am a world ending Lord of Time, don't mess' with him), but would audiences really respond to that now? Tennant has pretty much entrenched himself in the cultural zeitgeist.

Also, I think it would be cool if we could more than one companion going on. Remember when Mickey or Jack was tagging along? That shit was boss. I mean, maybe with the new format they feel that balancing a larger recurring cast would be harder, but I somehow don't buy that. I mean, there's scope for an old school Ian/Harry/Leela styled 'action hero' companion in the new series - it worked with Jack, and it could work on a more long-term basis. Or maybe, if we're going to stick with the Doctor + young attractive chick thing, we could get another Zoe? She was fun.

[Stark]

How about any companion who didn't just walk out of bogan everyman town? People like Jamie and Leela and Romana and Zoe and Steven were cool because they were clueless humans that WEREN'T from down the road.

The real shame is that they went from an interesting portrayal (and I think they did a lot of interesting things in S1) to a bog standard ROFFLE TOM BAKER thing. Amusingly, Tom Baker did the duality better than Tennant. Call me superficial but I knew Smith wasn't going to be interesting the moment I saw his outfit.

[Thanas]

How about any companion who didn't just walk out of bogan everyman town? People like Jamie and Leela and Romana and Zoe and Steven were cool because they were clueless humans that WEREN'T from down the road.

Romana being a clueless human?

That said, it would be nice to get someone in there who is actually competent at what he/she does.

I know the reason for the companion existing in the first place. What I meant was that the function is not important anymore. We the audience know the doctor. From that viewpoint, the companion becomes redundant unless she has a special skillset that the doctor does not have or that there is some other reason (sounding board, interest) for her to be kept around.

Ah but you missed the point of 'newer audience' in the response. Part of the companions point is to give an easier in road for first time viewers, not returning viewers.

For god's sake, I know that. Stop repeating stuff everybody even remotely interested in DW already knows. And what role of easier in road cannot be filled by any bog-standard one-note one-episode character?

[Stark]

Romana being a clueless human?

Well... clueless person. I liked the earlier companions from very different situations (spaceman, sailor, warrior, etc) a lot more than yet another Londoner.

[Ford Prefect]

To be fair, Amy at least has that outrageous accent to help her out. Though speaking of Jamie, could we get another companion from the past? I'd buy it.

And yeah, I'm not entirely sure why they went from fresh stuff to Tom Baker. Not that I have anything against the Fourth Doctor or anything, but I just don't see the impetus for doing it. Obviously it's in part because you want to do something which isn't obviously 'Ninth Doctor + new face', but it's so clearly meant to evoke Baker. Even down to the 'duality' thing, which I must admit I never noticed ... because Tom Baker was a better actor, so him sometimes cracking out the ruthless, violent sociopath thing didn't seem forced.

And I thought Matt Smith looked kind of interesting in his very first picture next to the TARDIS. His actual get-up in the show doesn't really grab me in any way. Maybe the Twelfth can dress like it's Prohibition?

I think calling Romana 'clueless' is a little unfair, Stark. She wasn't exactly Adric.

[Thanas]

Romana being a clueless human?

Well... clueless person. I liked the earlier companions from very different situations (spaceman, sailor, warrior, etc) a lot more than yet another Londoner.

True.


And I think another problem that currently troubles Who is that one can almost imagine how the stories will develop. They start with something bad happening to someone, then get into a faux "moral conflict", then somebody else dies/sacrifices himself and the Doctor/companion makes a last-minute rescue due to some macguffin. Along the road, there will be a condescending lecture by the Doctor about the evils of acting like Person X. It just gets boring.

[Stark]

Tom Baker did his duality by being generally a fop but making it clear it was all an act and like the older Doctors always willing to do 'bad' things for the greater good, even if he was sad about it later. That's part of why I enjoyed 'The TARDIS through a Pink Filter' so much; once he decides a threat is serious (moreso than yet another petty dictator) he's all business.

Tennant could carry off vulnerable (like in Utopia, which I think is probably his best acting, when he was doing something different) but I'm not sure he ever sold determined.

[Eternal_Freedom]

Hmmm. Agree wholeheartedly on that. Tennant doing determined just didnt work well.

Perhaps for Thirteen they could go back to an older, more serious Doctor? One who isn't trying to be an action hero? And perhaps he could be really serious all the time, and conscious of being on his last life. It would at least be different.

Thr trouble with most of the companions of the NuWho series was that they were nowhere near being on a par with the Doctor. They were always dependent on him for answers, intelligence, etc. Endless repititions of "Doctor, what's that?" and s on

THat's why companions like Jack and Romana worked so well, because they weren't dependent on him so much.

Then again, old series companions where dependent on the Doctor, but they stil were good because of decent writing and acting. Case in point, Ian Chesterton, who would frequently lock horns with the Doctor, which worked very well, as it showed the Doctor wasn't infallible. There is far too much of the "Im
'm the Doctor, I have all the answers" in Nu Who

[Shroom Man 777]

Seriously. As a bit odd as the Ninth Doctor was, at least he wasn't quite as much of a freak as Tennant's Ten was. Geeze. Destro was totally able to portray the Ninth Doctor perfectly, going from quipping and shit about 'lots of planets have a north' and being a complete dick to Mickey, to emoting and angsting and brooding about being the last of his species in a very convincing way. Jesus, Destro was a totally awesome actor man.

[Ford Prefect]

Then again, old series companions where dependent on the Doctor, but they stil were good because of decent writing and acting. Case in point, Ian Chesterton, who would frequently lock horns with the Doctor, which worked very well, as it showed the Doctor wasn't infallible.

Ian is a bad example because Ian was ridiculously multi-talented for a 60s math teacher. Remember The Aztecs?