T:SCC Season 2 premiere (spoilers)

[Erik von Nein]

Oh, okay. I wasn't insane.

Yeah, time travel and all that. I try to ignore it most of the time, but now that the past/future (depending on who you're talking to) seems to be absolutely riddled with terminators and freedom fighters I'm really having trouble maintaining interest. The timeline just doesn't seem to make any sense anymore.

I do like the actors and some of the plot-lines, I'm just losing interest.

[SylasGaunt]

Much as with Dr. Who with the amount of time-travel involved here should we be surprised?

[Anguirus]

I'm actually hoping that the T-1000s turn out to be super-advanced, hundreds-or-thousands of year-old descendants of Skynet. The resistance just doesn't know that, obviously, because why would they?

The T-1000s could have brought the time-displacement equipment to 21st century Skynet, instead of Skynet happening to invent it while on the verge of defeat, or indeed that the insanely advanced T-1000 is just a natural outgrowth of the Terminator program. They also would have a vested interest in making sure that they come to pass, obviously.

Rampant speculation here, obviously.

[Rye]

Did they show the T-1000 examining its surroundings by physical contact, or did they forget that they do that? I suppose just rewriting the whole thing to make it "terminator of the week"-friendly makes sense if you're going to try and string it out to an ongoing series. Sort of like with Terminator 3.

I'll try watching this soon to see if my tastes have changed.

[Anarchist Bunny]

Skynet sending a T-1000 back may explain why no matter what the resistance does, Skynet ALWAYS manages to come into being.

Or the fact that John Conner is the son of someone he sent back in time using Skynet invented technology means that because he exists, Skynet has to come into being.

[Anguirus]

She's not a Terminator-of-the-week, she's a lead character. Cromartie was also made a lead character.

Even Vick was in several first-season episodes, appearing at first just to be a random redshirt Terminator but appearing (after his destruction) in one of the most disturbing subplots on the show to date, detailing his marriage (months or years long) to a woman who he manipulating into creating hardware for Skynet to use in the future and then murdered.

The only Termy-of-the-week was Carter and that's because they discovered him stockpiling coltan to be used for future endo construction, then locked him in a bunker to avoid getting killed by him.

[eyexist]

The producers mentioned at a convention a few months ago that one of the main characters would die this season. That includes everyone except Dixon. I was sent a link to the video where they say it but deleted the email a while ago. I'll see if I can forage around on the internet for it.

[eyexist]

The producers mentioned at a convention a few months ago that one of the main characters would die this season. That includes everyone except Dixon. I was sent a link to the video where they say it but deleted the email a while ago. I'll see if I can forage around on the internet for it.

After a few seconds of google-fu I found this article.

[neoolong]

Did they show the T-1000 examining its surroundings by physical contact, or did they forget that they do that?

Technically, that was mostly cut out of Terminator 2 also. So, it's not exactly a big deal in terms of continuity.

However, they showed that Cameron did pick up physiological information through touch.

[Peptuck]

The producers mentioned at a convention a few months ago that one of the main characters would die this season. That includes everyone except Dixon. I was sent a link to the video where they say it but deleted the email a while ago. I'll see if I can forage around on the internet for it.

Well, that rules out John, as his survival is kinda-sorta important. Ditto for Sarah, her name's in the damn title.

Cameron, maybe, but Summer is a big part of the show. Killing her this early might hurt ratings hard. I know if she gets the axe I'm probably going to stop caring about the show, Glau fanboy I am.

My money's on Cromartie or Ellison.

[Anguirus]

^ Ellison would be an interesting choice, as he's already gone through a major character arc. However, I think he brings a much-needed bit of relief from the constant heavy Connors vs. Skynet stuff, plus he could become even more estranged from the FBI.

Cromartie seems like a more natural pick. Weaver can fill the role of the Big Bad now. Cromartie's competent enough to find the Connors (they are tooling around the same damn city) and when that happens it will be them or him.

On the other hand, maybe they're setting him up to be the series-long villain?

I also would not be surprised if Derek's days are numbered. I love him as a character, but there's no denying that his death would do interesting things to the dynamic considering how close he is becoming to John.

[Thanas]

The producers mentioned at a convention a few months ago that one of the main characters would die this season. That includes everyone except Dixon. I was sent a link to the video where they say it but deleted the email a while ago. I'll see if I can forage around on the internet for it.

Well, that rules out John, as his survival is kinda-sorta important. Ditto for Sarah, her name's in the damn title.

Cameron, maybe, but Summer is a big part of the show. Killing her this early might hurt ratings hard. I know if she gets the axe I'm probably going to stop caring about the show, Glau fanboy I am.

My money's on Cromartie or Ellison.

I am very skeptical about them terminating Cameron this season. Basically because it would not make sense storywise - we have got the whole high-school arcs which would be lost if they got rid of her character. And due to the truck scene, I am quite certain that if she dies, it will be a long time in the series. If they go for dramatic impact, killing her would only make sense after the dynamic between the two of them has played itself out. Also, the producers love her character.

I concur with Anguirus - Derek is the likely choice for making us feel an impact. Sarah cannot go (yet) and Ellison just got a new major arc. He is the only other candidate, but I am skeptical about that.

My other thoughts:
- the introduction sucks. How lame can it get?
- That is the way to make a premiere. Way better than I expected
- Summer Glau - what an actress. Definitely the best in the show. Compared to her, Lena Headey's acting abilities are nothing. Which also might be a problem in the future - instead of The Sarah Connor chronicles I fear it will become the John and Cameron show in the future. They better give her a good arc this season.

As an aside, I love the 5-2 rating system. It just says 'And people who hate the show, fuck off' so eloquently.

Would you believe me if I told you I just forgot the "1"?

As for a rating? Hmmm.

Based on the first musical montage, which I found to be over-the-top, I was ready to give it a three. Then the truck scene happened. And then the T-1000 reveal. So yeah, 5/5. I am sure I will nitpick it to death later, but I was thoroughly entertained for the hour.

[Imperial Overlord]

Ellison's new arc won't save him from being killed at the end of it, say near the end of the season. Of course it could be another major character, especially one introduced this season. Really anyone other than John, Sarah, or Cameron could be taken out without damaging the series as long as the writing remains good.

[Anguirus]

This will not happen, but what if John manages to get killed somehow, leaving Sarah and other survivors with no option then to make damn sure Skynet ever gets built?

Now THAT would fuck with people.

Anyway, on an unrelated note, I think it would have been nice to get some reference to or acknowledgment of the Arnold-Terminator from T2 when Sarah says "they can't love." That Terminator basically destroyed himself because he loved John, which could have played a role in John's (insanely risky) reactivation of Cameron.

[Thanas]

Anyway, on an unrelated note, I think it would have been nice to get some reference to or acknowledgment of the Arnold-Terminator from T2 when Sarah says "they can't love." That Terminator basically destroyed himself because he loved John, which could have played a role in John's (insanely risky) reactivation of Cameron.

Nah. He destroyed himself because it was his mission to safeguard John. Also, Sarah never was a fan of that Terminator - she was all too eager to smash it.

[Peptuck]

As an aside, did anyone else get a vibe at the part where Cameron is staring at the Crucifixion?

I keep noticing that Cameron has these little random moments throughout the series where she does oddly human stuff, like in "Vic's Chip" where she paints her nails for no reason (and she even says she doesn't know why she did it), or the rather more overt ballet dancing scene, or when she starts writing that note because she doesn't understand grief, etc.

[Thanas]

As an aside, did anyone else get a vibe at the part where Cameron is staring at the Crucifixion?

I keep noticing that Cameron has these little random moments throughout the series where she does oddly human stuff, like in "Vic's Chip" where she paints her nails for no reason (and she even says she doesn't know why she did it), or the rather more overt ballet dancing scene, or when she starts writing that note because she doesn't understand grief, etc.

Maybe her programming is evolving? "Emotions", "desires" starting to manifest because her programming wants to make her a better infiltrator and that is just what humans do? This culminating in the part where she overrode a termination order?

Also, the symbolism was off the scale in this episode. Like when the gang was standing divided into two groups- on the one hand we have the machine and the future leader of humanity, on the other the parent figures. The future and the past. Seperated by fire their child started.

[Drooling Iguana]

Stabbing someone through the eye in the bogs isn't going to do much for her ability to stay underneath the radar. Admittedly, there's little chance that she's going to be rumbled (who's going to be able to put that together?) but it seemed a bit random to me for someone who's not wanting to attract too much attention.

Are we even sure she's working for Skynet? Remember her whole speech in her first scene about a machine that would do something other than what it was programmed to to?

As for the show, awesome episode, crap opening. The original one was a bit inaccurate (implying that Cameron had been sent by Skynet and that Skynet was programmed to destroy the world) but it flowed a hell of a lot better than the new one.

[Strider]

The timeline just doesn't seem to make any sense anymore.

Fun with Closed Timelike Curves. It's entirely possible that the second T-1000 was sent back in time in response to a perturbation in the timeline from Cameron being sent back, which may have happened because Cromartie got sent back, ect ect. My explanation:

The rebellion has the apocalypse in a sort of perpetual check: they can never completely prevent it, but they can put it in danger of being completely prevented by their next move, forcing Skynet to send their agent back in time to get the apocalypse out of 'check'. Since some of these missions appear to be focused on John Connor, it is logical to assume that John Connor is not only the eventual rebel leader of a Skynet Victory, but he is MORE IMPORTANTLY a critical factor in the possible complete prevention of the apocalypse. This string of events appears to incidentally be slowly ripping causality to shreds up and down Skynet's light cone. Using time travel is like using nukes, except instead of radioactivity you get causality falling apart.

Now we're even getting backtime logistics missions, like Carter's, which don't even try to stop/cause the initial apocalypse. It's almost like causality is so screwed up already, neither side is particularly worried about "just one more nuke" anymore. I predict that the series eventually evolves into a full scale acausal Time War, circa Daleks and Time Lords. It also sort of reminds me of the situation in Exultant (Steven Baxter), but the timeline here is far more responsive to small changes than that one.

[Thanas]

Stabbing someone through the eye in the bogs isn't going to do much for her ability to stay underneath the radar. Admittedly, there's little chance that she's going to be rumbled (who's going to be able to put that together?) but it seemed a bit random to me for someone who's not wanting to attract too much attention.

Are we even sure she's working for Skynet? Remember her whole speech in her first scene about a machine that would do something other than what it was programmed to to?

Seeing as T-1000 are very hard to capture and that every terminator the resistance has employed was captured and reprogrammed (with the possible exception of Cameron), I think we can rule out a reprogrammed T-1000.

A rogue T-1000? Maybe, but given that she essentially wants to build skynet out of the Turk, I doubt that.

[Thanas]

Now we're even getting backtime logistics missions, like Carter's, which don't even try to stop/cause the initial apocalypse. It's almost like causality is so screwed up already, neither side is particularly worried about "just one more nuke" anymore. I predict that the series eventually evolves into a full scale acausal Time War, circa Daleks and Time Lords. It also sort of reminds me of the situation in Exultant (Steven Baxter), but the timeline here is far more responsive to small changes than that one.

The resistance has also used "resource time dumps", Derek Reese was involved in one. Or the engineer building the bank-time machine.

[Drooling Iguana]

A rogue T-1000? Maybe, but given that she essentially wants to build skynet out of the Turk, I doubt that.

Yes, but is her main goal simply to make sure that Skynet gets built, or is she positioning herself so that Skynet will be built to her own specifications and ensuring that she'll have a hand in its programming?

[Anguirus]

Nah. He destroyed himself because it was his mission to safeguard John. Also, Sarah never was a fan of that Terminator - she was all too eager to smash it.

"No. There is one more chip. And it must be destroyed also."

"I know now why you cry, but it's something I can never do."

Cue him disobeying a direct order from John (which was his real mission, to safeguard and obey the orders of John Connor), telling Sarah to destroy him, and Sarah practically losing it as she does so.

Ooh, plus Sarah saying that the Terminator was better than any of the father figures she'd tried to introduce into John's life. She definitely revised her opinion as the movie went on.

I realize that they want to avoid showing the T2 Terminator in flashbacks and such, but they could at least acknowledge him IMO. Without him they really would have no precedent for trusting Cameron or keeping her around.

[Damaramu]

For a moment, I thought Cameron would pull a Terminatrix with the blood droplets and analyze it orally.

[Anguirus]

^ SO glad there was none of that. Fuckin' T3...

I will say I was annoyed that she can tell male from female blood just by looking at it. Can she see chromosomes, or what?