For the Hardcore Gundam Fans...

[Zor]

Generic Gundam Story Guidebook

LOL! That is good.

Zor

[Sidewinder]

Thanks for tip. It does expose the skeletal structure of the Gundam series, with the exception of 'G Gundam'-- and the reason I find the series unentertaining, with the exception of 'G Gundam' and the 'Gundam SEED' manga. (I'v yet to see the anime.)

By the way, do you think the 'SEED' series is entertaining enough to be worth the cost of the box set?

[General Zod]

Thanks for tip. It does expose the skeletal structure of the Gundam series, with the exception of 'G Gundam'-- and the reason I find the series unentertaining, with the exception of 'G Gundam' and the 'Gundam SEED' manga. (I'v yet to see the anime.)

By the way, do you think the 'SEED' series is entertaining enough to be worth the cost of the box set?

Seed, along with most of the AU is rather boring and unimaginative. I'd suggest avoiding it myself. (Though I did enjoy G, if only because it did something unique with the gundam-verse, and wasn't taking itself seriously).

[Guardsman Bass]

Thanks for tip. It does expose the skeletal structure of the Gundam series, with the exception of 'G Gundam'-- and the reason I find the series unentertaining, with the exception of 'G Gundam' and the 'Gundam SEED' manga. (I'v yet to see the anime.)

By the way, do you think the 'SEED' series is entertaining enough to be worth the cost of the box set?

Seed, along with most of the AU is rather boring and unimaginative. I'd suggest avoiding it myself. (Though I did enjoy G, if only because it did something unique with the gundam-verse, and wasn't taking itself seriously).

I disagree on some aspects of SEED, since I did find it enjoyable. Mainly, it was kind of fun to watch. I would not recommend buying the whole box set (unless it is pretty cheap), at least until you've seen a few episodes.

Mind you, you won't be seeing anything original or truly dynamic. You can tell the main characters from the not-so-main ones by their appearances (the main characters are all bishonen and beautiful girls), and the movie has pretty standard plot devices and a nearly preposterously powerful set of Gundam suits. I still enjoyed it though, because it was simply fun to watch.

[Guardsman Bass]

As for the OP, that generic outline definitely seemed to resemble the plot outline and characteristics of Gundam SEED. I'm not quite certain on how well the other Gundam series relate to it (since, other than SEED, all I've seen is MS Gundam 0080, which does not follow the generic storyline at all).

[Xess]

As for the OP, that generic outline definitely seemed to resemble the plot outline and characteristics of Gundam SEED. I'm not quite certain on how well the other Gundam series relate to it (since, other than SEED, all I've seen is MS Gundam 0080, which does not follow the generic storyline at all).

The outline also fits Gundam Wing very well.

[Kuja]

And G-X as far as I can see. And of course, the original gundam, because Wing, X, and Seed are pretty much redos of the original.

[Battlehymn Republic]

Ah, finally found this besides me. I've already created my own prototype series based on the template. Please skim and scrutinize.

NAME: Quasi Gundam

The FACTIONS

EG: The Unitary Concord, a hegemony of strong South American states and associated post-balkanization North American satellites. Created out of the ashes of a divisive world war (probably the sixth or seventh), it maintained peace and order by using threats of violence. After a century of stagnant lull following decades of crackdowns, its leaders have become complacent and its military weak.

CS: Sfidante Supremo, a pact between nationalistic colonies at Lagrange Two and Lagrange Four, as well as a consortium of corporations interested in aerospace manufacturing and gas mining at Saturn. Sfidante is the name for the upstart colonists, Supreme is the company brand. Both halves are pretty icky: the colonists are renegades and exiles who were deported en masse to space, and the companies subscribe to the evil corporate doctrine. Plucky and hard-working, the original colonists created their own empires, and the corporations took interest; many executives are family. They have a mélange of Southern and Central European culture.

"Neutrals": Origin, Lagrange One, is a strong bloc of pro-UC colonies ruled by the Concord. Venturia, Lagrange Three, is a mercantilist state that is willing to work and sell to both sides, and posses large factories and technical institutes. The Moon is also nominally controlled by the Concord, but Supreme has many firms there. Many nations on Earth have leanings towards both. The Concord’s champions are Britain, Spain, Brazil, Germany, Russia, Turkey, India, and Masada (Israel). The Sfidante Supremo’s supporters are France, Austria, Neos Hellenia (Greece), Pan-Slavia, South Africa, and of course Italy.

True Neutrals: Lagrange Five dislikes both the UC and SS, and would like to be rid of both. They are called Alta Caelum and are very militaristic. The East Asian powers, China and Japan, are somewhat aloof though they are under the Unitary Concord’s rule. Alta Caelum has friends in Oceania.

New Factions: Alta Caelum helps to found the Caeserum Aegyptos Dynasty in Egypt, Sudan, and North Africa after the Conflict. They instantly try to seize both Masada and the old Sfidante nations devastated by war. CAD hooks up with Kremedict Efforts, a successor subsidiary to Supreme based in Frankfurt and St. Petersburg.

CONCEPTS

The Calendar: Restarted at year zero Quasi Command when the Unitary Concord ended the world war and defeated the last batch of rebels at Mount Everest. Don’t ask. The Unitary Concord was founded thirty-three years before that, at Minus Thirty-Three IP. IP is Interregnum Period, the 66-year world war between the QC calendar and the previous calendar system. AD?

The War: Started early in 107 QC, the year the series starts, with the Sfidante Supremo’s catastrophic attack on bi-wheel colony Pozzuoli at Origin.

The Atrocity: A betrayal by Pozzuoli pro-Sfidante elements leads to the colony’s easy capture. That minority of colonists was relocated to one colony wheel shortly after, and the rest shipped to the other. Then, that entire wheel was dropped on Earth, where the Concord was forced to use the massive Bolivar Laser to destroy it with all of its inhabitants onboard.

The Plot Device: The Quasicáscara, a miracle plot contrivance alloy that is able to simultaneously provide for strong yet flexible armoring and chassis, allow for the flight of fifty-foot tall robots, create intricate circuitry used for anti-nuke shield generators and particle generators, but impedes certain forms of communications, so a futuristic land-based sonar is used instead of radar. Of course, sonar cannot work in space.

The Counter Plot Device: La Macchina, a device that allows genetically enhanced individuals to send rough messages to others wearing the device, almost telepathically. However, unlike telepathy the messages are military jargon, and cannot be full thoughts. It is also used to identify the type of forces in an area, and boost both the pilot’s and the machine’s performance in unspecified ways. Mobile Suits do not require it, but many pilots use it.

The Counter-Counter Plot Device: Umano Espacio, space man. They are able to bypass the crude gene therapy to send full messages with La Macchina, and possess even better skills than La Macchina users.

The Mutant Pilot: Umano Espacio. Those born in the colonies and onboard spaceships in flight have almost (but not really) psychic powers that can be unlocked with training (sometimes) and technology (mostly). They are not Jedi. A mechanical touch is needed to unlock their powers of near-telepathy, advance detection, and amazing insight. They usually seem normal, but many find it hard to relate to others and are unhappy without counseling. Mental mystics in the past are hypothesized to be proto-Umanos Espacio, but never truly experienced their full potential because of staying Earthlocked. Detailed logs of Umano Espacio “gifts” are kept by all factions, but stories of true psychic powers (full telepathy without La Macchina, telekinesis, clairvoyance, pyrokinesis)remain rumors. Ues are also gifted at piloting experimental and dangerous weapons. Later on, it is revealed that extensive genetic therapy can create semi-Ues, but they tend to kill themselves. There are also rumors that La Macchina can coexist with the Umano Espacio personality, leading to the creation of a symbiotic consciousness, the Deus ex Macchina. At the beginning of the series, most soldiers aren’t even using La Macchina yet, and Umano Espacios won’t be investigated until a quarter in. Halfway into the war, definite findings are found.

The Apocalypse Plan: An admiral within the Unitary Concord decides to end the whole war by breaking previous treaties and to use the Bolivar Laser to destroy the L2 and L4 colonies, one by one. Sfidante Supremo agents catch wind of that and plan to capture the laser, causing it to self-detonate and destroy the UC Sur capital (Buenos Aires) where it is located. Then, colonies from Origin and Alta Caelum will be dropped into the oceans with all inhabitants inside. And as a final flourish, they plan to crash a hijacked asteroid into the Gulf of Mexico.

THE GEAR

The Space Colony: A whole panoply of types. Origin has mostly Island Two/Stanford Torus space wheels, some with two wheels linked at the hub. Sfidante Supremo has mostly Island Three/O’Neill Cylinders both opened and closed. Venturia has the most beautiful colonies, with open-mirror versions of both. Alta Caelum is the only one with Island One/Bernal Spheres. All posses at least one asteroid colony carted from the Belt, and settlements in the Belt itself.

The Colony Cluster: Already named above for their allegiances. L2 is named Sfidante Giustizia and L4 is Sfidante Alexandria. L1, L2, and L4 all have large populations. Origin has a federal, centrist government, while the Sfidante ones are confederations of regional families. L3 has a large population for its factories and merchants. L5 has less colonists than L3, but protects its neutrality with a very large military.

The Mobile Suit: The Unitary Concord has the ancient UC-33 Juarez first used in the latter days of the Interregnum Period. It is nearly obsolete, and no had ever thought of updating it with modern technologies. The Sfidante Supremo has a much newer, almost completely different version of the Juarez: the SS-01 Stalwart. I’m too lazy to go into the specifics right now, but I can assure you that it is ornate, aristocratic, gaudy, and armed with a flashy particle battleaxe. Think of the modified OZ Prize Leos from the Gundam Wing Last Outpost G-Unit manga. The Concord begins with a large supply of mostly-ceremonial junky Juarezes, as well as a modern but partly-dismantled supply of terrestrial warships, mobilized artillery, a small air force, and plenty of transports and shuttles. In general, all Mobile Suits have at least a moderate form of shield generator that can block beam attacks and some explosives, but the Sfidante Supremo has weaker ones. Later on, there is the SS-34 Cronus, a flight Mobile Suit. Regardless of side or specification, ALL Mobile Suits have beam blades.

The Mobile Armor: None planned for now. Instead, there are Mobile Suits that are superhero-like. I’m more used to Gundam Wing, so I don’t know how mobile armors work, other than they are really powerful and Gundam Wing sux!!!!!11112 for not having any.

What I will add is the QuasiTank, nicknamed the Houston, along with an upgrade nicknamed O’Higgins. The QuasiTank is a hovertank built of the Quasicáscara alloy and possesses incredible strength and exceptional speed, and can actually threaten Mobile Suits when in great numbers.

The Gundam: Secret facilities hidden in Origin, the moon, the Belt, Antarctica, and experimental outposts on Mars and under the sea (in the Gulf of Mexico, DAN DAN DAN!!!) are collaborating separately to create a Mobile Suit with a chassis of Geological Utilitarian Next-generation Defensive Amalgamate Metal, or GUNDAM. It is a derivative of Quasicáscara. The Mobile Suit’s name: the UC-01A GUNDAM, codenamed Washington. Details will be provided later, but its alloy is strong (though not as invincible as Gundanium)enough to defeat ranged machinegun fire up to a point. Its trademark weapon is the Lightning Bola, composed of Quasicáscara “rocks” tied together with GUNDAM strands, capable of being electrified. An array of machineguns and rocket launchers round out its initial complement of weaponry, although it later gets equipped with a beam cannon named after an American Revolutionary-Era musket. Later on, it is modified to have a fighter aircraft mode, causing it to be called the GUNDAM Gaucho.

The Other Gundams: The UC-01C Walker, codenamed William Walker, is a lighter, faster version of the UC-01A GUNDAM, designed for hit and run missions and close combat. The UC-0H Gunforcer, codenamed San Martín, is a GUNDAM for heavy artillery, without complete arms but instead specialized arms and slots for outfitting guns in the heat of the battle, and two giant rocket cannons on its shoulders. Fitted on hovercraft, it is remarkably speedy, but clunky and rather awkward with giant guns in place of arms. Each is given to a Kid, though the Walker soon gets destroyed and is replaced with a Gunforcer with legs. The Sfidante Supremo have various Stalwart models with different accessories, and the only different Mobile Suit is the SS-20 Franz, which carries a wide, metal “shield of Turin” that is capable of dissipating beam attacks, and so is almost invincible in dueling.

The Boss Gundam: The SS-44 Emmanuel is an advanced version of the Stalwart with a customized paint job and advanced technology able to nullify effects of Quasicáscara for amounts of time. That capability is coupled with small-range nuclear weapons that cause radioactive poisoning against enemies. However, the SS-44 is not made of GUNDAM and has no shield generator, and so is vulnerable to machinegun fire, explosives, and beam weaponry.

The White Ship: The Malinche was built to ferry a group of pilots and scientists and the GUNDAM from Origin to Earth. It looks like an Encomienda-class transport, except it also has a potent laser cannon that can take out a Mobile Suit, but is often malfunctioning. It also has turrets.

THE CHARACTERS

The Hero: Marco Aguatur, son of brilliant Quasicáscara metallurgist Hernando Aguatur. His mother lives at the Vesuvius colony at Origin, whereas Marco and his father live at the scientific colony of Herculaneum also at L1. Marco is something of an engineering prodigy(?) in an attempt to have some basis for interaction with his somewhat distant father, but his real love is for the starfighters also designed at the colony. Not only has he had experience in flying, he’s a fanatic with piloting simulations, and so lacks some social development. However, he shuns the weapons of the craft, and does not know that his father is actually creating the GUNDAM alloy from Quasicáscara. Immediately after Marco’s first experience in the GUNDAM, he experiences some of his umano espacio powers, but dismisses it as experience from piloting. He also finds that he can transmit messages telepathically in mobile suits, even though he never had surgery for La Macchina.

The Kids: José Santa Maria, Marco’s best friend on L1, also a fanatic for flying but more militaristic and a big shot. Ironically, he becomes the pilot of the Walker. Aquila Farnese, one of Marco’s old friends, is very sisterly to him and has a secret love for José. She becomes a communications deputy officer on the Malinche. Laura Alderman, an exchange student from an academy at the UC South American nation of Santa Cruz, quickly grows to like José, and becomes both a turret gunner and a diplomat. Somewhat tomboy-ish, but not in a stereotypical way. Tomás Lodge, stereotypical hacker and Laura’s cousin, becomes an intelligence officer and cryptologist after he cracks the code for some of the SS’s transmissions. Julio Moros, an immigrant from Venturia, becomes a pilot and runs a black market of sorts onboard. Shikari Miyuki, Japanese tourist and medical student, becomes a nurse. Finally, Isabella Rosetta knows Marco because her parents were also involved with the GUNDAM project. They were once close friends, but have since drifted apart since both are busy. She is in love with him, secretly.

The Junior Officers: Most of the Malinche’s crew was captured at Heculaneum, and nearly all of the pilots. Amazingly, the elderly Captain Jonah Lucás was onboard at the time (it is later revealed that he was there for an embarrassing reason), though he is at first guilty and depressed about leaving his crew behind and contemptuous of the young kids and eggheads he has to command. Warrant officer Nzinga Kiluanji is the first mate, and is a careful officer who does not show up often. The young Sublieutenant John Torres becomes a helmsman, and with hotshot derring-do better fit for a Mobile Suit pilot he pilots the Malinche with craziness. Most of the GUNDAM designers and scientists are onboard. Professor Nina Raimundo, a specialist on the revolutionary La Macchina, becomes the head doctor and psych chaplain. She’s rather bitchy at times, but a good person once you’re on her good side. Doctor Eldridge Sebert, a portly and scholarly expert on precise mechanics, handles all of the rough stuff as the new chief mechanic. The typical fish-out-of-the-water scenario ensues. Those two doctors have a humorous odd pair relationship. Raimundo’s academic archnemesis is Joao Jackson, a crotchety old codger and authority on Mobile Suit technologies, who everyone suspects is secretly working for someone other than the UC and Origin.

The Mysterious Woman: Nzinga Kiluanji is actually Son of the Revival‘s cousin and last relative and must keep it secret, knowing that he wants to kill her to remain the only heir to the SS throne. She would actually like to be Queen, and so schemes to kill him, also in revenge for her branch of the family’s murder by his. The second Mysterious Woman is a refugee found on a shuttle attacked by the SS. Her name is Alma del Oro, and identifies herself as a colonist from one of Origin’s fringe colonies, Leominster.

The Veteran: Alejandro Hermion. A battle-scarred veteran of several minor wars against guerillas before the Conflict, he is unhappy with the UC’s inflexibility, incompetence, and corruption. He hopes that he could instruct the Kids and others to finish the mission, but has a fatal secret- he was one of the first to adopt La Macchina, but his gene therapy was not well-implemented, and so he suffers from bouts of vertigo. A side-effect is that he is capable of high-speed fighting in certain battles, and so gets killed in a blaze of glory.

The Masked Nemesis: Giuseppe Venizelos, the Figlio D’Risorgimento, Son of the Revival. He first pilots a modified Stalwart with the tricolor, and later a Franz in light blue. He supposedly has connections with the currently ruling Zaghrebs, but he’s actually the son of Hernando Aguatur and his first wife, Princess Stella Sfidante, one of the original ruling family of SS who was ousted in a private power play some years ago. While he is strongly pro-SS, he hates the Zaghrebs. Though Marco is conflicted with fighting his half-brother, Venizelos isn’t and dismisses him as the son of his father’s lesser wife and an obstacle to the throne. His mask hides his Aguatur ancestry, and it comes off once he eventually confronts Marco.

The Protege: El Sid, a cousin of Giuseppe Venizelos, though of Spanish instead of Italian origin. He is a talented non-UE pilot, though there are hints that he has special powers from bad genetherapy. He is a hotshot and eager to prove himself, but also willing to follow his famous cousin. He gets killed by Alejandro Hermion, who is then killed by Venizelos, infuriating Marco. The second protégé is Venizelos’s fiancée, Catalina Magnani. A volatile and hotheaded woman, she is traditional but also nationalistic enough to fight instead of simply relaxing as a noble. She is eventually defeated and captured by Marco, but Venizelos thinks that she is dead and goes berserk. She is with her lover at the very end of the series.

The Peacemaker: Alma del Oro turns out to be a daughter of the Emperor of Alta Caelum. She tries to get the Captain to leave Malinche at her L5 colony and then somehow negotiate a peace, but he rebuffs her attempts. She tries to get Marco to take over, but Laura manages to stop her, leading to a friendship between she and Marco and jealousy from Isabella.

Noble Enemies: Archduke Sebastian Jelovic, the commander of the 86th Aerial Interceptor Squadron, the best Cronus pilots of SS. Nicknamed the Saluki, his fighters were transferred to the Kalahari Desert after his disputes with the Zaghrebs. Though disgraced, they fight honorably and chase the Malinche well. He catches Marco, and allows the Malinche to go on to Luanda after a few days of hospitality, as he believes that Marco is meant for great things and that the world’s fate might depend on him.

The Night Flight Fighters is Saluki’s best team within his Squadron, a motley crew of seven excellent pilots. They are later seen at the siege of Buenos Aires. José is forced to fight them, shooting three down, but they escape.
Sierra Cherokee is the female “Cacciatrice Mezzanotte”, sent by the SS to hunt down and destroy the Malinche through sabotage, but refuses because of the dishonor. She later joins the CAD after she discovers how the Alta Caelum colonies were brutalized by Sfidante Supremo.

Trece Galloway is the greatest caudillo of the War, rising to power in the Muddle but appearing in the Opening Moves as a well-to-do, well-respected leader within the Concord Congreso who is eventually revealed to be a puppet master of sorts, favoring the peace doves of the UC government but actually also working the war hawks. Since there are nations within the UC that support them only for more autonomy, frictions occur and are resolved by Galloway, who later takes over the Unitary Concord.

Scummy Enemies: UC Captain Burton Allenby, nicknamed “Antlion,” is a loathsome opportunist who charges the Malinche with treason to discredit Captain Lucás. He is killed before the ship reaches Luanda in a hopeless duel with Saluki. The two commanders at Luanda base, Colonel Jenkins Wendelson and General Davíd Pueblo, bicker and are anti-Malinche. The former wants to take the ship and give it to the Sfidante Supremo as a gift, and the latter wants to stop his subordinate in order to carry out his own wild dreams of becoming a hero. Lord Ephialtes, an SS noble and politician with questionable loyalties, tries to betray the Revival Son to a Sobel charge and ends up getting assassinated by one of SotR’s devoted friends. Corporate Chairman Franklin Varga is the Enron-type evil CEO, and tries to use the Sfidante families and nations’ war to sell weapons and gain access to resources. Onboard the SS flagship, he planned to assassinate Alberto Zaghreb and nearly succeeds, but the Laser fires just as he strikes.

THE STORY

Pregame: Events as related above.

The Opening Moves: Figlio D’Risorgimento/the Son of the Revival leads a task force of Stalwarts to Herculaneum as part of Operation Brain Trust, the capture of Origin’s scientific and engineering facilities as a part of the scheme to take the entire cluster. Things get out of hand, and Hernando warns his son and several colleagues, who escape aboard the Malinche with the GUNDAM. Marco and the Kids arrive at the hangar whilst the rest of the colony is being taken over, but manages to get into a duel with three Stalwarts before escaping. Early teamwork is displayed by José and Laura’s assistance on turrets. SotR is impressed, but is called away soon after and mysteriously does not report the Malinche’s escape until a while later.

The Run To Earth: Operation Amputation, the Sfidante Supremo’s conquest of the pro-UC L1 cluster of Origin, is carried out. The Malinche has a madcap flight to Venturia, where the crew takes shelter for a few days before they are expelled along with a few refugees from Origin (who also provide a Walker and a Gunforcer prototype). They go to Alta Caelum, but escape after the imperial military tries to seize them. In daring subterfuge, Malinche is disguised as an SS ship and enters Earth along with the SS invasion fleet, risking getting discovered by the enemy or destroyed by their own countrymen.

The Midgame: Malinche breaks off from the fleet, traveling to southern Africa instead of Europe. The ship is damaged and cannot last a whole transatlantic flight, and so the crew must fight to the UC-controlled Luanda base on the coast. There, machinations occur, and the crew is split in half, except for the Kids. Colonel Wendelson wishes to take the ship and its Suits and use it for himself... maybe even defecting to the Sfidante Supremo with it. The loyalist Pueblo opposes him but is unsympathetic to the Malinche’s plight, and fighting ensues. Discoveries are found regarding the Umano Espacios, leading Marco to question his humanity and morality.

The Muddle: Battle lines shift and flow on Earth, the Alta Caelum sees that everyone is too focused there, and the various space forces are weak enough to be attacked. Alma del Oro becomes a delightfully evil villain. However, AC’s strong army is defeated after Venturia stops sending them supplies. Much of the civilian population flees to Earth as “recolonists” in the Middle East, creating a proto-CAD. In the western hemisphere, the fringes of the Americas are invaded (northern Canadian territories, Tierra del Fuego, almost to the mainland) by the SS. The Sfidante have all kinds of advanced Mobile Suits I don’t feel like describing, and are almost stopped but for several Concord naval victories and General Diego Sobel’s brilliant QuasiTank charges. A decisive battle is fought and won by Sobel at Ciudad America (Mexico City), the capital of the UC. Fortunately, that happens at the eve of a vicious dispute onboard the Malinche, and so the crew does not leave the war as neutrals, angry at no progress. Also at this time, several caudillos spring up throughout the war within the Concord, some advocating peace, some seeking to submit the Concord to the SS, some just wanting to become generalissimo or el presidente.

The Endgame: The leader of the Sfidante Supremo, Alberto Zaghreb, tries to put his Apocalypse Plan into effect after he discovers that the UC might use the Bolivar Laser, and after they receive new empty colonies from Alta Caelum. Supreme’s corporate forces finally arrive from Saturn, utterly devastating the AC and preparing to crush their competitors by dropping an asteroid onto the underwater labs in the Gulf of Mexico. Malinche, finally working out internal issues, heads for Buenos Aires along with the rest of the force as the UC forces there were badly defeated by a SS landing and the city is besieged. The Unitary Concord rallies around the strongest and most charismatic caudillo, Trece Galloway, who takes complete power of Earth with the help of his private army of elite pilots and manages to foil the SS at multiple fronts- but not at Buenos Aires. Desperate, the SS starts to drop colonies, and the UC is forced to use the Bolivar Laser on almost half of the population from Origin. Nukes are used that are stopped by shields but cause irradiation. Madness erupts. Malinche is among the head of the UC reinforcements, and both the SS besiegers and UC relief army fights into the city. The showdown between half-brother and half-brother occurs, and Hernando Aguatur has a cameo but fails in getting either to lay down their arms. As the Bolivar Laser charges up, Marco manages to stop the Revival Son in an explosion that consumes them both. The Laser is used to destroy the Sfidante Supremo’s flagship at the last second, and an armistice is called. Unfortunately, Supreme’s asteroid still manages to strike the Gulf of Mexico, sending tsunamis all around and destroying the evacuated sea labs. As the characters grimly witness the destruction, they realize that for some reason, there’s no sign of the destroyed suits of either Marco or the Revival Son…

The Side Stories: Plenty of stories about the various Unitary Concord fighters in the nations that aren’t shown- the notorious Balkan front, where a Russian assault team tries to stem the tide of Supremo forces landing in Kosovo. A light tale about a band of UC ne’er-do-wells stationed in Hokkaido to prevent a completely unlikely SS landing- or an invasion from China. Spain’s identity crisis (half for the UC, half for the SS) leads to civil war. The story of Alta Caelum’s doomed attempt to fight both UC and SS. An account of a special scientific MS team’s attempt to continue communications between all of the experimental GUNDAM facilities, starring Hernando Aguatur. Finally, corporate greed reigns in the chronicle of a young Supreme employee sent from Jupiter to Europe in the Midgame to secure company holdings, and ends up founding Kremedict.

The Sequels: The Caeserum Aegyptos Dynasty is eventually created under the bloodline of Alma del Oro, bringing in thousands of secretly UE who were living in Alta Caelum before its destruction. The Sfidante are mostly defeated (no neo-Zeon for them), but Supreme’s corporate remnants quickly return to support this new customer for arms sales. The Moon declares independence as a partner of the CAD, its UE leader extolling the superiority of the Umano Espacio d’Luna. The colonies on Mars and the Belt are threatened, and the destruction of the Bolivar Laser has made the planet defenseless to colony drops.

After this “Industrialist-Imperialist Crisis,” the weakened UC attempts to foil a plot to threaten their rule by Trece Galloway’s niece, Valor Yamagata-Macmillan. As had received her famous uncle’s pilots for her command after they defected during the IIC, she seeks to repent for the Greatest War on Earth by seceding the old SS colonies at L2 and L4, but not starting a fight unless provoked. Though she is backed by Cortez, the last powerful family of Sfidante (who were actually weak and barely-mentioned in the original series), her non-war ends with a non-army: the Unitary Concord narrowly avoids another tragedy by sending in a crack special task force unit, the Deterrence Credenza, which includes some Kids from Malinche, such as José Santa Maria, Laura Alderman, and Tomás Lodge.

[Datana]

Never thought that I'd ever willingly respond to a thread by Zor. Also, shouldn't this thread be in Fantasy?

I'm not quite certain on how well the other Gundam series relate to it (since, other than SEED, all I've seen is MS Gundam 0080, which does not follow the generic storyline at all).

Ah, but it does. Specifically, this bit (even though it's an anime):

The Side Stories: Dozens of manga and videogames crop up to tell the stories of minor players in the War. Other Gundams usually appear, even ones supposedly better than The Gundam, diluting the franchise. Side Stories rarely follow the Generic Storyline, but will grab elements from it.

By the way, do you think the 'SEED' series is entertaining enough to be worth the cost of the box set?

Not really, unless you can get a three-finger discount. The SEED anime's story is hit-or-miss (the manga deviates quite a bit on some points, from what I've heard, mostly for the better). The first half of the series (1-26) is incredibly derivative and will drag if you've seen other Gundam series (especially the UC Gundams). This is the portion of the series that fits Zor's list perfectly. It hits a high point from 29-40, during which the plot moves more quickly and is fairly interesting. From there, suspension of disbelief becomes harder and harder as the director tries to cram in more plot points than he can handle into the last ten episodes, making the ending a mishmash of plot holes, leaps in logic, and missed opportunities.

The sequel, SEED Destiny (which gets an American release this winter), starts off on a fairly high note for the first ten or so episodes, but then is rapidly dragged down by the sheer number of characters, none of which receive any meaningful development (and some of the returnees from SEED actually regress). Toward the end, the characters effectively become set pieces for the story, which in itself is rather poorly written and developed. It pretty much completely jumps the shark around the time of the second clip show (episode 29), and self-implodes by the third (episode 41), not even trying to finish off all of the threads from earlier in the series (some pretty major). This would not be on a "to-buy" list unless you absolutely wanted more of SEED.

[Zor]

Never thought that I'd ever willingly respond to a thread by Zor. Also, shouldn't this thread be in Fantasy?

No, Regardless of the fact that it is Anime, its Science Fiction.

Zor

[Datana]

No, Regardless of the fact that it is Anime, its Science Fiction.

Anime, even sci-fi related anime, has consistently gone in Fantasy, especially mecha-based series. For instance, Darth Sephiroth's recent thread here between two mecha series, Ford Prefect's thread on a potential third GitS TV series, Xess' request for series, FOG3's thread about changing NERV leadership, and another mecha thread by TheMuffinKing. But that's enough of this argument; let's just have a mod rule on this and get back to the thread.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

But that's enough of this argument; let's just have a mod rule on this and get back to the thread.

Funny thing to say, considering that you brought it up in the first place...

[Datana]

Fine, I conceed.

[Datana]

Plus, I just got ruled against, anyway. Sorry for cluttering up the thread.

[LordShaithis]

Never thought that I'd ever willingly respond to a thread by Zor.

Other than Darth Wong, the Duchess, and maybe Shep, Zor is my favorite SD.net poster! RAR!

[Singular Quartet]

On Mobile Armors: Blame the directors of 0079 for that one. Basically, what happened was an argument between the directors as to what the series was doing: One wanted it to be straight military SF, while the other wanted it closer to the more famous super-robot shows of the time, resulting in a rather disgusting number of quite useless MAs.

What the MA is, though, is simple: A large machine with with better guns, better speed, better armor, and just in generally better than the standard MS. It doesn't look anything like an MS, but more like an overly stylized space ship. Generally, it can walk on land or fly in space, has more guns that should be able to be controlled by the one or two pilots, and occasionally has either arms or legs. If it has both, then it stops being a mobile armor and is then reclassified as a mobile suit (ie: Psycho Gundam mkI and mkII)

Anyways... yeah, that about sums it up.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

On Mobile Armors: Blame the directors of 0079 for that one. Basically, what happened was an argument between the directors as to what the series was doing: One wanted it to be straight military SF, while the other wanted it closer to the more famous super-robot shows of the time, resulting in a rather disgusting number of quite useless MAs.

Um, no, that's not how it happened. For one thing, there was only one director for MSG, and that was Tomino, and he did the whole 180 change from super robot show to military sci-fi during pre-production. The mobile armours are more of a holdover of the monster of the week mentality.

[Sidewinder]

What the MA is, though, is simple: A large machine with with better guns, better speed, better armor, and just in generally better than the standard MS.

Unfortunately, it still gets killed fairly easily by the Gundam. You'd think they'd use the resources to make more MSs, instead of wasting it on a white elephant-- like WW2 Germany using enough metal to build EIGHT Panther tanks in order to build two Maus prototypes.

The mobile armours are more of a holdover of the monster of the week mentality.

Monster of the week or not, the tactics used in the deployment of the MAs are inexcusably incompetent. You'd think by now the producers would hire military consultants, who'd advise the directors/writers to deploy the MAs like tanks, with MSs like infantry to keep the Gundam away so the MA's superior weapons can destroy it, instead of letting the hero close in and use a beam saber to hack up the MA like a pig in a butcher shop.

[SylasGaunt]

Part of the problem with the MAs as pointed out somewhere (forget where) is that by the end of the war Zeon's science and technical divisions had gotten into a gigantic bitch-fighting contest over resources with everybody pulling every string and trying to impress every politician they could. The end result was that instead of building lots of 1 very effective mobile armor, they ended up building one or two of many kinds of mobile armors.. most of which get utterly spanked.

Of course some of them like say the Big Zam manage to do quite a bit of damage, while other like the Apsalus don't really ever get to do that much.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Monster of the week or not, the tactics used in the deployment of the MAs are inexcusably incompetent.

I wasn't excusing them.

You'd think by now the producers would hire military consultants, who'd advise the directors/writers

"By now?" Kid, half of these series were made between almost thirty and fifteen years ago. And the primary goal of Gundam, storytelling or not, has always been to sell toys and kits.

Also, the majority of mobile armours have been presented as either prototypes or specialised weapons platforms, usually dedicated or designed for specific roles. Mass production of MAs has rarely been very practical.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Part of the problem with the MAs as pointed out somewhere (forget where) is that by the end of the war Zeon's science and technical divisions had gotten into a gigantic bitch-fighting contest over resources with everybody pulling every string and trying to impress every politician they could.

Pretty much. For one thing, the two major mobile suit and weapons manufacturers for Zeon, Zeonic Company and Zimmad Company, had an intense and bitter bidding rivalry throughout the OYW.

Additionally, there were only ten (maybe eleven) mobile armours that were fielded by the Principality during the war, virtually all of them prototypes or experimental models:

-Zakrello, Bigro, Grabro: MIP Company, a relatively minor corporation who bid against and lost to Zeonic and their AMBAC design for what would become mobile suits.

-Braw Bro and Elmeth: Flanagan Institute, for psycommu system research and field testing.

-Big Zam, Apsulas I-III and Adzam: Principality of Zeon, for three seperate projects (The Adzam was specifically built at Zeon's Granada Base).

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Oops, forgot the possible eleventh: the YMT-05 Hildolfr mobile tank prototype: Manufacturer is unknown, but more than likely it was another exclusive Principality project.

[Sidewinder]

You'd think by now the producers would hire military consultants, who'd advise the directors/writers

"By now?" Kid, half of these series were made between almost thirty and fifteen years ago.

The writers for 'Gundam' are still making the same damn mistakes, by having the Cosmic Era military make the same damn mistakes as the Universal Century's!

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TSX-MA717/ZD_Pergrande

It was destroyed by Blue Frame's Positron Cannon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YMAF-X6BD_Zamza-Zah

Although it ripped away Impulse's right leg with one of its claws, it was ultimately destroyed when Shinn went into SEED mode and stabbed the mobile armor through the cockpit with his beam saber.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YMAG-X7F_Gells-Ghe

It was instrumental in thwarting ZAFT's first attack on the base, but the second attack, reinforced by the battleship Minerva, was successful when ZGMF-X23S Saviour pilot Athrun Zala disabled the mobile armor, allowing Shinn Asuka in the ZGMF-X56S Impulse to destroy the Lohengrin Gate.

Also, the majority of mobile armours have been presented as either prototypes or specialised weapons platforms, usually dedicated or designed for specific roles.

That's why the producer's should hire military consultants, have the consultants teach the writers about combined arms tactics, and make sure the writers actually listened to the consultants! There's no suspence in a battle scene when the hero faces an incompetent villain, unless the hero's incompetent as well.

[The Yosemite Bear]

somehow I read this as gundam hardcore. yeah that's it Char fucks amoru in more ways then you can imagine.

[Bob McDob]

Somebody needs to use the template to make a World War I Gundam series.

Because that would be all sorts of awesome.