Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Ralin » 2019-08-20 12:24am

Broomstick wrote:
2019-08-19 05:46am
No, it was just Dresden, Molly, and Kincaid on the phone. There's a very brief mention of it. Dresden called Kincaid, then had Molly erase the memory of doing so from his mind.
I meant in the room on Kincaid's end.

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Lonestar » 2019-08-20 07:28am

Ralin wrote:
2019-08-20 12:24am


I meant in the room on Kincaid's end.

Everyone knows you did, I don't know why on earth she acted like you indicated otherwise.
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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Broomstick » 2019-08-20 07:52am

Because... I didn't realize he meant Kincaid's side?

Who knows who or if anyone was on Kincaid's side? It just wasn't addressed.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Ralin » 2019-08-20 08:26am

Broomstick wrote:
2019-08-20 07:52am
Because... I didn't realize he meant Kincaid's side?

Who knows who or if anyone was on Kincaid's side? It just wasn't addressed.
Well, he's around her on a regular basis. Probably much of the day, considering he's on retainer as a bodyguard. We know he was on the job that day from when Harry called Ivy asking for help in Changes before the house fire. Ducking into another room out of sight and earshot anytime he gets a call would be a pretty bad habit for a bodyguard. So it's speculation, but it seems likely

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Broomstick » 2019-08-20 09:31am

While Ivy by her very nature can not be a sheltered and naive little girl (arguably, she's the least naive and sheltered human on the planet), I don't think Kincaid is inclined to discuss killing other people in her earshot. For one thing, it's not part of the job of guarding Ivy, it's a different job, a different client if you will. They're not joined at the hip - in fact, there was the vacation he took with Karrin where I don't recall Ivy being present at all. I'm assuming he's not her only bodyguard. So.... maybe Ivy was aware of the conversation, maybe she wasn't, there is no way to know because we only here about this from Dresden's viewpoint.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-08-20 11:38am

Broomstick wrote:
2019-08-20 09:31am
While Ivy by her very nature can not be a sheltered and naive little girl (arguably, she's the least naive and sheltered human on the planet), I don't think Kincaid is inclined to discuss killing other people in her earshot. For one thing, it's not part of the job of guarding Ivy, it's a different job, a different client if you will. They're not joined at the hip - in fact, there was the vacation he took with Karrin where I don't recall Ivy being present at all. I'm assuming he's not her only bodyguard. So.... maybe Ivy was aware of the conversation, maybe she wasn't, there is no way to know because we only here about this from Dresden's viewpoint.
There's also the fact that Ivy doesn't really need a bodyguard. The impression I got was that Kincaid was more her driver/errand boy/maybe surrogate father, than someone she really needed to protect her from attackers, at least most of the time (the Denarian trap had to be specially prepared for her, with all the manpower their order could muster, plus a power-up for the magic from Satan himself, and she still gave them a real fight).

There's probably not much short of a fairy queen or an archangel in the Dresdenverse who can do a better job defending itself than Ivy can.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Mr Bean » 2019-08-20 02:46pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-08-20 11:38am
Broomstick wrote:
2019-08-20 09:31am
While Ivy by her very nature can not be a sheltered and naive little girl (arguably, she's the least naive and sheltered human on the planet), I don't think Kincaid is inclined to discuss killing other people in her earshot. For one thing, it's not part of the job of guarding Ivy, it's a different job, a different client if you will. They're not joined at the hip - in fact, there was the vacation he took with Karrin where I don't recall Ivy being present at all. I'm assuming he's not her only bodyguard. So.... maybe Ivy was aware of the conversation, maybe she wasn't, there is no way to know because we only here about this from Dresden's viewpoint.
There's also the fact that Ivy doesn't really need a bodyguard. The impression I got was that Kincaid was more her driver/errand boy/maybe surrogate father, than someone she really needed to protect her from attackers, at least most of the time (the Denarian trap had to be specially prepared for her, with all the manpower their order could muster, plus a power-up for the magic from Satan himself, and she still gave them a real fight).

There's probably not much short of a fairy queen or an archangel in the Dresdenverse who can do a better job defending itself than Ivy can.
I thought we knew that Ivy hired Kincaid because as well as being a useful bodyguard there's just a lot of threats someone like he can stop that a two year old, even a super magic one physically can't stop and her neutrality makes her want to not have to ice random people.

And then there's the simple things, she can't drive a car she's to short to see for much of the books.

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Broomstick » 2019-08-20 05:05pm

Also... rent an apartment, deal with well-meaning authorities that might otherwise want to place an orphan girl with a foster family, and so forth. Kincaid might be described as a heavily-armed butler rather than a bodyguard.

Also keep in mind that Ivy's grandmother, a prior Archive, died in a car accident. Ivy might be enormously knowledgeable and powerful, but physically she is still mortal. Having someone to keep her safe probably is very important.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-08-20 08:33pm

Broomstick wrote:
2019-08-20 05:05pm
Also... rent an apartment, deal with well-meaning authorities that might otherwise want to place an orphan girl with a foster family, and so forth. Kincaid might be described as a heavily-armed butler rather than a bodyguard.
Pretty much, yeah.
Also keep in mind that Ivy's grandmother, a prior Archive, died in a car accident. Ivy might be enormously knowledgeable and powerful, but physically she is still mortal. Having someone to keep her safe probably is very important.
Oh, there are certainly situations where having Kincaid could be useful for self-defense, but I'd expect them to be exceptional circumstances, namely those where Ivy was taken off-guard by something and incapacitated before she could bring her magical abilities to bear.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"Trump admirers like @TuckerCarlson describe themselves as "nationalist." But their nationalism attaches not to the multiracial American nation... but to a multinational white race with a capital in Moscow"-David Frum

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Ralin » 2019-08-21 02:16am

Kincaid told Dresden that if he wanted to kill him or any other wizard he would do it from a mile away via sniper rifle. Powerful as she is, I don't see any reason why that wouldn't work against Ivy too. Knowledge isn't the same as skill, and being perceptive and constantly on alert for potential threats and ambushes is a skill that Kincaid has.

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-08-21 02:32am

Ralin wrote:
2019-08-21 02:16am
Kincaid told Dresden that if he wanted to kill him or any other wizard he would do it from a mile away via sniper rifle. Powerful as she is, I don't see any reason why that wouldn't work against Ivy too. Knowledge isn't the same as skill, and being perceptive and constantly on alert for potential threats and ambushes is a skill that Kincaid has.
Yeah, that's pretty much the only scenario where Kincaid would be useful to her defense- a surprise attack from something she can't foresee.



Incidentally, I have a little fan theory about Kincaid- no idea if it'll ever be confirmed, but I think it makes sense. Basically, Kincaid is Macbeth. Yes, that Macbeth. Reasons: Kincaid is a Scottish name. Kincaid is clearly somewhat supernatural, and probably a lot older than he looks. Also, for the real clincher, what is Kincaid's title? The Hellhound. And what does MacDuff address Macbeth as during their final confrontation? Yup.

Plus, Butcher has IIRC acknowledged the influence of "Gargoyles" (specifically Xanatos on the character of Marcone), and that series also features a bad ass, semi-villainous Macbeth in the modern day.

Then again, I'm probably biased because Macbeth is my favorite play. :wink:
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"Trump admirers like @TuckerCarlson describe themselves as "nationalist." But their nationalism attaches not to the multiracial American nation... but to a multinational white race with a capital in Moscow"-David Frum

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Knife » 2019-09-01 11:12am

WOW, it's been years since I absorbed this series. I'm going to need to go back and re read most of this to get up to speed on side issues before this comes out.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-09-01 01:19pm

Knife wrote:
2019-09-01 11:12am
WOW, it's been years since I absorbed this series. I'm going to need to go back and re read most of this to get up to speed on side issues before this comes out.
At least it hasn't been as long as ASOIAF fans have been waiting for a new book. :)
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"Trump admirers like @TuckerCarlson describe themselves as "nationalist." But their nationalism attaches not to the multiracial American nation... but to a multinational white race with a capital in Moscow"-David Frum

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Vendetta » 2019-09-01 04:10pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-09-01 01:19pm
Knife wrote:
2019-09-01 11:12am
WOW, it's been years since I absorbed this series. I'm going to need to go back and re read most of this to get up to speed on side issues before this comes out.
At least it hasn't been as long as ASOIAF fans have been waiting for a new book. :)
Well no.

Jim has published 14 Dresden Files novels (and two short story collections), the entire Codex Alera, and the first Cinder Spires book in the same span of time as the last two ASOIAF books.

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Broomstick » 2019-09-01 05:31pm

Knife wrote:
2019-09-01 11:12am
WOW, it's been years since I absorbed this series. I'm going to need to go back and re read most of this to get up to speed on side issues before this comes out.
Either that, or TVTropes to review... but if you go that route make sure you have someone who come get you if you fall in and can't get out. :lol:
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Knife » 2019-09-02 10:59am

Broomstick wrote:
2019-09-01 05:31pm
Knife wrote:
2019-09-01 11:12am
WOW, it's been years since I absorbed this series. I'm going to need to go back and re read most of this to get up to speed on side issues before this comes out.
Either that, or TVTropes to review... but if you go that route make sure you have someone who come get you if you fall in and can't get out. :lol:
Haha.

First time around, I could chew through a book every couple days. They are good but not a hard read.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Knife » 2019-09-02 11:02am

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-09-01 01:19pm
Knife wrote:
2019-09-01 11:12am
WOW, it's been years since I absorbed this series. I'm going to need to go back and re read most of this to get up to speed on side issues before this comes out.
At least it hasn't been as long as ASOIAF fans have been waiting for a new book. :)
I've given up on that series. I read Game of Thrones in the 90's when it came out. Dance of Dragons was 2011. The old fat fuck is going to die before he finishes and in a lot of respects the show was better and I have little faith Martin would end it any better than the show.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red

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Re: Jim Butcher has finally finished Peace Talks (Dresden Files). Release date coming soon.

Post by Ralin » 2019-09-06 01:03pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-08-21 02:32am
Ralin wrote:
2019-08-21 02:16am
Kincaid told Dresden that if he wanted to kill him or any other wizard he would do it from a mile away via sniper rifle. Powerful as she is, I don't see any reason why that wouldn't work against Ivy too. Knowledge isn't the same as skill, and being perceptive and constantly on alert for potential threats and ambushes is a skill that Kincaid has.
Yeah, that's pretty much the only scenario where Kincaid would be useful to her defense- a surprise attack from something she can't foresee.
Just as an addendum, that scenario isn't one limited to well-planned out hits by skilled and professional killers. Ivy isn't invulnerable to some jackass runs at her with a knife and stabs her, no why or complete stranger grabs her at random and throws her over a third floor railing or any number of other random violent things that can happen at any given time, especially in public. Ivy's way better at protecting herself from that than most, but as her grandmother's car accident shows she only has to get unlucky once. She's not the kind of badass that doesn't need to worry about having a good pair of eyes on constant lookout.

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