A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

FAN: Discuss various fictional worlds that don't qualify for SF.

Moderator: Steve

Post Reply
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-07 08:36pm

For more Terminator-y goodness. :D

At some point in the distant future, and for reasons that remain unknown, a T-1000 Terminator is transported back in time to kill Lyanna Stark before she can give birth to Jon Connor Snow. Another Terminator, a T-800 in the Ahnuld mold, is sent back to protect her.

The T-1000 wins if Lyanna is killed before giving birth, if Rhaegar is killed before impregnating Lyanna, or if it can subsequently eliminate Jon.

The T-800 wins if it can keep Jon Snow alive long enough to fulfill whatever destiny awaits him.

Edit: TV-verse, the Terminators arrive at the tournament shortly before Lyanna elopes with Rhaegar.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
U.P. Cinnabar
Sith Marauder
Posts: 3845
Joined: 2016-02-05 08:11pm
Location: Aboard the RCS Princess Cecile

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by U.P. Cinnabar » 2019-02-07 09:27pm

And, then the Terminators were incinerated by dragons.
"Beware the Beast, Man, for he is the Devil's pawn. Alone amongst God's primates, he kills for sport, for lust, for greed. Yea, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land. Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him, drive him back into his jungle lair, for he is the harbinger of Death.."
—29th Scroll, 6th Verse of Ape Law
"Indelible in the hippocampus is the laughter. The uproarious laughter between the two, and their having fun at my expense.”
---Doctor Christine Blasey-Ford

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-07 09:52pm

Hmm... how much heat does it take to melt a Terminator? How much heat does a dragon's breath put out (presuming one hatches and grows to adulthood in this timeline)?

The other option that occurred to me was Wildfyre. Lure the T-1000 into a trap, detonate a bunch of Wildfyre. If that don't put it down, nothing in Westeros will.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
LaCroix
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4766
Joined: 2004-12-21 12:14pm
Location: Sopron District, Hungary, Europe, Terra

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by LaCroix » 2019-02-08 05:16am

Any terminator will completely melt in molten iron (above 1500 degrees)
A dragon was used to melt the Iron Throne - they just stopped at welding heat (1250 degrees) instead of melting them down completely.
(Explanation: If you heat steel swords up to make them weld together, they were at the cusp of melting - suface was already melting, that's how you did welding, back then)

Wildfyre is said to be burning just as hot.

That level of heat will be enough to at least distort any metal component of the Terminator, and certainly be enough to destroy any circuitry due to heat effects.

Sadly, there were no dragons left at that time, and quotes say that even wildfyre had lost a lot of potency in the time before magic/dragons returned.
Also, wildfyre is really dangerous to handle.

Still, sources say that a T-800 lacks the tools to destroy a T-1000, even with most of 20th century weaponry, up to small grenade launchers.So unless T800 manages to somehow hack the T1000 quickly into pieces without being harmed (or sacrificing itself so it can be done) and manages to store each piece seperately and take them to a blacksmith for disposal (a medieval blacksmith's forge needs to be able to heat material to 1300-1400 degrees and above to be useful within their technological context), lobbing wildfyre at it is most likely the only thing that can stop it.
A minute's thought suggests that the very idea of this is stupid. A more detailed examination raises the possibility that it might be an answer to the question "how could the Germans win the war after the US gets involved?" - Captain Seafort, in a thread proposing a 1942 'D-Day' in Quiberon Bay

I do archery skeet. With a Trebuchet.

User avatar
Solauren
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 8233
Joined: 2003-05-11 09:41pm

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Solauren » 2019-02-13 05:26pm

If it's a 'T3 Rise of the Machines' Terminator, then it could damage it's own fuel cell then stuff it into the T-1000.

However, that is such a long shot of working, it's probably not worth doing.
\

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-14 03:38pm

Solauren wrote:
2019-02-13 05:26pm
If it's a 'T3 Rise of the Machines' Terminator, then it could damage it's own fuel cell then stuff it into the T-1000.

However, that is such a long shot of working, it's probably not worth doing.
Seems like its also a one-shot effort. I mean, don't they need their fuel cell to work?
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
Elheru Aran
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 12754
Joined: 2004-03-04 01:15am
Location: Georgia

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Elheru Aran » 2019-02-14 04:05pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-02-14 03:38pm
Solauren wrote:
2019-02-13 05:26pm
If it's a 'T3 Rise of the Machines' Terminator, then it could damage it's own fuel cell then stuff it into the T-1000.

However, that is such a long shot of working, it's probably not worth doing.
Seems like its also a one-shot effort. I mean, don't they need their fuel cell to work?
The T3 Terminator was IIRC a T-850? something like that. He had -two- fuel cells, one is damaged in the shoot-out where he recovers Sarah Connor's coffin full of weapons and he throws it out the back of a truck creating a small nuclear explosion. The second is obviously what's used in the end of the movie to destroy the T-X.
It's a strange world. Let's keep it that way.

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-14 05:32pm

Well, a two-time move, then, I guess.

Might be worth trying. Its a long-shot, but probably no more than luring it into a Wildfire trap and not getting blown up by it yourself.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
Solauren
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 8233
Joined: 2003-05-11 09:41pm

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Solauren » 2019-02-14 05:37pm

If the Terminator could rig it up to explode at trigger, it might be more feasible to throw it at the T-1000.

Still, using the Fuel cell as a weapon is a long shot.
\

User avatar
Zixinus
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 6663
Joined: 2007-06-19 12:48pm
Location: In Seth the Blitzspear
Contact:

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Zixinus » 2019-02-20 11:38am

It is practically the only option that's readily available. You will not be able to seriously damage a T-1000, something that can reshape itself after being cleaved in half, with medieval weapons.

Yes, with medieval napalm you could seriously damage it and there might be a chance. But a T-800 getting their hands on it is somewhat remote.
Credo!
Chat with me on Skype if you want to talk about writing, ideas or if you want a test-reader! PM for address.

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-20 02:03pm

Eh... If a T-800 walked into the wildfire stores and decided to rob them... who exactly in King's Landing is going to stop it? The only way they could do so would be to... set off the wildfire.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
Zixinus
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 6663
Joined: 2007-06-19 12:48pm
Location: In Seth the Blitzspear
Contact:

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Zixinus » 2019-02-20 02:27pm

While the T-800 is also almost impossible to kill with medieval weapons, it can get stuck under a ton of rubble and cannot recover from damage as the T-1000. Yes, it is going to take a lot to damage a T-800, but it's possible because it is vulnerable in ways that the T-1000 isn't.

The problem with wildfyre is that it is located in only one place (IIRC) in Westeros, so the T-800 has to walk/ride (can a horse even take the T-800) there and get it. If it can even learn about the existence of wildfyre in time.

Meanwhile, the T-1000 does not need such an elaborate setup to finish it's job. It can just keep going and going with nothing to stop it.
Credo!
Chat with me on Skype if you want to talk about writing, ideas or if you want a test-reader! PM for address.

User avatar
Tribble
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2700
Joined: 2008-11-18 11:28am
Location: stardestroyer.net

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Tribble » 2019-02-20 11:25pm

Zixinus wrote: While the T-800 is also almost impossible to kill with medieval weapons, it can get stuck under a ton of rubble and cannot recover from damage as the T-1000. Yes, it is going to take a lot to damage a T-800, but it's possible because it is vulnerable in ways that the T-1000 isn't.
Against the T-1000 it could potentially be vulnerable to handheld GoT weapons depending on how tough they are. The T-1000 was eventually able to drive a crowbar straight through the T-800's chassis and power cells after beating it into submission with said crowbar and other heavy equipment.
Zixinus wrote:The problem with wildfyre is that it is located in only one place (IIRC) in Westeros, so the T-800 has to walk/ride (can a horse even take the T-800) there and get it. If it can even learn about the existence of wildfyre in time.
The T-800 is probably better off just walking/jogging the whole way as it is at least comparable in speed to a horse, and unlike a horse it has no need for things like food, water or rest.
Zixinus wrote:Meanwhile, the T-1000 does not need such an elaborate setup to finish it's job. It can just keep going and going with nothing to stop it.
What's particularly dangerous here is that the T-1000 will be learning about its abilities and evolving as it goes along. We see a clear progression in T2 of its tactics in both camouflage and combat, and imagine things would play out similarly here. At some point it's going to figure out that for much of its mission it has no need for remaining in a human form and can do things like turn into a multi-legged form (however many is most efficient for it) for quicker movement.

I wonder what the impact a white walker would have on a T-1000 if it came into physical contact with one? IIRC White walkers freeze and shatter most weapons on contact, though it's likely a T-1000 would be more resistant (and/or able to rebuild itself afterwards).
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!" - The official Troll motto, as stated by Adam Savage

User avatar
Zixinus
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 6663
Joined: 2007-06-19 12:48pm
Location: In Seth the Blitzspear
Contact:

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Zixinus » 2019-02-21 04:25pm

There is another thing that really tips the balance in favor of the T-1000: transport.

Yes, both terminators can run tirelessly. But in terms of the mission, one of the things that allowed the T-800 to win was the ability to escape the T-1000 by motored vehicles (and smooth asphalt). That is why the T2 has several chase scenes. The T-1000 is near-unstoppable but it can be escaped.

In Westeros, the fastest vehicle is a horse. Which the T-1000 can probably keep pace with. So there is no escape. Once the T-800 and T-1000 meet and fight, and unless there is some special factor like wildfyre or magic or whatever, the T-800 is doomed.

Yes, maybe a fully-grown dragon can carry but that's a very exotic and unlikely option.
Credo!
Chat with me on Skype if you want to talk about writing, ideas or if you want a test-reader! PM for address.

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-21 04:27pm

Zixinus wrote:
2019-02-21 04:25pm
There is another thing that really tips the balance in favor of the T-1000: transport.

Yes, both terminators can run tirelessly. But in terms of the mission, one of the things that allowed the T-800 to win was the ability to escape the T-1000 by motored vehicles (and smooth asphalt). That is why the T2 has several chase scenes. The T-1000 is near-unstoppable but it can be escaped.

In Westeros, the fastest vehicle is a horse. Which the T-1000 can probably keep pace with. So there is no escape. Once the T-800 and T-1000 meet and fight, and unless there is some special factor like wildfyre or magic or whatever, the T-800 is doomed.

Yes, maybe a fully-grown dragon can carry but that's a very exotic and unlikely option.
There are still some alternatives- you might be able to outrun it and lose it in a crowded urban environment, for example. Or you might be able to get on a boat- can Terminators swim? Given the weight of the metal, I somehow doubt it.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
Elheru Aran
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 12754
Joined: 2004-03-04 01:15am
Location: Georgia

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Elheru Aran » 2019-02-21 05:54pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-02-21 04:27pm
There are still some alternatives- you might be able to outrun it and lose it in a crowded urban environment, for example. Or you might be able to get on a boat- can Terminators swim? Given the weight of the metal, I somehow doubt it.
Actually given that motorcycles and cars don't settle significantly when Terminators get on them, I suspect they weigh less than one would think.
It's a strange world. Let's keep it that way.

User avatar
LaCroix
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4766
Joined: 2004-12-21 12:14pm
Location: Sopron District, Hungary, Europe, Terra

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by LaCroix » 2019-02-22 05:47am

They are designed to weight as much as a massive person they pose as, for camoflage reasons - 200lbs or thereaboutish .

The T1000 is certainly as fast/faster(long term) than a horse, he was easily keeping up with a speeding car, which is already high up on the *trained racehorse* scale, and most horses can't keep these speeds up for more than a mile, and could only keep galopping (with a rider) for more than a few minutes before they need to slow down.

And I would not count on the T1000 to be significantly slowed down by a crowded environment, as he would have no qualms to violently clear a path, which you might not want to do. And with his morphing abilities, he is much better at doing so, via weapons or simply appearance (monstrous form, fear +10, roll 2D6 to resist panic)
A minute's thought suggests that the very idea of this is stupid. A more detailed examination raises the possibility that it might be an answer to the question "how could the Germans win the war after the US gets involved?" - Captain Seafort, in a thread proposing a 1942 'D-Day' in Quiberon Bay

I do archery skeet. With a Trebuchet.

User avatar
Zixinus
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 6663
Joined: 2007-06-19 12:48pm
Location: In Seth the Blitzspear
Contact:

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Zixinus » 2019-02-22 11:18am

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-02-21 04:27pm
Zixinus wrote:
2019-02-21 04:25pm
There is another thing that really tips the balance in favor of the T-1000: transport.

Yes, both terminators can run tirelessly. But in terms of the mission, one of the things that allowed the T-800 to win was the ability to escape the T-1000 by motored vehicles (and smooth asphalt). That is why the T2 has several chase scenes. The T-1000 is near-unstoppable but it can be escaped.

In Westeros, the fastest vehicle is a horse. Which the T-1000 can probably keep pace with. So there is no escape. Once the T-800 and T-1000 meet and fight, and unless there is some special factor like wildfyre or magic or whatever, the T-800 is doomed.

Yes, maybe a fully-grown dragon can carry but that's a very exotic and unlikely option.
There are still some alternatives- you might be able to outrun it and lose it in a crowded urban environment, for example. Or you might be able to get on a boat- can Terminators swim? Given the weight of the metal, I somehow doubt it.
Boats are situational and still relatively slow. The T-1000 can swim or run along or just get a different boat.

As for crowds, that assumes that the T-1000 gives a fuck. It will force itself through the crowd without hesitation or better yet, simply jump above the crowd. Which is something that the T-800 can't do.
Credo!
Chat with me on Skype if you want to talk about writing, ideas or if you want a test-reader! PM for address.

Sky Captain
Jedi Master
Posts: 1212
Joined: 2008-11-14 12:47pm
Location: Latvia

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Sky Captain » 2019-02-24 09:10am

Could T-800 make some improvised explosives out of whatever suitable chemicals may be available? To kill T-1000 requires doing some massive damage essentially shattering it to bits and then preventing those bits from getting back together. Ambushing it and blowing to pieces and then disposing those pieces off in a hot fire should work although still lots of things would have to go right for this plan to work.

User avatar
Solauren
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 8233
Joined: 2003-05-11 09:41pm

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Solauren » 2019-02-24 11:43am

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-02-21 04:27pm
There are still some alternatives- you might be able to outrun it and lose it in a crowded urban environment, for example. Or you might be able to get on a boat- can Terminators swim? Given the weight of the metal, I somehow doubt it.
Yes, Terminators can swim. At least T-1000s can.

Terminator: Sara Connor Chronicles, we see a T-1000 escape a submarine that's at crush depth, and just swim away like it was nothing in 'liquid form'.

It's reasonable to assume a T-800 could swim as well. At the very least, they could get a log or piece of wood to act as a floatation device, and kick along like a flutter board.

Which brings some very cartoon like images to my head of a T-800s legs moving really fast, and propelling the flutterboard along.....
\

User avatar
Zixinus
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 6663
Joined: 2007-06-19 12:48pm
Location: In Seth the Blitzspear
Contact:

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Zixinus » 2019-02-24 03:31pm

One of the better routes would be to get the target on a ship that is constantly moving.
Sky Captain wrote:
2019-02-24 09:10am
Could T-800 make some improvised explosives out of whatever suitable chemicals may be available? To kill T-1000 requires doing some massive damage essentially shattering it to bits and then preventing those bits from getting back together. Ambushing it and blowing to pieces and then disposing those pieces off in a hot fire should work although still lots of things would have to go right for this plan to work.
Not a very good plan, although better in that it does not rely on overly special things. Separated pieces, IIRC, move quickly and would still attempt to rejoin into a greater hole. And there is the possibility that separated pieces can still escape and be able to move on their own. Say, if you make an iron container, it might be able to drill itself out of it.

It could, if it knows how to, but in a medieval-like society collecting all the materials will be much more problematic than in our world. Take simple gunpowder: charcoal you can get anywhere, sure. Sulfur you'll need to shop around or go to a mine. Potassium nitrate is where the problems start, gathering it naturally will be problematic and making it artificially will take time. Then there is issues like the lack of quality control.
Credo!
Chat with me on Skype if you want to talk about writing, ideas or if you want a test-reader! PM for address.

User avatar
Solauren
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 8233
Joined: 2003-05-11 09:41pm

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Solauren » 2019-02-24 10:14pm

The only way I can see the T-800 stopping the T-1000 is to somehow keep Lyanna and Rhaegar safe until Rhaegar has to join the war effort.
(At which point, it's safe to assume Lyanna is pregnant and therefore Rhaegar is no longer a target), and then set up a Wyldfire based trap at the Tower of Joy, while at the same time keeping her safe nearby. (for Ned Stark to eventually find her and Jon in).

When the T-1000 infiltrates the Tower of Joy, activate the Wyldfire.

It's the only way I can think of to get the T-1000 in a place where you can use the Wyldfire, or otherwise have weapons capable of killing it.
\

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 19098
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-02-24 10:18pm

Best bet is to draw it into a pre-arranged wildfire trap, yes. Up to that point, run, throw any expendable guards you have at it to try to slow it down, and pray.

Worst comes to worst, blow the fuel cell on the T-800.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zxT8CM8XntA

User avatar
Tribble
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2700
Joined: 2008-11-18 11:28am
Location: stardestroyer.net

Re: A Skynet Terminator in King Aerys' Court.

Post by Tribble » 2019-02-25 09:20pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-02-24 10:18pm
Best bet is to draw it into a pre-arranged wildfire trap, yes. Up to that point, run, throw any expendable guards you have at it to try to slow it down, and pray.

Worst comes to worst, blow the fuel cell on the T-800.
The thing is, in T2 the T800 did not know by default the full extent of the T1000s abilities, what it took to cause permanent damage, or whether it could be destroyed at all (IIRC when John Connor asked it replied "unknown"). The T1000 itself did not seem to know the full extent of its abilities, and was shocked that it could be frozen and outright panicked when it was thrown into the molten steel and started to melt. Which makes sense given that the T1000 was supposed to be a "highly advanced prototype".

How much information are we giving the two going in? The T1000 was stated to know everything the T800 knows, and it was even able to figure out things like the Connors eventually deciding to use the T800s knowledge to go after Dyson and Skynet. If the T800 has the knowledge on how to hypothetically stop a T-1000 the T1000 would almost certainly have that same information. Would the T1000 risk getting into close contact with the T800 if it knew the T800 may blow its fuel cells, for instance? Possibly, but it would only do so if it felt it had a reasonable chance at killing Stark in the process.
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!" - The official Troll motto, as stated by Adam Savage

Post Reply