Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

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Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by FaxModem1 »

Due to Act of Q, or some other random deity, you awaken half a kilometer from Fiddler's Green, from the movie Land of the Dead. This is a week prior to the events of the film. You have on you papers, a duffel bag full of tools, medicines, and supplies, a map of Pittsburgh, and most importantly, the same amount of cash that Paul Kaufman, the ruler of Fiddler's Green has. This, once you reach the gates, enables you to become a member of the board.

Q instructs you to try and keep every human alive within the city, and to make it a more self sustaining community.

How do you fix Fiddler's Green?
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by Joun_Lord »

First figure out why money is worth anything. Anybody with a decent crew can go into most any decent sized town and become a millionaire easily. Cash should be incredibly easy to find, should be more or less worthless except as fuel for fires. I think the economy should either be barter or using a local currency backed by Fiddler's Green's government but not be plain old dollars. The wealthy should be people with resources, people who control things. Not a bunch of rich bitches with piles of money in some bank from before the dead started walking as apparently the people inside seem to be.

People with no skills, no resources beyond worthless paper, and no way to ensure loyalty from people would be out on their asses as zombie chow or manual laborers.

Fixing Fiddler's Green especially within a week would probably be nearly impossible. Fiddler's Green had a class problem (that again doesn't make sense) resulting in a highly disaffected population. The rich people act like dicks to the poor, living in luxury while the poor live in squalor. With or without the zombie attack shit was going to blow up. Fixing that would require some serious retooling of the city government and probably have Kaufman taking a one way trip into zombieland.

The more immediate problem is the impending zombie attack. With more time maybe the city can be more sustainable to the point they no longer have to raid into zombie infested lands, risking people during the attack and risking the zombies following them back. Thats even ignoring the dumb "zombies just want to be left alone or coexist or find a place to belong" or whatever the stupid message of that film was. Whatever, the less interactions with zombies the better.

The main problem with the attack itself is the militia seemed really, really, REALLY terrible at fighting zombies. Zombies shouldn't be much of a threat to people who have been fighting zombies for years, maybe decades depending on what time period its set in (I dunno, the time it seems weird). Soldiers should know some basic zombie fighting skills like bodyshots are useless, close in fighting is stupid, a bit of body armor might help just a bit, and bodyshots are fucking useless (even though they really shouldn't be, somebody pumping dozens of rounds into a human torso is going to fuck up bones, ligaments, tendon, and all kinds of shit that should cripple or mission kill a zombie even if its not completely dead).

It probably couldn't hurt to get improved defenses. Even though Fiddler's Green is surrounded by water on two sides they should know they are dealing with corpses that can't drown. Either floating or walking on the bottom like Big Daddy did, zombies are going to make it to their shores. Putting some sort of wall around the city proper would probably do wonders, maybe having some patrols in the abandoned areas would do even better.

Personally I'd try to sign up for the supply raid the movie opened with and see about putting a round in Big Daddy's head. Sorry buddy, you might want to protect your zombie friends or find a place to live or coexist with humans when you aren't eating them but whatever you're want you're going to get alot of living people killed doing it. And maybe I'm a zombie racist (a zocist?) but I think the needs of the living outweigh the needs of the dead.

As an aside, when is Land of the Dead supposed to be set? I know its supposed to be part of the Night of the Living Dead and part of that timeline that encompasses all the Romero zombie movies until Diary of the Dead. Night and Dawn are supposed to be set around the late 60s or the 70s. Day is years later so maybe the 70s or very early 80s. Societal breakdown couldn't occur before the 70s because of the ERDL camo uniforms worn by some troops is Day. ERDL was used by some US troops in the late 60s but didn't see more wide spread usage until the mid 70s. Though its possible while the soldiers weren't special forces (clearly) they were using equipment meant for special forces or just whatever they could find considering their wide variety of equipment including Pvt Steel wearing a what looks like a Marine 8 point cover and them using G3 rifles and Uzi submachine guns which were never US military equipment.

Of course this goes out the window in Land where they have equipment and gear that should not be around thanks to nothing new being produced since the apocalypse happened. Weapons like the Steyr AUG were introduced in the late 70s and the Beretta 92 the mid 70s so aren't out of place but weapons like the G36C introduced in 2001, the Taurus PT92 introduced in the 80s, and the Sig Sauer P228 introduced in the late 80s probably shouldn't exist, especially the G36. Then there is equipment like the M81 Woodland and 6 color desert pattern which were introduced in the early 80s and I'm pretty sure there was a soldier wearing a desert camoflague uniform hat which wasn't issued until 1990. Also I'm fairly sure some of the products they were looting like the Pepsi weren't 70s era vintage either plus they had things like laptops and flat screens. I don't think there was much in the way of flat screens and laptops during the 70s.

I know, a bunch of nitpicky bullshit. But a director should have tried to have an internally consistent world and because Romero was trying to tell some crappy social issue story or several he didn't thus giving nitpicky bastards with entirely too much time on their hands a fit thanks to all the anachronistic stuff.
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by Ziggy Stardust »

<snip>As an aside, when is Land of the Dead supposed to be set? I know its supposed to be part of the Night of the Living Dead and part of that timeline that encompasses all the Romero zombie movies until Diary of the Dead. <snip>
Um, NONE of the Romero zombie movies are meant to take place in the same timeline. Even Romero was pretty explicit about that. They are all self-contained.
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

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Ziggy Stardust wrote:Um, NONE of the Romero zombie movies are meant to take place in the same timeline. Even Romero was pretty explicit about that. They are all self-contained.
According to Wikipedia (which of course you have to take with a grain of salt) he said he doesn't consider them sequels because "none of the major characters or story continue from one film to the next", not that he doesn't consider them part of the same timeline. Though he apparently considered Diary and Survival to be part of the Night timeline with Diary supposed to be taking place during the same time period as Night........even if that makes little sense......like at all just for the central macguffin. So I dunno.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_ ... lm_series)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diary_of_ ... _franchise
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by Ziggy Stardust »

Joun_Lord wrote: According to Wikipedia (which of course you have to take with a grain of salt) he said he doesn't consider them sequels because "none of the major characters or story continue from one film to the next", not that he doesn't consider them part of the same timeline.
From the Wikipedia page you linked to:
The films are not produced as direct follow-ups from one another and their only continuation is the theme of the epidemic of the living dead. This situation advances with each film, showing the world in a worsening state, but each film is independent of its predecessor. This is exemplified by the fact that each movie is set within the era it is filmed, with Land of the Dead being set in modern times with current (as of 2005) technology such as game consoles, flatscreen televisions, cell phones and other examples of modern tech.
Yes, of course, take it with a grain of salt because Wikipedia. I remember reading/hearing an interview with Romero years ago where he talked about this. He only considers the movies linked conceptually, not in any literal sense, throwbacks to other movies notwithstanding. In any case, I don't really want to argue the issue, but there's little reason to appeal to other Romero movies for this RAR scenario.

As for the OP, it's been a while since I've seen the movie (god, I saw it in theaters when it was new ... haven't seen it since then ...), but I don't recall if it is mentioned whether or not there are other known communities of survivors? IIRC, we only see Fiddler's Green, but I don't remember if there is dialogue indicating whether or not other cities have similar (or, ideally, BETTER) communities established?
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

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Ziggy Stardust wrote:I don't really want to argue the issue


I feel ya. Mind you it was mostly just an aside, something that has bothered me. Alot of the Dead series is kinda consistent but sometimes it isn't. Land is mostly consistent. With the exception of the G36 and the Taurus pretty all the weapons are consistent with the late 70s/early 80s time period for the zombie apocalypse (and you can say the Taurus us just standing in for a nearly identical Beretta 92 Inox also in the film). They were so trying to make the weapons consistent they even made some M16A2s look like more period appropriate M16A1s by switching out the handguards. The uniforms are mostly consistent with the exception of like two people wearing DCU camo, no digital camo uniforms or anything. The vehicles are mostly 70s and 80s vintage, they are using various military Jeeps, no Humvees to be found.

But then you got stuff like the G36c, the flat screens, the lap tops. The best I can figure is its something like Archer where despite it looking like its set in the 60s they have contemporary gadgets like the cell phone to serve the plot (the creators I think said they didn't want characters to have to find a payphone anytime they needed to make a call).
As for the OP, it's been a while since I've seen the movie (god, I saw it in theaters when it was new ... haven't seen it since then ...), but I don't recall if it is mentioned whether or not there are other known communities of survivors? IIRC, we only see Fiddler's Green, but I don't remember if there is dialogue indicating whether or not other cities have similar (or, ideally, BETTER) communities established?
There was some mention of going to Canada towards the end of the film but I don't recall if they said they weren't going to other survivors or just going because there was less people. The wiki for Land of the Dead mentions other outposts across America but again, a wiki, and I can't find anything to back that up.

Presumably there has to be but because there is little information of the world of Land of the Dead (whether or not its part of the Night continuity doesn't matter considering its so far removed chronologically from the other movies, any hints of other survivors in those movies wouldn't matter much) its mostly guessing.
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by FaxModem1 »

In the 'of the dead' series, Fiddler's Green is the only real sustaining settlement. Every other one seems to grab stupidity by the horns and die out fully. Like it or not, Kaufman's little fiefdom is humanity's best chance of survival.
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by Ziggy Stardust »

Joun_Lord wrote:[
I feel ya. Mind you it was mostly just an aside, something that has bothered me. Alot of the Dead series is kinda consistent but sometimes it isn't. Land is mostly consistent. With the exception of the G36 and the Taurus pretty all the weapons are consistent with the late 70s/early 80s time period for the zombie apocalypse (and you can say the Taurus us just standing in for a nearly identical Beretta 92 Inox also in the film). They were so trying to make the weapons consistent they even made some M16A2s look like more period appropriate M16A1s by switching out the handguards. The uniforms are mostly consistent with the exception of like two people wearing DCU camo, no digital camo uniforms or anything. The vehicles are mostly 70s and 80s vintage, they are using various military Jeeps, no Humvees to be found.

But then you got stuff like the G36c, the flat screens, the lap tops. The best I can figure is its something like Archer where despite it looking like its set in the 60s they have contemporary gadgets like the cell phone to serve the plot (the creators I think said they didn't want characters to have to find a payphone anytime they needed to make a call).
entions other outposts across America but again, a wiki, and I can't find anything to back that up.
Honestly, the way I like view it (because I spend an inordinate amount of time watching and thinking about zombie movies) is that all of the Romeroverse are essentially alternate realities or mirrorverses of each other. That would neatly explain the fact that there are some consistencies between the movies, while not letting the massive inconsistencies seem out of place. Considering that the zombies are explicitly supernatural (they actually come back from the dead, rather than being victims of a mysterious virus as in most modern zombie stories), it seems more fitting to try and explain the relationship between the movies as being some sort of supernaturally linked or related set of alternate realities rather than being one internally consistent universe. Also, though I don't think it's "canon" so far as these movies actually have one (in that I don't recall it ever being "confirmed" on screen), the tagline for "Dawn of the Dead" was "When there's no more room in hell, the dead will walk the earth". If that's really the intended origin for the Romero zombies (Rombies, if you will), it could also be rationalized as a consequence of a closely related set of alternate realities without too much gymnastics.
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by Joun_Lord »

Ziggy Stardust wrote:I spend an inordinate amount of time watching and thinking about zombie movies
I know how that is. While I ain't as bad as some people who draw up zombie escape plans and build anti-zombie bug out bags I do spend far too much time examining movies and tv shows, nit-picking the actions of the survivors, the setting, and everything else. Also hypothesizing how much better I'd do. Then IRL I do mental exercises of how I'd try to survive a zombie attack, what in my house I'd use for armor and weapons, where I'd go, what vehicle I'd try to steal because no way in hell I'd trust my rust bucket car to carry me to safety, and how I'd reach my family and friends. Nothing serious because I'm not so deluded as to think theres anything but the most remote possibility of a zombie attack happening, like the remoteness of suddenly everyone turning into Klingons. Its possible in the "everything is possible because of a infinite universe" sort of way but highly unlikely. Just fun to think of it even though I'd never ever want it to happen.

I do like the alternative universe theory. Would explain why things are similar but different, how there are some characters that are the same like the machete bikers but other characters aren't like a police officer in Dawn and Captain Rhodes in Day looking the same. Could as some fan theory's say be the same person (Rhodes could have been National Guard and Dawn was before he was activated), brothers, or your theory of a different reality. Of course the out of universe explanation is they just reused actors but theres no fun in that.

Other connections is like the renegade National Guard Sgt in Diary of the Dead and Survival was also a militia member in Land. The new recruit who offs himself at the beginning of Land after getting bit during a supply run is played by one of the students in Diary (also plays Wesker in the Resident Evil movies, OMG Resident Evil and the Romero zombies are in the same universe!!!!! !! !). Considering the discrepancies in the settings (Land looking like its set in the 90s or 2000s after the zombie apocalypse in the 70s and 80s while Diary had to be set in the then modern times because of the technology central to the plot, the internet) there is no way for them to be the same people unless you believe the bullshit about Diary and Survival being in the same timeline as the originals but apparently set in a universe where the internet and many modern electronics were invented in the 70s.

Really the same timeline theory does work up until Diary. Other then a few minor discrepancies that only a nit-picky bastard would see Land does work as as follow-up to Night/Day/Dawn. It feels like a world atleast a decade or two after then apocalypse. If you really wanted to make the out of place tech work you could always go with the jokey fan theory that only America fell and the rest of the world is fine, thus Germany still produces the G36, Brazil the Taurus, and asia the flat screens and laptops and ship them to the zombie infested US for some reason. I guess zombies really are still consumers.

Diary and Survival though only work as alternate universes. Related to the Night series tangentially but definitely separate.
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Re: Fix Fiddler's Green(Land of the Dead)

Post by Ted C »

FaxModem1 wrote:Due to Act of Q, or some other random deity, you awaken half a kilometer from Fiddler's Green, from the movie Land of the Dead. This is a week prior to the events of the film. You have on you papers, a duffel bag full of tools, medicines, and supplies, a map of Pittsburgh, and most importantly, the same amount of cash that Paul Kaufman, the ruler of Fiddler's Green has. This, once you reach the gates, enables you to become a member of the board.

Q instructs you to try and keep every human alive within the city, and to make it a more self sustaining community.

How do you fix Fiddler's Green?
Use the "wealth" I have been provided to hire both Riley and Cholo out from under Kaufman. Riley wants out, so I'll be happy to provide him with transportation that suits his needs. Cholo wants luxury living: I ditch Kaufman's racist admission policies. Most of the other important people will follow the lead of Riley and/or Cholo, so ousting Kaufman shouldn't be too difficult.

Create a secure inner perimeter with fencing that will stop a massed zombie charge (which might require putting large vehicles up against the fence to absorb the impact). Put rotating guards on duty, and train the security staff in head-shooting.

Begin revitalizing additional buildings. Establish factories in some of them to build what necessities and luxuries can be made from locally available materials. Set up rooftop farms and other agriculture within the secure zone.

Continue scavenging operations as needed, but dispense with the "necessities only" policy so it doesn't have to be done secretly. Prioritize necessities, of course, but luxury items that can be picked up with minimal risk are fine.

Generally stop being a dick to the majority of the population and take the zombie threat seriously.
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