Our World 1680 connected to Abeir-Toril 1373 DR

[Honorius]

As the tin says.

Several stable portals open up to this world, each is a perfect 200m by 200m square framed by indestructible columns.

One portal is set just outside Constantinople and leads to the High Forest. Ottomans can have fun.

One Portal opens on land just outside of Warsaw leading to the Ride. What could go wrong?

One portal outside Madrid connects to the Underdark, good luck to them.

Paris' Gate opens to the Dalesland.

Last Portal connects Tehran to the Utter East.

Who do you feel more sorry for?

[Batman]

Since just this once this doesn't involve any of my canon iterations I don't give a damn.

[Guardsman Bass]

How does the magic work? Does it cease working the instant anyone steps into our world, or are we now fully vulnerable to everything that was magically possible in Abeir-Toril? Do the Gods cross over?

If you want something other than "Earth people get fucked over eventually"*, you might want to say that the Gods and magic have no power on our side. At that point, you get some groups trying conquests here on Earth (and vice versa), probably to poor results. I assume there will be some massive trade in magically produced products with no magical properties from Abeir-Toril to Earth, in exchange for silver/gold/tobacco/textiles/etc. You'd also probably get adventurers on both sides trying their luck.

* If that is what you want, then what's there to discuss?

[Esquire]

Related question - do people who would be spellcasters in a D&D universe become so when they cross over to Toril? That is, will Ottoman imams become whatever-level clerics of Allah?

[Esquire]

And similarly for everyone else, of course; I've just been reading a lot about the Ottomans lately.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

FR cosmology is somewhat more convoluted, but by basic D&D cosmology, clerics of gods only get their powers and spells because the god grants them to the cleric. If the god does not exist, or is dead, there is nothing to grant the spells - see clerics of Aoskar, who was obliterated by the Lady of Pain.

In terms of arcane magic, FR has the Weave, which as I understand it is a sort of dimensional fabric woven into reality. Presumably, the Weave would not exist on Earth, and thus FR wizards would be unable to cast spells here.

[Imperial Overlord]

Canonicallyall of FR's multiverse, which specifically includes Earth, has the Weave. There are ancient portal connections that are now forgotten and lost (thus the Forgotten Realms). So magic works on Earth and so will divine magic. Fun fact: the Egyptian and Norse pantheons are real in FR.

[Simon_Jester]

The flip side of this is that, in the context of D&D cosmology, it is highly unlikely that deities who are real would end up losing all their worshippers to deities who are not. If Isis and Thor and so on exist in Forgotten Realms cosmology, the deities that replaced them presumably do too- even if, in that cosmology, they aren't omnipotent beings.

In which case (to phrase it as the Ottomans might) it is likely that Allah will indeed see fit to grant the power to work wonders unto his most faithful servants, so that they are not overpowered by pagans...

[Honorius]

How does the magic work? Does it cease working the instant anyone steps into our world, or are we now fully vulnerable to everything that was magically possible in Abeir-Toril? Do the Gods cross over?

If you want something other than "Earth people get fucked over eventually"*, you might want to say that the Gods and magic have no power on our side. At that point, you get some groups trying conquests here on Earth (and vice versa), probably to poor results. I assume there will be some massive trade in magically produced products with no magical properties from Abeir-Toril to Earth, in exchange for silver/gold/tobacco/textiles/etc. You'd also probably get adventurers on both sides trying their luck.

* If that is what you want, then what's there to discuss?

Magic works and all. But remember magic isn't the be all and end all of FR and complement's the conventional armies rather than replaces it.

As for the Ottoman's Faith, as brought up by others, likely go the way of Zakharan Pantheon. Islam rejects the notion people are inherently born evil an in a world where there is tangible proof the Divines exist, and the closet thing to Allah is the Zakharan pantheon, they'll probably flock to it once they become aware of it.

Overall this about three years before Second Vienna so everyone is pretty armed up.

[Purple]

So there are no portals in the far east at all? I wonder how that would effect the global balance of power and technology.

[Honorius]

So there are no portals in the far east at all? I wonder how that would effect the global balance of power and technology.

Wildly imbalance it. England gets no portals period.

Introduction of Gunpowder Armies would be an unpleasant shock though to the world of Torril. The formations used by the Armies of Torril make them susceptible to cannon fire.

[Rogue 9]

They also make them susceptible to fireball, yet they keep being used.

[Mr Bean]

They also make them susceptible to fireball, yet they keep being used.

A high end Wizard gets a max of six fireballs per day, has to be within 150 meters and needs LOS. Also you can't turn out a 10th level Wizard every four days from the Wizard foundry.

[Jub]

They also make them susceptible to fireball, yet they keep being used.

A high end Wizard gets a max of six fireballs per day, has to be within 150 meters and needs LOS. Also you can't turn out a 10th level Wizard every four days from the Wizard foundry.

Only a poor wizard would use direct damaging spells over crowd control and summoning.

[Imperial Overlord]

The flip side of this is that, in the context of D&D cosmology, it is highly unlikely that deities who are real would end up losing all their worshippers to deities who are not. If Isis and Thor and so on exist in Forgotten Realms cosmology, the deities that replaced them presumably do too- even if, in that cosmology, they aren't omnipotent beings.

In which case (to phrase it as the Ottomans might) it is likely that Allah will indeed see fit to grant the power to work wonders unto his most faithful servants, so that they are not overpowered by pagans...

False gods are entirely possible in FR, so no it doesn't follow that the religions that replaced them are real gods that actually grant powers. If there are real gods then they might be abiding by some kind of no direct interference treaty that might get shredded pretty quickly.

The bullshit "crowd control vs direct damage" spells argument is based on game mechanics of a game that has been through five editions with significant changes in each edition and centered around scenarios where some of the best warriors in the world armed with magic weapons confront exotic monsters. Dense masses of gunpowder and pike armed human conscripts are practically begging for AoEs (although I will concede a large fire elemental will also be awesome).

Islam has other issues besides distant Zhakara. The empire of Mulhurond is still ruled by god-kings directly descended from ancient Egyptians stolen from our world and have no shortage of badass clerics and wizards. With them fireball isn't the issue, gate is. Mulhurond has a lot of powerful spellcasters if they decide to try and retake the homeland.

[Honorius]

The bullshit "crowd control vs direct damage" spells argument is based on game mechanics of a game that has been through five editions with significant changes in each edition and centered around scenarios where some of the best warriors in the world armed with magic weapons confront exotic monsters. Dense masses of gunpowder and pike armed human conscripts are practically begging for AoEs (although I will concede a large fire elemental will also be awesome).

And are these AOEs capable of being used on a fluid battlefield and at sufficient standoff range to take on cannon armed armies?

In battle the Earth Armies are bringing field cannons with effective ranges of at least 600m and lots of matchlocks backed by polearms and pikes. To be useful, these spells have to get in range while under fire and suffering morale shock at being hit with field artillery.

[Jub]

And are these AOEs capable of being used on a fluid battlefield and at sufficient standoff range to take on cannon armed armies?

In battle the Earth Armies are bringing field cannons with effective ranges of at least 600m and lots of matchlocks backed by polearms and pikes. To be useful, these spells have to get in range while under fire and suffering morale shock at being hit with field artillery.

The better question is how do the military commanders of Earth deal with mind control effects, illusions, summoned/called creatures (especially the kind that just don't take damage unless you kill them with the right materials), armies consisting of zombies and skeletons... I could go on, but depending on exactly who decides to come through towards earth the armies of the day may have issues of their own.

[Honorius]

The better question is how do the military commanders of Earth deal with mind control effects, illusions, summoned/called creatures (especially the kind that just don't take damage unless you kill them with the right materials), armies consisting of zombies and skeletons... I could go on, but depending on exactly who decides to come through towards earth the armies of the day may have issues of their own.

Well once Earth Armies figure out what they are dealing with, they'll target the Magic Users with massed fire power. If the Magic User has to be physically present for a spell to work and sets up an obvious command post within artillery range of Earth Armies, they are asking for it. Then there is the fog of war to account for.

But again depends on how frequently they encounter a magic user of sufficient threat, and what kind of magic user they encounter, plus the potential to win over magic users to their side.

Most wars are won by conventional forces with magic complementing them, not replacing them and it may take time for Faerun's Major Powers to realize what is going on at first, then they have to summon their forces, and prepare for a campaign while also guarding their frontiers. Meanwhile the Earth powers are operating from their main centers. Especially the Ottomans who are already gearing up for Vienna in three years.

[Imperial Overlord]

And are these AOEs capable of being used on a fluid battlefield and at sufficient standoff range to take on cannon armed armies?

In battle the Earth Armies are bringing field cannons with effective ranges of at least 600m and lots of matchlocks backed by polearms and pikes. To be useful, these spells have to get in range while under fire and suffering morale shock at being hit with field artillery.

Yes the AoEs have the range and cannons will be almost useless against high level casters of this time period (there's a large number of spells designed to save wizards from being mutilated by projectiles and shooting at flying targets with an seventeenth century cannon is going to be hard at the best of times). The Realms have some pretty mediocre siege cannons for the last couple of centuries so while cannons suitable for use as field artillery will be a surprise, it will be something they understand. This is the Realms before the Spellplague with large numbers of brutally powerful spellcasters. The Zhentarim has a corps of wizards armed with blasting wands mounted on flying monsters. Halruaa has airships. Summoning fuck off powerful elementals to crush enemy armies is a common practice by every nation that has powerful wizards (which isn't all of them, but it is a good number of them) and Thay uses legions of undead as cannon fodder before sending in their good troops.

Not all FR nations can muster as much magical firepower as the Zhentarim or Aglarond, so those guns and cannons will make an impact, but they're also going to be copied by the priests of Gond the Wonderbringer who have already produced primitive fire arms. This isn't going to be easy for Earth, but at least they aren't having to fight the Iron Kingdoms.

[Vendetta]

They also make them susceptible to fireball, yet they keep being used.

A high end Wizard gets a max of six fireballs per day, has to be within 150 meters and needs LOS. Also you can't turn out a 10th level Wizard every four days from the Wizard foundry.

Depends how high end your wizard is, and what version of the game it is.

A really high end wizard in 3rd is basically able to do whatever the fuck he wants, in fact a level 1 wizard can do whatever the fuck he wants as long as he's a Kobold.

Really though, if you want to do arbitrarily big combat damage to something (which is far too gauche for proper wizards) you'd use a Hulking Hurler (properly optimised they'll be lobbing items weighing a couple of thousand tons at things).

[Honorius]

Yes the AoEs have the range and cannons will be almost useless against high level casters of this time period (there's a large number of spells designed to save wizards from being mutilated by projectiles and shooting at flying targets with an seventeenth century cannon is going to be hard at the best of times). The Realms have some pretty mediocre siege cannons for the last couple of centuries so while cannons suitable for use as field artillery will be a surprise, it will be something they understand. This is the Realms before the Spellplague with large numbers of brutally powerful spellcasters. The Zhentarim has a corps of wizards armed with blasting wands mounted on flying monsters. Halruaa has airships. Summoning fuck off powerful elementals to crush enemy armies is a common practice by every nation that has powerful wizards (which isn't all of them, but it is a good number of them) and Thay uses legions of undead as cannon fodder before sending in their good troops.

Not all FR nations can muster as much magical firepower as the Zhentarim or Aglarond, so those guns and cannons will make an impact, but they're also going to be copied by the priests of Gond the Wonderbringer who have already produced primitive fire arms. This isn't going to be easy for Earth, but at least they aren't having to fight the Iron Kingdoms.

Zhentarim are fully engaged in an internal struggle for power and is going after Phlan next and is far from where the Earth Powers will be a entering. Aglarond is also far from the initial action. Only Spain is in it thick with the Underdark from the get go.

As for wizards blocking projectiles. What kind of projectiles, subsonic arrows or supersonic .80cal balls, or even six pound balls from six pounder cannons, and how numerous are they, and their effectiveness?

[Imperial Overlord]

As for wizards blocking projectiles. What kind of projectiles, subsonic arrows or supersonic .80cal balls, or even six pound balls from six pounder cannons, and how numerous are they, and their effectiveness?

Depends on the spell in question. There are a bunch of them, ranging from shield to protection from normal missiles (which includes cannons) to prismatic sphere. Effectiveness is hard to rate for many of them because D&D game mechanics are mediocre at best fairly fucking horrible at handling gunpowder and heavy weapons with the specifics varying from edition to edition but anything good against arrows is good against guns. The Realms has guns and cannons, they just don't use them much so there's no question if their magic works against them.

The Zhentarim has periodic civil wars but it also has tons of wizards and clerics and beholders and tries to get power by controlling trade so they're definitely going to pay attention and they're a player with too much power to ignore. So the portal in The Ride and High Forest is going to get their attention because they're in area they have interests. High Forest also will draw the attention of the Silver Marches, who are considerably nicer people but also have a ton of wizards and magic so they aren't going to get steam rolled. The Spanish are going to find out that a human city with no magic and a direct connection to the Underdark is a problem (no mention of where in the Underdark so this problem could range from Illithid all you can eat slave and snack bar to occasional wandering monster. The Dales aren't aggressive and aren't numerous but are scrappy when someone tries to lean on them and might be to get help from Cormyr and its famous war wizards but since Elminster lives there and they have a large number of murder hobos seasoned adventurers are going to be unpleasant for any invader. Connecting Tehran to the Utter East doesn't tell us much either, so it could go a number of ways.

[Vendetta]

As for wizards blocking projectiles. What kind of projectiles, subsonic arrows or supersonic .80cal balls, or even six pound balls from six pounder cannons, and how numerous are they, and their effectiveness?

Persistent Greater Ironguard.

Doesn't matter, wizard is now completely ignoring all metal which is not enchanted to at least +3 or higher. As in it passes harmlessly through them or they can walk harmlessly through it as if it is insubstantial in the case of metal walls, bars, or other obstacles.

Also the wizard isn't even there, you're only seeing his astral projection whilst he's sitting at home in his personal demiplane.

[Honorius]

Depends on the spell in question. There are a bunch of them, ranging from shield to protection from normal missiles (which includes cannons) to prismatic sphere. Effectiveness is hard to rate for many of them because D&D game mechanics are mediocre at best fairly fucking horrible at handling gunpowder and heavy weapons with the specifics varying from edition to edition but anything good against arrows is good against guns. The Realms has guns and cannons, they just don't use them much so there's no question if their magic works against them.

Mind giving an example from the books where one of these spells blocked a subsonic arrow or a supersonic lead bullet. I'm interested in seeing the mechanics of these blocking spells. If there is a noticeable effect of a subsonic arrow hitting the magical shield and imparting momentum, it stands to reason a three pound ball hitting such a shield at supersonic speed would either punch clean through or at least send the wizard flying into the air to land hard.

The Zhentarim has periodic civil wars but it also has tons of wizards and clerics and beholders and tries to get power by controlling trade so they're definitely going to pay attention and they're a player with too much power to ignore. So the portal in The Ride and High Forest is going to get their attention because they're in area they have interests.

True,it will get their attention, but they have other things to worry about for the foreseeable future, and are just as likely to first see if the Poles and Ottomans might be good Allies first in their power struggles, not to mention their enemies might seek the Poles, French, and Ottomans Aid as well. Hmm... A Joint Ottoman, Polish, French, and Silver Marches Force taking on the Zhentarim...

Still, there is the Geography.

The Zhentarim kinda have to fight through others first to intervene. Said others might ally with the Earth Powers to keep the Zhentarim in check.

So they aren't intervening anytime soon and that and they never really broke out of the Moonsea Area which tends to show they were a minor power at best and effectively bottled up in the Moonsea Area.

[Imperial Overlord]

Mind giving an example from the books where one of these spells blocked a subsonic arrow or a supersonic lead bullet. I'm interested in seeing the mechanics of these blocking spells. If there is a noticeable effect of a subsonic arrow hitting the magical shield and imparting momentum, it stands to reason a three pound ball hitting such a shield at supersonic speed would either punch clean through or at least send the wizard flying into the air to land hard.

What examples? D&D is an RPG not a TV series. Bullets are just another missile weapon and cannons are just another siege weapon (D&D as I have mentioned, has stats for them) and protection from normal missiles, for example, will protect against both of them. A cannon would probably get some damage through protection from normal missiles (but that's getting into D&D's terrible hit point damage system and its siege weapon stat fail) but spells like wraithform or the previously mentioned greater ironguard would give complete protection from both.

The Zhentarim kinda have to fight through others first to intervene. Said others might ally with the Earth Powers to keep the Zhentarim in check.

So they aren't intervening anytime soon and that and they never really broke out of the Moonsea Area which tends to show they were a minor power at best and effectively bottled up in the Moonsea Area.

The area the Zhentarim directly controls is visible part of the iceber. It's called the Black Network for a reason. It physically controls areas around the Moonsea, includes most of the mines near The Ride, but its influence is felt over all of Northern Faerun due to its efforts spent controlling trade and the fact that it works hand in glove with the church of Bane.