Dresden Files fan fiction films.

[Gaidin]

Think of it as a hypothetical of Dresden's first meeting with McCoy after his supposed death in Changes

Tangentially related but have I ever mentioned how much I disliked that revelation about McCoy at the end of Changes? Because I did. A lot.

It fit...shockingly. Especially given Dresden's past run-ins with the Wardens and his trial and the reason he had the Doom instead of flat out had his head cut off. It had a nice, "Sorry Dresden the world doesn't revolve around you and the entire book's involvement with you is nothing but coincidence." ring to it.

[Crazedwraith]

Think of it as a hypothetical of Dresden's first meeting with McCoy after his supposed death in Changes

Tangentially related but have I ever mentioned how much I disliked that revelation about McCoy at the end of Changes? Because I did. A lot.

It fit...shockingly. Especially given Dresden's past run-ins with the Wardens and his trial and the reason he had the Doom instead of flat out had his head cut off. It had a nice, "Sorry Dresden the world doesn't revolve around you and the entire book's involvement with you is nothing but coincidence." ring to it.

It sort of works in the context of that book. As you say the whole 'this is really about you' vibe worked and was well set up in that book. I didn't really like how it takes McCoy down from someone who was trying to do the right thing looking out for Harry out of general decency and moral fibre to
Spoiler

Just doing it becaue Harry was family. The same for his involvement in the final battle. Harry wants help to rescue a little girl: 'you got to think big picture Harry'. His own head on the chopping block; 'oh shit better pull out all the stops.

But I guess even that sort of works for McCoy given his 'broken pedestal' aspect for Dresden.

[Ralin]

His own head and by extension all the things he is personally responsible for, which is a lot. Especially in light of the expected Red Court resumption of the war and the fact that he's probably the heaviest hitter on the Grey Council in addition to its leader.

I don't think it hurts his general decency as much as you think it does. We've known for awhile that he can and will do terrible things for the greater good and I don't think Harry was wrong when he thought that McCoy's personal welfare was way down the list of his reasons for changing his tune.

[Gaidin]

I'd like to get another read on the Grey Council, personally. I want to know if Odin is on the Grey Council or if he was just throwing in with them...

[Ralin]

There was a theory floating around that Nicodemus was in the Grey Council. Yeah, really.

[Gaidin]

There was a theory floating around that Nicodemus was in the Grey Council. Yeah, really.

Nicodemus is where he wants to be when he wants to be. If there's ever a period of time where that's in his interests that's where he'll be for the five minutes he'll want to be. Not that they'll trust him enough to let him.

[Ralin]

That last bit was what I was going for.

[The Romulan Republic]

No one with the slightest hint of a brain or a sense of right and wrong would work with Nicodemus. Even Harry and Mab fully intended to fight him when they worked with him. He is a devoted backstabber working with Fallen angels and Satan himself.

I think I read somewhere (might have been in Skin Game) that he was booted out of the Accords. And given some of the folks in the Accords (even the fucking vampire courts), that's saying something.

Nobody trusts Nicodemus. With good reason.

[Ralin]

Yes, I know. The logic mostly boils down to "Nicodemus is clearly working against Nemesis, the Black Council is likely connected to Nemesis and the Outsiders, McCoy is capable of dealing when some very nasty people and things and Nicodemus is hella knowledgeable and competent."

Also don't forget what Mab did to the Red Court for violating her Accords...

[The Romulan Republic]

Sure, Nicodemus is capable. The problem is that he's a utter monster and that his competency is actually a negative because he'll use that capability against whoever's with him and wreak utter destruction with it.

I'd think a lot less of Ebineezer if he was dumb enough to throw in with Nicodemus.

Edit: And I know you get this. I'm just baffled that anyone wouldn't.

[Ralin]

Presumably they think McCoy would be accepting his help on some areas of mutual interest while keeping him at arms length. Remember, the Grey Council is being organized in cells. One hand doesn't know what the other is doing and only McCoy knows the full roster.

Not that it isn't a dumb idea.

[Gaidin]

I'm going to make a crazy analogy here that sort of looks at Nicodemus big picture. Forget Gray Council, they're sort of small in the scheme of things and more a resource now. A resource you trust, but just a resource. They were organized in the war against the Red Court but things have moved on. Nicodemus is what I like to call a semi-known quantity. They just totally dicked him over and his political power value in the magic world is down to about a fraction of what it used to be. However he can still get stuff done. On the other hand the Outsiders are extremely powerful beings that are always trying to make runs at the physical world apparently and are the real reason the Winter Court does what it does as we learn in Cold Days. Nicodemus is what I might consider that double bladed sword now that he doesn't have that political power he used to. You need something done by someone dangerous because he's the only one able to do it, but hell if you can trust him but you have no choice but to trust him and all you can really do is keep an eye on him. You expect him to try to screw you if not succeed in trying to screw you and you hope his method of screwing you doesn't also screw the mission against the Outsiders.

[Ralin]

Is there really any doubt that book twenty is going to involve Harry learning that he foiled Nicodemus's master plan to stop the Outsiders?

[The Romulan Republic]

If you're talking about what happened in Spoiler

Skin Game, first of all, Nicodemus got away with the Holy Grail, didn't he? And second of all, why would Mab want to stop him from fighting the Outsiders? Didn't Cold Days establish that its her job to fight Outsiders?

Edit: Added warning for spoilers.

[Ralin]

Spoiler

Nicodemus got away with one of five things he wanted. And Harry was fairly sure the Grail wasn't even the most important one for whatever Nicodemus has planned. And he's now minus his daughter and soon most of his organization, further weakening his ability to get shit done.

As for the second... It's also part of Mab's nature to be vengeful and punish people who violate her Accords. This may interfere with her duty to stop the Outsiders, but it's part of who she is.

... Which does make me think of that time she said the stars would fall from the sky before Mab fulfills not her word...