Armour of Game of Thrones (TV show)

[Thanas]

The UnSullied... yeah... I know they're based on the Jannisaries, but there were better armies to base them on.

Book ones are. But those show ones look nothing like Janissaries.

The ranks they're standing in give a hint of how the shields could interlock in wall formation -- give the front men short spears/swords and the ranks behind those long spears and they can do a lot of damage.

Historically such a formation doesn't make any sense and wasn't used. Better to give everyone long spears and then have them interlock.

[Vympel]

Bolton men:



Locke, Lord Bolton's hunter:



Thoros of Myr:



Random BwB dudes:



Also, the new Stark helmet we saw last week is also seen on a Bolton man.

[spaceviking]

Well that makes sense, prob just replaced his helmet with a fallen starks helmet.

[The Yosemite Bear]

if I recall correctly the BwB mostly are Stark bannermen who were declared outlaw by Jeoffry....

[Mr Bean]

if I recall correctly the BwB mostly are Stark bannermen who were declared outlaw by Jeoffry....

You remember incorrectly. Most of the BwB are common folk from villages raided, trading posts burned and refugees from the war. The start of the BwB was when the Mountain came down on the fifty men odd men(twenty were Stark soldiers) being lead by Berrick Dondarian(sp?) the Lightning Lord as they crossed a river. The men lost but out of their defeat the BwB was born lead by Thoros of Myr and the Lightning Lord as they fought the raiders sent out by Tywin to burn the riverlands and round up the free riders and sell swords helping themselves to the loot.

[LadyTevar]

The ranks they're standing in give a hint of how the shields could interlock in wall formation -- give the front men short spears/swords and the ranks behind those long spears and they can do a lot of damage.

Historically such a formation doesn't make any sense and wasn't used. Better to give everyone long spears and then have them interlock.

Are you sure? I had thought the Romans used the gladius for the front line of their shield walls, backed by spearmen. In SCA melee combat, axe & shield is common, as you can hook the enemy's shield, moving it just long enough for a spearman to get a shot.

[Lord Revan]

The ranks they're standing in give a hint of how the shields could interlock in wall formation -- give the front men short spears/swords and the ranks behind those long spears and they can do a lot of damage.

Historically such a formation doesn't make any sense and wasn't used. Better to give everyone long spears and then have them interlock.

Are you sure? I had thought the Romans used the gladius for the front line of their shield walls, backed by spearmen. In SCA melee combat, axe & shield is common, as you can hook the enemy's shield, moving it just long enough for a spearman to get a shot.

I though the spears roman legionaries used were javelins that they threw before closing ranks to use swords.

[Rogue 9]

That depends. Pre- or post-Marian legions? Even before the Marian Reforms, the legion of the Roman Republic had spearmen, but the triarii were a separate formation from the gladius-armed hastati and principes that formed the first and second lines, and didn't come in behind them to thrust over their shoulders. SCA combat just isn't a good representation of the Roman system.

[Thanas]

The ranks they're standing in give a hint of how the shields could interlock in wall formation -- give the front men short spears/swords and the ranks behind those long spears and they can do a lot of damage.

Historically such a formation doesn't make any sense and wasn't used. Better to give everyone long spears and then have them interlock.

Are you sure? I had thought the Romans used the gladius for the front line of their shield walls, backed by spearmen.

I have never heard of this. What is your source?

In any case, you do not want to have a wall of spear points. You want waves/ripples. Having a wall of spear points with no other spears behind that first line just begs you to have all your spears broken by, say, a warhorse impact etc.

In SCA melee combat, axe & shield is common, as you can hook the enemy's shield, moving it just long enough for a spearman to get a shot.

SCA combat is never an indication for real combat. The rules they do enforce make such a joke - for example, one cannot even really grapple an opponent in their swordplay. Valid reasons for that but really not that good of a combat indicator.

That depends. Pre- or post-Marian legions? Even before the Marian Reforms, the legion of the Roman Republic had spearmen, but the triarii were a separate formation from the gladius-armed hastati and principes that formed the first and second lines, and didn't come in behind them to thrust over their shoulders. SCA combat just isn't a good representation of the Roman system.

Correct on all points.

[Rogue 9]

Are you sure? I had thought the Romans used the gladius for the front line of their shield walls, backed by spearmen.

I have never heard of this. What is your source?

In any case, you do not want to have a wall of spear points. You want waves/ripples. Having a wall of spear points with no other spears behind that first line just begs you to have all your spears broken by, say, a warhorse impact etc.

Incidentally, this is precisely why SCA combat is how it is - the only mode of warfare is unsupported infantry combat, and there are consequently no cavalry charges to require a wall of pikes. Against men on foot bulling their way past the spearpoints, a line of men with swords and shields in front of the spearmen serve the same purpose as a second and third line of spearmen behind the first, and stands a better chance of survival. That and hand weapons are the primary authorization, with spears being a separate test taken after, so you need something to do with all the sword and board rookies.

[Vympel]

Edmure Tully, somewhat oafish Lord of Riverrun



Thoros of Myr's breastplate:



Tully soldiers (barely):



The Blackfish:



(he has chainmail, Edmure doesn't)

[Crazedwraith]

That's an interesting realisation of the Tully sigil. I always imagined lots of individial stripes going horizontally, rather than the single vertical divide between two blocks of colour but I iamgine this would be much easy to make, especial in mediveal times?

[Vympel]

That's an interesting realisation of the Tully sigil. I always imagined lots of individial stripes going horizontally, rather than the single vertical divide between two blocks of colour but I iamgine this would be much easy to make, especial in mediveal times?

I have no idea - I guess it looks easier so it probably is

Looking at the Tully armor - I guess its some sort of scaled leather? Note the Blackfish's sleeves near the mail - those scales appear to be metal.

[LaCroix]

Looking at the Tully armor - I guess its some sort of scaled leather? Note the Blackfish's sleeves near the mail - those scales appear to be metal.

Increased armor on the shoulders makes a lot of sense, especially on the sword arm, which lacks the protective cover of a shield.

[Elfdart]

That's an interesting realisation of the Tully sigil. I always imagined lots of individial stripes going horizontally, rather than the single vertical divide between two blocks of colour but I iamgine this would be much easy to make, especial in mediveal times?

I have no idea - I guess it looks easier so it probably is

Looking at the Tully armor - I guess its some sort of scaled leather? Note the Blackfish's sleeves near the mail - those scales appear to be metal.

According to the costume designer on HBO Go, the scales and everything but the mail is leather.

[Thanas]

They do have a kinda fishy appearance with the scales. Fits well with their banners even if I do not think leather scales are that good for knights. Better go with padded leather instead.

[Vympel]

From last week's episode:



This week:

Another look at Bolton men:



Beric's armor - he has a steel gorget combined with flexible looking pauldrons:



Ser Loras' fancy practice cuirass:

[Vympel]

Ok, some new additions.

Yunkish men:



Another look at Bolton men:



Given that every single helmet we see Bolton men have is the one that I orignally called a new type of Stark helm, it seems clear that the guy holding the Stark banner back in my earlier screencap is actually a Bolton man, simply chosen to hold the banner.

Also note the shields.

Steelshanks Walton (steel armor for his legs barely visible):

[LadyTevar]

That's an interesting realisation of the Tully sigil. I always imagined lots of individial stripes going horizontally, rather than the single vertical divide between two blocks of colour but I iamgine this would be much easy to make, especial in mediveal times?

You didn't see the shields did you. There is a Heraldic difference in how House Coats are displayed on a shield or tabard and on pennants and flags. On the shields, the fish is at top, separated from the bottom by the 'river': the wavy blue/white stripes have long been used to deplict water in Heraldry. On the Pennants, the fish is closest to the flagpole (the "top"), then the river across the width of the pennant, then the bottom of the shield. A huge hint the House Sigil is sideways on the pennant: note the position of the leaping fish on the shields v/s the pennant. Both times the fish is parellel to the water.

[LadyTevar]

They do have a kinda fishy appearance with the scales. Fits well with their banners even if I do not think leather scales are that good for knights. Better go with padded leather instead.

IIRC, that kind of overlapping scale is called "Fishscale", and can be leather or metal. I applaud the leathermakers on the show.

[LadyTevar]

From last week's episode:

[img]http://imageshack.us/a/img22/8726/broth ... or.jpg[img]
Very nice plated leather.

This week:
Beric's armor - he has a steel gorget combined with flexible looking pauldrons:

[img]http://imageshack.us/a/img849/2407/beric.jpg[img]
Good articulation on the pauldrons and how it's buckled to the gorget. I've seen many examples of this in historical armor.

Ser Loras' fancy practice cuirass:

[img]http://imageshack.us/a/img339/6030/lora ... or.jpg[img]
Padded, reinforced leather.

[LadyTevar]

[quote="Vympel"]Ok, some new additions.[quote]

Yunkish men:
[img]http://imageshack.us/a/img22/5413/yunkishmen.jpg[img]
Good chest protection, but the legs look to be just cloth.

Another look at Bolton men:
[img]http://imageshack.us/a/img13/7352/boltonmen3.jpg[img]
They really love their leather over chain. I didn't think the "bloody cross" would be shown that way. Interesting depliction.


Steelshanks Walton (steel armor for his legs barely visible):

[img]http://imageshack.us/a/img823/3015/stee ... on.jpg[img]
I would like a better look at those greaves. The knees look well-articulated

[Elfdart]

Bolton's men look like they're wearing early-model Tudor helmets from the reign of Mary:

[Vympel]

Second Son commanders - and Ser Barristan the Bold, who could kill all three of these preening scumbags with his left hand while taking a piss with his right.

[Ahriman238]

Well there's a motley collection of armor. Guy on the right has mail, but scale arms and I think a leather skirt. Middle's got what looks like a Yunkish breastplate over a what do you call it, gambeson or brigadine? The studded leather. Last guy's got what looks a mail toga over, is that actually plate? Probably leather. Got the flexiple pauldrons like Dondarrion.

And in simple leathers, Barristan still easily outclasses all of them.