AMC's "The Walking Dead" Season 2 Discussion (Spoilers)

[JME2]

Great episode, if a little slow.

Now, the question becomes will Rick and the others find out what Shane did?

I'm not sure how they could, unless Shane himself tells one of them. If Zombie Otis shows up, Shane could just say that he got bit and couldn't make it.

True on both points.

[Stofsk]

Didn't Shane pick up Rick's revolver? If so, that might raise a few eyebrows since Otis was the one who Rick gave it to. If Otis was the one who was left behind then how come Shane has his revolver? Of course how did Shane get the second backpack either for that matter. These are questions someone will probably start asking or at least thinking to themselves.

[JME2]

Didn't Shane pick up Rick's revolver? If so, that might raise a few eyebrows since Otis was the one who Rick gave it to. If Otis was the one who was left behind then how come Shane has his revolver? Of course how did Shane get the second backpack either for that matter. These are questions someone will probably start asking or at least thinking to themselves.

Good point; I missed that.

[Themightytom]

Didn't Shane pick up Rick's revolver? If so, that might raise a few eyebrows since Otis was the one who Rick gave it to. If Otis was the one who was left behind then how come Shane has his revolver? Of course how did Shane get the second backpack either for that matter. These are questions someone will probably start asking or at least thinking to themselves.

That's the part where Shane saying that Otis told him to go on, he'd hold them off, pretty much covered his tracks.

I am of the opinion that Shane is an unnecesary asshole. You know what fine. I was sick of Otis too. "Pant pant, I just need to rest" "Pant pant, I'm going as fast I can" "Pant pant back in my day..." But you know what? Too fucking bad, I don't want Wilfred Brinley at MY back during the zombie apocalypse, but if I did, I'd plan accordingly.

I'd bring extra flares if I had a flare contingent plan, I'd bring one of the many many machetes Carl found, one of which he was definitely carrying in the forest. I would pick up one of the many many guns I noticed on the ground clutched by dead soldiers, and above all, I would keep a fucking low profile! I would have had my decidedly slow moving friend Wait In A Fucking Car, and distract the zombies with THAT, so he could get away, lead them off and circle back. none of this flare shit anyway.

Shane wasn't thinking clearly at the end, he was scared, distraught over Carl's injury, PROBABLY a little pissed at Otis for shooting him and feeling a little conflicted that his surrogate son got hurt while he was being a dick to him. They were so close to the car Shane had to turn BACK to Otis, and he had time to shoot him, struggle with him, take the respirator and hobble away. Otis' grisly death MIGHT have been enough for him to break even, given the time it took, but there was not advantage gained with it, the whole thing was a debacle.

Why Isn't There A Guard at the farmhouse, Fine you have a gate. i caught the reference, but wild animals break through gates all the time, I'd take shifts keeping a weather eye out for the ol' army of the living dead that is apparently just a few miles away, and infesting the forest surrounding your property.

Darryl, seriously man, I can't even figure out why you went out with a flashlight in the middle of the night. Children don't maintain vigilance when they are lost and outside, they curl up in a ball and hide from the darkness all around them....as well as the zombies. You weren't going to find anything, waving the flashlight around and taking Ms FallToPieces with you was just cruel. We both know she was getting an "arra" in the leg if you got ambushed, so you could make your escape.

Darryl also has a weird morality. "Naw he ain't hurtin anybody up there?" Really? he's obviously starving, and has minimal prospects for success at life, you're just being CRUEL leaving him up there, if you so worried about the arrows, shoot him, cut him down, and get your arrow back, that's why you have arrows right? they are reusable?

By the way, do the walkers eat their own? Because unless he had his legs chewed off while he was hanging himself or immediately after, he really could not have gotten up there, let alone composed a nice little poem about it. if the walker's eat their own then, well..
SHANE YOU ASSHOLE! YOU COULD HAVE SHOT A WALKER!

How was that thing still alive anyway, it couldn't feed itself, do they go dormant when they have no food? Even assuming the guy takes two weeks to starve to death as a flesh pinata, they apparently don't need blood because that guy's would have drained out long ago, and what about infection??

I think this virus does a hell of a lot more than turn off higher brain functions, can walker's still reproduce too? I don't want to think about unkillable zombie sperm crawling around

Anyway I'm glad we all decided to wait on the road in case the little girl gets back...so that we could all wonder out into the woods one by one to look for her in the dark and forgo any sort of strength in numbers.

[Stofsk]

Well maybe Shane will say something to inadvertently tip people off.

As for the walkers not starving to death, they're zombies. They don't die due to natural causes. And yeah, they do go dormant. So far the timescale of the show has been a few weeks. Eventually they're going to hit winter, and the zombies won't be their biggest problem.

[spaceviking]

How bad is winter going to be for them? They are in the southern United States, they live on scavenged canned good. If anything the winter will help them; the forests and similar places will be more open and rouge zombies will be easy to spot.

[Akhlut]

Well maybe Shane will say something to inadvertently tip people off.

As for the walkers not starving to death, they're zombies. They don't die due to natural causes. And yeah, they do go dormant. So far the timescale of the show has been a few weeks. Eventually they're going to hit winter, and the zombies won't be their biggest problem.

They're in the US state of Georgia, where temperatures generally remain freezing all year (minus the mountainous areas). Wild sources of food might be relatively sparse, but not impossible to find (plenty of ponds, rivers, and other bodies of water to fish; lots of turkey, grouse, quail, etc.; a lot of pecans grow in the region; etc.), while raids on abandoned houses for canned goods is always viable.

In short, not too hard to get a meal in Georgia during any time of the year. However, because the state usually doesn't freeze too deeply or too long for winter, zombies will remain a threat most of the time.

Darryl also has a weird morality. "Naw he ain't hurtin anybody up there?" Really? he's obviously starving, and has minimal prospects for success at life, you're just being CRUEL leaving him up there,

He's a fucking zombie; it's unlikely he has a capacity to suffer.

if you so worried about the arrows, shoot him, cut him down, and get your arrow back, that's why you have arrows right? they are reusable?

Not if you're shooting human skulls. The arrowhead will blunt, the shaft can bend or otherwise be rendered unusable, and so forth.

By the way, do the walkers eat their own? Because unless he had his legs chewed off while he was hanging himself or immediately after, he really could not have gotten up there, let alone composed a nice little poem about it. if the walker's eat their own then, well..
SHANE YOU ASSHOLE! YOU COULD HAVE SHOT A WALKER!

If the dude got bit and knew he was going to die, he could have hung himself instead of waiting to turn. It's not like he needed more than 5 minutes to write that poem, if that.

[Guardsman Bass]

I'd bring extra flares if I had a flare contingent plan, I'd bring one of the many many machetes Carl found, one of which he was definitely carrying in the forest. I would pick up one of the many many guns I noticed on the ground clutched by dead soldiers, and above all, I would keep a fucking low profile! I would have had my decidedly slow moving friend Wait In A Fucking Car, and distract the zombies with THAT, so he could get away, lead them off and circle back. none of this flare shit anyway.

They did try to keep a low profile, it's just that it was hard. The place they needed to get to didn't have a secure entrance, or any other way out of it. Besides, it took two back-packs' worth just to carry everything, and they didn't think they were going to get stuck running for their lives through the high school.

The machetes wouldn't have done much good. There were several dozen zombies in that swarm at least, and they were moving pretty quick. Stop to whack one of them in the head with a machete, and the rest of them would have swamped them in seconds.

Shane wasn't thinking clearly at the end, he was scared, distraught over Carl's injury, PROBABLY a little pissed at Otis for shooting him and feeling a little conflicted that his surrogate son got hurt while he was being a dick to him. They were so close to the car Shane had to turn BACK to Otis, and he had time to shoot him, struggle with him, take the respirator and hobble away. Otis' grisly death MIGHT have been enough for him to break even, given the time it took, but there was not advantage gained with it, the whole thing was a debacle.

That's because Otis managed to get a firm hold of him. I don't think Shane was expecting that - as I said up-thread, Shane under-estimated Otis's strength.

Why Isn't There A Guard at the farmhouse, Fine you have a gate. i caught the reference, but wild animals break through gates all the time, I'd take shifts keeping a weather eye out for the ol' army of the living dead that is apparently just a few miles away, and infesting the forest surrounding your property.

It's pretty careless of them. Of course, you could say the same thing about Rick's Group before the ambush in Episode 4 last season. Like the Farm People, they got sloppy due to their isolation and rarity of zombie sightings. I suspect the Farm People are in the same position (but you would at least think they would try to board up the bottom windows, just in case).

Darryl, seriously man, I can't even figure out why you went out with a flashlight in the middle of the night. Children don't maintain vigilance when they are lost and outside, they curl up in a ball and hide from the darkness all around them....as well as the zombies. You weren't going to find anything, waving the flashlight around and taking Ms FallToPieces with you was just cruel. We both know she was getting an "arra" in the leg if you got ambushed, so you could make your escape.

I think it was just arrogance and irritation on his part (he was tired of listening to Carol sob, and he knows he's a good survivalist). It definitely wasn't a good idea in terms of searching, although they weren't trying too hard.

Darryl also has a weird morality. "Naw he ain't hurtin anybody up there?" Really? he's obviously starving, and has minimal prospects for success at life, you're just being CRUEL leaving him up there, if you so worried about the arrows, shoot him, cut him down, and get your arrow back, that's why you have arrows right? they are reusable?

Of course it was cruel. Darryl's a survivalist, and he had nothing but contempt for the guy who tried to kill himself after getting bit.

By the way, do the walkers eat their own? Because unless he had his legs chewed off while he was hanging himself or immediately after, he really could not have gotten up there, let alone composed a nice little poem about it. if the walker's eat their own then, well..
SHANE YOU ASSHOLE! YOU COULD HAVE SHOT A WALKER!

The transformation time is variable, and those who get bitten tend to go through the fever symptoms first for at least a couple of hours. My guess is that the guy tried to hang himself, but didn't do it properly. Instead, he ended up slowly strangling to death, during which time the Walkers showed up and took large bites out of his legs.

How was that thing still alive anyway, it couldn't feed itself, do they go dormant when they have no food? Even assuming the guy takes two weeks to starve to death as a flesh pinata, they apparently don't need blood because that guy's would have drained out long ago, and what about infection??

I think this virus does a hell of a lot more than turn off higher brain functions, can walker's still reproduce too? I don't want to think about unkillable zombie sperm crawling around

They're your standard Movie Zombies, in that they don't rot (too much), and can keep going without food or rest.

[FSTargetDrone]

Darryl also has a weird morality. "Naw he ain't hurtin anybody up there?" Really? he's obviously starving, and has minimal prospects for success at life, you're just being CRUEL leaving him up there, if you so worried about the arrows, shoot him, cut him down, and get your arrow back, that's why you have arrows right? they are reusable?

Everything we've seen thus far shows Darryl to be a better guy than Shane and one of the more competent members of the group. He may complain (not so much recently, however) be rude and mouth off, but he's risked himself numerous times to save/help the others. He saved T-Dog by throwing a corpse on top of him and then later giving him necessary drugs without hesitation as soon as he found out they were needed. He could easily sit himself down and not worry about the girl lost in the woods, but he's taken the risk to look for her. Him not caring about the hanging undead guy is the least of my concerns. Shooting that particular zombie (which isn't a threat) means he isn't focused on other things at that moment. Wasting time to retrieve the arrow, he could find himself with a real threat on the ground if another walker shambles up. He could be generally unpleasant, constantly making a nuisance of himself, berating the others about his brother, but he seems to have gotten over it and is coping much better than many of the others. If I had to choose Shane or Darryl to back me up, knowing what I know of both of them up to this point, I'd choose Darryl.

[Dread Not]

Is there any reason to think Shane and Otis didn't have a machete or hatchet discreetly tucked away? There wasn't really any point where a melee weapon would have come in handy.

I found it a little odd that Shane first told Otis to leave him behind, only to later throw Otis to the wolves. I guess he realized that Otis wasn't just moving slowly because he was carrying him.

Overall a good episode, though it's getting annoying to see little things like those mentioned about farmhouse each and every week where you keep saying "Why don't they do X, Y and Z, to prepare for a zombie attack?"

[FSTargetDrone]

I found it a little odd that Shane first told Otis to leave him behind, only to later throw Otis to the wolves. I guess he realized that Otis wasn't just moving slowly because he was carrying him.

Sad thing is, Otis kept pushing him along, pulling him up. I watched the show again and I still think they could have made it together. I would have liked to see Shane push Otis away and run towards the horde. He would have gone out in a blaze of glory. Instead, we get a Pyle lookalike in the bathroom.

They just should have kept going at the end, instead of turning and shooting. That was silly and only served to slow them down. With more walkers than rounds left in the guns, it was nothing but a waste of time. Should have saved the rounds for whatever might appear in front of them.

[Guardsman Bass]

I'll re-watch the episode, but if I remember right Shane told Otis at least once to leave him behind and keep going. Otis refused to do it, which is why Shane decided to leave him as bait.

[FSTargetDrone]

I'll re-watch the episode, but if I remember right Shane told Otis at least once to leave him behind and keep going. Otis refused to do it, which is why Shane decided to leave him as bait.

He did and Otis refused because he was a better man. Otis could have taken off on his own, but he came back and saved Shane at the chain link fence. For all we know he would have died next to Shane instead of using him as a distraction.

Shane should have shot him in the back of the head instead of leaving him to be torn apart alive. That, at least, would have been a little more merciful.

[Themightytom]

Hunh, three responses to Darryl criticism.

He's a fucking zombie; it's unlikely he has a capacity to suffer

It's a starving zombie you idiot, they feel hunger, that's why they mindlessly pursue food.

Of course it was cruel. Darryl's a survivalist, and he had nothing but contempt for the guy who tried to kill himself after getting bit.

I heard sympathy in that voice, like he was looking at a wild animal and just wanted it to live. I think he had contempt for who the person was, but separates whoever it was, from the beng before him now. That's why I am thinking "Shit or get off the pot Darryl, either it's a monster, and kill it, or it's just a wild animal, but put it out off it's misery."

If I had to choose Shane or Darryl to back me up, knowing what I know of both of them up to this point, I'd choose Darryl.

Sure, me too, but he's still demonstrated a weird decision making process.

Not if you're shooting human skulls. The arrowhead will blunt, the shaft can bend or otherwise be rendered unusable, and so forth.

That's not "wasting" he can take the fricking arrow right back and repair it, it's not a single use weapon.

If the dude got bit and knew he was going to die, he could have hung himself instead of waiting to turn. It's not like he needed more than 5 minutes to write that poem, if that.

Thanks for nothing Aklhut, obviously you couldn't be bothered to consider the main point of the sentence which was that the guys legs were chewed to shit. that wasn't a "bite". Either he had his legs seriously torn apart before he hung himself, or they were feasted upon after, suggesting walkers eat their own, maybe weaker or helpless members, which does not explain the one dragging itself along in the first episode.

I have answered my OWN question with more thought. He got bit, he wrote a poem, he hung himself, and BEFORE he revived, he was used as a human terriyaki stick. Then he reanimated to discover he was no longer able to model socks.

Edit: I hit send because I got interrupted, but I just noticed Guardsman answered my question in his post.

[Themightytom]

I think with regards to the machete, people are forgetting the stealth factor. There were a doesn't points where firing a gun to attract attention, versus to defend oneself would have been REALLY handy, and using a Machete to defend oneself would likewise have been handy. Shane could have lopped the head off the Zombie that chased him up the bleachers for example BEFORE jumping out the window, and would have had time to consider his descent more carefully, and NOT fire the pistol out in the open.

Those hordes of zombies following them were drawn by the sound of gunfire. They had indoor and outdoor terrain obstacles cordoning off the zombies, but they couldn't evade attention because every time they were clear, they ran into a COUPLE zombies and had to open fire. Every shot was making it worse unttil they were the center of attention.

Sure, at the end when they were in an open space being followed by zombies, at that point a machete is arguably too little too late, but when they ran out of BULLETS I bet they could have used one, and Shane considered that in making his final decision. They had almost no bullets left and were about to be overrun. They were close enough to the car that Shane could have held off the Zombies while Ottis started her up or whatever.

A silencer in this world would be worth it's weight in gold.

[Guardsman Bass]

I think with regards to the machete, people are forgetting the stealth factor. There were a doesn't points where firing a gun to attract attention, versus to defend oneself would have been REALLY handy, and using a Machete to defend oneself would likewise have been handy. Shane could have lopped the head off the Zombie that chased him up the bleachers for example BEFORE jumping out the window, and would have had time to consider his descent more carefully, and NOT fire the pistol out in the open.

It would be easier simply to bury the machete in the zombie's brain, since it's hard to cut through the neck if the blade isn't super-sharp. Unfortunately, that also means that it's harder to yank it out of the now-dead zombie's brain in time to kill the other dozen that are about to drag you down and kill you.

In Shane's case, he just didn't know that the zombie had gotten up there before he climbed out of the window. I think neither he nor Otis thought the zombies could actually get up the folded-up bleachers.

Those hordes of zombies following them were drawn by the sound of gunfire. They had indoor and outdoor terrain obstacles cordoning off the zombies, but they couldn't evade attention because every time they were clear, they ran into a COUPLE zombies and had to open fire. Every shot was making it worse unttil they were the center of attention.

I agree, although I question whether they were ever completely in the clear. I think that they were being chased by at least several zombies every time we saw them in the past two episodes.

Sure, at the end when they were in an open space being followed by zombies, at that point a machete is arguably too little too late, but when they ran out of BULLETS I bet they could have used one, and Shane considered that in making his final decision. They had almost no bullets left and were about to be overrun. They were close enough to the car that Shane could have held off the Zombies while Ottis started her up or whatever.

Shane would have been overwhelmed very quickly if he had tried to stop and kill several zombies with a machete, considering the size of the group that was chasing them. He would be sacrificing himself if he did that, which he did offer to Otis at least once by asking to "go on".

A silencer in this world would be worth it's weight in gold.

They work better on smaller weapons, but would still be useful in preventing far-off zombies from hearing the "crack" of the gunshot. Unfortunately, I think they tend to degrade over time.

Anyone with better gun knowledge here, feel free to enlighten us both.

[FSTargetDrone]

That's not "wasting" he can take the fricking arrow right back and repair it, it's not a single use weapon.

Well, he's lost the arrow he shot into the Hanging Zombie. (As an aside, I would like to see Darryl finding some new arrows. He's been using the same ones again and again and eventually more will get lost or simply break. Also, his crossbow will eventually be in need of repairs at some point.) Anyway, when Andrea answered him, he wasn't satisfied with her reply, shot the arrow anyway and then said, "waste of an arrow" and walked away. I didn't think he was going to scramble up the tree and try to pluck it out of the Hanger. If not for Andrea, there is no reason to bother putting the Walker out for good. Even if it drops from the tree intact before eventually rotting away, it isn't much of a threat to anyone who isn't standing underneath it.

I have answered my OWN question with more thought. He got bit, he wrote a poem, he hung himself, and BEFORE he revived, he was used as a human terriyaki stick. Then he reanimated to discover he was no longer able to model socks.

I agree. Poet was infected, decided to off himself, wrote the note and then was gnawed on after he died (or sometime shortly before) and then experienced the Turning. We haven't seen any Walkers feeding on other Walkers (though that would be cool to see that now and again). A diet of fresh meat only seems to be the norm.

[spaceviking]

I am no gun expert....

Silencers make a gun quieter, but are still very loud. The main thing silencers do is change the sound making it harder to identify. Since the Zombies are reacting to general noise this would not help that much.

IIRC Silencers weaken the force of a shot. To what extent I am not sure, but if it is enough to change a brain shot into a skull crack it is not worth it.

[Akhlut]

Hunh, three responses to Darryl criticism.

He's a fucking zombie; it's unlikely he has a capacity to suffer

It's a starving zombie you idiot, they feel hunger, that's why they mindlessly pursue food.

That's all the respond to; even insects have more complex responses to stimuli than zombies do, and I'd be hesitant to say that insects can experience suffering.

Not if you're shooting human skulls. The arrowhead will blunt, the shaft can bend or otherwise be rendered unusable, and so forth.

That's not "wasting" he can take the fricking arrow right back and repair it, it's not a single use weapon.

Assuming he can repair it given the existing resources he has available. If he has a carbon shaft arrow and it's broke, well, he's out a fucking arrow. If it's aluminum shaft and it's dented and won't fly straight anymore, how's he going to repair it? If the arrowhead blunts too much for his tools to sharpen, what then? The zombie wasn't a threat to potentially ruin his ammo for no reason.

Plus, some additional considerations: what if he falls out of the tree while trying to cut down the zombie and breaks a leg or sprains his ankle or whatever? That's a huge fucking problem right there, when all he had to do was leave the damn thing well enough alone. There's also the real possibility of getting an open wound and getting the zombie virus in the open wound (though, given the apparent gore baths numerous people have taken without turning makes that open to interpretation as far as the true route of infection goes).

[Wing Commander MAD]

Regarding the arrow reusability. I did some looking and most modern arrows are either aluminium or carbon (more popular) for the shaft, and I'd guess high grade steel or aluminium for the arrowhead. If the shaft is messed up I doubt you can repair it easily, as to my understanding a damaged shaft is considered a lost arrow by most modern hunters. You may be able to repair a blunted arrowhead given specific tools, something Darryl likely lacks given their current situation. Keep in mind most arrowheads used in hunting are broadheads designed to cause rapid death by exsanguination and will probably blunt or otherwise deform when penetration a human skull. My uncle archery hunts and he had me perform a few conversions for something he was doing a couple months back. I think he was casting arrowheads, unfortunately he's away right now so I can't ask him for any specifics about how repairable modern sporting arrows are.

[LadyTevar]

Moved to Appropriate Forum

[FSTargetDrone]

For anyone interested, Darryl is using a Horton Scout HD 125 Crossbow. You can see its specifications at this link. The manufactuer doesn't seem to have it listed on its crossbows page, however. It must be a discontinued item. Horton sells aluminum and carbon arrows, but of course Darryl could be using a different brand.

And here's the Internet Movie Firearms Database list of weapons for The Walking Dead.

[Dread Not]

Thanks for nothing Aklhut, obviously you couldn't be bothered to consider the main point of the sentence which was that the guys legs were chewed to shit. that wasn't a "bite". Either he had his legs seriously torn apart before he hung himself, or they were feasted upon after, suggesting walkers eat their own, maybe weaker or helpless members, which does not explain the one dragging itself along in the first episode.

I have answered my OWN question with more thought. He got bit, he wrote a poem, he hung himself, and BEFORE he revived, he was used as a human terriyaki stick. Then he reanimated to discover he was no longer able to model socks.

The walker dragging itself in the first episode is explained in the web series. I suggest you avoid it since it's total shite, but basically in an act of supreme stupidity, a woman feeds herself to a hoard of walkers so her children can escape. They tear her limb from limb and then she wakes up all zombified with her legs missing. This ends up raising more questions because she's torn apart in the streets and wakes up in the middle of a park area. But anyway, yeah, you have the right idea. Walkers will only eat fresh meat and will lose interest some time before the person turns but not immediately after they die. Unless the brain has been feasted on, whatever is left of the victim will reanimate as a walker.

[Themightytom]

It would be easier simply to bury the machete in the zombie's brain, since it's hard to cut through the neck if the blade isn't super-sharp. Unfortunately, that also means that it's harder to yank it out of the now-dead zombie's brain in time to kill the other dozen that are about to drag you down and kill you.

I don't know about that I use a machete regularly in Honduras, and it's a blunt shitty one. I can chop through some PRETTY thick branches and I get tired after like... twenty minutes, You kind of just find a rhythm and let the weight of the thing do the work. By contrast, I was a little terrified when I saw Carl waving a nice shiny one around.

In Shane's case, he just didn't know that the zombie had gotten up there before he climbed out of the window. I think neither he nor Otis thought the zombies could actually get up the folded-up bleachers.

You wouldn't maybe take a quick peak to make SURE before sticking your head out a window?? It couldn't have gotten up very quickly, or it would have done it earlier.

I agree, although I question whether they were ever completely in the clear. I think that they were being chased by at least several zombies every time we saw them in the past two episodes.

Yeah I will rewatch it because the analysis is more entertaining than I would have thought. This must be how people who calculate turbolaser yields feel about Star Wars

Shane would have been overwhelmed very quickly if he had tried to stop and kill several zombies with a machete, considering the size of the group that was chasing them. He would be sacrificing himself if he did that, which he did offer to Otis at least once by asking to "go on".

There were front runners, and wounding zombies to impede their mobility thins out the crowd too.
Now I'm thinking bear traps would be handy as well. hopefully the farm is ringed with them.

That's all the respond to; even insects have more complex responses to stimuli than zombies do, and I'd be hesitant to say that insects can experience suffering.

ummm pulled a lot off wings of flies have we? there's a huge difference between the behavior of insects relative to ability to feel sensations, and the ability of former humans. The nervous system is there, the question is whether the virus animates enough of the brain to process it.

Assuming he can repair it given the existing resources he has available. If he has a carbon shaft arrow and it's broke, well, he's out a fucking arrow. If it's aluminum shaft and it's dented and won't fly straight anymore, how's he going to repair it? If the arrowhead blunts too much for his tools to sharpen, what then? The zombie wasn't a threat to potentially ruin his ammo for no reason.

But Andrea's opinion was worth potentially ruining his one arrow? Can you diagram this value system for me?

Plus, some additional considerations: what if he falls out of the tree while trying to cut down the zombie and breaks a leg or sprains his ankle or whatever? That's a huge fucking problem right there, when all he had to do was leave the damn thing well enough alone. There's also the real possibility of getting an open wound and getting the zombie virus in the open wound (though, given the apparent gore baths numerous people have taken without turning makes that open to interpretation as far as the true route of infection goes).

It's a LITTLE late in the game to be considering all that when you're stomping around in woods full of zombies looking for a little girl you JUST told someone is probably fine and you PREVIOUSLY said it was too dangerous to search for at night.

Well, he's lost the arrow he shot into the Hanging Zombie. Anyway, when Andrea answered him, he wasn't satisfied with her reply, shot the arrow anyway and then said, "waste of an arrow" and walked away.

I think he felt that neither the Zombie's predicament NOR her answer was worth the expense of arrow, it's possible he was hoping Andrea would articulate some kind of revelation that assure him of her state of mind. Again and back to my original comment, weird morality Darryl...

(As an aside, I would like to see Darryl finding some new arrows. He's been using the same ones again and again and eventually more will get lost or simply break. Also, his crossbow will eventually be in need of repairs at some point.)

Right??? I would make it a priority to obtain a few quiver fuls in the event I am forced to... try to storm a compound full off zombies in order to get something someone critically needs. What's more he could start training other people on using them, because given their silence there are a few advantages over guns. Aim is obviously a problem, as well as range, but there would be applications.

I didn't think he was going to scramble up the tree and try to pluck it out of the Hanger. If not for Andrea, there is no reason to bother putting the Walker out for good. Even if it drops from the tree intact before eventually rotting away, it isn't much of a threat to anyone who isn't standing underneath it.

He wasn't worried about the arrow. he didn't retrieve it, he fired it for a stupid reason, even after protesting. Darryl was full of shit and he was performing for Andrea.

I agree. Poet was infected, decided to off himself, wrote the note and then was gnawed on after he died (or sometime shortly before) and then experienced the Turning. We haven't seen any Walkers feeding on other Walkers (though that would be cool to see that now and again). A diet of fresh meat only seems to be the norm.

You're one of those Namey people aren't you.

Well that's just awful, but it is what I presumed.

[Akhlut]

Firstly: Jesus fuck, man, can you use the preview function to make sure you're quote tags aren't fucked up to hell and back?

That's all the respond to; even insects have more complex responses to stimuli than zombies do, and I'd be hesitant to say that insects can experience suffering.

ummm pulled a lot off wings of flies have we? there's a huge difference between the behavior of insects relative to ability to feel sensations, and the ability of former humans. The nervous system is there, the question is whether the virus animates enough of the brain to process it.

Insinuations of cruelty to animals; stay classy there.

Anyway, we see no complex behavior out of zombies. They move toward a stimulus in order to feed. Insects have more complex behavior; jellyfish and seastars are among the animals with functional neurological systems that exhibit behavior that is that simple (and even they have some more complex behaviors associated with them).

Additionally: we see no indications of zombies feeling anything remotely resembling pain or suffering. They hunger, but given that gross bodily trauma doesn't deter them unlike literally every other living thing on earth, I'd say that suffering is not something they are capable of feeling.

Assuming he can repair it given the existing resources he has available. If he has a carbon shaft arrow and it's broke, well, he's out a fucking arrow. If it's aluminum shaft and it's dented and won't fly straight anymore, how's he going to repair it? If the arrowhead blunts too much for his tools to sharpen, what then? The zombie wasn't a threat to potentially ruin his ammo for no reason.

But Andrea's opinion was worth potentially ruining his one arrow? Can you diagram this value system for me?

As best as I can tell and remember, he wanted an answer from her and gave his word he'd kill the zombie if she answered him. He thought her answer was shitty, but he's apparently a man of his word and went ahead and killed the zombie. I wouldn't necessarily agree with his course of action, but it's not like it's completely inexplicable.

Plus, some additional considerations: what if he falls out of the tree while trying to cut down the zombie and breaks a leg or sprains his ankle or whatever? That's a huge fucking problem right there, when all he had to do was leave the damn thing well enough alone. There's also the real possibility of getting an open wound and getting the zombie virus in the open wound (though, given the apparent gore baths numerous people have taken without turning makes that open to interpretation as far as the true route of infection goes).

It's a LITTLE late in the game to be considering all that when you're stomping around in woods full of zombies looking for a little girl you JUST told someone is probably fine and you PREVIOUSLY said it was too dangerous to search for at night.

He's an experienced woodsman who has seemingly hunted a great deal in the woods at night. It might not be wise to go traipsing about with the whole crew at night, but Daryl and an apprentice aren't going to attract all the attention that the whole crew would and he seemingly wants to feel like he's actually accomplishing something for the group.

There's also the cogent argument that a certain number of risks can be handled and have good potential for reward (saving Sophie means less time spent on that task that could be spent doing other shit; group cohesion improves), while other risks are unnecessary and stupid (climbing up to retrieve an arrow from a zombie that doesn't need to be shot).