Riddler Out for Batman 3

[JME2]

From Newsarama

Ladies and gentlemen, we have a title.

Christopher Nolan has announced that his third Batman film will be called The Dark Knight Rises, according to an interview with the Los Angeles Times.

“We’ll use many of the same characters as we have all along, and we’ll be introducing some new ones,” Nolan said in the interview, adding that the villain “won’t be the Riddler.” Hmm… curiouser and curiouser, right?

The movie is due out in July 20, 2012, which may put it on the tail end of the Avengers film, due out on May 4 of the same year.

Interesting.

On one hand, it would have been a challenge to adapt the Riddler to the Nolan-verse. Their best shot would have been to take a page from Paul Dini's revamp from the last few years.

On the other hand...they've already used the major Gotham Rogues that could conceivably work within the Nolan-verse. The only ones that could work at this point would be Penguin, Catwoman or Talia. Talia would be a nice way to come full circle and have Bruce facing the repercussions for stopping the League of Shadows in the first film.

[Crossroads Inc.]

Well there goes my personal theory for the next movie...

I kept holding out hope that the next two villains would be the Penguin and the Riddler. With the Riddler being an FBI Profile who goes over the edge trying to track down and flushout Batman, while the Penguin would be an overseas Mafia boss who comes in to take charge of Gothams organized crime after much of the top got eliminated in the last movie.

[JME2]

Penguin's presence would actually allow for some interesting conflict. In TDK, we saw what Batman's limits were.

Now, what about Bruce Wayne's limits.

Penguin could be a corrupt Mafia figure posing as a legitimate businessman. He could move in to take over the Falcone and Maroni syndicates as you said. But he could also make a move against Wayne Enterprises. Or, Talia might go that route if she's brought in.

[Bottlestein]

What about Mr Freeze?

The Penguin without the Joker feels a bit strange, for some reason. I know there's loads of stuff where Penguin appears without him, but it just makes the episode better when they're both together.

[Ghost Rider]

Actually people are wondering a tad on which particular direction.

Doubtful it will be Freeze, Ivy , or a returned Ra's as Nolan has said he does not want to go down that particular route of fantasy bullhockey needed to make said characters work.

Now people are veering the rumors towards either Talia, Bane, or Catwoman.

[Batman]

Fries, Dr Isley and in my not the tiniest bit humble opinion Bane are too fantasy for the Nolan take on my tiny corner of the DC universe though you could probably make Isley work as a biochemistry terrorist. Poisoned vegetable supplies and deadly house plants instead of vines on steroids (not to mention the inevitable killing/mind-control lipstick).
I could see the riddler but he's apparently out. Selina I could see as being worked into the setting but not really as a villain, she's just not unambiguously evil for that. Same goes for Talia. Yes if course I'm personally biased. I'm also correct.
I could have seen Nigma but he seems to be out at least for the time being.
Cobblepot or Black Mask could work from the organized crime angle, though I'm not sure the latter is well known enough to the general audience.
Jervis Tech might work as a deranged high tech criminal but again, I'm not sure he's sufficiently well known or big enough to work as the main villain.

[adam_grif]

Go for some less well known villains.

Clayface as some sort of master of disguise, but definitely NOT actually having his regular superpowers. Hush might be another possibility.

[Batman]

Hush doesn't work without a fuckton of background that never happened in the Nolan movies to begin with, even ignoring my deep and searing hatred for that for want of a better word storyline.
Clayface as a master of disguise could work, I agree.

[adam_grif]

I don't know much about Hush, I was just pouring through the rogues gallery trying to find fits

My experience with Batman comes from the Movies and The Animated Series.

Also, as a thing to keep in mind, although The Dark Knight was keeping it fairly plausible (except the cell phone thing, lol), Batman Begins had the crazy fear toxin-destroying-gotham plot and the global ninja conspiracy led by Liam Neeson. So some degree of craziness is possible.

[Anguirus]

I was kind of skeptical of Riddler to begin with. Riddler CAN work, but only when you have time to delve into his prodigious intelligence and his obsessions. Not least because of the similar name, Riddler can fall into the trap of seeming like he's trying to follow up the Joker, which just will not work. Most people are probably thinking of Frank Gorshin or Jim Carrey (who was not an inherently bad choice himself, but in an over-the-top movie).

[xt828]

Is it Scarface who is the ventriloquist with the psychotic doll? That could be done, I guess. Another that might be interesting would be to have Azrael as the bad guy.

[Batman]

That'd be Scarface all right, but I think he too is too obscure for the silver screen audience.
And Azrael would never work even for people who know who in Valen's name he is in the first place. You'd probably need an entire trilogy just to establish his background in the first place, and he's just nowhere near evil enough. Harvey Dent came across as a tortured soul, a victim, despite everything he did towards the end of TDK. There's no way you can make Jean Paul look like a real bad guy without massively straying from the base material.
You could have him as a backup but the prime antagonist has to be someone who's unmistakably a villain.

[JME2]

Is it Scarface who is the ventriloquist with the psychotic doll? That could be done, I guess. Another that might be interesting would be to have Azrael as the bad guy.

It'd be interesting to see a Nolan-verse take on Wesker and the dummy, but it can't sustain the entire film.

[RecklessPrudence]

I'm still holding out for a shadowy-Joker-outline-in-Arkham running things and a slowly-driven-batshit-insane Harleen Quinzel out tearing the town up.

Near the start of the movie, she's not even aware she's doing it, then as it goes on, she starts noticing things about the crimes that seem familiar, and finding detonators and the like in her apartment. At some point, she tries to confront Joker, but he convinces her nothing's wrong. Later on she gives herself to the persona, but near the end of the movie, once Harley is defeated, a twisted, even more naive version of "Harleen" comes out from behind what she has become and tries to psycho-analyse herself.

...Maybe?

[Drone]

Why exactly does it have to be someone well known to non-comic fans? Unless you watched the animated series or read the comics you wouldn't have had any idea who Ras Al-Ghul was and it certainly didn't make him a bad villain. The way the story was written and the way the character interacted with Batman was all that mattered. They could use some random guy that dresses up as a Satyr or something as long as it's a convincing story, people who've never touched a comic book will still go to see it.

[Setzer]

Why not try creating some villains who exist specifically for the movie? It's not like they weren't willing to rewrite Ras Al-ghul to suit their needs.

[Metahive]

I know a perfect villain, the Batman from Frank Miller's All Star Batman and Robin. Batman vs The Goddam Batman, a match made in heaven.

[CaiusWickersham]

Maybe have Black Skull as the B villain? And, no, we are not even thinking of using Anarky.

[Ryushikaze]

“We’ll use many of the same characters as we have all along, and we’ll be introducing some new ones,” Nolan said in the interview, adding that the villain “won’t be the Riddler.” Hmm… curiouser and curiouser, right?

Of course! The Mad Hatter! HE'S the next movie villain!

Seriously, Bane hunting down Bats, Penguin working the Mafia, or Isley the ecoterrorist would work best for the tone of Nolanverse Batman.

[Shroom Man 777]

Mad Hatter would totally tickle Nolan's fancy if he wants to do more Inceptioning.

Though that wouldn't work either.

[Anguirus]

I know a perfect villain, the Batman from Frank Miller's All Star Batman and Robin. Batman vs The Goddam Batman, a match made in heaven.

I like this idea way too much. They even set up the "copycat" Batmen in TDK.

[Themightytom]

Can they really use the title from the last movie in this one? The Dark Knight? The Darknight Rises? Superman Returns The Second Time?

lets not get sloppy.

[FaxModem1]

What about Zsasz? He's a serial killer who just randomly chooses a victim, and needs to kill them, and once they are killed by him, he makes a mark on his body. Although I don't think he could work for a whole movie, he would be a great henchman or something like that.

[Crazedwraith]

Didn't he already cameo in Batman Begins? He would make a good nolan verse villian.

[Gandalf]

With a title like Dark Knight Rises, it implies a return to prominence for Batman. So I imagine the villain is someone he can defeat publicly, in order to win back the favour of the public. Of course, this is based on my own speculation.

I'm still holding out for a shadowy-Joker-outline-in-Arkham running things and a slowly-driven-batshit-insane Harleen Quinzel out tearing the town up.

Near the start of the movie, she's not even aware she's doing it, then as it goes on, she starts noticing things about the crimes that seem familiar, and finding detonators and the like in her apartment. At some point, she tries to confront Joker, but he convinces her nothing's wrong. Later on she gives herself to the persona, but near the end of the movie, once Harley is defeated, a twisted, even more naive version of "Harleen" comes out from behind what she has become and tries to psycho-analyse herself.

...Maybe?

No. Nolan has said quite explicitly that there will be no Joker in the third one.