Game of Thrones Season 5 (TV ONLY)

[Sinewmire]

Also, the scene with Jon Snow writing the Boltons for help was idiotic. I mean, he JUST had a conversation with Stannis about how he was days away from marching south to conquer Winterfell, so why bother dealing with the Boltons at all right now? Yes, the Night's Watch needs men, but just wait for Stannis to conquer the place and then ask for help. It just seemed like an unnecessary scene considering the circumstances.

Stannis might lose.

That said, they could just have easily replaced it with Lord Frey.

That's the thing, I think she views the high sparrow as naive and easily manipulated. And right now she has Margaery quite perturbed and seems rather pleased with herself.

I think she is seeing this as the same thing she did to Ned Stark. A family who are soon to be enemies, acted against boldly before the actual conflict begins. A small force with a heavy street presence but little political power. Their leader and cause empowered in exchange for their support at a crucial moment.

Problem is, the Goldcloaks already had a stake in protecting the crown and law. Janos Slynt was greedy, venal and prideful which meant that his new position and accolades were important to him. The Goldcloaks were a semi-militarised with a command structure and organisation which meant they all obeyed orders.

The sparrows have no stake in anything, they are fanatic cultists. The High Sparrow is principled, intelligent and disdains the trappings of power. The Sparrows act on faith, not on commands, and will not necessarily obey the High Sparrow if he calls for restraint.

Oh, and Ned Stark wasn't feeding King's Landing this winter.

[Pelranius]

I think she is seeing this as the same thing she did to Ned Stark. A family who are soon to be enemies, acted against boldly before the actual conflict begins. A small force with a heavy street presence but little political power. Their leader and cause empowered in exchange for their support at a crucial moment.

Problem is, the Goldcloaks already had a stake in protecting the crown and law. Janos Slynt was greedy, venal and prideful which meant that his new position and accolades were important to him. The Goldcloaks were a semi-militarised with a command structure and organisation which meant they all obeyed orders.

The sparrows have no stake in anything, they are fanatic cultists. The High Sparrow is principled, intelligent and disdains the trappings of power. The Sparrows act on faith, not on commands, and will not necessarily obey the High Sparrow if he calls for restraint.

Oh, and Ned Stark wasn't feeding King's Landing this winter.

Not to mention that the Tyrell army doesn't have to march through the Riverlands and Tywin, and Kevan Lannister isn't too well disposed to her either.

And the Iron Bank is probably going to get even more yanked off if Mace Tyrell meets an accident at Braavos.

[Ziggy Stardust]

Stannis might lose.

Granted, but having that conversation without at least MENTIONING Stannis' coming attack was idiotic. It was completely ignoring the context of everything that is going on. Like, at least have Jon Snow bring it up or say SOMETHING. It really just makes no sense at all to have that conversation without also talking about Stannis in some capacity.

That said, they could just have easily replaced it with Lord Frey.

Lord Frey would have been a much better choice for that scene. It wouldn't have blatantly ignored the context of the show and would have made the same point. Pity that they didn't do that, instead.

[Pelranius]

So Stannis has the bigger Army (Roose would probably know about him by know, word of the battle at the Wall would have spread by now), and didn't Roose have an army of 6,000 or thereabouts?

Seems that the Baratheon sellswords are also wearing Baratheon armor and colors.

[TheHammer]

So Stannis has the bigger Army (Roose would probably know about him by know, word of the battle at the Wall would have spread by now), and didn't Roose have an army of 6,000 or thereabouts?

Seems that the Baratheon sellswords are also wearing Baratheon armor and colors.

They're not all sellswords. Some of them are certainly still Baratheon men.

And yeah Roose is probably well aware that Stannis is coming and well aware that he is outnumbered by Stannis. But I think its been long claimed that Winterfell could withstand a siege against a much larger force. That's what Theon was counting on to hold it against the inevitable Northern retaliation after his men took it, but obviously the lack of reinforcements made that impossible.

It also still remains to be seen if some or all of the "free-folk" will end up fighting for Stannis. If he makes some concessions regarding kneeling, he might find them willing to fight for him. Would greatly bolster his forces in terms of man power.

[FaxModem1]

He burned Mance for not obeying him, that event alone turned a lot of people against Stannis. I think the Free Folk don't have a strong incentive to follow Stannis unless they're being press-ganged into following him. And that will only work for as long as they're forced to, after that, they'll flee when the opportunity arises.

[Balrog]

Jon Snow sending a message to the Boltons may be a way to try and put their minds at ease. They probably do know about Stannis' army being at the Wall, and they may suspect he plans to march on them soon. But if the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch is asking them for men, someone who would be privy to what Stannis is going to do, they may think Stannis has something else in mind.

[Ziggy Stardust]

Jon Snow sending a message to the Boltons may be a way to try and put their minds at ease. They probably do know about Stannis' army being at the Wall, and they may suspect he plans to march on them soon. But if the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch is asking them for men, someone who would be privy to what Stannis is going to do, they may think Stannis has something else in mind.

That, too, would have been a better way to do it. But the scene really didn't play out that way. Samwise Ga- .. erm Samwell Tarly basically tried to sneak it past Jon who he was even writing the letter to.

[Crown]

Does anyone remember when Jon Snow had a Dire Wolf called Ghost?

[Vympel]

Does anyone remember when Jon Snow had a Dire Wolf called Ghost?

He was sitting down, eating, in the first episode of the season. Par for the course

I quite liked this episode (Episode 5). I (surprisingly) didn't see the Stone Men attack coming this episode at all, but I knew when it began that Jorah would end up being infected with greyscale. An interesting turn of events, I have to wonder what the ultimate end of it is. Stannis' scenes were great - we had another Stannis grammar correction, and the excellent scene with Sam.

They've succeeded in making Dany's Meereen plot in the show far more interesting than it is in the show, because finally everything for her is turning to shit. No more gifts just being handed to her from on high over and over and over.

Easily the best scene in the whole episode was the Bolton family dinner, though.

THOUGHT:

Stannis is marching on Winterfell. Brienne and Podrick are near Winterfell at an inn. They've signaled that they're ready to rescue Sansa.

Stannis lays siege to Winterfell. Shit goes down in Winterfell. Brienne rescues Sansa - runs smack dab into Stannis' forces?

[Pelranius]

Would Stannis even recognize Brienne (he seems to have been at Dragonstone or Kings Landing for most of her life)? It might make awkward any attempts by her on his life.

Before Selyse interrupted him, did Davos say that he was going to see to it that Shireen is safe (send her off somewhere, a la Edric Storm)?

I imagined the Ruins of Valyria to well, be more lifeless, but 400 years is plenty of time for volcanic ruins in a semitropical area to get grown over.

[Ziggy Stardust]

Would Stannis even recognize Brienne (he seems to have been at Dragonstone or Kings Landing for most of her life)?

Brienne was a "king's guard" to Stannis' brother Renley. It would be surprising to me if Stannis wasn't aware of who she was. Hell, he knew who the fucking Tarley's were.

[Pelranius]

Would Stannis even recognize Brienne (he seems to have been at Dragonstone or Kings Landing for most of her life)?

Brienne was a "king's guard" to Stannis' brother Renley. It would be surprising to me if Stannis wasn't aware of who she was. Hell, he knew who the fucking Tarley's were.

D'oh, I'd forgotten about a lot of Season 2!

[TheHammer]

Would Stannis even recognize Brienne (he seems to have been at Dragonstone or Kings Landing for most of her life)?

Brienne was a "king's guard" to Stannis' brother Renley. It would be surprising to me if Stannis wasn't aware of who she was. Hell, he knew who the fucking Tarley's were.

It's possible her reputation will precede here, but equally likely it won't. She wasn't present for the Renley/Stannis meeting, so its possible he doesn't know who she is and probable that he doesn't know that she has a vendetta against him. I guess we will see.

My guess is that Brienne is forced to make a choice between saving Sansa or getting revenged on Stannis. I could easily see her going out in a blaze og glory and Oathkeeper ending up in the hands of Stannis - the Oathkeepiest guy in the 7 kingdoms.

[Ziggy Stardust]

It's possible her reputation will precede here, but equally likely it won't. She wasn't present for the Renley/Stannis meeting, so its possible he doesn't know who she is and probable that he doesn't know that she has a vendetta against him. I guess we will see.

Do we know how long Brienne was in service to Renley? I know we haven't seen the two of them on screen together, but I was under the impression that Brienne and Renley went back a ways (Brienne had that story of Renley dancing with her years prior), so there would have been time before Season 2 that they may have met, or at the very least Stannis would have heard about her.

I agree with you that Stannis likely doesn't know that Brienne is out to get him, but I do think there is good reason to believe that he at least knows who Brienne of Tarth is in a general sense.

[Pelranius]

He's probably heard about Lord Tarth's very tall daughter, so he might make a connection if he sees her, though Stannis probably couldn't pick her out of a yearbook (unless she resembles her father or mother a lot, whom Stannis would probably know the former).

[Napoleon the Clown]

Would Stannis even recognize Brienne (he seems to have been at Dragonstone or Kings Landing for most of her life)? It might make awkward any attempts by her on his life.

Before Selyse interrupted him, did Davos say that he was going to see to it that Shireen is safe (send her off somewhere, a la Edric Storm)?

I imagined the Ruins of Valyria to well, be more lifeless, but 400 years is plenty of time for volcanic ruins in a semitropical area to get grown over.

Davos seemed to be about to say Shireen would be nowhere near any of the battles when he got cut off.



I can't help but wonder if Shireen's greyscale will end up being a significant plot point down the road. More than just demonstrating the human side of Stannis.

[Pelranius]

Davos seemed to be about to say Shireen would be nowhere near any of the battles when he got cut off.

I can't help but wonder if Shireen's greyscale will end up being a significant plot point down the road. More than just demonstrating the human side of Stannis.

Thanks. I wonder where Davos would stash her (it might make Selyse freak out, for all the wrong reasons).

As for the greyscale, she seems to be non-contagious (Jorah causing an outbreak in Mereen that goes global seems more likely).

[TheHammer]

It's possible her reputation will precede here, but equally likely it won't. She wasn't present for the Renley/Stannis meeting, so its possible he doesn't know who she is and probable that he doesn't know that she has a vendetta against him. I guess we will see.

Do we know how long Brienne was in service to Renley? I know we haven't seen the two of them on screen together, but I was under the impression that Brienne and Renley went back a ways (Brienne had that story of Renley dancing with her years prior), so there would have been time before Season 2 that they may have met, or at the very least Stannis would have heard about her.

I agree with you that Stannis likely doesn't know that Brienne is out to get him, but I do think there is good reason to believe that he at least knows who Brienne of Tarth is in a general sense.

She herself wasn't in Renly's service long, we are introduced to her by her beating Ser Loras (earning her place as Kings Guard) and the impression was she was a very recent arrival. However, her family's lands were part of Stormlands and traditionally held allegiance to house Baratheon, so it would not be a surprise if Stannis did recognize or at least know of her.

Makes me wonder... who ostensibly is lord of the Stormlands at this point? I guess Thommen would qualify since he is supposed to be a Baratheon...

[Napoleon the Clown]

Davos seemed to be about to say Shireen would be nowhere near any of the battles when he got cut off.

I can't help but wonder if Shireen's greyscale will end up being a significant plot point down the road. More than just demonstrating the human side of Stannis.

Thanks. I wonder where Davos would stash her (it might make Selyse freak out, for all the wrong reasons).

As for the greyscale, she seems to be non-contagious (Jorah causing an outbreak in Mereen that goes global seems more likely).

I was thinking more that there'd be a plot point made of her being effectively cured of it. Exactly how it could become relevant, I don't know. But it seems the sort of thing that wouldn't be introduced without there being a narrative plan for it.

[streetad]

Well either Stannis or Joffrey (then Tommen) would have inherited the Stormlands from Renly - so basically the title is disputed.

[Iroscato]

Well, episode 5 was awesome.
Spoiler

Noooo! Ser Barristan! We finally get to see him kick arse and take names, and it's the last thing he ever does...
The story with Grey Worm and Whatserface continues to be strangely cute.
Tyrion's fucking face when he sees Drogon flapping nonchalantly overhead
Danaerys is going down a very dark path. Hope Tyrion and Jorah can help bring her back from inheriting the Targaryen madness...
Aaaand Jorah now has the lurgy. I'd forgotten how trigger-happy this show is with characters, but I'm paying for my foolishness. Man, do I ever love it though.

[Vympel]

Just a note that Brienne was in fact present at the meeting between Renly and Stannis- however she was wearing an open face helmet which could make her hard to recognize, especially given how long ago it was. Stannis would've been focusing on Renly and Cat anyway, not Renly's guards.



(Forgot I had it in my armor thread)

[Pelranius]

Davos seemed to be about to say Shireen would be nowhere near any of the battles when he got cut off.

I can't help but wonder if Shireen's greyscale will end up being a significant plot point down the road. More than just demonstrating the human side of Stannis.

Thanks. I wonder where Davos would stash her (it might make Selyse freak out, for all the wrong reasons).

As for the greyscale, she seems to be non-contagious (Jorah causing an outbreak in Mereen that goes global seems more likely).

I was thinking more that there'd be a plot point made of her being effectively cured of it. Exactly how it could become relevant, I don't know. But it seems the sort of thing that wouldn't be introduced without there being a narrative plan for it.

Well, I had a thought during episode two that it might involve magic, perhaps something from Selyse that cause her to miscarry all future pregnancies (though her trouble carrying to term might have more to do with her nearly starving to death at the Storm's End siege in Robert's Rebellion).

Don't know what inspired that particular notion.

[LaCroix]

I think Danaerys is doing the ony thing she can do in her situation. And the most economic. Everyone agrees that the Sons of the Harpy are trained, financed and led by some big house as a political terror tool. Whenever they attack, she randomly executes one of the leadersof said houses. So it's in their personal interest to collaborate and end these attacks, quickly. Sooner or later, one of them will.

Her actions may seem abhorrent to someone like us, but in the scale of Westerosi/Slave Bay culture, she's pretty restrained in terms of bloodshed. Other rulers would order revenge executions of x (random and usually poor) people for every soldier killed. She simply demands the life of one leading person. Her method is superior for getting the people actually responsible.