Technology in Harry Potter

FAN: Discuss various fictional worlds that don't qualify for SF.

Moderator: Steve

User avatar
neoolong
Dead Sexy 'Shroom
Posts: 13180
Joined: 2002-08-29 10:01pm
Location: California

Re: Technology in Harry Potter

Post by neoolong »

Master of Ossus wrote:
phongn wrote:
Master of Ossus wrote:Muggle technology does not work at Hogwarts, although that's pretty inconsistent. Colin's camera worked fine (albeit he was developing his film magically, at the time).
For all we know, Colin's camera was completely manual. There's no reason that it had to be a modern electronic SLR.
The operating mechanism for all cameras, however, is chemical. Chemicals should be affected by Hogwart's magical energy.
Should it?

Don't they do potions and stuff like that? That would appear to utilize chemical reactions as well. So surely some must work.

And since the camera did work, the chemicals were not affected to a degree that it wouldn't work.
Member of the BotM. @( !.! )@
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

Colin Creevey's camera wasn't an electronic one. I don't see why photosensitive film wouldn't work, since it's not really high technology in the same way a computer or a cell phone is. Colin mentions in the second book that someone showed him a special potion that made the animated photos which he was suprised about and thought that his parents would get a kick out of, which implies that he brought the camera from home and the magical part of magic photography is done when developing the film, not the camera itself. The only thing that is a bit inconsistant is that Colin's camera had a flash bulb, which shouldn't work in Hogwarts since it's just a powerful lightbulb. Maybe it was a magic flash bulb, though if the movie is to be believed it is one of those old school flash bulbs of death, so it might be primitive enough to not be effected.
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
phongn
Rebel Leader
Posts: 18487
Joined: 2002-07-03 11:11pm

Post by phongn »

Well, perhaps electronics don't work well (e.g. solid state stuff or even vacuum tubes) but relatively simple electric circuits or electromechanical systems would? A flash is a bit complex but not as much as, say, an electronic light meter.
User avatar
phongn
Rebel Leader
Posts: 18487
Joined: 2002-07-03 11:11pm

Post by phongn »

SirNitram wrote:Can I just say I find the idea of an 'anti-tech' field one of the most ridiculous, up there with 'dur, magic and tech react violently/null each other out'?
I figured it was interference (perhaps the magics output some sort of strong magnetic field?) versus 'tech simply doesn't work'
User avatar
SirNitram
Rest in Peace, Black Mage
Posts: 28367
Joined: 2002-07-03 04:48pm
Location: Somewhere between nowhere and everywhere

Post by SirNitram »

phongn wrote:
SirNitram wrote:Can I just say I find the idea of an 'anti-tech' field one of the most ridiculous, up there with 'dur, magic and tech react violently/null each other out'?
I figured it was interference (perhaps the magics output some sort of strong magnetic field?) versus 'tech simply doesn't work'
Looking at the explanation, yes, it looks more like a EMP(Or a TMP.. A Thaumic-Magical Pulse) effect over the area. That I'll buy.
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.

Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.

Shadowy Overlord - BMs/Black Mage Monkey - BOTM/Jetfire - Cybertron's Finest/General Miscreant/ASVS/Supermoderator Emeritus

Debator Classification: Trollhunter
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

phongn wrote:Well, perhaps electronics don't work well (e.g. solid state stuff or even vacuum tubes) but relatively simple electric circuits or electromechanical systems would? A flash is a bit complex but not as much as, say, an electronic light meter.
Isn't a flash bulb a lightbulb with a burnaway filament, a bunch of capacitors, and a couple of batteries?
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
phongn
Rebel Leader
Posts: 18487
Joined: 2002-07-03 11:11pm

Post by phongn »

Basic ones, yes. More complex ones exist, but I doubt Colin had one like that.
User avatar
phongn
Rebel Leader
Posts: 18487
Joined: 2002-07-03 11:11pm

Post by phongn »

SirNitram wrote:
phongn wrote:I figured it was interference (perhaps the magics output some sort of strong magnetic field?) versus 'tech simply doesn't work'
Looking at the explanation, yes, it looks more like a EMP(Or a TMP.. A Thaumic-Magical Pulse) effect over the area. That I'll buy.
Field rather than pulse, but yes. Still, I'd think that it could be shielded against, just that the Wizards haven't realised the advances that the muggles have made in passive defenses against such interference.
User avatar
RedImperator
Roosevelt Republican
Posts: 16465
Joined: 2002-07-11 07:59pm
Location: Delaware
Contact:

Post by RedImperator »

Harry's watch worked until the fourth book. Mechanical and chemical devices seem to work fine, as do simple electrical devices. The magic field only seems to screw with electronics, which would knock out computers, radios, TVs, and the like. The steam locomotive that pulls the Hogwarts train in every year isn't effected at all.

There's also the general predjudice among the wizards against Muggles in general and Muggle technology in general. Most of them consider technology quaint at best and the clumsy, flailing workarounds of the degenerate sub-human non-wizard masses. The worst of them, like the Malfoys, consider wizards who use technology, even just for fun, as borderline race traitors.
Image
Any city gets what it admires, will pay for, and, ultimately, deserves…We want and deserve tin-can architecture in a tinhorn culture. And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed.--Ada Louise Huxtable, "Farewell to Penn Station", New York Times editorial, 30 October 1963
X-Ray Blues
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

RedImperator wrote:Harry's watch worked until the fourth book. Mechanical and chemical devices seem to work fine, as do simple electrical devices. The magic field only seems to screw with electronics, which would knock out computers, radios, TVs, and the like. The steam locomotive that pulls the Hogwarts train in every year isn't effected at all.
Actually Harry's digital watch was mentioned to have stopped, until Hermione replaced it.
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
RedImperator
Roosevelt Republican
Posts: 16465
Joined: 2002-07-11 07:59pm
Location: Delaware
Contact:

Post by RedImperator »

Gil Hamilton wrote:
RedImperator wrote:Harry's watch worked until the fourth book. Mechanical and chemical devices seem to work fine, as do simple electrical devices. The magic field only seems to screw with electronics, which would knock out computers, radios, TVs, and the like. The steam locomotive that pulls the Hogwarts train in every year isn't effected at all.
Actually Harry's digital watch was mentioned to have stopped, until Hermione replaced it.
Heh. I thought he had a regular mechanical watch. It's been a while since I read the first book.
Image
Any city gets what it admires, will pay for, and, ultimately, deserves…We want and deserve tin-can architecture in a tinhorn culture. And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed.--Ada Louise Huxtable, "Farewell to Penn Station", New York Times editorial, 30 October 1963
X-Ray Blues
User avatar
Zaia
Inamorata
Posts: 13983
Joined: 2002-10-23 03:04am
Location: Londontowne

Post by Zaia »

Vendetta wrote:
They might not be up to our standards of tech?
The setting of the books is early 90's. (first book set in '91).

Somehow, they've managed to leap ahead technologically though. Dudley managed, somehow, to get a Playstation six months or so before the Japanese release.....
Ummm....ok, I could be remembering this incorrectly, because I've seen "Chamber of Secrets" about seven times since I read any of the first three books, but....aren't the brooms that all the kids want, in the first book, Nimbus 2000s, or is that only in the movie? I know in "Chamber of Secrets" the movie, Lucius Malfoy buys the whole Syltherin team Nimbus 2001s, so...I don't know about the books, because I haven't read them in a while, but it sort of sounds to me like the story will take place through the years 2000-2007. Based on the movie, anyway.
"On the infrequent occasions when I have been called upon in a formal place to play the bongo drums, the introducer never seems to find it necessary to mention that I also do theoretical physics." -Richard Feynman
User avatar
neoolong
Dead Sexy 'Shroom
Posts: 13180
Joined: 2002-08-29 10:01pm
Location: California

Post by neoolong »

Zaia wrote:
Vendetta wrote:
They might not be up to our standards of tech?
The setting of the books is early 90's. (first book set in '91).

Somehow, they've managed to leap ahead technologically though. Dudley managed, somehow, to get a Playstation six months or so before the Japanese release.....
Ummm....ok, I could be remembering this incorrectly, because I've seen "Chamber of Secrets" about seven times since I read any of the first three books, but....aren't the brooms that all the kids want, in the first book, Nimbus 2000s, or is that only in the movie? I know in "Chamber of Secrets" the movie, Lucius Malfoy buys the whole Syltherin team Nimbus 2001s, so...I don't know about the books, because I haven't read them in a while, but it sort of sounds to me like the story will take place through the years 2000-2007. Based on the movie, anyway.
I believe that you are correct. However, the 2000 may not be a year number. It may refer to a model.
Member of the BotM. @( !.! )@
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

Actually, I've always assumed that the series started at the end of the 90s, since book four was fifty years after the murder of the Riddle family, and that was a few years after World War 2 ended.
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
Zaia
Inamorata
Posts: 13983
Joined: 2002-10-23 03:04am
Location: Londontowne

Post by Zaia »

RedImperator wrote:Harry's watch worked until the fourth book. Mechanical and chemical devices seem to work fine, as do simple electrical devices. The magic field only seems to screw with electronics, which would knock out computers, radios, TVs, and the like. The steam locomotive that pulls the Hogwarts train in every year isn't effected at all.

There's also the general predjudice among the wizards against Muggles in general and Muggle technology in general. Most of them consider technology quaint at best and the clumsy, flailing workarounds of the degenerate sub-human non-wizard masses. The worst of them, like the Malfoys, consider wizards who use technology, even just for fun, as borderline race traitors.
There's also that whole thing that Hogwarts is supposed to be hidden. If there were electrical wires and things, don't you think it'd be kind of obvious exactly where they were located? No point in casting spells or putting magical force fields or whatever over the campus if you're using enough electricity to run a small country, and it's all focused on one spot out in the rolling hills of lovely England.

Besides, judging from the level of difficulty Mr. Weasley has understanding toasters, rubber ducks, turnstiles, etc., and the fact that he is fascinated with that sort of thing and devotes his life to the study of it, I would find it hard to believe there would be any wizards who'd be able to wire up that enormous school successfully. And they couldn't possibly get any muggles in there to do it--how would they explain the place? Or the inhabitants? Even during the summer, there's the greenhouse full of rather alarming things, and the stuff that lurks in the Forbidden Forest... Plus the ghosts are always there, at the school. So the school couldn't possibly bring any muggles in to do it.
"On the infrequent occasions when I have been called upon in a formal place to play the bongo drums, the introducer never seems to find it necessary to mention that I also do theoretical physics." -Richard Feynman
User avatar
Zaia
Inamorata
Posts: 13983
Joined: 2002-10-23 03:04am
Location: Londontowne

Post by Zaia »

neoolong wrote:I believe that you are correct. However, the 2000 may not be a year number. It may refer to a model.
Yes, I know it could, but since the movies were made in 2000 and 2001, I think that would be a pretty big coincidence. But, it could just be a movie adaptation. I'll have to check the books to see for sure what the broom to drool over Harry's freshman year was.
"On the infrequent occasions when I have been called upon in a formal place to play the bongo drums, the introducer never seems to find it necessary to mention that I also do theoretical physics." -Richard Feynman
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

Zaia wrote:Yes, I know it could, but since the movies were made in 2000 and 2001, I think that would be a pretty big coincidence. But, it could just be a movie adaptation. I'll have to check the books to see for sure what the broom to drool over Harry's freshman year was.
The model in the broomshop that the kids were drooling over was in fact the Nimbus 2000, which almost certainly refers to the model number (not that alot of the brooms had such numbers, like the Comet 260, for instance).
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
phongn
Rebel Leader
Posts: 18487
Joined: 2002-07-03 11:11pm

Post by phongn »

Gil Hamilton wrote:
Zaia wrote:Yes, I know it could, but since the movies were made in 2000 and 2001, I think that would be a pretty big coincidence. But, it could just be a movie adaptation. I'll have to check the books to see for sure what the broom to drool over Harry's freshman year was.
The model in the broomshop that the kids were drooling over was in fact the Nimbus 2000, which almost certainly refers to the model number (not that alot of the brooms had such numbers, like the Comet 260, for instance).
OTOH, ther was the N2K1, which makes it sound like Nimbus releases brooms by model year.
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

phongn wrote:OTOH, ther was the N2K1, which makes it sound like Nimbus releases brooms by model year.
Could be. I imagine different broom makers might have a different system. Also, some brooms don't seem to have a model or year number at all, like the Firebolt. I think it was a model number though, though it's certainly possible that the Nimbus 2k was the millenium edition of the broom (like everyone else, I imagine wizards milked the new millenium for marketing purposes too).
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
Ghost Rider
Spirit of Vengeance
Posts: 27779
Joined: 2002-09-24 01:48pm
Location: DC...looking up from the gutters to the stars

Post by Ghost Rider »

The problem is the HP timeline basically states(the one approved by Rowling) it's in the 90's.

Who knows why the Nimbus have the 2K and 2K1 though aside from possible model number.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!

Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all

Saying and doing are chocolate and concrete
User avatar
Master of Ossus
Darkest Knight
Posts: 18213
Joined: 2002-07-11 01:35am
Location: California

Post by Master of Ossus »

Ghost Rider wrote:The problem is the HP timeline basically states(the one approved by Rowling) it's in the 90's.

Who knows why the Nimbus have the 2K and 2K1 though aside from possible model number.
Gruntmaster 6000?
"Sometimes I think you WANT us to fail." "Shut up, just shut up!" -Two Guys from Kabul

Latinum Star Recipient; Hacker's Cross Award Winner

"one soler flar can vapririze the planit or malt the nickl in lass than millasacit" -Bagara1000

"Happiness is just a Flaming Moe away."
User avatar
Gil Hamilton
Tipsy Space Birdie
Posts: 12962
Joined: 2002-07-04 05:47pm
Contact:

Post by Gil Hamilton »

Ghost Rider wrote:The problem is the HP timeline basically states(the one approved by Rowling) it's in the 90's.

Who knows why the Nimbus have the 2K and 2K1 though aside from possible model number.
It could be in the 90s, but the fouth book indicates it's the late 90s. Like I said, the incident at the Riddle House was ~50 years before the events of the fourth book, but a few years after the end of fighting in WW2 (the housekeepr accused of the murder was said to have come back from fighting a few years or so before the murders) He'd have likely come home in the middle of 45, and I'd guess the incident was at the end of the 40s, so even with conservative estimates (he was shipped home early as a psychological causalty, the 50 years is a rough estimate erring on a short span of time, et cetera), the events of the Harry Potter books would have to be the middle to late 90s.
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet

"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert

"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
User avatar
RedImperator
Roosevelt Republican
Posts: 16465
Joined: 2002-07-11 07:59pm
Location: Delaware
Contact:

Post by RedImperator »

phongn wrote:OTOH, ther was the N2K1, which makes it sound like Nimbus releases brooms by model year.
People were assigning the number "2000" to things years before the actual turn of the milennium. Maxis called the sequel to Sim City, Sim City 2000 even though it was released at the latest in 1994 (I was in 8th grade then and a friend of mine had a copy). They could have reset their numbering system to start at 2000 (much like Maxis later released Sim City 3000, though they eventually went back to single digit sequel numbers).
Image
Any city gets what it admires, will pay for, and, ultimately, deserves…We want and deserve tin-can architecture in a tinhorn culture. And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed.--Ada Louise Huxtable, "Farewell to Penn Station", New York Times editorial, 30 October 1963
X-Ray Blues
User avatar
Ghost Rider
Spirit of Vengeance
Posts: 27779
Joined: 2002-09-24 01:48pm
Location: DC...looking up from the gutters to the stars

Post by Ghost Rider »

The closest bit I could find of when it's taken place is the Nearly hedaless Nick comment celebrating his deathday party for 500 years...which would mean since his death in 1492, the year would be 1992.

The only problem is it slightly contradicts the timeline given in Chamber's DVD(which Rowling approved of) which said Potter's first year was late '91.

This is about as close as dates get.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!

Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all

Saying and doing are chocolate and concrete
User avatar
Vendetta
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10895
Joined: 2002-07-07 04:57pm
Location: Sheffield, UK

Post by Vendetta »

Ghost Rider wrote:The closest bit I could find of when it's taken place is the Nearly hedaless Nick comment celebrating his deathday party for 500 years...which would mean since his death in 1492, the year would be 1992.

The only problem is it slightly contradicts the timeline given in Chamber's DVD(which Rowling approved of) which said Potter's first year was late '91.

This is about as close as dates get.
No it doesn't.

The first year would be Sept '91 to Jun '92, the second year Sept '92 to Jun '93.

Halloween '92 would fall during year 2.

Timeline restored.
Post Reply