Watchmen. [SPOILERS!]

[General Zod]

I don't just worry that this is the new superhero movie being marketed to your kids today. I worry about the ones that will be even more depraved a decade from now.

I love it when clueless morons go into a movie expecting one thing and then whining when they find out it's something else because they were too stupid to find out the background of the movie beforehand. Ignoring the fact that the book the movie's based on has been out for more than 20 years. . .

In fact, as a movie critic who sees most new releases, I haven't seen a more violent, depraved movie in years (not to mention a longer, more boring movie with a more preposterous and silly plot). This movie makes the graphic bloodshed of the recently released "Friday the 13th" look like "Cinderella."

So it was more violent, boring and depraved than the SAW movies? Really. What a tool.

[2000AD]

It was ..... good. Just good.

Maybe it's because I've read the book, but even though it's 2.5 hours plus it does feel rushed in places, you can clearly see where they left bits out, I bet even people that haven't read the book would be able to spot the bits where it's been shortened and compacted.

I liked it, but I'm still dissapointed it wasn't better. I know it would never be as good as the book but I was hoping it would be better than ..... just good. It stays really faithful to the book and I reckon you couldn't ask for more from a film adaption of Watchmen, which is a depressing thought, that the best adaptation of a brilliant work of art will at best be only ..... just good.

[SylasGaunt]

I love how he says it's marketed to kids when it's rated R. I mean seriously, that should be a flag right there. That and the ratings box tells you exactly why it's rated R. But then we get this same issue with parents who buy their kids games like Grand Theft Auto and then are shocked at the content because they were too stupid or lazy to read the rating box.

But you always get idiots who are too selfish or cheap to leave their kids at home and so drag them along to movies they probably shouldn't be seeing. I'm reminded of the woman and her brood of 5 elementary age kids who sat next to me when I went to see 30 Days of Night.. and this was at an 11 pm showing.


As for the rest of his 'review'.. what was he asleep? Or just retarded? I mean they explained all the historical changes within the film, how did he miss that?

[Rahvin]

Oddly enough, that "review" made me even more excited to see the movie tonight...

[Peptuck]

I don't just worry that this is the new superhero movie being marketed to your kids today. I worry about the ones that will be even more depraved a decade from now.

Laughing so goddamn hard.

My opinion: I've only gotten to the fourth chapter of the actual graphic novel, but I loved the shit out of this movie. Gonna see it again.

[Posner]

I liked it a lot. I'm glad to hear that people who didn't read the comic were able to follow it. I'm also glad Rorshach's scalding scene was shown, I was actually kinda disappointed that Moore left it out. I wasn't a huge fan of the ending, especially when Laurie stole Dr. Manhattan's line about nothing ever ending. The actor playing Veidt didn't look the part and his accent kept on disappearing and reappearing. I also don't like how they made Laurie and Dan getting together more of a romantic thing- it was better in the comic when you felt like it was just a couple of desperate people fucking. But those are minor compared to the travesty that you would think Hollywood would produce. I would recommend it to any fan of the comic.

[Stark]

I liked it, but the first act much more than the rest. Whether it was the insertion of so much wire-fu with bad metal or the removal of scenes to be re-inserted later (the device of cutting away from a scene to a flashback with a VO describing something the audience didn't see but was present in a cut scene) or simply the direction, I felt many of the 'steps' up the drama curve were missed and the pacing so spotty I was getting bored towards the end. Manhattan's departure worked, but his Mars experience didn't since it lacked the reiteration. The 'I am your father' revealation didn't work because it was directed very simply and had terrible music, instead of the constant cutaway flashbacks used in the book. The finale was fine, but frankly makes no more 'sense' than the original. The addition of Dan proving the Comedian right by deteriorating into an angry, frustrated and violent child when he doesn't get his way was great, but not followed up at all. He proved Comedian and Veidt right, but this was presented as him being 'hardcore'. Sadly I actually think that despite the Comedian looking great, the actor simply couldn't pull off the pathos required - particularly obvious in the Moloch scene.

So the addition of terrible action sequences for no reason while simplifying other scenes (in style, not time, doing them properly would probably have been shorter) for no reason means... I liked it, but Zack Synder is an idiot. Changing scenes for absolutely no other reason than to insert gore = oh dear. I expect many of the issues I have to be resolved by the longer versions, but Snyder's 'slow mo punch up with giant gore' will always remain rubbish. His most ridiculous departure - turning Dan and Laurie into multiple murderers - even removes the pathos from Kovacs, since when he says he was 'soft' because 'sometimes he let them live', there is no longer any impact because everyone casually kills people all the time.

[Peptuck]

Actually, nix my previous comment on what aspects of the review I found funny. Instead-

At the same time, the Soviets are about to nuke America. It's 1985 and Nixon is President. We've won in Vietnam. Oh, and Henry Kissinger has a Russian accent. And Ronald Reagan is thinking of running for President in 1998. Wow, isn't that cool that they got it wrong on purpose? I'm so amazed at this "high-brow art" of deliberately getting dates and timelines wrong, you know, just to be "artistic," and get the drooling of the critics. That is sooooo genius. Like way totally cool.

Maybe if I make a movie about how Eisenhower was President in 1972, we "lost" World War II, and Bin Laden was gonna bomb the World Trade Center then, I'll be cool, too. . . so long as it's "dark" and I include a bunch of rape, torture, explicit sex scenes, and extremely graphic killings, and oh, write a "graphic novel" a/k/a comic book about it, first.

I found this ridiculously funny too. Someone has never heard of "alternate history," apparently. Also-

* Cops being set on fire and burning to death by superhero compatriot "Rorschach;"

Outright lie. We never see any cops getting burned to death, just a single SWAT officer getting his (normally fireproofed) tactical gear set ablaze.

Yup, this is the garbage that Rupert Murdoch's Fox and Warner Brothers and Paramount are marketing toward your kids.

Yup, what with that big old "R" rating, this movie is perfect for kids!

Remember the White single mother who told me her ten-year-old son could see it because "he knows it's not real and he knows the difference between right and wrong"? Well, she was back with her ten-year-old, and they waited in line for at least two hours with their free pass to get in to this screening, I'm told. I saw them walking out at the end.

Her son is going to grow up to be messed up. Don't do the same to your kid.

So, this guy can tell the future now?

Ah, idiotic, ignorant, hysterical reviewers. Always good for a laugh.

[Posner]

Yeah Stark, I found the wire fu annoying as well. The only character where that dramatic technique would really work is Ozymandias (Dr. Manhattan doesn't really need to punch people). I did get a sick thrill out of Manhattan's gorier Destructo beam, I have to admit.

And you have a great point about the alleyway fight, I hadn't thought of that. We can debate the morals of sticking a knife in a mugger's throat, but Moore's Nite Owl and Silk Spectre wouldn't- they see avoiding murder as what separates them from Rorsasch

[Stark]

The lamest part is when something gory happens, and then Snyder gives us a lingering shot of some gore, while later being too unimaginative to mirror the direction of the book and thus losing impact on important scenes. The skeletons hanging from the chandelier was pure juvenile shock-value and I actually rolled my eyes. There's a difference between not flinching from realism (ie Jupiter's terrible injuries from the Comedian) and just going out of your way. It's a minor thing that didn't affect my enjoyment of the movie, but I also rolled my eyes at the main cast's super-durability.

[NomAnor15]

I just got back from seeing this movie, and I found it to be pretty enjoyable. The story was kind of so-so, but I haven't read the graphic novel, which I'm sure would make it more interesting. Mostly what I enjoyed was the way it was portrayed. I can't put my finger on it exactly, but I just felt for all the characters and their situations. I also found their choice of music to be absolutely hilarious. Just goes to show what my sense of humor is like.

[Posner]

I just got back from seeing this movie, and I found it to be pretty enjoyable. The story was kind of so-so, but I haven't read the graphic novel, which I'm sure would make it more interesting. Mostly what I enjoyed was the way it was portrayed. I can't put my finger on it exactly, but I just felt for all the characters and their situations. I also found their choice of music to be absolutely hilarious. Just goes to show what my sense of humor is like.

Yeah, I loved the use of Unforgettable by Nat King Cole, thought the tracks from Philip Glass's Koyaanisqatsi soundtrack was great, had to smile at Flight of the Valkyries, but The Sound of Silence made no sense for the funeral scene. The Muzak version of whatever 80's song was great.

[Rye]

I thought it was pretty epic. I found that Manhattan was the one I was most interested in throughout, and I enjoyed his descent into solipsism and ascent to godhood. The ending dragged a bit, and there were a few bits of bad acting and Matrixy out of place philosophical analysis (where Dan said "you've made a mockery of human idealism" or something near the end). Despite its faults, I did actually quite like the "wire fu" super-fighting, because anything else would look unimpressive for what they were meant to be, and really expose superheroism for the sham it would be. I'm ambivalent at how Snyder added action to scenes that would otherwise be more faithful to the comic, on the one hand, it's not too mature, on the other, I think it might have been too dry in the cinema had it been more faithful.

A really small thing that I would've done different was when Rorschach and Dan had a fight about Dan being "soft" and then they shake hands to make up. In my head, at that part in the comic, Rorschach was so socially inept he didn't realise he was holding Dan's hand too long and it was a bit of comedy, but it wasn't really played up for that in the film.

Also, with Ozymandias' monologuing at the end, the revelation tension/release wasn't handled too well. I had imagined all the diegetic sound suddenly "holding its breath" and then Veidt says "...I did it 25 minutes ago" or whatever the actual quote is, but there wasn't any pause or even special editing on the bit.

The score wasn't great (they should've got Steve Jablonsky), but the diegetic music and the era-specific music was great. The opening titles showing what happened to the old superheroes was fantastic. That shot with "LESBIAN WHORES" (no references to shroom_man please) really impacted on me.

Given what could've gone wrong but didn't, I really did enjoy it and will no doubt get it on Blu Ray in the super-duper director's cut version.

[open_sketchbook]

I saw this earlier with my girlfriend. Even as a fan of the graphic novel, I thought it was well done and overall a very good movie. As an artist I was particularly intrigued by the effects on Rorschach's mask, and I want to watch it again and watched to see if the mask changes according to his emotions, or simply randomly.

[Stark]

It's definately not random, and doing it 'randomly' would be an absurd waste of effects budget. It reflects his mood in shape, movement and colour.

[open_sketchbook]

That's what I thought, but I'd like to try and work out the pattern.

[Old Plympto]

The opening titles showing what happened to the old superheroes was fantastic. That shot with "LESBIAN WHORES" (no references to shroom_man please) really impacted on me.

Agreed. The opening titles is an inspired move. You could say that the movie condensed Hollis Mason's Under The Hood book excerpts in the back of the comics into a fantastic slow motion montage.

[Nephtys]

I really liked the introduction too. Just a montage with that song fit perfectly, and conveyed the way you're supposed to feel when looking in the past towards the present. The fight scenes to be honest weren't too annoying, except that godawful way they had to add the saw scene on screen. Why couldn't it have been implied, like the bathroom scene?

Otherwise, I think it's a fantastic adaptation. It cuts out stuff that needs to be cut out for the sake of the movie format, while preserving what's important and a bit more. You understand how each character sees the situation, and why.

[SylasGaunt]

Also, with Ozymandias' monologuing at the end, the revelation tension/release wasn't handled too well. I had imagined all the diegetic sound suddenly "holding its breath" and then Veidt says "...I did it 25 minutes ago" or whatever the actual quote is, but there wasn't any pause or even special editing on the bit.

To be fair on this I don't think there's any indication of a pause in the graphic novel either. He' just calmly speaking and then whammies them with the revelation that they're too late.

[Oskuro]

Saw it yesterday. I hadn't read the novel, although I knew about it, and found it to be an excellent movie. Although I must agree with the character's super-durability and strength making it less obvious that they have no real superpowers. I had to explain to my friends that all the wire-fu was movie exaggeration, and that the characters were supposed to be regular (albeit well-trained) people, rather than low powered super-strength capes, as they were arguing they were.

Now I have to actually read the novel.

[The Cooler King]

Went to see it last night and loved it. There's some dead space here and there (mainly due to the non-chemistry between the actors playing Nite Owl II and Silk Spectre II), but overall, a fantastic adaptation. My favorite moments were in there ("I'm not locked up in here with you... you're locked up in here with me!" and Manhattan and Laurie on Mars), the action was brisk, and the plot condensed just enough to work on-screen. The only problems I had were really related to the shitty theater I saw it at. A group of teenagers behind me giggled and snorted like idiots whenever Dr. Manhattan's junk was visible, and some jackass brought his eight year old to the movie with him. The guy held his hands over the kids eyes about every five minutes, and never once seemed to think about leaving the movie.


Edit: I noticed after posting that SylasGaunt had already commented on this phenomenon...

But you always get idiots who are too selfish or cheap to leave their kids at home and so drag them along to movies they probably shouldn't be seeing. I'm reminded of the woman and her brood of 5 elementary age kids who sat next to me when I went to see 30 Days of Night.. and this was at an 11 pm showing.

[Lost Soal]

Went to see it last night and loved it. There's some dead space here and there (mainly due to the non-chemistry between the actors playing Nite Owl II and Silk Spectre II), but overall, a fantastic adaptation. My favorite moments were in there ("I'm not locked up in here with you... you're locked up in here with me!" and Manhattan and Laurie on Mars), the action was brisk, and the plot condensed just enough to work on-screen. The only problems I had were really related to the shitty theater I saw it at. A group of teenagers behind me giggled and snorted like idiots whenever Dr. Manhattan's junk was visible, and some jackass brought his eight year old to the movie with him. The guy held his hands over the kids eyes about every five minutes, and never once seemed to think about leaving the movie.


Edit: I noticed after posting that SylasGaunt had already commented on this phenomenon...

But you always get idiots who are too selfish or cheap to leave their kids at home and so drag them along to movies they probably shouldn't be seeing. I'm reminded of the woman and her brood of 5 elementary age kids who sat next to me when I went to see 30 Days of Night.. and this was at an 11 pm showing.

What idiot came up with the American rating system.
"This film is rated R, has scenes of nudity, sex, extreme violence and is unsuitable for young children. However if there is an adult in the group then any age is perfectly fine."
How idiotic can you get, over here it got an 18, at best with a few cuts it might have got a 15 but none of these have any age exception just because their with an adult.

[Minischoles]

I liked it a lot. I'm glad to hear that people who didn't read the comic were able to follow it. I'm also glad Rorshach's scalding scene was shown, I was actually kinda disappointed that Moore left it out. I wasn't a huge fan of the ending, especially when Laurie stole Dr. Manhattan's line about nothing ever ending. The actor playing Veidt didn't look the part and his accent kept on disappearing and reappearing. I also don't like how they made Laurie and Dan getting together more of a romantic thing- it was better in the comic when you felt like it was just a couple of desperate people fucking. But those are minor compared to the travesty that you would think Hollywood would produce. I would recommend it to any fan of the comic.

On the accent thing, I just read that its to do with some German past he has, where in public he has a perfect American accent, but in private he slips back into his german accent.


Overall I liked it, Rorschach was probably the stand out character for me and done pretty damn well by the actor, Dr Manhatten and the Comedian were done fairly well too. Silk Spectre II and Nite Owl II were ok on their own, but together there chemistry was so poor it was practically a black hole.
All in all it felt both very rushed in trying to cram the story in, but then also very long. 3 hours is a long time to sit in cinema seats and watch a movie. Did like the opening montage, and the flashbacks seemed pretty spot on as far as i can remember without a reread.

[General Zod]

The lamest part is when something gory happens, and then Snyder gives us a lingering shot of some gore, while later being too unimaginative to mirror the direction of the book and thus losing impact on important scenes. The skeletons hanging from the chandelier was pure juvenile shock-value and I actually rolled my eyes. There's a difference between not flinching from realism (ie Jupiter's terrible injuries from the Comedian) and just going out of your way. It's a minor thing that didn't affect my enjoyment of the movie, but I also rolled my eyes at the main cast's super-durability.

Just got back from my film, and I think the gore was probably the weakest link in the whole thing. It was done pretty well over all, but all the blood and guts parts just didn't really seem to fit in very well, so they didn't have any kind of "shock" value or emotional impact. When they were breaking some guys arms and all the blood squirted out I couldn't help but wonder how many blood packets they used instead of getting any kind of real impact. Otherwise the adaptation was fairly impressive.

[fgalkin]

Just got back from the film.

I used to think that the Giant Squid was completely utterly ridiculous and setting-breaking and as far as ridiculous endings go, that one can't be beat.

Boy, was I wrong. The ending to the Watchmen movie leaves "ridiculous" territory and goes so far into non sequitur land it almost comes out the other side.

Seriously, Dr. Manhattan as the threat? They could have at least done "The Day the Earth Stood Still" ending, plagiarized as it would have been. Instead, they just made one that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Having said that, the movie WAS awesome, especially the character bits. It does get across what it needs to, i.e. "Comedian is a scumbag," "Ozymandias is a git," "Dreiberg is impotent," (although that one was heavy-handed).

When it comes to Laurie, and Dr. Manhattan, however, the movie drops the ball. The depths of Laurie's hatred for Blake are not emphasized enough in the movie, so the final revelation loses impact. And you really don't see how weak-willed Manhattan is in the movie.

That, and making the superheroes UBER! sort of defeats the whole purpose.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin