Best vampires

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-07-01 02:33pm

Traditional? Steer clear of S.P. Somtow's Timmy Valentine then, he's basically limited to what he believes he is.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-07-01 02:39pm

Well my thoughts on the origins of my vampires:

Well in my world, there's an astral plane, and above it, all the gods of light reside, and it's ruled with yhwh's iron fist, the angels are supremely powerful, and few gods can challenge them, so they live up there in a form of mafia "security" as the angels can kcik gods that don't comply to the banishment realm, hell, which as you might expect is under the astral plane.

The astral plane is where the life forces of all the sentient beings that live in the physical realm interact, and the forces of both sides attempt to harvest as many as possible for their etheral weaponry to use on the other side.

Anyway, this fits in because during the roman times, there was a small tribe the romans could never conquer that had dominion over a reasonably large section of land in romania. They worshipped vampire gods, and used various mystical artifacts linked to the gods to give them their power. Then, christianity and the crusades rolled around and the knights dominated the inferiorly equipped vampire god worshippers, and burned their temples, killed their babies etc.

Till eventually there were only a few left. These few decided to make the ultimate sacrifice, to become demigods that could only live in darkness and feed on the living. They became one with their gods and the gods escaped from the banishment realm, and into new vessels. These were the "purebloods" with the biggest best vampire powers.

When they make new vampires, they are significantly lacking compared to the generation before them, less demigod power is passed on, and they feel an innate need to worship and serve their sires (or whatever the word is), and their morality is based on the opposite of christianity because of what the christians did to them.

The powers of your average vamp today would include: seductiveness, about 4 times as powerful as the average human (so a polar bear could still kick their ass) about twice as fast as your average athlete, improved senses, and a pack mentality, similar to that of chimps or wolves.

The purebloods are obviously way more powerful and have their own particular abilities that get spread down "lite" to their descendants.

As for atheists and crosses, well, let's just say they'll have to rely on their other weapons more, coming to think of that, i need some more inspiration for anti vamp weaponry for the slayers to have.

And NO freaking angst. That really pisses me off.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-07-01 02:59pm

neoolong wrote:I thought it was interesting and actually brought up plausible, well as plausible as you can get, reasons for the vulnerabilities.

But the movie still wasn't that good.

Yeah, the movie sucked, but it did have Dracula make his three vampire chicks and they were all hotties~ Jeri Ryan, Vitamin C, and Jennifer Esposito ... MMMMMMmmmmm.....

I personally like Buffyverse vamps, although their origin is unknown I believe.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-07-01 03:16pm

Death from the Sea wrote:
neoolong wrote:I thought it was interesting and actually brought up plausible, well as plausible as you can get, reasons for the vulnerabilities.

But the movie still wasn't that good.
Yeah, the movie sucked, but it did have Dracula make his three vampire chicks and they were all hotties~ Jeri Ryan, Vitamin C, and Jennifer Esposito ... MMMMMMmmmmm.....

I personally like Buffyverse vamps, although their origin is unknown I believe.

Giles said they came from when the demons were banished from the earth by the light. They left vampirism as a blight on humanity, who inherited the earth.

Captain Cyran · Post by **Captain Cyran** » 2003-07-01 03:20pm

That seems like a pretty good idea for vampires, we get the amazingly powerful vampires to kick most people's asses and we get the vampires who aren't that good.

Shortie · Post by **Shortie** » 2003-07-01 03:34pm

Rye wrote: Anyway, this fits in because during the roman times, there was a small tribe the romans could never conquer ...

Am I the only person who thought he was talking about a small village in Northern Gaul?

As for atheists and crosses, well, let's just say they'll have to rely on their other weapons more, coming to think of that, i need some more inspiration for anti vamp weaponry for the slayers to have.

Of course, an atheist who sees a vamp isn't likely to remain one, although that wouldn't necessarily give them faith in any particular theology.

As to weapons, anything will do to slow them down, with crossbows, spears, axes and such to finish them off.

For more sophisticated stuff you could try carbon or silver bullets, high power UV lamps, garlic-impregnated gas grenades, guns designed to fire huge shurikens or discs, Riff's stake minigun, night-vision cameras (if they don't show up but you can see them or if they do but they're too cold you know they're vamps), white phosphorous grenades, flamethrowers, and conventional weapons upgraded with magic (An M16 with +2 against vampires).

Oh, and tanks. And UAVs. And attack helicopters. And a full battalion of combat trained and fuly prepared infantry working together to wipe out a single vampire nest. And do it in daylight.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-07-01 04:10pm

Shortie wrote:
Rye wrote: Anyway, this fits in because during the roman times, there was a small tribe the romans could never conquer ...
Am I the only person who thought he was talking about a small village in Northern Gaul?

lol, i never thought of it as an asterix reference, but that's a great idea!

Of course, an atheist who sees a vamp isn't likely to remain one, although that wouldn't necessarily give them faith in any particular theology.

Yes that's true, but all that will just be fear, which the vamps will love, unless they have enough faith to hate the abomination in front of them in the name of the lord and can channel that into a weapon, they'll prolly still get eaten.

As to weapons, anything will do to slow them down, with crossbows, spears, axes and such to finish them off.

I was thinking of having an anglican priest with and m16 assault rifle with crosses carved on the bullets, and a fire engine full of holy water, molotov cocktails will loads of garlic oil in...cars with stakes on the front, samurai swords and other bladed weapons...something like the ripper from unreal tournament's a good idea.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-07-02 12:19am

IMHO, "Buffy" was the worst thing to ever happen to the vampire mythos.

Someone who can do a few kicks can kill a vampire? Someone who scratches a vampire with a pointed stick makes them explode into dust? FUCK that.

The vampire Jerry Dandrige in "Fright Night" was good. Barnabas Collins from "Dark Shadows" was good. Christopher Lee's Drac was great!

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-07-02 12:54am

In my opinion Rice was the knee blow to the crotch of vampire mythos, while Buffy and her ilk were the final flying crane kick to the head...

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-07-02 04:03am

neoolong wrote:
Baron Mordo wrote:I'd say that Vampires should be affected by all religious icons held by someone of strong faith. Unfortunately, that leaves Taoists and atheists high and dry.
Actually, in Chinese movies with vampires Taoist priests do have ways of defeating vampires.

They use magic spells and spells written on paper.

And vampires should hop like in Chinese movies.

As for atheists, we don't need faith. We just need weapons.

Orr faith in your weapons

"This is my Boom-stick"

SylasGaunt · Post by **SylasGaunt** » 2003-07-02 06:43am

The vampires in Brian Lumleys' Necroscope books were a damn nasty bunch (and contagious as all get out).

As for vampire hunting weapons.. last vampire hunter I played in an RPG was a somewhat unbalanced, cybernatically enhanced, paladin working for the catholic church who's idea of subtlety was killing the guard's silently before you kick the door in on a vamp rave and open up with a silver loaded minigun..

Majin Gojira · Post by **Majin Gojira** » 2003-07-03 01:34am

Lord Poe wrote:IMHO, "Buffy" was the worst thing to ever happen to the vampire mythos.

Someone who can do a few kicks can kill a vampire? Someone who scratches a vampire with a pointed stick makes them explode into dust? FUCK that.

I blame Rice, she did the most damage. Honestly, Vamps just getting more and more powerful in fiction to the point of insanity.

The Average vamp should NOT HAVE ALL OF THE POWERS OF DRACULA! It robs him of his uniqueness. If ALL vamps can do what he does, why is he considered special?

Buffy knocked them down to their more Ancient Roots. If Anything, Buffy broguth vamps back down to earth.

And your simplifications are simply attrotious to the point where even I don't want to point out how incorrect they are.

But I agree with the Christopher Lee thing though. Good Dracula.

Grand Admiral Ancaris · Post by **Grand Admiral Ancaris** » 2003-07-03 06:54am

hmmm... I was always partial to the idea that there were different "bloodlines" of vampires. Over the course of their existance they branched into what are essentally different subspecies. Some stronger and better fighters, some great sorcerers, some faster, etc.

I'm also partial to the idea that newer vampires are rather weak and pathetic, but the longer a vampire lives, the more powerful it becomes. Those living for hundreds of years or millenia becoming very powerful indeed.

Weapons.... Religious Icons do jack$#!^. Anything silver/garlic should be effective against younger vampires. Older and ancient vampires you're going to need some heavy firepower. A minigun with silver rounds would work well.... if you can afford it (and if you can hit them)

Grand Admiral Ancaris · Post by **Grand Admiral Ancaris** » 2003-07-03 07:40am

Mark S wrote:The only person who would be able to become a damned, undead monster, feeding off the blood of the living, and not come out of it with at least a few issues, is a psychotic.

I guess that would be me then.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-07-03 02:52pm

Grand Admiral Ancaris wrote:
I'm also partial to the idea that newer vampires are rather weak and pathetic, but the longer a vampire lives, the more powerful it becomes. Those living for hundreds of years or millenia becoming very powerful indeed.

There was a show that had one series, called "Brimstone" in which loads of people in hell broke out and Satan let a dead ny cop out of hell to hunt them all down. The thing was, the longer they stayed in hell, the more powerful they became, which is a good idea.

Of course the purebloods are the most powerful, being one with their gods for several centuries, who themselves have been in hell for millennia.

Some of the younger vamps i reckon will have gone rebellious as soon as they get enough power, and you get a "shol'va(sp)" situation with those loyal to the sires and those with ideas of making their own army and killing the competition.

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2003-07-03 05:34pm

Rye wrote: There was a show that had one series, called "Brimstone" in which loads of people in hell broke out and Satan let a dead ny cop out of hell to hunt them all down. The thing was, the longer they stayed in hell, the more powerful they became, which is a good idea.

Excellent show. It really brought up a lot of questions about Christian morality since the cop was in Hell because he murdered his wife's rapist.

The leader of the escapees had been a priestess of Ashera who had sacrificed her daughter to her goddess as she was required to. Certainly I am against sacrificing anyone but it brought up an interesting ethical point because she was being punished for all eternity for comitting a crime according to religion she did not believe in and may not have even known about.

Other plusses for the show. John Glover as the Devil. All angels and ex-angels tended to look alike to humans who see them. I especially liked the "car from hell".

Anyway, back on the subject of vampires. While I like Anne Rice's books all of her vampires except for Louis are entirely too powerful to be threatened by most of the normal world.

I like vampires in the Dracula vein the best. With mystical powers (shape shifting, weather control, hypnosis etc...) the traditional stuff. I really like Chirstopher Lee as Dracula although I often wished he had more of novel character's abilities.

Vampires in Marvel Comics are usually pretty cool. For the most part they all have the same powers or the potential for the same powers but Dracula and Varney are much more powerful than the typical vampire.

Fred Saberhagen's version of Dracula is pretty cool. He's liked a cleaned up suave version of Stoker's Dracula.

The vampires in Laurel K. Hamilton's Anita Blake series are pretty cool but an awful lot of them are extremely powerful. Even some of the weak ones are more than a match for most people.

What about the vampire's in Chelsea Quin Yarbarro's books? Other than being immortal, enhanced strength and healing they are pretty weak. I don't think religious artifacts bother them but they do need soil from their homeland or they become much more vulnerable. With the soil they can cross running water (with difficulty), be at full strength under the sun and truly rest. Without the soil they continue to weaken even though they are feeding. Their style of feeding is much more of a psychic thing although they do take blood.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-07-03 09:04pm

Brimestone was cool.

What was also cool was that Stone ended up having to "kill" his wife's rapist again, because he was one of the 113 escaped souls. Twistedly appropriate.

FireNexus · Post by **FireNexus** » 2003-07-08 02:46pm

I always thought of the whole "faith" thing as being a form of innate psychic warfare. I believe something is a powerful anti-vampire weapon, so my mind makes it so. Of course, in my (terribly written and pretty cliched) mythos, humans and vampires are incapable of concious psychic warfare.

To get around this, they're shown a lightshow, and told they're being given powerful magickal weapons. Then the weapons work.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-07-08 05:56pm

Majin Gojira wrote:
Lord Poe wrote:IMHO, "Buffy" was the worst thing to ever happen to the vampire mythos.

Someone who can do a few kicks can kill a vampire? Someone who scratches a vampire with a pointed stick makes them explode into dust? FUCK that.
I blame Rice, she did the most damage. Honestly, Vamps just getting more and more powerful in fiction to the point of insanity.

The Average vamp should NOT HAVE ALL OF THE POWERS OF DRACULA! It robs him of his uniqueness. If ALL vamps can do what he does, why is he considered special?

Buffy knocked them down to their more Ancient Roots. If Anything, Buffy broguth vamps back down to earth.

And your simplifications are simply attrotious to the point where even I don't want to point out how incorrect they are.

But I agree with the Christopher Lee thing though. Good Dracula.

agreed

Post by **weemadando** » 2003-07-08 10:12pm

Rice did the most damage - "Hey look at me, I'm immortal with amazing powers and I'm also an angsty fucktard pretty boy - oh, oh, woe is me!"

Buffy made Vampires fun again - "if every vampire who claimed to be at the cruxifiction had been there, it would have been like Woodstock. Now I was at Woodstock - I ate a flowerperson; and spent the next two days looking at my hand."

Lord of the Farce · Post by **Lord of the Farce** » 2003-07-08 10:38pm

Andrew J. wrote:As for vulnerability to silver, that probably came about only after vampires became associated with werewolves in the early days of Hollywood horror movies, so it'd be fine to toss it, IMO.

If I recall correctly, vampires were originally associated (if not synonymous) with werewolves for centuries, but were then associated to bats after discovery of vampire bats... Or something like that, according to some book I read years ago.

Post by **weemadando** » 2003-07-08 10:46pm

Andrew J. wrote:As for vulnerability to silver, that probably came about only after vampires became associated with werewolves in the early days of Hollywood horror movies, so it'd be fine to toss it, IMO.

Actually that goes back to the concept of "pure" metals from the middle ages, where certain substances were viewed as being "higher" than others. Gold, silver, platinum and other such precious metals were viewed as "pure". This "pure" metal had a mythological implication as it was believed that weapons forged from "pure" substances would be able to defeat such evil much more quickly.

Majin Gojira · Post by **Majin Gojira** » 2003-07-08 11:37pm

Lord of the Farce wrote: If I recall correctly, vampires were originally associated (if not synonymous) with werewolves for centuries,

It was reputed that certain vampires such as Azeman which were basiclly big vampire wolves

Wherewolves were reported to drink blood and, if I recall corectly, in certain parts of europe, a dead Werewolf would rise again as a Vampire.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-07-08 11:40pm

Well, I've a fantasy world of my own creation in it though vampires and werewolves are both on the side of "good" they are a sort of magical experiment gone wrong during a war between two races, the Surani and the Estori.
The Estori use demons and the like as the bulk of thier army, the Surani however had never been a particularly warlike people but they were at least the equal of the Estori in terms of magical power. Using this magic they created first vampires (which were something of a fuckup) and later werewolves to try and fight the demon hordes of the Estori.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2003-07-08 11:59pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:But powerful or weak, I would always keep them as monsters, not lovers...

Thing about this is, they started off as lovers. In Bram Stoker's Dracula, when they bite people it's just an excuse to sneak around the unspoken law at the time that you can't write about sexual intercourse in a published book. If he were trying to write the same book today, it would almost be a porno novel.