Here's a goofy one for ya.

Yogi · Post by **Yogi** » 2003-05-21 04:12pm

Goku has had Telekinetic force used on him before (his fight with Freiza) and maneged to break out.

In addition, you need to apply force to rip his blood from his body, stop his heart, crush his throat etc. Goku and Gohan are many order of times more powerful than Muten Roshi, and Roshi once destroyed the moon. Freiza destroys planets and they pimp-slap him around. Buu destroyed 12 galaxies (probably not all at once) and Chou Gohan/SSJ3 Goku can put up good fights.

As for Precog helping, say you have precog and you knew a Nuke was going to land right where you are standing in around 5 min. How are you going to dodge that? You can't. Similarly the Jedi knows that several hundred punches, followed by a blast that will turn the ground into a molten sea will follow around 2 picoseconds after the starting bell rings. Doesn't mean they can do anything about it though.

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 06:37pm

Aya wrote:Goku and Gohan die very painful deaths. Palpy and Vader have precog and could easily force choke, rip all the blood from G&G's bodies, crush their brains, etc. Very messy.

Yeah right. Goku and Gohan travel at super speed and rip them to pieces. You are kidding me right? Super sayains can level the entire continent with a slight blast, and those light sabers aren't going to be able to do squat at deflecting the Kamahmea wave.

Super sayains kills the Sith faster than you can say "The force is w'ackkkkk."

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 06:44pm

Drach wrote:Nah, I think it'd be a good fight. From all the massive beatings Goku has taken and survived, I'm not quite sure Vader or Palp would have the power to outright kill them

Kill him? They don't have the power to tickle him. He has survived blasts from guys like Vegeta, Frieza, Cell, guys that can destroy planets. I don't care what the Sith can do, the Super Sayain can power up and blow them out of the areana or whatever and into low orbit with just their power.

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 06:45pm

SirNitram wrote:
Drach wrote:We've seen Goku thrown through mountains, take ki blasts full on, the some of which miss and look like multi-megaton explosions...he's a tough little bugger. Prove to me that Vader or the Emperor would have the Force might it takes to do something that a trip through soild rock can't
Crush the trachae, prevent them from breathing. Are you one of the traditional morons that think raw power is all that's needed?

Are you one of the morons that doesn't really watch DBZ, you just vote for your favorite characters anyway? Goku can harness enough energy, even while chocking, to slam an energy blast into Vader's body and leave nothing but ashes long before he is at any risk of death

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 06:49pm

Durran Korr wrote:Vader and Palpatine, realizing that nothing more than basic martial arts are necessary to bring down the fools, go further and rip their bodies apart with the power of the Dark Side. Cue the Imperial March as ISDs tear across the entire DBZ universe, claiming it for Coruscant.

When all of the sudden, reallity interludes. Realizing that they don't have a chance of hitting either Gohan or Goku with those lightsabers, they try the force lightening. Gohan comments on how much that tickles, while Goku doesn't even notice.

The Sith go for the force grip, and that's when the two super sayain fire a mountain smashing energy blast and wipe the sith out.

Strider119 · Post by **Strider119** » 2003-05-21 06:52pm

I have to assume the reasons people give for the DBZ crew losing are jokes

I hate DBZ, but I have to recognize that their powerlevels and abilities cant really be applied to any other form of entertainment, not even other anime

the crap that they do is so far above vaders and palpatines head that they have to look down to look up

"bla bla bla precognition"

precogntion is cute. it will serve you real well when you face an opponent that can move faster than LIGHT!!

"bla bla bla force choke"

How strong is a force choke? 'Casue the durability level of DBZ folks are not even measurable by terrestial standards. I mean they are at a level where the only thing that hurts them are other friggin DBZers by teh Buu saga

its all stupid, I know. Believe me its not even worth discussing DBZ guys in context with other forms of entertainment. Its just not copasetic, and it alwyas gets ugly

late DBZ levels and GT level guys are beyond planet destroying power and are up near solar system destroying power

Buu blew up earth like it was nothing. 1 blast that was so fast Gokuy didnt even have time to gather all the people near him up to teleport them off the earth.

So while the Death Star is commencing primary ignition and taking its sweet ass time to blow up a planet, any Saiyan-Jin can do it with the flick of thier wrist.

Goku byhimself can run through Vader, Palpetine, the death star, the imperial armada, AND the Rebel fleet .... all by himself. You add Gohan and you get the same result but now it only takes 5 minutes instead of 10

not for individual sale:
Strider119

Jove · Post by **Jove** » 2003-05-21 07:08pm

Wait...

What the HELL are some of you smoking?

Eagle299 · Post by **Eagle299** » 2003-05-21 07:38pm

This fight last exactly as long as it takes for the Sons to stop laughing at the mere concept for Force Users challenging them. So it could actually go on for quite come time.

Nothing Vader and Palpatine can throw at Goku and Gohan will even get their attention, up to and including the Death Star. Force TK will not work. Goku has fought Telekinetics that could levitate mountains and chuck them at him. Force Lightning will do nothing. Goku's been deflecting more powerful energy attacks than that since he beat Taopaipai.

And Precognition is an absolute joke. Force Precog is less reliable than Spidersense for one. Two, even if they can see the future and know every move that the Sons will make, all it will tell them is just how screwed they are before they die.

Genfreak · Post by **Genfreak** » 2003-05-21 07:54pm

[b]Explain to me how Goku could survive having his brain crushed or all the blood ripped from his body? Oh wait, that's right, he can't. [/b]

No he can't. It is a good thing he is fighting characters who can't do that. :)

This whole debate goes down as one of the most humrous things I have ever seen, the stuff of a George Lucas wet dream.

I mean the very fact you guys are giving the Emp enough credit with his "precognition" to see multiple lightspeed attacks coming at him in time is hilarious consdering that old fart didn;t even see Vader, who was standing five foot from him, power bombs his wrinkled butt straight into the death star reactor.

Vader and the Emp can't even react at mach speeds, let alone light speeds, and since using the force takes some degree of thought, they have already lost this battle, not being capable of thinking even close to those speeds.

Destroying a 17 kilometer star ship is impressive. For a Star Wars character. However, Goku as a child could have easily done that, no sweat.

Freeza alone hit Trunks with a blast large enough to destroy all of planet Earth, and Trunks caught it in one hand, detonated it, and it didn;t even move his hair. Freeza, who was also tough enough to withstand that blast, was later destroyed by Trunks. The same Trunks who turned the full force of that planet busting power on Goku only to have it blocked with a finger.

Oh man. I am glad I saw this thread though. I needed a laugh, and the image of Goku clearing his throat only to have the shockwaves instaneously destroy the Emperor definately gave me one. :)

Zod · Post by **Zod** » 2003-05-21 07:59pm

All attacks, including telekinesis and reality manipulation (Chaozu and Shenron's powers respectively), work only on those with lower, equal, or very slightly higher power levels in Dragonball. A much, much higher power level makes you invulnerable to these attacks, I.E. Chaosu and Shenron's power failing to harm Nappa or Bejita.

I think it'd be rather hilarious to watch the lightsaber deflect harmlessly off of an aura that reflects galaxy destroying blasts.

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 08:19pm

Zod wrote:All attacks, including telekinesis and reality manipulation (Chaozu and Shenron's powers respectively), work only on those with lower, equal, or very slightly higher power levels in Dragonball. A much, much higher power level makes you invulnerable to these attacks, I.E. Chaosu and Shenron's power failing to harm Nappa or Bejita.

I think it'd be rather hilarious to watch the lightsaber deflect harmlessly off of an aura that reflects galaxy destroying blasts.

Hell, the sith won't be able to give Goku a haircut, much less actually land a hit in any way.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-21 08:30pm

Strider119 wrote: precogntion is cute. it will serve you real well when you face an opponent that can move faster than LIGHT!!

Nothing can move faster than light.

How strong is a force choke?

As strong as one's strength in the Force. Vader and Palpatine are very strong in the Force.

So while the Death Star is commencing primary ignition and taking its sweet ass time to blow up a planet, any Saiyan-Jin can do it with the flick of thier wrist.

Last time I checked, it takes a DBZ character about 20 episodes to amass that sort of power. Meanwhile, the other people stand aroung gawking like idiots. Vader and Palpatine aren't idiots, they would actually act.

Goku byhimself can run through Vader, Palpetine, the death star, the imperial armada, AND the Rebel fleet .... all by himself.

Where's your fucking proof, wanker?

T-1000 wrote:those light sabers aren't going to be able to do squat at deflecting the Kamahmea wave.

Vader can absorb energy, and can discharge it right back. I'm not saying he is impervious to energy attacks, but you should take that into consideration.

Drach · Post by **Drach** » 2003-05-21 08:33pm

The energy absorbing force power is a funny thing, you can only take in so much before it kills you. A kamaehamaha wave would kill Vader outright, seeing as Cell and everyone watching was terrfied for the safety of the entire planet when it looked like Goko was going to fire it towards the ground

Nobody · Post by **Nobody** » 2003-05-21 08:49pm

DPDarkPrimus wrote:
Strider119 wrote: precogntion is cute. it will serve you real well when you face an opponent that can move faster than LIGHT!!
Nothing can move faster than light.

So X- Wings, The Falcon, heck Even The Death Star are all SLOWER than light?? Wow... That gives a WHOLE new spin to the "Cramped Universe" theory... It must have Been A REAALY tight fit...

Well, that certainly playes merry Hell with Han's infamous"pint 5 past Light-speed" quote... Guess it really MUSt have been a Star Wars Brand of Coffee...

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-21 08:50pm

And so I must ask, how long did it take for Son-Goku to ready this Kamehameha wave attack?

Genfreak · Post by **Genfreak** » 2003-05-21 08:51pm

[b]Nothing can move faster than light. [/b]

Um, you don't watch DBZ do you?

[b]As strong as one's strength in the Force. Vader and Palpatine are very strong in the Force. [/b]

Can they crush a planet with their TK? If not, it is not going to effect the saiyans, who can easily take planet crushing blows and survive it. There TK would not even be enough to press in the saiyan's flesh, let alone constrict it.

[b]Last time I checked, it takes a DBZ character about 20 episodes to amass that sort of power. Meanwhile, the other people stand aroung gawking like idiots. Vader and Palpatine aren't idiots, they would actually act. [/b]

The episodes are time expanded, if you actually bother to pay attention. Also, nothing they can do will hurt the DBZ guys.

[b]Where's your fucking proof, wanker? [/b]

Buu could wipe out a galaxy with his blasts, obliterating them so only pot marks in reality were left behind. Goku is stronger than Buu. Is the imperial fleet more durable than a galaxy?

[b]Vader can absorb energy, and can discharge it right back. I'm not saying he is impervious to energy attacks, but you should take that into consideration.[/b]

Vader cannot abosrb anywhere near the power Goku can dish out. He can also not think fast enough to realize what Goku is doing or even see him.

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 08:52pm

DPDarkPrimus wrote:
T-1000 wrote:those light sabers aren't going to be able to do squat at deflecting the Kamahmea wave.
Vader can absorb energy, and can discharge it right back. I'm not saying he is impervious to energy attacks, but you should take that into consideration.

Yes, well since I don't consider this ability to be without limit, and we know that the Goku can casually reduce an entire moutain to rubble, I am going to say that Goku can throw way more energy than Vader can possibly handle.

And for the record, Goku actually can travel at the speed of light. It's called the Instant Transmission technique.

Genfreak · Post by **Genfreak** » 2003-05-21 08:52pm

[b]And so I must ask, how long did it take for Son-Goku to ready this Kamehameha wave attack?[/b]

He could take all the time he want considering there is nothing his opponents can do to harm him.

Genfreak · Post by **Genfreak** » 2003-05-21 08:54pm

Casually destroy a mountain?

Goku as a child, power level around 300 could casually destroy a mountain. Goku during the Buu Saga could casually wipe out the solar system.

nightmare · Post by **nightmare** » 2003-05-21 08:55pm

I think you are all focusing on the wrong aspect here. I would say that Palpatine and Vader get themselves a couple of obedient slaves. Is there really someone here that's going to tell me that Goku is strong-minded? It takes practically nothing to distract him as far as I can tell. Heck, a couple fruits would do the trick..

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-21 08:56pm

Genfreak wrote: He could take all the time he want considering there is nothing his opponents can do to harm him.

Nice dodge, turd. How about a straight answer?

BlackWarMewtwo · Post by **BlackWarMewtwo** » 2003-05-21 08:56pm

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:
Drach wrote:Yes, I know what precognition is. And no, the force has never demonstrated the capability to give near this level of speed. Not only the sheer speed of Goku, but there is his ability Instant Transmission. It does what it sounds like, he thinks about being somewhere, and he is there instantly.
You don't get it. Jedi can percieve any action instants before it transpires.

Thus, Goku prepares his "Instant Transmission" - but of course the Jedi already knows this before Goku has even begun. Goku appears where he wants to, and is promptly choked to death, or has his brain vessels squished or any other number of mean, mean things.

But if this is all done instantaneously, how do the force users react? They're not as fast as the Saiyins. They'll know what's going to happen, but that doesn't mean they can stop it.

Genfreak · Post by **Genfreak** » 2003-05-21 09:00pm

[b]Nice dodge, turd. How about a straight answer?[/b]

LOL

Oh Shit!
Did I just get called a turd?

Man, that is proof positive those Star Wars movies should be legally required to carry a "[b]Surgeon General's Warning:/b][i] This movie has been found to cause mental retardation.[/i]" label.

The time it takes Goku to form a Kamehameha is proportionate to the size of the blast and his power level. Normal Goku from the Buu saga could wipe out Earth with a generic ki blast. he would not even need the power of the Kamehameha attack to do it.

Nobody · Post by **Nobody** » 2003-05-21 09:01pm

nightmare wrote:I think you are all focusing on the wrong aspect here. I would say that Palpatine and Vader get themselves a couple of obedient slaves. Is there really someone here that's going to tell me that Goku is strong-minded? It takes practically nothing to distract him as far as I can tell. Heck, a couple fruits would do the trick..

Welll IIRC, in a straight Mind-screw Palpatine wouldd run into some serious trouble. On the other hand offering a huge plate of food probably would do the trick...

T-1000 · Post by **T-1000** » 2003-05-21 09:01pm

nightmare wrote:I think you are all focusing on the wrong aspect here. I would say that Palpatine and Vader get themselves a couple of obedient slaves. Is there really someone here that's going to tell me that Goku is strong-minded? It takes practically nothing to distract him as far as I can tell. Heck, a couple fruits would do the trick..

We have seen the super sayains resist mental attacks before. Vegeta once resisted an attempt from Babiddi. He shouted, he huffed, and he puffed, and he cast aside Babiddi's influence with ease.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Here's a goofy one for ya.

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