Scarlet-Spider vs Jedi

[Crazedwraith]

This thread is still here?

Yep im supprised too. this the 1st of my topics to go beyond a page!

PS. Your lame-ass argument about how neither Vader or Luke can be considered proof of Jedi force-choke capability is pathetic. They show that it CAN be done, so your only argument is that they WON'T do it, and there is not a shred of canon evidence to support that claim. Moreover, your ridiculous claim that Luke was using the dark side in the beginning of ROTJ is utterly without basis; there was not a shred of evidence for any Dark side leanings until Vader pushed him over the edge on DS2.

What so force-choking isn't of the dark side in itself? I seem to remember saying agreesion was the way of the dark side? I think aggresion seems to character rise everythikn Luke did a the beginnig of RotJ. Force choking guards, shooting at Jabba Rancor slaying. Murdering a whole bunch of guards. Blowing up the sail barge when he could have just run away?
Yep all seems to be done in defensive of Han doesn't it??

[Strider119]

40 times faster. Typical human reaction time is about a half-second, which implies that Spidey can react in about .01 seconds. No microsecond reaction time here, pal. And since a Jedi can react BEFORE the event occurs, Spidey still loses.

Becuase the jedi react before actions occur all the time ... like when they were all shot to shit by the droid army.

and as far as the cals go, I already posted a quick calc figuring that Spidey punches 100 times per second

Your lame-ass argument about how neither Vader or Luke can be considered proof of Jedi force-choke capability is pathetic. They show that it CAN be done, so your only argument is that they WON'T do it, and there is not a shred of canon evidence to support that claim. Moreover, your ridiculous claim that Luke was using the dark side in the beginning of ROTJ is utterly without basis; there was not a shred of evidence for any Dark side leanings until Vader pushed him over the edge on DS2.

no one said they aren't capable of it. We have said from the start that a force choke is out of character and a light side jedi will never use it. There have been numerous movie qouted scenes supporting our claim. the scenes show that ...

A) luke was not a jedi when he force choked

and

B) Force choking is not something a Jedi would do



and while direct quotes from the movie are given, you just kinda meander past them and post nonsense without ever disproving anything.

I mean the proof is straight from the horses mouth, wong. Jedi do not force choke. It would be better for you to just concentrate on other parts of the debate, because it is FIRMLY established that a light side jedi would not choke an opponent.




gotta catch em all:
Strider119

[SAMAS]

Just wondering, do you think I'm lying about his speed?

http://members.aol.com/bendersgraphics/MOL/reflex.jpg
http://members.lycos.co.uk/shurukudemon ... ingman.jpg

http://members.lycos.co.uk/shurukudemon ... urfer1.jpg
http://members.lycos.co.uk/shurukudemon ... relord.jpg

http://members.lycos.co.uk/shurukudemon ... vsthor.jpg

http://members.lycos.co.uk/shurukudemon ... dvsff1.jpg

Is it me, or is Spidey able to say several comlete sentences in some of the panels that supposedly show his very fast reflexes?
Now, does that mean he can talk really fast too?

Nah, that's Comic Dialogue. In Comics, you can apparently think of a disseration on the punch you're about to kick the bad guy with while throwing it.

[Batman]

Is it me, or is Spidey able to say several comlete sentences in some of the panels that supposedly show his very fast reflexes?
Now, does that mean he can talk really fast too?

Nah, that's Comic Dialogue. In Comics, you can apparently think of a disseration on the punch you're about to kick the bad guy with while throwing it.[/quote]

I'm sorry, but isn't that something of a double standard?
Either that panel is admittable as evidence because it's an accurate depiction of what happened, in which case either Spidey can talk extremely fast or that scene lasts long enough for him to say those things, or, this being a comic, there is artistic license involved, in which case it is no longer useful as evidence because it's no longer an accurate depiction of what happened.

[Strider119]

just posting some spidey stuff showing how powerfull he is






take it or leave it:
Strider119

[Strider119]

I'm sorry, but isn't that something of a double standard?
Either that panel is admittable as evidence because it's an accurate depiction of what happened, in which case either Spidey can talk extremely fast or that scene lasts long enough for him to say those things, or, this being a comic, there is artistic license involved, in which case it is no longer useful as evidence because it's no longer an accurate depiction of what happened.

Fine, Spidey talks fast ..... happy now?





contract killer:
Strider119

[KK]

KK, thanks for posting yet another picture which DISPROVES your argument. Read the text: "Since my reflexes are as much as 40 times faster than a normal human's ..."

How does that disprove my argument? I said he had reaction speed that was 40 times faster than a human's right from the start. Had I claimed his reaction speed was 100 times faster than a human's, then that picture would've disproven me.

But I didn't, so it doesn't.

40 times faster. Typical human reaction time is about a half-second, which implies that Spidey can react in about .01 seconds. No microsecond reaction time here, pal.

Ghost Rider brought the word microsecond into it. Not I, pal.

And since a Jedi can react BEFORE the event occurs, Spidey still loses.

That seems like a much more impressive aregument than it actually is.

If Spidey is way faster than a Jedi, a precog "heads up" isn't going to do a whole damn lot of good.

Let's say the time between an event and their reaction is measured in units. If Spidey is 1 unit, and the Jedi is 5 units, and the Jedi gets a 1 unit headstart, that's still only 4 units compared to Spidey's 1 unit.

You have to prove that the Jedi's precog actually makes up for the speed difference. Simply saying "they have precog, hence they win" is nonsensical.

Spidey also has precog, anyway. So I fail to see how it makes a damn bit of difference.

PS. Your lame-ass argument about how neither Vader or Luke can be considered proof of Jedi force-choke capability is pathetic.

Which part? The part where I use canon qutes to back me up? Or the part where every single bit of logic and evidence points to me being right?

They show that it CAN be done, so your only argument is that they WON'T do it, and there is not a shred of canon evidence to support that claim.

Except, of course, all the evidence that has already been posted.

Moreover, your ridiculous claim that Luke was using the dark side in the beginning of ROTJ is utterly without basis;

Luke and Yoda talking about the light side and the dark side.

LUKE: "How will I know the difference?"
YODA: "The Jedi use the force NEVER FOR ATTACK."

Luke uses the force for attack. Hence he dabbled into the dark side.

Yoda flat out fucking stated that using the force for attack is the dark side.

If Locas wrote "Force choking is the dark side" on his dick in black marker and then cock-slapped you until "Force Choking is the dark side" was imprinted backwards on both sides of your face, that would only be slightly less subtle than he already made it in the movie.

there was not a shred of evidence for any Dark side leanings until Vader pushed him over the edge on DS2.

I like you you chose to ignore all the evidence that was already given, rather than actually refute it.

[KK]

I'm sorry, but isn't that something of a double standard?
Either that panel is admittable as evidence because it's an accurate depiction of what happened, in which case either Spidey can talk extremely fast or that scene lasts long enough for him to say those things, or, this being a comic, there is artistic license involved, in which case it is no longer useful as evidence because it's no longer an accurate depiction of what happened.

For one, only a few of those had dialogue. You'd still be stuck with the others.

For two, that's just how comics are. They have tons of dialogue fit into no time at all. I have one comic where a ninja gives an entire speech while in the middle of a "flying death kick." And given the dialogue, it all had to have taken place while in the air.

I've seen a comic where two people fell out of a window that was only two or three stories up, and they talked back and forth like 4 times before they hit the ground. That's just how comics are. Unless you want to tell me they fell slowly?


Take a look at the Thor picture I posted. In that one Spidye is drawn as a damn cyclone. He's an blur of motion.

[Darth Wong]

KK, thanks for posting yet another picture which DISPROVES your argument. Read the text: "Since my reflexes are as much as 40 times faster than a normal human's ..."

How does that disprove my argument? I said he had reaction speed that was 40 times faster than a human's right from the start. Had I claimed his reaction speed was 100 times faster than a human's, then that picture would've disproven me.

No, the important point is that you said he had reaction speed sufficient to beat a Jedi. That ain't enough.

And since a Jedi can react BEFORE the event occurs, Spidey still loses.

That seems like a much more impressive aregument than it actually is.

If Spidey is way faster than a Jedi, a precog "heads up" isn't going to do a whole damn lot of good.

He's faster than TK now?

You have to prove that the Jedi's precog actually makes up for the speed difference. Simply saying "they have precog, hence they win" is nonsensical.

But saying "Spidey has fast reflexes, therefore he wins" is NOT?

Spidey also has precog, anyway. So I fail to see how it makes a damn bit of difference.

Good, then we're back to telekinesis.

Which part? The part where I use canon qutes to back me up? Or the part where every single bit of logic and evidence points to me being right?

Declaring yourself the winner doesn't actually work, dumb-ass. Just ask Baghdad Bob.

Moreover, your ridiculous claim that Luke was using the dark side in the beginning of ROTJ is utterly without basis;

Luke and Yoda talking about the light side and the dark side.

LUKE: "How will I know the difference?"
YODA: "The Jedi use the force NEVER FOR ATTACK."

Luke uses the force for attack. Hence he dabbled into the dark side.

Except that Yoda was bullshitting. The Jedi used the Force offensively many times in the prequels. Are they all Dark Jedi now too?

Yoda flat out fucking stated that using the force for attack is the dark side.

And you are obviously too fucking blind and stupid to see that he was obviously not telling the truth, since we saw the Jedi use the Force offensively many times in the prequels. Yoda lied about quite a few things, remember?

If Locas wrote "Force choking is the dark side" on his dick in black marker and then cock-slapped you until "Force Choking is the dark side" was imprinted backwards on both sides of your face, that would only be slightly less subtle than he already made it in the movie.

If Lucas showed Jedi actually using the Force offensively, you would still be too stupid and arrogant to accept that over your simple-minded gospel-like interpretation of a Yoda quote. Oh wait a minute, THAT ALREADY HAPPENED.

there was not a shred of evidence for any Dark side leanings until Vader pushed him over the edge on DS2.

I like you you chose to ignore all the evidence that was already given, rather than actually refute it.

The evidence you gave was Yoda's propaganda, hence no evidence at all. It does not compare to actual observation, dumb-ass.

[KK]

No, the important point is that you said he had reaction speed sufficient to beat a Jedi. That ain't enough.

Fucking prove it.

I'm sure to end up having to read a giant calculation based on the speed of some blaster bolt. I sure as fuck know I'm not going to get any proof based on actual displayed combat speed.

He's faster than TK now?

Straw man.

You don't have to be faster than the bullet to be faster than the gunman.

I never said anything about Spidey being "faster than TK" so you can roll your eyes elsewhere.

But saying "Spidey has fast reflexes, therefore he wins" is NOT?

You left out an "-er" in there. Faster reflexes.

Good, then we're back to telekinesis.

Hooray?

Declaring yourself the winner doesn't actually work, dumb-ass. Just ask Baghdad Bob.

If you refuse to acknowledge points, let alone refute them, then I win.

Except that Yoda was bullshitting.

"Yoda was bullshitting."

Priceless.

The Jedi used the Force offensively many times in the prequels. Are they all Dark Jedi now too?

They used it against machines. And the most they ever did was push, at that. Force pushing a droid is as much of an attack as Anakin lifting that piece of fruit. It could fall under defense. You'll note that for all the force pushes they used against machines, not once did Jengo Fett ever have to deal with getting his throat collapsed or any other form of force attack.

And you are obviously too fucking blind and stupid to see that he was obviously not telling the truth, since we saw the Jedi use the Force offensively many times in the prequels.

Why the fuck would he lie? Why? Luke asked him a question, and he answered.

They force pushed in the prequels. Good, great, grand, wonderful. They pushed around some machines.

Yoda lied about quite a few things, remember?

So your argument is that Yoda is a compulsive liar?

He lied to Luke right off the bat to test his patience. What else?

If Lucas showed Jedi actually using the Force offensively, you would still be too stupid and arrogant to accept that over your simple-minded gospel-like interpretation of a Yoda quote. Oh wait a minute, THAT ALREADY HAPPENED.

No, IT DIDN'T.

They pushed around fucking machines. That doesn't translate into force-choking.

The evidence you gave was Yoda's propaganda, hence no evidence at all. It does not compare to actual observation, dumb-ass.

What about the 6 or 7 other points?

[Darth Wong]

I'm sure to end up having to read a giant calculation based on the speed of some blaster bolt. I sure as fuck know I'm not going to get any proof based on actual displayed combat speed.

Jedi accelerated at 60-100G in TPM. This was observed. Spidey never moved so fast onscreen, and interpretation of comic panels is something that you have demonstrated to be a selective act; you select that which you like and ignore that which annoys you.

He's faster than TK now?

Straw man.

You don't have to be faster than the bullet to be faster than the gunman.

I never said anything about Spidey being "faster than TK" so you can roll your eyes elsewhere.

Yes, your response to TK is that the Jedi will never use it, even though we've seen Jedi use TK offensively in both prequels. Rolling of ones' eyes is an understatement when dealing with your brand of deliberate ignorance.

If you refuse to acknowledge points, let alone refute them, then I win.

If you are too stupid to recognize a rebuttal when you see it, and then declare that no rebuttal exists as a result, you only THINK you win.

Except that Yoda was bullshitting.

"Yoda was bullshitting."

Priceless.

In other words, you have no answer. Since Yoda DID bullshit about not being himself when he first met Luke, and Yoda DID conceal the truth about Luke's father, you would have to be a complete idiot to think that Yoda is incapable of lying.

They used it against machines. And the most they ever did was push, at that.

You're a moron. Why do you think the superbattledroid that collapsed on C3PO in AOTC never got up? It was killed by a moderate fall which didn't even dent its case? Wrong, dumb-ass. It was obviously killed by telekinetic mangling of its internal components.

Force pushing a droid is as much of an attack as Anakin lifting that piece of fruit. It could fall under defense.

Look up "offense" in your dictionary, fucktard. It says nothing about applying only against humans.

You'll note that for all the force pushes they used against machines, not once did Jengo Fett ever have to deal with getting his throat collapsed or any other form of force attack.

Because Mace could easily kill him by decapitating him the old fashioned way. By the way, umpteen repetitions of the known weakness of the Jedi seem to have sailed over your head. Not to mention Anakin using TK to hurl objects at Geonosians.

So your argument is that Yoda is a compulsive liar?

He lied to Luke right off the bat to test his patience. What else?

Yoda's lying is an observation, dumb-ass. Your idiotic attempt to redefine the word "attack" won't change that.

What about the 6 or 7 other points?

Repetitions of the same basic point; you argue that Force-chokes are impossible for a Jedi to use, ignore clear exceptions to this "rule", and repeat your point several times, acting as though it's a new point each time.

[Strider119]

Except that Yoda was bullshitting. The Jedi used the Force offensively many times in the prequels. Are they all Dark Jedi now too?

Ummmm is it the scene where Obie Wan uses TK rip off Jango's head, or the scene where Anakin uses the force to stop the monsters hearts, or just the scene where Qui-Gon realizes that the destroyer droids have shield generators and uses the force to tear them to pieces instead of getting the fuck outta dodge?

the only thing that comes to mind is the jedis force pushing some droids. and in case you didnt realize, DROIDS ARE NOT LIVING.

AND the force pushes were defensive moves against the droids

please elaborate on Yoda and his lying, treacherous tongue

And you are obviously too fucking blind and stupid to see that he was obviously not telling the truth, since we saw the Jedi use the Force offensively many times in the prequels. Yoda lied about quite a few things, remember?

they used the force agaisnt robot, yes. Which is no different than using the force to shut off a camera or turn off a light switch. It wasn't a real person

plese elaborate on the lies

If Lucas showed Jedi actually using the Force offensively, you would still be too stupid and arrogant to accept that over your simple-minded gospel-like interpretation of a Yoda quote. Oh wait a minute, THAT ALREADY HAPPENED.

you want to give examples of yodas lying? he prety much seemed to be the head honcho and they make him out to be a reliable source in the movies.

The evidence you gave was Yoda's propaganda, hence no evidence at all. It does not compare to actual observation, dumb-ass.

You mean like observing the time that Jango blasted away a Jedi in and giving Obie Wan a hard time AoTC, without needing any powers of his own?








I'm looking over your responses Wong and I can only say "HAHAHAHAH"

I gotta tell you you put up a good fight till now

But when you try and refute stuff just by saying "uhhhh, he was lying" its pretty much time to pack yer bags


but hey, good effort. Better luck next time. Let's do this again real soon



w00t:
Strider119

[Darth Wong]

Ummmm is it the scene where Obie Wan uses TK rip off Jango's head, or the scene where Anakin uses the force to stop the monsters hearts, or just the scene where Qui-Gon realizes that the destroyer droids have shield generators and uses the force to tear them to pieces instead of getting the fuck outta dodge?

Notice how every one of his examples comes from AOTC rather than TPM. You can repeat that "diminished ability to use the Force" line a hundred times, and the morons will ignore it a hundred times.

the only thing that comes to mind is the jedis force pushing some droids. and in case you didnt realize, DROIDS ARE NOT LIVING.

In case you are a blithering idiot, the word "attack" does not apply exclusively to living targets.

<snip repetitions>

I love the way you idiots think that repeating the same point somehow constitutes new points.

[Strider119]

Jedi accelerated at 60-100G in TPM. This was observed. Spidey never moved so fast onscreen, and interpretation of comic panels is something that you have demonstrated to be a selective act; you select that which you like and ignore that which annoys you.

im just curious as to how you attained these figures. can i see teh numbers and stuff?





man of steel:
Strider119

[Darth Wong]

Jedi accelerated at 60-100G in TPM. This was observed. Spidey never moved so fast onscreen, and interpretation of comic panels is something that you have demonstrated to be a selective act; you select that which you like and ignore that which annoys you.

im just curious as to how you attained these figures. can i see teh numbers and stuff?

It was done on this board. Look for it.

[Connor MacLeod]

For those unable to properly use a search function:

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... sc&start=0

This is the thread. Now lets all watch as the calculations are dismissed by people whose intellect is not equal to understanding how the hell they were calculated

[Strider119]

Ummmm is it the scene where Obie Wan uses TK rip off Jango's head, or the scene where Anakin uses the force to stop the monsters hearts, or just the scene where Qui-Gon realizes that the destroyer droids have shield generators and uses the force to tear them to pieces instead of getting the fuck outta dodge?

Notice how every one of his examples comes from AOTC rather than TPM. You can repeat that "diminished ability to use the Force" line a hundred times, and the morons will ignore it a hundred times.

yeah. where i said qui-gon i was obviously reffering to his major role in ATOTC, right?

In case you are a blithering idiot, the word "attack" does not apply exclusively to living targets.

They openly refer to themselves as peace keepers and i'll have to search for the specific word for word lines, but i know they say that fighting is a last resort in one of the 5 movies. i think tpm.

And a defensive force push against a robot does not mean that they will choke an opponent to death

I love the way you idiots think that repeating the same point somehow constitutes new points.

I love the way that you ignore shit and somehow that constitues a valid argument



where the haert is:
Strider119

[Ghost Rider]

Man...this parroting has gone on for how many pages?

And yet Spidey team has gone from reflexes to Webbing to reflexes all the while nitpicking Dark/Light.

So in the end we have seen Spidey now moves not quite microsecond...but his spray webbing will encompass the Jedi completely(disregard Pre-cog, TK, and Lightsaber)...now not even that fast unless his speaking is also within Microsecond...and now back to Light/Dark abilites.

Bravo.

[Connor MacLeod]

Reminds me of the DBZ thread and their complete ignorance of momentum and recoil (which more than a few people here, including SAMAS and KK I believe, participated in and demonstrated the same indefatiguable logic.)

[Strider119]

For those unable to properly use a search function:

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... sc&start=0

This is the thread. Now lets all watch as the calculations are dismissed by people whose intellect is not equal to understanding how the hell they were calculated

There is no need for you or Wong to be dicks about it.

I was merely asking for the calc, and i did it politely.

If you expect me to accept your numbers as facts, you could at least give the comon courtesy of putting the calculations up in plain sight. I shouldnt have to dig for them or anything

thanks for the link




fireproof:
Strider119

[Connor MacLeod]

By the Way, it should be noted that precognition and actions taken as a result of it are not controlled/determined by the person, but under the control of the FORCE (at least partially - refer to Luke and Obi-Wan talking in ANH.) A Key factor in USING the Force is trusting and submitting TO it and letting it guide your actions (Remember Luke destroying the Death Star in ANH?)

[Connor MacLeod]

There is no need for you or Wong to be dicks about it.

Considering how you and KK are responding, there is perfect reason to. I might add that the more than ample insults being hurled at Wong, a close friend of mine, qualify more than enough reason for ME to get irritated with you. I suppose you'll go ahead and declare a big "conspiracy" against you.

I was merely asking for the calc, and i did it politely.

For once. Before that you were being an incredibly arrogant prick in casually dismissing his arguments.

If you expect me to accept your numbers as facts, you could at least give the comon courtesy of putting the calculations up in plain sight. I shouldnt have to dig for them or anything

If you don't want to be treated like an ass, don't act like one. (IF you need a reminder about where you were being an ass, refer to your prior responses to Mike on THIS PAGE ALONE.)

[Strider119]

And yet Spidey team has gone from reflexes to Webbing to reflexes all the while nitpicking Dark/Light.

my main argument has been, and remains, that a light side jedi would not force choke an opponent

and so far no one has proven to me that they will

we have Luke doing a force choke when Yoda tells him that choking is not a jedi thing to do. Then he also tells him that he is not a jedi

So basically at that point Luke is a guy who has some force abilities and some offensive training

he never went through that proper training of a REAL jedi, just a rag-tag training from yoda to get him on his way

How can anyone really consider Luke a proper representation of a light side jedi at that point, when he dosen't come close to going through what the true jedi padwans go through in the prequils?

So in the end we have seen Spidey now moves not quite microsecond

you said "micro", not us.

..but his spray webbing will encompass the Jedi completely(disregard Pre-cog, TK, and Lightsaber)

I wonder how well a light sabre would react agaisnt webbing since it has shown to be fireproof. I'm not sure about the specs of sabres though so this might be a moot point, but wouldn't the sabre be reduced to being basically a long stick?

...now not even that fast unless his speaking is also within Microsecond

Hey, if you guys are gonna get into such a hissy fit over the fact that Spider-Man can talk and move at the same time, how about the fact that its physically impossible for sound to travel in a vacume?

I guess that Star Wars can't take actually place in space, as observational evidence contradicts it





hero of the day:
Strider119

[Ghost Rider]

And yet Spidey team has gone from reflexes to Webbing to reflexes all the while nitpicking Dark/Light.

my main argument has been, and remains, that a light side jedi would not force choke an opponent

and so far no one has proven to me that they will

we have Luke doing a force choke when Yoda tells him that choking is not a jedi thing to do. Then he also tells him that he is not a jedi

So basically at that point Luke is a guy who has some force abilities and some offensive training

he never went through that proper training of a REAL jedi, just a rag-tag training from yoda to get him on his way

How can anyone really consider Luke a proper representation of a light side jedi at that point, when he dosen't come close to going through what the true jedi padwans go through in the prequils?

Looky Subjective BS when objective proof showed LUKE choking someone.

Was Luke a Sith(add you fave title)?

No?

Huh....

you said "micro", not us.

Hell...he's slower then I said...and worse I overestimated him and that is what I put on par for the Jedi.

Guess he's slower then even before.

I wonder how well a light sabre would react agaisnt webbing since it has shown to be fireproof. I'm not sure about the specs of sabres though so this might be a moot point, but wouldn't the sabre be reduced to being basically a long stick?

Durasteel fireproof as well.

So no extrapolation to infinity given that the Lightsaber has shown to cut through something far more durable then a foot of steel.

...now not even that fast unless his speaking is also within Microsecond

Hey, if you guys are gonna get into such a hissy fit over the fact that Spider-Man can talk and move at the same time, how about the fact that its physically impossible for sound to travel in a vacume?

I guess that Star Wars can't take actually place in space, as observational evidence contradicts it




hero of the day:
Strider119[/quote]



Hmmm and when they said that the noise outside of the cockpits is transmitted through the pilots ears to give the effect of where the object is coming from.

Guess that piece of offical evidence just flew by your head as well

[Strider119]

Considering how you and KK are responding, there is perfect reason to. I might add that the more than ample insults being hurled at Wong, a close friend of mine, qualify more than enough reason for ME to get irritated with you. I suppose you'll go ahead and declare a big "conspiracy" against you.

PLEASE go through as count every time I called Wong or anyone a name. count them all.

NOW go count all the times he has called me an idiot or something else negative and derogatory

and tell me who has been disrespectful to whom. Please don't try to take the moral high road on me. I have treated everyone I have disagreed with on here with more respect than I have been given. I even called for everyone to stop the name calling with my second post and Wong replied....

style over substance, fucktard

so there goes any argument of moral superiority

For once. Before that you were being an incredibly arrogant prick in casually dismissing his arguments.

again, I have shown more respect for posters here than anyone else. I let "dick" slip because your comment about being stupid was tottaly unwarranted and its hard to keep insults out of my posts when so many others are throwing them at me. plus I dont appreciate being patronized, all i wanted were the calculations for figures you expect me to accept as fact.

If you don't want to be treated like an ass, don't act like one. (IF you need a reminder about where you were being an ass, refer to your prior responses to Mike on THIS PAGE ALONE.)

OH PLEASE!!

I am begging you dood. go through and count all the times i called him a name. Do it. and then count all the times he called me a name. If you want to bring morality into this argument that is fine. But my responses have almost all been clear of insults and mean remarks sans the one sinlge post where i said "dont be dicks about it" to you and wong.





hard target:
Strider119