Legend of Korra Book 3 Talkback - "Changes" (Spoilers)

[Haruko]

Spoiler

Have to say I absolutely loved that moment when airbender-master Zaheer, who unlocked an airbending technique only unlocked once before, was brought down by a group of airbending students. That felt so good to watch.

[Steve]

....I admit I was worried that Book 3's ending wouldn't work. That unless it was a cliffhanger it would be rushed.

But it has.

Oh, it has.

That finale was.... awesome. It worked on so many levels... I'm actually sad this show ends next book because it seems they've finally found their footing and given us something special.

I admit the only bit I was frustrated at was when everyone got to the Airbenders... and instead of warning the rescuers so they could get their asses in gear, we had to have the "so glad you're safe" bits. I was like "Uh, hello? Jinora, you know what they're doing! Korra doesn't have time for you to play huggies with your boyfriend!"

Of course, she redeemed herself in the end and credit for the takedown of Zaheer really goes to her.

It'll be interesting to see what's in store for Book 4. Republic City still needs fixing from the spirit vines, the Earth Kingdom is disintegrating, and the Red Lotus may still be operational, even if they've lost three-quarters of their elite. And Korra is clearly traumatized beyond the physical damage she endured from the poisoning and the fight with Zaheer. She's been oxygen-deprived, subjected to metal poisoning, and put through the wringer... and she still has the trauma of losing her connection to her past lives.

I suspect Book 4 will be about Korra's rebound, although I'm curious who the villain will be this time... or, well, maybe not a villain? It would be interesting if there's no central antagonists, just episode-by-episode foes, with the story arc being Korra's recovery, perhaps even finding a way to reconnect with the avatars of the past.

[Steve]

Another note: this season's villains were perhaps even stronger than Amon/Tarrlok were in Book 1. There was a human element to the Red Lotus that gave them dimension and character, where Amon and Tarrlok were, while not flat, still... how should I put it? Amon was the scary shadowy threat with the mask and his development, in terms of finding out his character, was almost entirely by Tarrlok's flashback, and Tarrlok himself was straightforward in that he wanted power. He wanted to surpass his father's power in Republic City, and he saw the Equalists as a tool for that.

And Unalaq and Vaatu.... Vaatu was Evil Incarnate and Unalaq was a religious extremist who became his ally out of his hatred for the world as it was.

Zaheer, P'Li, Ming-hua, and Ghazan each had their own element that made them interesting. You actually feel sorry for Zaheer when P'Li gets head-sploded.

[xerex]

Given that Korra has delt with Amon, Unalaq, Vaatu and now Zaheer, I think she's earned her rest. She's done far more than Aaang did.

[Steve]

The episode did bring up some interesting parallels to both "Crossroad of Destiny" and "Sozin's Comet"; the fight with Zaheer was on needle formations like the final battle with Ozai, of course, but also the Red Lotus' cave camp was in a crystal cave like the one in "Crossroad of Destiny", with plenty of parallels there (Hell, Azula's VA got taken out by lightning-bending). And of course it being the site of an attempt to permanently kill the Avatar by killing her in the Avatar State.

And even if this snding was more victorious than that one... I think we all remember how Aang was after it as well. Weeks of recovery and being at one of his lowest points afterward, feeling like a failure.

[mr friendly guy]

Loved how Mako took out the waterbender, playing on his strengths.

[Mr Bean]

Loved how Mako took out the waterbender, playing on his strengths.

Should have known Water types are weak to Lightning.
Seriously however, so we are 2 for 4 on villains. Two of the Red Lotus are still alive, Korra is trashed and in a wheel chair and even Tenzin who got the crap kicked out of him is fine she's still down. But hey Bolin continues to be dumb but he can bend lava now and Zaheer can fly. I wonder if Tenzin or the kids will master that technique because flying Airbender's got us almost to DBZ level fights with how mobile they were.

Also question, why was Zaheer so broken up?
After all the Red Lotus only has to get lucky... once. All they need is one avatar state Avatar and one good hit and the avatar cycle ends... but the question is does the rebirth end because Rava dies with the avatar? Or because this breaks the connection between Rava and the Avatar cycle?

[xerex]

The Korrasami is strong in this episode.

[Koolaidkirby]

did not see vegi-korra coming.

[Steve]

Loved how Mako took out the waterbender, playing on his strengths.

Should have known Water types are weak to Lightning.
Seriously however, so we are 2 for 4 on villains. Two of the Red Lotus are still alive, Korra is trashed and in a wheel chair and even Tenzin who got the crap kicked out of him is fine she's still down. But hey Bolin continues to be dumb but he can bend lava now and Zaheer can fly. I wonder if Tenzin or the kids will master that technique because flying Airbender's got us almost to DBZ level fights with how mobile they were.

Also question, why was Zaheer so broken up?
After all the Red Lotus only has to get lucky... once. All they need is one avatar state Avatar and one good hit and the avatar cycle ends... but the question is does the rebirth end because Rava dies with the avatar? Or because this breaks the connection between Rava and the Avatar cycle?

What, you're counting Ming-Hua as alive? Or did you think Ghazan escaped after calling down the lava?

And I get the feeling that the Laghima flying technique is only possible for someone who has completely cut themselves off from "earthly constraints"; for Zaheer, it was P'Li's death. I don't know if any of the current Airbenders can manage that given how tight-knit a family they are.

And Zaheer's reaction is understandable since he, well, came within a hair's breadth of victory just to be denied at the last second. All of that sacrifice, P'Li's death, everything, accomplished... nothing. Korra is still alive, the Avatar Cycle is still present, and the Red Lotus may never get another chance like that. Who knows how much damage he organization took with his defeat and the death or capture of the members they had there?

[Mr Bean]

What, you're counting Ming-Hua as alive? Or did you think Ghazan escaped after calling down the lava?

An Earth Bender can get out of anything he wants to by going down. If Ming-Hua wanted to escape he could have if he chose to. So put him in for a "Jett death" unclear but possible. And yes Ming Hua is alive lightning or not she did not fry and I don't see them letting Mako get a kill in.

And Zaheer's reaction is understandable since he, well, came within a hair's breadth of victory just to be denied at the last second. All of that sacrifice, P'Li's death, everything, accomplished... nothing. Korra is still alive, the Avatar Cycle is still present, and the Red Lotus may never get another chance like that. Who knows how much damage he organization took with his defeat and the death or capture of the members they had there?

I expected some sort of callback to P'Li death to see his hopelessness. He started this story in jail and under lock and key. He still has contacts apparently with the Red Lotus and now that the group is in the open I expect us to see him broken out or silenced shortly.

[bilateralrope]

He started this story in jail and under lock and key. He still has contacts apparently with the Red Lotus and now that the group is in the open I expect us to see him broken out or silenced shortly.

The Red Lotus wasn't able to free Zaheer when they were an unknown group. I doubt they could do so now. Assuming he was imprisoned again. Think of the effort taken to imprison him before. Why would anyone want to go to that effort again ?
It's not like interrogating him will get them anywhere.

Then there is the problem of safely imprisoning an airbender who can fly.

[Koolaidkirby]

He started this story in jail and under lock and key. He still has contacts apparently with the Red Lotus and now that the group is in the open I expect us to see him broken out or silenced shortly.

The Red Lotus wasn't able to free Zaheer when they were an unknown group. I doubt they could do so now. Assuming he was imprisoned again. Think of the effort taken to imprison him before. Why would anyone want to go to that effort again ?
It's not like interrogating him will get them anywhere.

Then there is the problem of safely imprisoning an airbender who can fly.

Imprisoning him in a steel cage not disimilar to his original prison wouldn't be difficult as long as his guards knew he could airbend and took proper precautions.

Also, i just realized why the poison Korra was given was metallic and silvery... it was probably mercury poisoning.

[mr friendly guy]

Without the connection to her past lives, Korra didn't seem to think to surround herself with the elements like Aang did. I doubt Zaheer could have done his ramming attacks through that type of shielding.

[bilateralrope]

He started this story in jail and under lock and key. He still has contacts apparently with the Red Lotus and now that the group is in the open I expect us to see him broken out or silenced shortly.

The Red Lotus wasn't able to free Zaheer when they were an unknown group. I doubt they could do so now. Assuming he was imprisoned again. Think of the effort taken to imprison him before. Why would anyone want to go to that effort again ?
It's not like interrogating him will get them anywhere.

Then there is the problem of safely imprisoning an airbender who can fly.

Imprisoning him in a steel cage not disimilar to his original prison wouldn't be difficult as long as his guards knew he could airbend and took proper precautions.

How do you feed him without endangering the guards ?

Even if Zaheer can be kept imprisoned, that doesn't stop him communicating with any remaining Red Lotus members via the spirit world. It doesn't stop him leading the Red Lotus from his cell.

[xerex]

What, you're counting Ming-Hua as alive? Or did you think Ghazan escaped after calling down the lava?

An Earth Bender can get out of anything he wants to by going down. If Ming-Hua wanted to escape he could have if he chose to. So put him in for a "Jett death" unclear but possible. And yes Ming Hua is alive lightning or not she did not fry and I don't see them letting Mako get a kill in.

.

In the behinds the scenes clip available on Amazon the creators have confirmed that Ming Hua and Ghazan are dead. So is Amon for anyone who was hoping he survived .

This still is a Nickelodeon show, they're not going to show corpses.

[Themightytom]

What was with the metal guard that went out of her way to introduce herself to Tonraq? I feel like they name dropped her more than is coincidence?

Couldn't Korra just energy bend Zaheer to make him less of a threat? SHOULDN'T she do that even?

I'd like to see the Air nation step up and handle some of the issues with the Earth Kingdom and the Red Lotus, but I also feel like the water, fire and earth benders could step up too

[Teebs]

Couldn't Korra just energy bend Zaheer to make him less of a threat? SHOULDN'T she do that even?

Aang nearly lost in his energy bending fight with Firelord Ozai. Korra is far less spiritual and isn't back by all the past avatars, she's almost certainly lose if she tried that.

[Sharp-kun]

I'd like to see the Air nation step up and handle some of the issues with the Earth Kingdom and the Red Lotus, but I also feel like the water, fire and earth benders could step up too

I don't think the air nation is really ready for anything on the world stage at this point. Right now they need a generation to get back on their feet.

[Ahriman238]

A lot to think and comment on, but first, just so it doesn't get lost in the noise, can I just say that I loved Ginora's annointing ceremony with airbenders bending incense and ringing wind chimes. We've never seen someone formally acknowledged as a bending master before and this seemed really appropriate.

That said, I hope Ginora starts growing her hair back soon.

[bilateralrope]

What was with the metal guard that went out of her way to introduce herself to Tonraq? I feel like they name dropped her more than is coincidence?

I have a feeling we will see more from her next season.

Couldn't Korra just energy bend Zaheer to make him less of a threat? SHOULDN'T she do that even?

Aang nearly lost in his energy bending fight with Firelord Ozai. Korra is far less spiritual and isn't back by all the past avatars, she's almost certainly lose if she tried that.

Especially when the fight has left her so weakened that she is confined to a wheelchair.

[Kingmaker]

What was with the metal guard that went out of her way to introduce herself to Tonraq? I feel like they name dropped her more than is coincidence?

That was a touch odd, especially it seemed like there was a 'villain' sting when she said her name (I might have imagined that though). Prediction: the underlying conflict of season four is marital discord.

Even if Zaheer can be kept imprisoned, that doesn't stop him communicating with any remaining Red Lotus members via the spirit world. It doesn't stop him leading the Red Lotus from his cell.

Honestly, given what we've seen of him, Zaheer seems like the kind of guy you'd execute if you got the chance. He's unambiguously guilty, poses a danger even while imprisoned, and poses an even greater danger in the event that he escapes again. I am sort of curious to see how that is handled.

That said, if you wanted to imprison him, I'm sure you could construct a sufficiently elaborate cell as to keep Zaheer isolated from his wardens.

[JME2]

The Red Lotus really should've studied their history.

The last time somebody tried to artificially trigger the Avatar State...well, we all remember the ATLA Book 2 premiere.

If a garrison of Earth Kingdom soldiers couldn't handle it, what made Zaheer think he and a handful of followers could do it.

Poisoning the Avatar would only piss off the State even more.

[Steve]

The explanation I liked was that what they didn't expect was Korra's resistance to going in the Avatar State. That made them hesitate in striking the fatal blow, wanting to make sure she was staying in the State, and that cost them the vital second to finish the job.

Their plan was already desperate; they had to have Korra actively in the Avatar State as it was. This was the best solution they had. And, well, it actually almost worked. Korra lived because Su Bei-Fong got the metallic poison out of her before it killed her. If she or another metalbender skilled enough to filter the metal out hadn't been around, Korra would have died regardless. So... it really was a good plan. Even if Korra resisted in the State and couldn't be directly killed, the metallic poison would do the job.

[Solauren]

You want to imprison the Airbender? He's already nicely imprisoned thanks to the Earthbenders. Encase him in rock so he can't move, and feed him with a spoon.