Iron Man vs Thor...

Skelron · Post by **Skelron** » 2007-09-05 07:06pm

Steve wrote:he's making Tony look nasty and vicious when he has Tony almost goose-stepping with that "you're either for the government, with the government, or you're against the government" spiel.... which is in real direct contradiction with how Tony treated Nova in Nova #2 and #3 (he gave him 24 hours to decide what to do, blasted the Thunderbolts for attacking Nova, seemed generally sympathetic and supportive, etc.).
.

Except thats pretty much how it is, if you don't sign up and get drafted, then you are a criminal. If they catch you they will lock you up, and have chosen such places as the negative zone to do so in. In short, no matter how he talks, what he says, his actions speak louder than his words, and his actions are. 'Your either with us or against us.' 24 Hours to sign up, or be thrown in prison is no real option, saying he's sympathetic, is irrelavent, judge not by words but by deeds.

Post by **Steve** » 2007-09-05 07:33pm

Skelron wrote:
Steve wrote:he's making Tony look nasty and vicious when he has Tony almost goose-stepping with that "you're either for the government, with the government, or you're against the government" spiel.... which is in real direct contradiction with how Tony treated Nova in Nova #2 and #3 (he gave him 24 hours to decide what to do, blasted the Thunderbolts for attacking Nova, seemed generally sympathetic and supportive, etc.).
.
Except thats pretty much how it is, if you don't sign up and get drafted, then you are a criminal. If they catch you they will lock you up, and have chosen such places as the negative zone to do so in. In short, no matter how he talks, what he says, his actions speak louder than his words, and his actions are. 'Your either with us or against us.' 24 Hours to sign up, or be thrown in prison is no real option, saying he's sympathetic, is irrelavent, judge not by words but by deeds.

He certainly didn't treat Nova in that fashion; though he probably recognized that if Nova said no there was no need to get nasty, since Nova would probably leave the planet.

And like I said, the feel of it was different. The depictions of Iron Man seem to vary from writer to writer.

SylasGaunt · Post by **SylasGaunt** » 2007-09-05 10:03pm

There's also the fact that at the time Nova could probably beat him and shield up and down like a group of red headed stepchildren.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2007-09-06 12:15am

SylasGaunt wrote:There's also the fact that at the time Nova could probably beat him and shield up and down like a group of red headed stepchildren.

Yeah, Nova is pretty powerful right now.

You guys just all need to wait... [Iron Man is my Fave] Tony is going to be proven right in all this, you just watch!! He did all this for a DAMN good reason and will be vindicated and you will all love him again!![/Iron Man is my Fave]

Crom · Post by **Crom** » 2007-09-06 05:43am

I'm a little disappointed that Tony Stark hasn't been taken down a few pegs. I was under the impression that WWH would have undone the worst of the CW events, but it sounds like post-WWH Marvel is still under Iron Man's thumb.

And doesn't Iron Man have the Reality Gem? Can he use that against Thor?

Ford Prefect · Post by **Ford Prefect** » 2007-09-06 07:16am

Crom wrote:And doesn't Iron Man have the Reality Gem? Can he use that against Thor?

He probably doesn't keep it on him, but yeah, he does have the Reality Gem. He could probably get a hold of the Strength Gem too, unless him and Reed have had a big falling out. I honestly doubt he'd go that far - one, he had a really bad experience with the Reality Gem when they first found it, and two, it'd very likely get Doctor Strange all over his ass.

Ford Prefect · Post by **Ford Prefect** » 2007-09-06 07:20am

Apologies for the double post, but I also have to add that Tony might not even know how to use the Reality Gem with any sort of competency. He might be afraid of destabilising reality and destroying the world/universe. It took the combined efforts of the Space, Soul and Power Gems to calm what was going on when Stark pulled the Reality Gem out of the rift. He may not want to mess with that.

PS. I mean't 'Power', not 'Strength' in my previous post.

Jason · Post by **Jason** » 2007-09-06 08:43am

Yeah, the Reality gem isn't something you should mess with, unless you REALLY know what you're doing, or have the other Infinity gems working in concert with it. I'm pretty sure when Warlock had to break up the gauntlet he secretly gave Thanos the Reality gem, basically because he knew Thanos wouldn't be stupid enough to actually use it.

Baal · Post by **Baal** » 2007-09-06 11:09am

Jason wrote:Yeah, the Reality gem isn't something you should mess with, unless you REALLY know what you're doing, or have the other Infinity gems working in concert with it. I'm pretty sure when Warlock had to break up the gauntlet he secretly gave Thanos the Reality gem, basically because he knew Thanos wouldn't be stupid enough to actually use it.

Also I could be wrong but didnt Thanos sort of imply that trying to use the Reality Gem without having some of the other gems was REALLY dangerous. Basically you needed some of the other gems in your possession to be able to safely use the gem at all.

I could though be remembering this completly wrong.

Jason · Post by **Jason** » 2007-09-06 01:07pm

That sounds about right.

Sriad · Post by **Sriad** » 2007-09-13 01:30am

When did Stark, Mr. Fantastic, etc get infinity gems? That's kind of big to have totally gone over my head.

Anyway, this issue came out today and was pretty good.

What we saw in preview was pretty much their entire fight. Thor entirely disabled Tony's armor without taking a scratch, and had him walk out of New Orleans. Stark agreed to present Floating Asgard as an embassy, giving Thor diplomatic immunity from the powers registration act. A scene from SHIELD headquarters later showed it wasn't fully settled in Stark's mind, though: "Orders sir?" "Nothing. We let it go. For now."

SylasGaunt · Post by **SylasGaunt** » 2007-09-13 01:32am

Well the issue is on the stands. A lot of fears voiced here are unfounded as Thor beats Tony like a red-headed stepchild before dismissing him as unimportant.. at the moment.

SylasGaunt · Post by **SylasGaunt** » 2007-09-13 01:33am

Dammit, ninja'd by Sriad.

I do like that Thor makes it clear he's not done with Tony yet though.. as well as dropping a bit of reminder about how powerful he is.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2007-09-13 01:33am

Sriad wrote:When did Stark, Mr. Fantastic, etc get infinity gems? That's kind of big to have totally gone over my head.

In the Illuminati series, which is pretty good. Anyway, Richards was collecting them. They decided no one should have all the gems so they got distributed.

Ford Prefect · Post by **Ford Prefect** » 2007-09-13 01:56am

havokeff wrote:In the Illuminati series, which is pretty good. Anyway, Richards was collecting them. They decided no one should have all the gems so they got distributed.

His actual plan was to erase the Infinity Gauntlet, so as to stop anyone else getting their hands on it. Didn't work out, though, which is why Richards, Stark, Xavier, Strange, Black Bolt and Namor each have a Gem.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-09-13 01:59am

http://community.livejournal.com/scans_ ... tml#cutid1 if anyone wants to read the rest of the fight

Adrian Laguna · Post by **Adrian Laguna** » 2007-09-13 03:11am

Found this in 4chan, can't help but agree.

Anon wrote:Is it just me, or is the entire Marvel universe lining up to tell Tony he's a amoral dick? I'm half expecting Doom to show up, waltz over to Tony, smack him upside the head, tell him to have some class, then run off while shouting "diplomatic immunity."

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2007-09-13 04:02am

I'm not a reader-of-comics, but I'm a little confused about this depiection of Thor. I like reading these Civil War threads, since the action is fun, and I do like the art, and I've wondered what the deal is with this Asgard stuff. Is this actually Asgard, from the Norse myths? And is this actually the Norse god Thor? He seems more like some sort of 'new' Thor, not like the original one at all, and though that could just be bad comic-writing I was wondering about it now that there's apparently some actual Asgard floating around. How is it that Ironman could even think about messing with Asgard? I have to assume Thor isn't the only aesir around, and even if this is a 'new' Thor of some variety, there's probably a big pissed-off 'new' or 'old' version of Odin there, right? I assume they've got some variety of quantified power, but... isn't that just a fight you can't win?

Isn't this relatively similar to what would happen if someone set up Hell in Detroit? Not like it is now, but literally a Gate to Hell just opened up in the sewers and they started selling admission tickets and renting jetski's for the lakes of fire.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2007-09-13 04:08am

Covenant wrote:I'm not a reader-of-comics, but I'm a little confused about this depiection of Thor. I like reading these Civil War threads, since the action is fun, and I do like the art, and I've wondered what the deal is with this Asgard stuff. Is this actually Asgard, from the Norse myths? And is this actually the Norse god Thor? He seems more like some sort of 'new' Thor, not like the original one at all, and though that could just be bad comic-writing I was wondering about it now that there's apparently some actual Asgard floating around. How is it that Ironman could even think about messing with Asgard? I have to assume Thor isn't the only aesir around, and even if this is a 'new' Thor of some variety, there's probably a big pissed-off 'new' or 'old' version of Odin there, right? I assume they've got some variety of quantified power, but... isn't that just a fight you can't win?

Isn't this relatively similar to what would happen if someone set up Hell in Detroit? Not like it is now, but literally a Gate to Hell just opened up in the sewers and they started selling admission tickets and renting jetski's for the lakes of fire.

read.

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2007-09-13 04:11am

Hey, that absolutely rules, and explains my confusion. I'm glad someone thought of that little retcon. Thanks!

So I take it that this Asgard is a very literal sort of place, like some kind of Atlantis that they decided to drop over the US, just for convenience?

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2007-09-13 04:38am

Asgard.

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2007-09-13 04:45am

I think that thing wins the 'flying castle' thread as well.

dragon · Post by **dragon** » 2007-09-13 05:50am

Covenant wrote:I think that thing wins the 'flying castle' thread as well.

The edges look a little unstable though.

Enigma · Post by **Enigma** » 2007-09-13 07:50am

Why didn't IM use an armour similar to the Hulkbuster armour when facing off with Thor?

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2007-09-13 08:40am

Enigma wrote:Why didn't IM use an armour similar to the Hulkbuster armour when facing off with Thor?

Because Evil Overlords are stupid?