The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

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The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by KraytKing » 2019-11-13 04:19pm

Anyone else seen the first episode yet? I got Disney+ as part of a package with Verizon, so I went ahead and watched it last night.

Disappointing. Thoughts?
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Reyvan » 2019-11-13 05:27pm

I think it was pretty fun and I'm looking forward to the next episode.

I'm interested in seeing how they portray Mandalorian culture, especially compared to Rebels and the Clone Wars.

My two favorite parts were his meeting with the bounty hunters guild representative, and his interactions with the guild droid.

I find it funny how many references there are to the most reviled piece of Star Wars. I am, of course, speaking about the Holiday Special.

I'm not a huge fan of the music, and I feel like the pacing could be a little better, but I always find the pacing in the first episode of a TV show to be weird.

All in all, I'm excited to see where its going.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by KraytKing » 2019-11-13 08:26pm

The pacing was pretty offputting. So was the forced grittiness, opening with talking about how to harvest organs and the first fight concluding with a guy being bisected. I didn't like a lot of the stuff they implied, such as bounties being trackable with a simple device. It would be one thing if the device guided a hunter to the last known location, but it just goes straight to the person. So you have to wonder why they don't just use stormtroopers, since if all they have to do is follow a GPS and subdue the target, it isn't outside the normal soldiering skillset.

It just seemed like run of the mill TV garbage. The stuff about Mandalorian culture was dumb as shit, I am absolutely not on board with how frou-frou it was. The first fight scene was okay choreography wise, but the finale at the mercenary base had no tension. The two bounty hunters weren't smart or clever, they just came in the front and shot everyone and the bad guys missed. Once again, we have a droid being incredibly powerful with no hint of why droids don't just do everything, except for his hatred of droids that pretty quickly disappears.

Baby Yoda was fucking stupid. There are certain boxes that don't need opening, and adding more of the Yoda species was one of them.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Darth Lucifer » 2019-11-13 11:38pm

Overall, this was very enjoyable and I was definitely wanting more. Supposedly, we'll be seeing Chapter II this Friday on Disney+.
My two favorite parts were his meeting with the bounty hunters guild representative, and his interactions with the guild droid.
Carl Weathers as Greef Karga was a great casting choice. Also, in the short time they were together, I thought Mando (I know it's not his name, but that's what I'm calling him for now) and IG-11 had great chemistry. I have a feeling that we're going to see more of the bounty hunting droid; they're not going to make a character this cool and off him in the first episode.
The pacing was pretty offputting. So was the forced grittiness, opening with talking about how to harvest organs and the first fight concluding with a guy being bisected.
I didn't have a problem with either one. For an episode with a ~35 minute runtime (minus opening and credits), I thought they did well. As for the Quarren dood being sliced in half by the door irising closed on him, I was actually a little shocked they would even go this far until I remembered that Obi-Wan Kenibi sliced Darth Maul in half in The Phantom Menace. In that scene, there was a visible mist of blood, then we saw the two halves of the Sith apprentice separate in mid-air as he was falling down the shaft.
I didn't like a lot of the stuff they implied, such as bounties being trackable with a simple device. It would be one thing if the device guided a hunter to the last known location, but it just goes straight to the person.
I can see this method being used for bail jumpers (maybe they have to agree to being chipped in addition to having a Bondsman cover their bail) but I don't see how it would be used in other circumstances. I glossed over the fact that when collecting payment, Mando handed over to Greef Karga a handful of these trackers since it seemed like most of the jobs that were available were bail jumpers.
So you have to wonder why they don't just use stormtroopers, since if all they have to do is follow a GPS and subdue the target, it isn't outside the normal soldiering skillset.
At this point in the timeline (which is set ~five years after Return of the Jedi), Stormtroopers no longer have any legal police power, but Pre-Endor this would definitely apply. We saw in Rogue One that Imperial Stormtroopers were used as civilian police forces on the planet Jedha.
Baby Yoda was fucking stupid. There are certain boxes that don't need opening, and adding more of the Yoda species was one of them.
I didn't have a problem with this, I just hope they don't fuck it up. My prediction: He's a clone of Jedi Master Yoda or his species is especially force sensitive and the Imperial Remnant wants to exploit this somehow. If he was grown in a lab, he could have had the tracking device implanted at birth. If he was not a test tube Jedi, then he must have been chipped at some point by whoever he was with prior to ending up with the bandits on the desert planet.

Now some minor gripes of my own:

The alien guy constantly prattling while freely roaming about and poking around the underbelly of Mando's ship (including popping open the doors to his arsenal just by pushing random buttons) was pretty dumb. Mando should have iced the blue guy in carbonite as soon as they got onboard.

I know they were going for the "western in outer space" thing, but the scenes with Mando learning how to ride the alien thingies was cliche and really stupid...Kuiil the Ugnaught said the way to the outlaw base was impossible to cross without a blurrg mount but they didn't show any kind of terrain or obstacles that Mando couldn't have passed on foot; those crevasses they were jumping across were not so large that they couldn't be overcome with a running start and a long jump. He's also got that wrist rope thingy too.

I think it was kind of corny that even the children in the Mandalorian camp were also wearing helmets...I know that in some interpretations of the Star Wars EU (mainly the toilet paper novels written by Karen Traviss), the Mandalorians are some kind of uber-warrior culture with rules about never taking off their helmets or some shit, but seeing that extended to the kids in the background just seemed absurd to me. Besides, we saw Mandalore in Clone Wars (which IIRC is still considered canon under Disney) and its people were not this dumb-ass homogeneous warrior culture like Star Trek Klingons. Seeing as how David Filoni had a hand in the writing and production of both shows, it was disconcerting to see this brain-bug rear its ugly head again.

Finally, one of the things I loved the most: the little detail of the Stormies armor showing signs of rust and disrepair was a fantastic metaphor for the state of the remaining Imperials. Such a minor thing conveys so much.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by tezunegari » 2019-11-14 02:09am

About the mini-Yoda:
The show is set 5 years after the defeat of the Empire... so around 10 ABY (if the Battle of Jakku is the fall of the Empire and not Endor)
The formation of the Empire and the Great Jedi Purge was in 19 BBY, so a mere 29 years before the show.
With the baby being 50 years old, that puts the birth around 40 BBY... a year after Anakin's birth.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by houser2112 » 2019-11-14 09:46am

Darth Lucifer wrote:
2019-11-13 11:38pm
My two favorite parts were his meeting with the bounty hunters guild representative, and his interactions with the guild droid.
Also, in the short time they were together, I thought Mando (I know it's not his name, but that's what I'm calling him for now) and IG-11 had great chemistry. I have a feeling that we're going to see more of the bounty hunting droid; they're not going to make a character this cool and off him in the first episode.
If you mean another instance of the same model, perhaps. The one we saw in this episode looked quite dead.
I know they were going for the "western in outer space" thing, but the scenes with Mando learning how to ride the alien thingies was cliche and really stupid...Kuiil the Ugnaught said the way to the outlaw base was impossible to cross without a blurrg mount but they didn't show any kind of terrain or obstacles that Mando couldn't have passed on foot; those crevasses they were jumping across were not so large that they couldn't be overcome with a running start and a long jump. He's also got that wrist rope thingy too.
I was annoyed by that too. Convenient to save your energy, yes. Necessary, no.
I think it was kind of corny that even the children in the Mandalorian camp were also wearing helmets...I know that in some interpretations of the Star Wars EU (mainly the toilet paper novels written by Karen Traviss), the Mandalorians are some kind of uber-warrior culture with rules about never taking off their helmets or some shit, but seeing that extended to the kids in the background just seemed absurd to me. Besides, we saw Mandalore in Clone Wars (which IIRC is still considered canon under Disney) and its people were not this dumb-ass homogeneous warrior culture like Star Trek Klingons. Seeing as how David Filoni had a hand in the writing and production of both shows, it was disconcerting to see this brain-bug rear its ugly head again.
I can understand never removing the helmet in public, but in private it seems rather silly. Do they sleep in full armor?
Finally, one of the things I loved the most: the little detail of the Stormies armor showing signs of rust and disrepair was a fantastic metaphor for the state of the remaining Imperials. Such a minor thing conveys so much.
Was it rust? I was under the impression Stormtrooper armor was plastic. I thought the armor was merely dirty and damaged.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Iroscato » 2019-11-14 01:01pm

Loved it, the freshest thing I've seen from Star Wars for a long while. I kept my expectations tempered but I was pleasantly surprised at such a strong opener. Looking forward to more and I'm even up for learning more about Yoda's species, which I've always been curious about.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Darth Lucifer » 2019-11-14 01:16pm

If you mean another instance of the same model, perhaps. The one we saw in this episode looked quite dead.
It's possible the same one gets repaired or IG-11 was merely incapacitated because his core processor/droid brain/whatever wasn't located in his head. I think (and kind of hope for dramatic purposes) that shooting a fellow Guild bounty hunter will have consequences for Mando later on.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Reyvan » 2019-11-14 01:17pm

Darth Lucifer wrote:
2019-11-13 11:38pm

I think it was kind of corny that even the children in the Mandalorian camp were also wearing helmets...I know that in some interpretations of the Star Wars EU (mainly the toilet paper novels written by Karen Traviss), the Mandalorians are some kind of uber-warrior culture with rules about never taking off their helmets or some shit, but seeing that extended to the kids in the background just seemed absurd to me. Besides, we saw Mandalore in Clone Wars (which IIRC is still considered canon under Disney) and its people were not this dumb-ass homogeneous warrior culture like Star Trek Klingons. Seeing as how David Filoni had a hand in the writing and production of both shows, it was disconcerting to see this brain-bug rear its ugly head again.
In the past Filoni has mentioned working out the politics of Mandalore to a level he compared to Game of Thrones. He said hes come up with tons of Mandalorian clans and houses and their network of allegiances.

The Mandalorians here are referred to as a tribe. I'm guessing they might be some Mandalorians who are even more hardline than Death Watch was. Instead of trying to infiltrate and subvert New Mandalorian society to bring about a return to a warrior past, I'd guess that this tribe of Mandalorians just left and wrote off Mandalore when Satine or her predecessors took power, and now that Bo-Katan is in charge, they don't think that the new regime is traditional enough.

Theres room for variations in Mandalorian culture and belief. I hope that is something that gets explored in the show.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by bilateralrope » 2019-11-14 01:24pm

KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-13 08:26pm
Once again, we have a droid being incredibly powerful with no hint of why droids don't just do everything, except for his hatred of droids that pretty quickly disappears.
The droid seemed less competent as a bounty hunter than the Mandalorian.

In the opening scene, the Mandalorian came to within grabbing distance of his target before revealing who he was after. The droid walked into the compound and started repeating something about a waiver, giving the target plenty of warning.

The Mandalorian used cover to avoid getting hit. The droid just stood out in the open, relying on its armor to survive. Armor that wasn't immune to blaster fire.

The droid didn't even hesitate to announce it was going to kill the baby Yoda when the Mandalorian said he wanted to take it in alive. It didn't even consider the possibility that they had been given conflicting bounties by different people. Which also explains why they both thought they were the only bounty hunter after this target.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by KraytKing » 2019-11-14 09:39pm

bilateralrope wrote:
2019-11-14 01:24pm
KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-13 08:26pm
Once again, we have a droid being incredibly powerful with no hint of why droids don't just do everything, except for his hatred of droids that pretty quickly disappears.
The droid seemed less competent as a bounty hunter than the Mandalorian.

In the opening scene, the Mandalorian came to within grabbing distance of his target before revealing who he was after. The droid walked into the compound and started repeating something about a waiver, giving the target plenty of warning.

The Mandalorian used cover to avoid getting hit. The droid just stood out in the open, relying on its armor to survive. Armor that wasn't immune to blaster fire.

The droid didn't even hesitate to announce it was going to kill the baby Yoda when the Mandalorian said he wanted to take it in alive. It didn't even consider the possibility that they had been given conflicting bounties by different people. Which also explains why they both thought they were the only bounty hunter after this target.
Sure. Piss poor bounty hunter, nigh invulnerable killing machine.

Also, I'll add that I really hated the scene. They just shot everyone. They didn't do anything clever, they didn't really show off the Mando's skills in a way that's accessible to a general audience, because we're all already accustomed to good guys being able to casually make impossible shots. Much better would have been for him to use some mobility and clever applications of terrain to dispatch all the baddies. Plus, that avoids the inflation in later episodes, when the writers are struggling to come up with credible threats following the main character blowing through huge battles in the opener.
Last edited by KraytKing on 2019-11-14 09:47pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by KraytKing » 2019-11-14 09:42pm

Reyvan wrote:
2019-11-14 01:17pm
Darth Lucifer wrote:
2019-11-13 11:38pm

I think it was kind of corny that even the children in the Mandalorian camp were also wearing helmets...I know that in some interpretations of the Star Wars EU (mainly the toilet paper novels written by Karen Traviss), the Mandalorians are some kind of uber-warrior culture with rules about never taking off their helmets or some shit, but seeing that extended to the kids in the background just seemed absurd to me. Besides, we saw Mandalore in Clone Wars (which IIRC is still considered canon under Disney) and its people were not this dumb-ass homogeneous warrior culture like Star Trek Klingons. Seeing as how David Filoni had a hand in the writing and production of both shows, it was disconcerting to see this brain-bug rear its ugly head again.
In the past Filoni has mentioned working out the politics of Mandalore to a level he compared to Game of Thrones. He said hes come up with tons of Mandalorian clans and houses and their network of allegiances.

The Mandalorians here are referred to as a tribe. I'm guessing they might be some Mandalorians who are even more hardline than Death Watch was. Instead of trying to infiltrate and subvert New Mandalorian society to bring about a return to a warrior past, I'd guess that this tribe of Mandalorians just left and wrote off Mandalore when Satine or her predecessors took power, and now that Bo-Katan is in charge, they don't think that the new regime is traditional enough.

Theres room for variations in Mandalorian culture and belief. I hope that is something that gets explored in the show.
The portrayal of Mandalorians was fucking weird. I was onboard when Werner Herzog gave him the beskar and said it should be returned to Mandalorians, but I did not like the rest. They seemed way caught up in the tradition and bullshit, not just the fact that "hey this is really good for armor better make some."
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Meest » 2019-11-15 11:29am

I usually give a bit of leeway on pilots as they are usually shot well before the series and then they find their groove. Huge potential but need to remember Favreau is very old school and hoping Filoni can keep it Star Warsy. Trying too hard to be spaghetti western I hope calms down after first episode because they have to hammer in the tone of the show.

I was more concerned with the Mandalorian getting shot multiple times in I'm assuming non besker plates and shrugging it off. Maybe they will explain he's still kind of new but lucky he has mando gear?

I agree with him needing to be a bit more clever, they should take more cues from Red Dead Redemption vs classic western. Right now he's just a guy with good reflexes.

Again hope it settles down and gets to good storytelling instead of reference barrage.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Lonestar » 2019-11-15 09:30pm

So after tonight's episode, it's 100% a Yoda clone, right?
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by bilateralrope » 2019-11-15 09:43pm

KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-14 09:39pm
Sure. Piss poor bounty hunter, nigh invulnerable killing machine.
Unless someone shoots it in the head. Then it goes down.

Do you now understand why organics make better bounty hunters ?

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Galvatron » 2019-11-16 04:25am

I'm withholding my judgment until I see more, but WTF is with the Rocky music in this show?


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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Anacronian » 2019-11-16 07:16am

bilateralrope wrote:
2019-11-15 09:43pm
KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-14 09:39pm
Sure. Piss poor bounty hunter, nigh invulnerable killing machine.
Unless someone shoots it in the head. Then it goes down.

Do you now understand why organics make better bounty hunters ?
Because Organics can survive being shoot in the head?
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by KraytKing » 2019-11-16 08:58am

bilateralrope wrote:
2019-11-15 09:43pm
KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-14 09:39pm
Sure. Piss poor bounty hunter, nigh invulnerable killing machine.
Unless someone shoots it in the head. Then it goes down.

Do you now understand why organics make better bounty hunters ?
The part of bounty hunting that organics are good at is obviated by the tracking chips and the fact that frontal assault seemed to work. Droids fit into Star Wars because their ridiculous specialization makes them only marginally useful in most applications. When you pare down the bounty hunting profession to essentially only the shooting, it becomes clear that specialized droids would be all the rage.

He forgot his hate too quickly. Here I thought it was a character trait for the long term.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by houser2112 » 2019-11-18 08:45am

KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-16 08:58am
The part of bounty hunting that organics are good at is obviated by the tracking chips and the fact that frontal assault seemed to work. Droids fit into Star Wars because their ridiculous specialization makes them only marginally useful in most applications. When you pare down the bounty hunting profession to essentially only the shooting, it becomes clear that specialized droids would be all the rage.
The frontal assault should not have worked, though. I think it was bad writing to make it work. Realistically, that job required stealth and cleverness. It was only Mando explicitly telling IG not to self-destruct that prevented him from doing so, so the "guns blazing" method didn't really work, and he even had Mando's help.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Knife » 2019-11-18 11:57am

So...

I like it, but does anyone else feel like each episode is like 10-15 minutes of story stretched into 35-40 minutes. It's slow. Like really slow. Don't know if it's on purpose, or the editor sucks, or what. Without commercial breaks, these could really be 20 minutes shows.

The acting is ok, the themes and look is definitely SW. Had a bit of a SOD problem with him and Ugnaught-Nolte putting his starship back together in the middle of the desert after jawa's junk it. Other than that, its fun. I'm a little worried about what they plan on doing with baby Yoda but willing to stick it out and see what they're doing with it. The Mando seems to be aping a Clint Eastwood type western movie character. Outlaw Joesy Whales, or Highplains Drifter.
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Batman » 2019-11-18 06:40pm

So if the outlaw base was impossible to reach on foot...how come the Mandalorian made it back to his ship on foot (with a hovering toddler in tow no less) just fine?
For whatever reason there seems to be circuitry in the chest armour (which took quite a beating in the encounter with the Rhino thingy).
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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by bilateralrope » 2019-11-19 06:24am

Anacronian wrote:
2019-11-16 07:16am
Because Organics can survive being shoot in the head?
Maybe the Mandalorians armor can have him survive that. Maybe not.

All I'm saying in that post is that " nigh invulnerable killing machine" is not an accurate description of that droid.
KraytKing wrote:
2019-11-16 08:58am
The part of bounty hunting that organics are good at is obviated by the tracking chips and the fact that frontal assault seemed to work. Droids fit into Star Wars because their ridiculous specialization makes them only marginally useful in most applications. When you pare down the bounty hunting profession to essentially only the shooting, it becomes clear that specialized droids would be all the rage.

He forgot his hate too quickly. Here I thought it was a character trait for the long term.
The droid thought that it had lost the fight. Which is why it activated its self-destruct. So, with no Mandalorian to come up with the "you cover me" plan, the droid would have triggered its self destruct. Maybe the baby dies from the blast. But with nobody to provide proof of termination, I can't see the bounty being paid. Which makes it a failure.

The only thing the droid managed to do right was figuring out the way to the compound. Which was done by the tracking tool that all bounty hunters get to use, not any capability of the droid.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Meest » 2019-11-19 08:10am

Batman wrote:
2019-11-18 06:40pm
So if the outlaw base was impossible to reach on foot...how come the Mandalorian made it back to his ship on foot (with a hovering toddler in tow no less) just fine?
For whatever reason there seems to be circuitry in the chest armour (which took quite a beating in the encounter with the Rhino thingy).
One of my biggest complains, unless these are some direct homages to westerns. Problem--->montage--->solved. Would rather have the extra 20-25mins of him really trying to problem solve since there is no real B plot line.

For the armour I'm hoping it's some form of power armour, can explain it's toughness. Takes blaster shots and just dents, multi-ton beast rams him a few times and he's still conscious.
"Somehow I feel, that in the long run, Thanos of Titan came out ahead in this particular deal."

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by bilateralrope » 2019-11-19 09:10am

Lonestar wrote:
2019-11-15 09:30pm
So after tonight's episode, it's 100% a Yoda clone, right?
Why are so many people saying the baby is a clone ?

The facts we know are:
- Force sensitive
- Member of Yoda's species
- Hidden in the middle of nowhere for 50 years. Long enough that it was hidden from both the Jedi Order and the Empire

We don't need a clone. Just parents who didn't want to hand their child over to the Jedi or Empire.

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Re: The Mandalorian Discussion Thread (spoilers and such)

Post by Galvatron » 2019-11-19 02:17pm

FWIW, the new canon never did account for Yaddle...

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