Low density galaxy

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Elheru Aran
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Elheru Aran » 2017-12-28 06:22pm

It's still pretty sketchy how he knows exactly where to go on the Supremacy, unless he was trained there or something. Which I grant is possible, the TLJ ICS implies it's basically a huge floating base for the First Order. Still one would think the hyperspace tracking facility would be *highly* secure and well above his pay grade to be mopping floors... (also why the heck is a stormtrooper mopping floors but whatever)

Honestly it makes as much sense as him knowing the layout of Starkiller Base, I guess. He appears to be in, what, his mid twenties? Boyega is 25 so that's a good guess... I suppose that's enough time to be trained on the Supremacy (which might entail for example guard duty in different parts of the ship, thus having to know his way around) and then get posted to Starkiller Base. Particularly if, IIRC, he was picked up as a kid and started training/indoctrination at a very young age.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Solauren » 2017-12-28 06:33pm

Stop and think for a minute about how Han and leia knew about the area they were in.
First, Han had records. You can see him reading them over.

Leia is a high ranking member of the Rebellion, and was in command of their base. It makes sense for her to have read over a basic summary of the nearby systems. It would make using local resources, and avoiding the Empire, that much easier.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Elheru Aran » 2017-12-28 07:12pm

Yeah, Leia and Han being aware of nearby systems isn't going to be as much of an issue to rationalize as Luke being able to zoom over to Dagobah with minimal notice or Obi-wan finding a hidden planet and hypering there.

To a certain degree, it honestly makes sense that the Rebels would have categorized low population, out of the way systems; they're a convenient place to hide away, particularly as hyperspace speeds mean that the journey times are trivial. If Finn and Rose can go from literally one side of the galaxy to the other in a matter of hours, there's really no reason they can't hide anywhere they want. Smugglers would do the same for similar reasons.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Galvatron » 2017-12-28 07:42pm

Elheru Aran wrote:
2017-12-28 07:12pm
To a certain degree, it honestly makes sense that the Rebels would have categorized low population, out of the way systems; they're a convenient place to hide away, particularly as hyperspace speeds mean that the journey times are trivial.
That's exactly what we see in the new comic about the time the Our Heroes scouted Crait as a potential base after the evacuation of Yavin IV.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_War ... s_of_Crait

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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Zixinus » 2017-12-29 01:51pm

Of course, 'life readings' could mean anything from lichen to tauntauns to wampas, so one has to assume that probe droids are geared to scan for lifeforms that *aren't* indigenous to the planet in question. So if Hoth is known to be inhospitable to 'human forms', but the probe droid detects them... there's something there.
Except that then you'd have to have a database of what lifeform is indigenous to what planet.

And that does not even begin with invasive species. Easy FTL access coupled with a large number of life-sustainable planets and lots of independently-evolved (more or less) biology means that there is going to be the Star Wars equivalent of invasive plants, animals, fungi and maybe even entire ecosystems. That just can't wait to smuggle themselves unto a ship and unleash itself, all Zerg-stlye, on some unsuspecting, mostly-defenseless planet.

Which would actually another difficult data-point to consider. The presence of an invasive species, depending on the history of hte planet, mean a once-failed expedition or a secret base with a pest problem.
Perhaps people simply download stuff they WANT to know about, or feel will be useful, rather than the entire corpus of knowledge available?
Probably there are limitations on the technology and its use. For example, the human brain has finite capacity. And that what was learned has to be practiced.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Eternal_Freedom » 2017-12-29 02:46pm

Elheru Aran wrote:
2017-12-28 07:12pm
Yeah, Leia and Han being aware of nearby systems isn't going to be as much of an issue to rationalize as Luke being able to zoom over to Dagobah with minimal notice or Obi-wan finding a hidden planet and hypering there.
Except Luke didn't got to Dagobah on minimal notice, he had time while recovering to look up Dagobah in the database and/or ask Artoo to do so. And Obi-Wan knew where Kamino was, it just didn't appear on the charts. He already had the coordinates.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by streetad » 2017-12-31 07:34am

Solauren wrote:
2017-12-28 06:33pm
Stop and think for a minute about how Han and leia knew about the area they were in.
First, Han had records. You can see him reading them over.

Leia is a high ranking member of the Rebellion, and was in command of their base. It makes sense for her to have read over a basic summary of the nearby systems. It would make using local resources, and avoiding the Empire, that much easier.
That's true.

If anything it's a bit odd that they didn't know Han's old buddy was essentially planetary governer the next system over before the Empire even turned up.

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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Solauren » 2018-01-02 05:18pm

Actually, all we know that Lando was in charge of Cloud City. We don't know if there are any other cities in the planets atmosphere.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Khaat » 2018-01-02 05:39pm

Gotta remember: ESB was before any six-year-old with mom's phone could search the Internet for "places near me". The very fact that Lando was boasting about slipping under the notice of the Mining Guild is significant, given that you could get his name attached to a location with a casual search (which was also untraceable by the Empire - true Net Neutrality!) The Empire (and Mining Guild) look significantly more inept with hindsight.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Galvatron » 2018-01-03 12:16am

Who says Han accessed the Space Internet at all? When he searched the Falcon's navicomputer database for safe ports near the Anoat system, maybe "Bespin (see: Lando)" popped up as one of the results.

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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Khaat » 2018-01-03 10:46am

Ok, so the Empire doesn't update its space GPS/TomTom/Garmin/whatever? I liked the idea that the junk dropped by the SD was Rebel ship debris that had been scrubbed for data/clues as to where the rest had fled.... :(

So there's an interesting question: is the SW universe operating in a manner where much navigation data is widely corrupted/destroyed/limited on purpose?* That only local (Imperial) authorities have accurate data, and civilian databases are being actively impaired and discouraged? It would go a long way toward why there's a need for smugglers (with un-corrupted navigation database files), in a universe where you can get from the outer rim to the core worlds in hours if you know the way.

*Yes, I fully expect someone to tell us about that EU novel that covered just that.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Elheru Aran » 2018-01-03 11:18am

Khaat wrote:
2018-01-03 10:46am
Ok, so the Empire doesn't update its space GPS/TomTom/Garmin/whatever? I liked the idea that the junk dropped by the SD was Rebel ship debris that had been scrubbed for data/clues as to where the rest had fled.... :(

So there's an interesting question: is the SW universe operating in a manner where much navigation data is widely corrupted/destroyed/limited on purpose?* That only local (Imperial) authorities have accurate data, and civilian databases are being actively impaired and discouraged? It would go a long way toward why there's a need for smugglers (with un-corrupted navigation database files), in a universe where you can get from the outer rim to the core worlds in hours if you know the way.

*Yes, I fully expect someone to tell us about that EU novel that covered just that.
No novel as far as I know, but if you take the notion that it all started with removing Kamino from the Jedi map of the galaxy, then it's not a very great leap to assume that the Empire took that Jedi map (quite possibly a primary source of galactic cartographic information) and censored it further. After all, it's certainly something that, say, the Soviet Union did historically. It would absolutely fit for smugglers and the Rebels to build their own database of the galactic map rather than relying upon Imperial information which might only be useful for the more populous, well guarded areas. If you're a big corporation like KDY or Sienar, you have no reason to not use the Imperial maps because you'll be using fixed, well trafficked routes... but if you want to avoid Imperial attention but still get around, you have to figure it all out or buy/beg/borrow/steal an independent database.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Galvatron » 2018-01-03 01:01pm

Khaat wrote:
2018-01-03 10:46am
Ok, so the Empire doesn't update its space GPS/TomTom/Garmin/whatever? I liked the idea that the junk dropped by the SD was Rebel ship debris that had been scrubbed for data/clues as to where the rest had fled.... :(
No, I'm saying that the Empire's space GPS doesn't include "Lando Calrissian lives here" in its public listing for Bespin. Any such annotations that are personally or professionally significant to Han would be confined to his own database on the Falcon alone.

Although, I do find merit in the theories that you and Elheru just proposed about the Empire censoring galactic navigational information from the masses. That's not a bad idea either.

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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Solauren » 2018-01-04 09:46pm

It's also entirely possible Lando had a 'front man' for dealing with unknown parties/parties he wanted to avoid. i.e Lobot.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Elheru Aran » 2018-01-05 12:08pm

Solauren wrote:
2018-01-04 09:46pm
It's also entirely possible Lando had a 'front man' for dealing with unknown parties/parties he wanted to avoid. i.e Lobot.
Lobot was the numbers guy/consoligere, not a front guy. Lando probably had a bunch of other people working for him, we just don't see a whole lot of them because we only saw a small slice of Cloud City.
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Re: Low density galaxy

Post by Solauren » 2018-01-06 10:16am

Elheru Aran wrote:
2018-01-05 12:08pm
Solauren wrote:
2018-01-04 09:46pm
It's also entirely possible Lando had a 'front man' for dealing with unknown parties/parties he wanted to avoid. i.e Lobot.
Lobot was the numbers guy/consoligere, not a front guy. Lando probably had a bunch of other people working for him, we just don't see a whole lot of them because we only saw a small slice of Cloud City.
I used Lobot as he was the only named example. However, still, it's entirely possible Lando had a 'front-man'.
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