Just Got Hearts of Iron

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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-10 01:18pm

I'm playing my first campaign as the Italians, and some of it is quite annoying. The early game was good. I siezed Yugoslavia, Bulgaria, and Greece without much trouble, then sat and improved my infantry via research.

The Axis and Allies went to war early over the Czechs' refusal to sede the Sudetenland, and then Poland joined the allies. It took a couple of months for Germany to curbstomp the two poor countries before they turned to France. At that point, I decided that it would be nice to grab the mediterranean coast of France, so I checked up on the option. I found that the French had kept 30 divisions bordering me, against my sixteen. They were actually more concerned with my slow-moving medium-org army than they were with the swarming Panzer-Mechanized German armies; the results were predictable. :rolleyes:

Then, when I moved to the North African theatre, I enjoyed some early success with a judiciously timed landing at Port Said (the Brits were smashing my weak Libyan garrison, and their entire theatre force was past Tobruk, so I landed a twelve-division force in their rear). I carefully established convoy routes to keep my troops in supply, and then marched off to defeat the enemy. Much to my surprise, my troops never regained Org. They were in supply, stationary, and not under attack, but they just didn't gain any org. A single Free French mechanized division then appeared and rounded them up in Alexandria, and a heroic Dunkirk-style evacuation ensued. WTF? Is that a bug, or was I doing something wrong?
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Post by Sea Skimmer » 2003-06-10 01:49pm

That whole game is a bug, as far as realism is concerned, from everything I’ve heard.
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Post by Stravo » 2003-06-10 03:57pm

Did you get all the patches for it? The game out of the box is a fucking mess. With all the patches it should work fairly well.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-10 04:18pm

Stravo wrote:Did you get all the patches for it? The game out of the box is a fucking mess. With all the patches it should work fairly well.
That was 1.04, actually.
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Post by Robert Treder » 2003-06-10 04:53pm

Regaining org. can depend on the infrastructure of the territory your unit is on. If it's in North Africa, there's a chance that you were on a crappy piece of land that didn't allow the organization to rise.

Other than that, I don't know. It's possible that it was a bug.

The game has some problems, but overall, I find it to be pretty fun. I like playing small nations and watching while the big countries duke it out, and I switch to them every once in a while and manipulate them to do crazy stuff. Like I had a three-way battle between Germany, Britain, and Russia which was cool. I also noticed that if you play as Poland and join the Axis early, you can build up quite an empire, easily conquering the Baltic states, conquering Romania with a little bit of effort, and then you can march through Turkey, Persia, wherever else you want. But then when the Soviets join in, you're fuxored.
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Post by Ted » 2003-06-10 06:47pm

Sea Skimmer wrote:That whole game is a bug, as far as realism is concerned, from everything I’ve heard.
Skimmer, if you aint gonna say something relavent, shut up.

The thread had nothing to do with realism.

Pablo:

Did you have a convoy from ROME, to Alex?

convoys leaving your country must be from the source of supplies (capital) if the capital is on the coast, otherwise any coast province.

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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-10 08:16pm

Ted wrote:Did you have a convoy from ROME, to Alex?

convoys leaving your country must be from the source of supplies (capital) if the capital is on the coast, otherwise any coast province.
From Rome, to Alexandria, bearing supplies and a bit of oil to keep my two motorized divisions mobile. Alexandria is also high infrastructure enough to keep an army group together, isn't it? Maybe it was just a bug. The allied troops trying to retreat from Libya and face me had the same problem, I think. They hit my army group and disintegrated immediately, as if they were at 0 org.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-10 11:14pm

I reloaded the game in 1938 to see how the war would go. Strangely, the Allies felt that it was okay for Germany to take Poland, but it was totally unacceptable for the USSR to attack Finland. There ensued a massively boring war, with the Allies attempting amphibious landings and being uncerimoniously destroyed.

In the meantime, I used my DI to influence such nations as Portugal, Nationalist Spain, Argentina, and Persia to join our wonderful Axis alliance, thereby pushing our victory point total to just seven points over the Allies. Now all I have to do is set it to very fast and yawn repeatedly.
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Post by Enforcer Talen » 2003-06-11 01:43am

is it realtime or turnbased?
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Post by Brother-Captain Gaius » 2003-06-11 02:27am

Realtime.
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Post by Faram » 2003-06-11 02:57am

Okay piked up HoI for 150skr~15€ in the bargin bin.

No to figure out how to play it :D

And yea I have d/l and applied the latest patch.
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Post by Raptor 597 » 2003-06-11 02:10pm

1.04 is good. But Paradox are notrious for horrible 1.00 releases. Some of the systems like naval and air combat are not all that accurate. Carriers aren't working but could if ypu made carrier air wings which are extremely good for fleet attack. But the system now is WAD (working as designed). The manuals are extremel funny because nothing works as described in their. An expansion pack is needed and the engine is good (EU Series Engine) but a new one built for the game may of been better. The game is quite excellent modded. Shep's/Stony Road Mod is very difficult and quite many accuracies. CORE 0.2 is very historically accurate. And The Great War Mod is done with gameplay but they're working on ministers. But I am working on the 1.05 leader patch.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-11 03:19pm

Captain Lennox wrote:1.04 is good. But Paradox are notrious for horrible 1.00 releases. Some of the systems like naval and air combat are not all that accurate. Carriers aren't working but could if ypu made carrier air wings which are extremely good for fleet attack. But the system now is WAD (working as designed). The manuals are extremel funny because nothing works as described in their. An expansion pack is needed and the engine is good (EU Series Engine) but a new one built for the game may of been better. The game is quite excellent modded. Shep's/Stony Road Mod is very difficult and quite many accuracies. CORE 0.2 is very historically accurate. And The Great War Mod is done with gameplay but they're working on ministers. But I am working on the 1.05 leader patch.
Does Shep's mod boost the difficulty or not? Because I'm interested in increasing accuracy, but I'm a pretty lackluster strategist as it is and I don't think I would enjoy being curbstomped.
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Post by Exonerate » 2003-06-11 04:18pm

Eh, I played as the US... Was too easy. Just sat and industrialized researched until I knew war was nearing... Then right after France and Britain declared an alliance, I joined, and landed 24 armored and 16 infantry divisions in France after most of it was conquered...

I found it easier to seperate my forces into groups of 3-4 divisions. In the beginning, I kept getting supply lines cut off, but after seperating them, I had no trouble at all. Germany got their ass kicked so bad that France installed a puppet regime. I pushed East, and moved in the USSR, took Archangel, but then decided that the upkeep needed wasn't worth it, so retreated to Leningrad.

Landed more infantry and armored on China, routed the Japanese out, then invaded their mainland. Annexed them, and attacked the Soviets from the East. Game ended with the allies at about 600 to 100 for the Soviets.

I kinda enjoyed playing Spain a little more... Except that fiasco about declaring on France after Germany did so, but then finding out they wouldn't let me join their alliance :(

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Post by Raptor 597 » 2003-06-11 08:59pm

Pablo Sanchez wrote:
Captain Lennox wrote:1.04 is good. But Paradox are notrious for horrible 1.00 releases. Some of the systems like naval and air combat are not all that accurate. Carriers aren't working but could if ypu made carrier air wings which are extremely good for fleet attack. But the system now is WAD (working as designed). The manuals are extremel funny because nothing works as described in their. An expansion pack is needed and the engine is good (EU Series Engine) but a new one built for the game may of been better. The game is quite excellent modded. Shep's/Stony Road Mod is very difficult and quite many accuracies. CORE 0.2 is very historically accurate. And The Great War Mod is done with gameplay but they're working on ministers. But I am working on the 1.05 leader patch.
Does Shep's mod boost the difficulty or not? Because I'm interested in increasing accuracy, but I'm a pretty lackluster strategist as it is and I don't think I would enjoy being curbstomped.
It does quite so. But you can play the normal campaigns will added on events. Rather fun. But I wouldn't recommend playig Shep's Stony Road until you can beat the normal game on Very Hard/Furious which is the only way I like it. His beginner difficulty isn't tht hard so after a few Hard/Agressive normal games you could try it.

Exonerate, your problem was building heavy divisions before war. Industrailization and even some research is fine but you shouldn't build more than twenty infantry divisions before war. Yeah, and the 3-4 division Corps System woks better by deploying your Lt. Generals and giving your commanders division that they attack with. Everybody gets he skill they deserve.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-13 02:33pm

Right now I'm playing vanilla 1.04 as the USSR, and I'm putting T-34/85 and motorized+engineer divs into mass production in early 1939, all with org 70+ and research techs preparing to increase them. :)

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Post by Ted » 2003-06-13 02:56pm

Pablo Sanchez wrote:Right now I'm playing vanilla 1.04 as the USSR, and I'm putting T-34/85 and motorized+engineer divs into mass production in early 1939, all with org 70+ and research techs preparing to increase them. :)

ZA RODINA!
You'll need about 50 of those Divs, if you are playing on hard or above.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-13 11:51pm

Ted wrote:
Pablo Sanchez wrote:Right now I'm playing vanilla 1.04 as the USSR, and I'm putting T-34/85 and motorized+engineer divs into mass production in early 1939, all with org 70+ and research techs preparing to increase them. :)

ZA RODINA!
You'll need about 50 of those Divs, if you are playing on hard or above.
I've already got about 12 each and its only early 39. I'm playing on normal all, since it's my first campaign as a major.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-14 01:53pm

Pablo Sanchez wrote:
Ted wrote:
Pablo Sanchez wrote:Right now I'm playing vanilla 1.04 as the USSR, and I'm putting T-34/85 and motorized+engineer divs into mass production in early 1939, all with org 70+ and research techs preparing to increase them. :)

ZA RODINA!
You'll need about 50 of those Divs, if you are playing on hard or above.
I've already got about 12 each and its only early 39. I'm playing on normal all, since it's my first campaign as a major.
Arg... The Allies fail to notice the invasion of Poland, but I forced to sue for peace with Finland because of my unacceptable aggression. :roll: The Axis finally declare war on the French in mid '41, and while most German troops are in the west I declare war on the Axis, which by then includes every nation between France and USSR (except the Swiss). Using four tank fronts of twelve divisions each, I rapidly encircle German positions in Poland, puppet Romania and Czechoslovakia (which had joined the Axis?), and begin the process of eliminating encircled Germans. And then my newfound allies fucked around and I had to waste time defending their territory.
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Post by Exonerate » 2003-06-14 03:36pm

4 tank fronts with 12 divisions each? You're probably better off with 8 fronts if 6 each, or less...

I've had my supply lines cut off a few times before I learned that. Not fun.

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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-14 04:10pm

Exonerate wrote:4 tank fronts with 12 divisions each? You're probably better off with 8 fronts if 6 each, or less...

I've had my supply lines cut off a few times before I learned that. Not fun.
Yeah, I'm having the same problem, but only because I tried to encirlce all of poland at a gulp. The Germans somehow managed to supply 60+ divisions solely from Hungarian stocks (I had grabbed central Germany by that time) and fought back. I was also under the impression that taking another nation's capital lost it its supply stockpile. How wrong I was :roll: I'll reload and split them up.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-15 08:29pm

I took your advice, and I encircled 30+ divisions (mainly Balkan and Italian auxilia, tho) in the first week, left two Mechanized Armies to reduce them, and sent four to set up a defensive line along the Oder. The difference was immense!
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-16 12:51pm

Okay, I finished off the USSR game. In late 1944, the scores stand at Axis-0, Allies-369, Comintern-550. I have puppeted Germany, Yugoslavia, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Manchukuo, and fully annexed Japan (while Tito annexed Italy with the sole effort of my own divisions :)). The only reason I didn't annex Germany was because the FUCKING game moved their capital to Colmar on the Maginot line, and that province and Stassbourg were both staffed with ten infantry/militia divisions after I had taken every other province from the European axis. They were impossible to encircle because the capital was there, they could not be taken by force (I tried with 30 divisions, 20 infantry with arty and ten armored--25% casualties to no effect), and my primitive airforce disintegrated the moment they began bombing :(

This is unrealistic bullshit. First, when I attacked from the France side of the line, it should have been a cakewalk because the fortifications faced the other way IRL. Second, how much will to resist would those 20 divisions be able to muster up? It's absolutely ridiculous to think that they would keep up the fight when the nearest friendly province was in Mongolia.

Still, I'm satisfied with the game.
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Post by Vympel » 2003-06-16 01:17pm

Pablo Sanchez wrote:Okay, I finished off the USSR game. In late 1944, the scores stand at Axis-0, Allies-369, Comintern-550. I have puppeted Germany, Yugoslavia, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Manchukuo, and fully annexed Japan (while Tito annexed Italy with the sole effort of my own divisions :)). The only reason I didn't annex Germany was because the FUCKING game moved their capital to Colmar on the Maginot line, and that province and Stassbourg were both staffed with ten infantry/militia divisions after I had taken every other province from the European axis. They were impossible to encircle because the capital was there, they could not be taken by force (I tried with 30 divisions, 20 infantry with arty and ten armored--25% casualties to no effect), and my primitive airforce disintegrated the moment they began bombing :(

This is unrealistic bullshit. First, when I attacked from the France side of the line, it should have been a cakewalk because the fortifications faced the other way IRL. Second, how much will to resist would those 20 divisions be able to muster up? It's absolutely ridiculous to think that they would keep up the fight when the nearest friendly province was in Mongolia.

Still, I'm satisfied with the game.
I tend to play it risky when I do the USSR.

1. Zero troop supplies and military production. You won't need them till 1940. This gives you three years of accelerated R&D which you should spend mostly on land warfare technology, artillery, armor, electronics, and land doctrine.

2. Get in good with Japan. Not too hard. You want to prevent them from attacking your rear.

3. Start your military and supply buildup at the end of 1938. Build tanks and infantry, upgrade your existing tanks to the most modern model you have (I go for broke for the Advanced Medium 80mm+), and attack Germany when it attacks France (after it finishes off Poland). Their forces will be committed in the West- you'll steamroll them.

The rest of the game is in your lap.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez » 2003-06-16 05:32pm

Vympel wrote:I tend to play it risky when I do the USSR.
[snip]

The rest of the game is in your lap.
That's basically what happened, except I went for an early siezure of Persia and didn't butter Japan up enough. The Fascists went after France in April '41, and the game was basically a foregone conclusion by September '41 (I had taken Germany proper and all Euro Axis minors, all that remained was to roll up Austria and Northern France, then smash Italy).

I actually spent more time beating Japan into submission than I did taking down Europe, and that whole campaign was really set before I even started (they were at war with Commonwealth, France, USA, USSR, and had no allies :D). My campaign had some moments that would have made excellent History Channel fodder:
1) The decisive moves in both the German and Japanese campaigns were made by the same three marshals--Tukhachevsky, Konev, and Rokossovski
2) To counteract the Japanese siezure of the middle of the Trans-siberian railroad, I sent six T-34/85 divisions under Malinovsky on a six-month oddyssey; they marched from Moskva to Irkutsk, opposition evaporating in their path :D
3) The seven divisions under Vassilevsky held out in Vladivostok against twenty Manchurian and Japanese divisions and a dozen aircraft groups for almost a year before they were relieved. For most of the siege, they were totally surrounded and attacked from several sides. I think my superior infantry inflicted about 5-1 casualties :)
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