Please suggest a game to me.

[Tony Stark]

I am in many ways weird when it comes to my games. I play MMORPG's with my friends, but while they focus on questing I like to focus on trading and in other types of games, planning out mine output's ROI etc. in spreadsheets and my own programs.

So I am looking for games for a Mathling/Probability/Statistics nerd to play. I will leave it open to interpretation as to what that covers.


Thank you.

[Mr Bean]

Dwarf Fortress?
Civilization?
Tropico?
Faster than Light?

Also
Dwarf Fortress

[Jub]

The obvious one that comes to mind MMO wise is EVE, I don't know a ton about it but info should be super easy to find.

[Tony Stark]

I have heard of all of those and actually do play Civ. I am also an Eve player. Not as much as I used to though.


WHat are the merits of Dwarf Fortress?

[Jub]

Dwarf Fortress is a rogue like with a steep learning curve that rewards those who can manage things well and who don't mind rolling up a new batch for fresh dwarves on a regular basis. I haven't played it much, so the best I can do is suggest looking at lets plays either on forums (there should even be a few on here) or on Youtube or some such.

[Tony Stark]

I am reading about it now. It seems awesome.

[Mr Bean]

Keep in mind this about Dwarf Fortress
It's complexity will kill you.
It's complexity will reward you
Part of the problem with Dwarf fortress is how poorly the Dwarves will communicate their wants and why certain of them are not met. The classic pet cat dies in the food cave thus all your dwarves starve to death because the corpse makes them think the food is bad. Or fey dwarves wanting stuff you simply don't have nor can't have for ages. Or carvan's show up with nothing but more mouths to feed.

Or the odd heroic goblin who kills six axe dwarves and two bow dwarves before being put down.
It's a game that's been designed in some ways to try to convince you not to play. But once you learn all 400 lessons to keeping them alive you'll love it to death.

[Tony Stark]

From preliminary reading, I believe I will love this game.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Paradox strategy games sound like they might be up your alley. Europa Universalis IV is coming out soon. Look into the 3rd game in the series and see if it sounds like something you might be interested in. Alternatively, Crusader Kings 2 for a stronger RPG/character-driven approach, or Hearts of Iron III for the ultimate in 20th century strategic grognardery. You practically need spreadsheets in the latter to keep track of your army armies army groups.

[Esquire]

Could you expand a little on what you mean by Crusader Kings being more RPG-ish? I've played EUIII and loved it, but haven't touched one of the other series.

[Simon_Jester]

Crusader Kings is very much a dynastic game; EUIII is to some extent but CK is more so. In Crusader Kings, you're not really attached to a plot of land so much as a dynasty, and theoretically you could lose all your original holdings, conquer territory somewhere else on the map, and still be doing well as long as the dynasty continues to flourish.

So take the elements like making sure your monarchy doesn't die out in EUIII and amplify them tremendously, while reducing the 'international relations simulator' angle a bit, and I think you can see how that becomes more RPG-like in its flavor.

[Singular Intellect]

Minecraft? It has a great deal of role playing and flexibility to it's makeup, especially as you discover modded servers.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Could you expand a little on what you mean by Crusader Kings being more RPG-ish? I've played EUIII and loved it, but haven't touched one of the other series.

In EU, you play a nation-state. Your actions and gameplay are tied to it.

In CK, you play a person (and eventually, his/her descendants). This person has a name (often one of your own choosing), stats, traits, etc., and interacts with the 1 zillion other characters also inhabiting the game world. The concept of a coherent nation-state doesn't really exist yet; counties, duchies, and kingdoms are relatively transient things tied to the characters, so it become a game about your character, your character's dynastic descendants, and the other characters you interact with.

For example, say you are the petty King of East Anglia. The Vikings come in and ruin your shit, as they are wont to do. But you're also the Earl of Glastonbury, so even though the Vikings may have conquered East Anglia and taken your petty kingdom, you're still an earl with holdings elsewhere in England. If you maintain that status quo long enough, eventually you'll die, and your heir (probably your eldest son, depending on succession laws) will become Earl of Glastonbury and play resumes with you now playing the new Earl.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Ghetto edit: Get while the getting's good, if that's your inclination. As of this post, CK2 stands a good chance of being the vote winner on Steam's next 8(?) hour sale, 5 hours from this post.

[Arthur_Tuxedo]

Space Empires 5 might be up your alley. Play with mods, though, as the stock game balance is hideous. Balance Mod is the go-to, but you'd probably enjoy the B5 Wars mod more, as it is very complex.

[Purple]

If you want to play Space Empires I would suggest staying away from V and going for IV. Not only is the game that much better out of the box but it looks better as well. And almost all data is modifiable as it's all stored in .txt and .bmp files so the mods that are out there for it are that much better and more complete. Plus the learning curve to mod it to your own desires is roughly as long as learning how to type.

Also, I would like to reiterate what others said about Dwarf Fortress. It is quite literally the best game in the world. Since you are a beginner thou I would advise you to check out the Lazy Newb Pack for a few months before getting stuck in with the way it's meant to be plaid.
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=59026.0

[fgalkin]

King of Dragon Pass? And oldie but goodie and you can play it on a tablet?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Purple]

King of Dragon Pass? And oldie but goodie and you can play it on a tablet?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

How could I have forgotten to mention that one? Jesus Christ is it a good game. I fully support this suggestion.

[fgalkin]

King of Dragon Pass? And oldie but goodie and you can play it on a tablet?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

How could I have forgotten to mention that one? Jesus Christ is it a good game. I fully support this suggestion.

You were distracted by a cattle raid?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Well now you've lost clan magic.

[StarSword]

You might enjoy the X series. Heavily moddable sandbox space sim series (people have called it a single-player EVE clone, but X came first) with an emphasis on building your own megacorp of sorts.

Whole series is on Steam.

[TheHammer]

Could you expand a little on what you mean by Crusader Kings being more RPG-ish? I've played EUIII and loved it, but haven't touched one of the other series.

Military conquest is but one way to acquire land, but before you can even do that there is often a rather involved shell game where you might have to assinate one character, get another one excomunicated, or lure a title claimaint to your realm before you can have cause to declare war. Then you've got some tough decisions to make as your character grows older. Your eldest title claimaint (your son from your first wife, a duchess of York) may be a hunchback imbecile, excomunicated and hated by most of your vassals whose ascension to the throne would almost certainly gaurantee civil war. And you're next in line (your son from your second wife, princess of England) may well be a genius with claims to other titles. At times like that, you'll find how cold blooded you can be when "thinning the heard".

I don't know about your other preferred media, but if you are in to Game of Thrones, then this is the game for you. It's the game George RR Martin would have made if he made games.There is even a very highly regarded Game of Thrones mod out right now.

Fair warning, this game is highly addictive especiallly when you add the various mods - many of which add some intriguing "what-if" scenarios.

To give you a real taste of the RPG elements. I'll spoilierize it, but there isn't much in here that is exactly a spoiler. Your game will likely go vastly different from mine, and that's the point.
Spoiler

My most recent game I started as a Duke of some importance in Southern Italy. I then conquered Sicily in the name of Christ naming myself King. My descendants would later launch an invasion of France with the pope's blessing against it's excomunicated ruler. I and my allies (secured through Marriage) succeeded in topling the regime leaving me at the top of two kingdoms. At which point I willingly joined the Byzantine Empire.

The Emperor was all too happy to add my holdings to his realm, and I made like a good little vassal, all the while my eventual plan to see one of my dynastic decendants on the throne. The sitting Emperor was far to powerful and popular to try and take down. But he happened to have a very single daughter, who made a very nice wife for my heir. Once the emperor died, I started a faction to put that daughter on the throne. With the combined might of Sicily, France, and as many of his vassals as I could bribe into turn against him, I launched a war against the new emperor that ended with a his sister on the throne, and my grandson as next in line.

However Her continued rule, and thus eventual succession to my grandson, was far from assured. Soon other factions arose for her siblings, and through assisination, political maneuvring, and yes sometimes war, the other primary claimants were killed, imprisoned, or subdued. It would not be the last time I'd have to do this. As the years wore on, I continued to subjegate more kingdoms when from across the Atlantic word comes of England (at this time part of the Holy Roman Empire) being invaded by the Aztecs (one of those "what-if" scenarios). England is quickly steam rolled, and I'm concerned about my holdings in France...

Thankfully the Holy Roman Emperor and the Pope were none too please about these new heathens encroaching on their territory. The Pope was quick to call a crusade, and being a good Christian I volunteered the might of the Byzantine Empire to the cause. The Pope and the HRE's forces weren't very coordinated, and weren't powerful enough to confront the Aztec directly. But they did provide the diversion I needed to gather my own vast forces. The Aztecs hade a force aproximately 160,000 strong made up of many heavy infranty. Normally an insurmountable force. However my Byzantine cataphracts backed by conscripts from around the realm were up to the task. I sent my best generals and in invasion force to England.

Once there, I enacted my favorite tactic. I call it the "Byzantine Rat Trap". I landed a small force of about 30,000 men in "Land's End" England, the very place the Aztecs themselves had first invaded. 30,000 A very sizable force, but obviously no match for the 160,000 force the Aztecs had. And it proved all too tempting of a target for the Aztec commander. He went for the bait, and as he egaged my diversionary force, I landed another 200,000 of the Empire's finest troops. The end result: the Aztecs suffered massive caulties, leaving only about 50,000 alive to my 160,000+. In full retreat, they fled for their lives but my forces were unrelenting in their pursuit. Most of their forces dead, their best commanders imprisoned or dead themselves, defeat was inevitable.

Normally, in light of my overwhelming contribution to the Crusade, the Pope would have awarded the kingdom of England to me. However, since the Holy Roman Emperor was the primary title claimant, and a God fearing Catholic, his possessions were returned to him. But it was worth it to end the Aztec threat once and for all (believe me this is not always the case). When the dust settled the Byazntine Empire stood as the mightiest in the world. United, its subject kingdoms could overcome any foe. Holding it together was at times tricky, requiring the occaisional bribe, assassination plot, or other political maneuver, but the Empire endured. Soon Egypt and Jerusuelum were conquered. Then all of Northen Africa. I was close to achieving my goal: Restoration of the Roman Empire.

The Pope was a problem. Sitting as the head of Rome, he held lands that I needed... So, I installed my own pope. With my hand picked pontif at the head of my army, the sitting pope had no choice but to abdicate. With my puppet in the Vatican, I was the master of both Church and State (and garnered the rather lucrative financial benefits that came with having the Pope as your vassal). Conquering the few remaining territories in Italy I was finally able to proclaim myself Emperor of a restored Roman Empire, with Holdings that ringed the Mediteranean and held vast swaths of Europe and the middle-east...

Some CK2 fans may ask, "where the hell the Mongols were in this game?". Well, funny story. Normally they are a giant thorn in my side. But when the Illkhanate and the Golden horde invaded within close proximity, they actually took on each other intially. I took advantage of this time to try and send religious emissarys to try and convert these heathens to Christianity. Soon the Illkhanate emerged victorious, and despite imprisioning a few of the missionaries I sent, did in fact convert to a form of Christianity. It was a Heretical version of Greek Orthodox, but still Christian none the less. I don't know if that's the reason, or if it simply seemed wiser to gobble up the fractured muslim kingdoms in Persia and the middle east, or the kingdoms of eastern europe rather than to take on the Byzantine Empire in Turkey. It's also possible that the forces of the Golden Horde, and the Illkhanate annihlated each other - a crippling blow that would prevent them from ever mounting a real threat to the Christian world.

Anyway, that should give you a taste of the complexity involved in this game. And it has evolved quite a bit, the developers are constantly adding new content, whether it is fluff such as new music or graphics, or hardcore additions such as "legacy of rome" (Allows restoring the Roman Empire) or the "sunset invasion" (Aztecs)

[Edi]

If strategy games are up your alley, try the new Dominions 4 when it comes out at the end of August or early September. To get an idea of what it's like (only a lot better), you can grab the Dominions 3 demo for free and give that a spin.

The game does not have high end graphics (more like mid-late 1990s), but it will give you your share of number crunching and opportunity for analysis and then some. The Dominions 3 manual was 300 pages long and I'll be very, very surprised if the Dominions 4 manual is any shorter. The additional documentation for the game is also significant.

[Esquire]

<snip>

Welp, that settles it, this is being added to my library.