Homebrew tabletop game system thread the II

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

Rohal could be in one or two places, depending- in wolf form at the moment, and with the party, but- head up, ears up, nose twitching, staring into the distance- clearly senses something that might matter. probbaly wants to go and look at it, whatever it is.

Dale can tell, though, looking at the crowded village, that the people in it have barely, and by great struggle, emerged from the shadow of death-a good case can be made that they cheated death, in fact. You know you ought to care about that- but can't quite decide if it's right or wrong.

The group you're with, not so much- only Lisanna, and she seems more like their guide through it all.

She notices, and chooses to ask 'Can you tell us a little more about the elves you met?'

[Fiji_Fury]

"I have seen many elves in the past several days. They move about cautiously, but they are not quite so stealthy as they think... at least for the most part. Two groups I've seen coming from the south, and both had scouts harass me into moving well clear of their main path. The first moved to the east many days back. The other is still nearby. Those one's were sour and becoming desperate. The threads of their lives are running short and if nothing else, that is upsetting them. I have been shot at more than once, although had they wanted me dead I certainly would be. Their intent seems to have been more to test how I would react, perhaps to draw out any allies I had or drive me off. I am alone, and while I did move away from their provocation, this land is unfamliar to me and I am not certain what is causing their bitter and erratic behavior."

"A different party of elves crossed my path three days past, coming from the west. A small group, and much less hostile although they made no particular attempt to engage me in any greeting or conversation. They had me watched for half a day then moved on about whatever their business was. I think there have been more small parties criss crossing the landscape under the moonlight, but sign of them has been much less clear."

Dale looks down at the elven prisoner and frowns.

"Whatever he has done, his kin will be drawn to him. Holding him as a prisoner will invite conflict, bloodshed, death. If that is what you seek, so be it. If not, you would do well to release him now before his bitter kin become enraged and your choices are renderred moot."

[Simon_Jester]

"It's a little late for that." Larric stares flintily, in the general direction of Randolf (if Randolf is visible; he doesn't seem to be) or the dissection site or pyre (if not). "This lot's running from their war with the Zarths* down south. Some of them hate everything with round ears so much, their brains get scrambled."

He looks and Panzer and Dirt. "Can we get away with her plan, do you think? Something about it... I don't know. As soon as they talk to him, any trickery we've got is over.

*Unless Dale has moved very far, very fast, he'll know that the kingdoms of Zarthan are to the south of Kuquan, the land he is now traveling through.

OOC:

I always think of Kuquan as having medieval France's climate and medieval England's social structure (complete with longbowmen), with a few deviations from the norm in each case. And Zarthan as bearing a striking resemblance to medieval Spain, with the elves cast as the Moors. That's not strictly accurate, but it helps me get my brain in gear.

ECR calls the inhabitants 'Zarthani;' despite being very shrewd, Larric is what you might call an elementary school dropout, most of his education self-taught and at this phase of his life, the underlying peasant culture is showing a bit, probably because of stress. He tends to use an abbreviated one-syllable pejorative word for the Zarthani without thinking about it, even when he's not particularly angry or hostile. On balance, he doesn't like the Zarthani very much, and holds a mental stereotype of them as violent, touchy, hot-blooded southerners. Although meeting the kind of elves they have to deal with is making him more sympathetic.

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

Is everyone still interested?

Just because I'm away- which I am most weekends over the summer, this time doing a new thing- would you believe pirate re-enactment, up at Fort George, and if you look at the photos I'm not the one in the big hat- doesn't mean everything has to stop.

Have I simply thrown you too big a curve ball with this one? Too complicated a problem?

Talk to me. Seriously. I'm getting worried.

[Simon_Jester]

I'd made the last post; I didn't want to weigh in.

I think this does border on too complicated a problem. Many variables, caught between forces that would utterly squash us in a fight- it'd be fun with the right kind of party in a tabletop environment where things evolved faster, but I'm not sure it's working here. There's such a thing as too intricately political and complex.

Kaelan and Rohal have both been very explicit about how busy they are; since Dirt's the party's only expert on dark elves that leaves us seriously short-handed given the plan that was getting nosed about last week. Vehrec seems... I don't know; my impression is that the character is badly out of his depth, something along the lines of "Dammit, Jim, I'm a doctor, not a commando!"

Panzer's been kind of out of it; I'm afraid we've been hitting him with negative reinforcement. When he's not involved the situation evolves so fast he seems to get mixed up about what's going on, and when he tries to get involved again it gets awkward.

I think Fiji's character still needs more help figuring out what's going on, or Fiji doesn't know what to do in this situation- the backstory of the setting is complicated enough that most people won't have much to say when faced with a political situation cold.


I'm still interested, but that feeling that we've got a big enough problem to choke on and no leverage to handle it with is pretty strong. I get the idea that the PCs are supposed to become movers and shakers in their own right. But that's only possible if there's something TO move and shake, and if the (broadly) intended consequences of PC actions are more important than the unintended ones. Here, the reverse was true- Randolf acted according to his own motivations, and now we're morally certain a party of dangerous homicidal loony elves are going to drop on us. Nothing we can do on purpose will do more than get us out of the jam we accidentally wound up in just by showing up in the town. And even that's going to be damned hard.

We never even had a real chance to convince them not to attack us, as far as I can tell; they were the practical equivalent of mindless WAAAGHing orcs. Not even sensible enough to pretend to agree to our terms and ride off to tell their friends they were going to have to beat the supplies out of us.

Which is probably a fair characterization of this particular stripe of Alanavirimirian elves in your campaign setting. But so far... of the five times we've encountered elves, on four occasions any attempt at negotiation was useless and it turned into a fight to the death almost immediately. Even if it's realistic, it's kind of discouraging.

That might count as playtesting advice, honestly.

[Fiji_Fury]

OOC:

So here's my thoughts on the current problems:
1) Elves - specifically, these ones are aggressive and possibly psychotic (the one tied up as prisoner certainly is). Are the rest of them so threatening to a town full of soldiers and regular inhabitants plus PC's that we need a convoluted solution here? After all, our group is headed back to the capital, right? The Baron's forces are headed back to the capital. Can less than a quarter the number of the Baron's forces (unless I'm counting wrong) really hope to attack without suffering losses of their own? Losses they cannot replace at all. I'm not so certain that all the Elves are trigger happy in the face of an armed numerically superior force. Although my character has no background with the specific situation (he came to the barony for other purposes than Elves... at least he thinks so), I'd suggest letting the elf go back to his people and leave the ball in their court, with a solid thrashing ready if they should attack the Baron and his soldiers. Blend in with them and the Elves present no insurmountable combat problem. While dissecting the dead elf cannot have earned any happy points, the Elves themselves are a problem for the Baron. Confer with him to see what he wants done and attempt to carry out his orders without getting killed. The man survived a death trap and brought a lot of his fighting forces out of it. He's probably more cagey and potentially nasty than anyone's bothered to give him credit for. I cannot see him wasting combat resources (PC's included). For bonus points, perhaps try to approach him with a summary about the Elves with townsfolk observing so that he can demonstrate his duty to protect the people from armed threats.

2) Pace of player posts - no real advice here. I'd have posted more myself in character by now, but the character is still so new to the situation, hungry and an outsider to boot that it doesn't seem right to be determining the course of events. Much like Simon_Jester, I'm looking forward to the others re-engaging with the game so that the plot can move forward. Whether it moves into a cautious advance to the capitol or a bloodbath or a wacky scheme to simulate Svartfellen to scare off the refugee Elves or something else. Let's finish getting input from everyone and then roll the dice to see what happens.

[Simon_Jester]

OOC:

Wooo!

[waves Fiji flag]

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

Now that is the sort of way of looking at the problem, and solution, I hoped you would come up with. There's no "set" way out of this, of course.
Who you end up on the right and wrong side of matters, but don't look for perfection- wing it, flange it, and as Aburon said, "there are times when the next few years are going to seem bloody awful." Dodging a problem is perfectly acceptable, remember your characters probably want to live and survive; being confused and deciding discretion is the better part of valour is all human.

Clever solutions are appreciated, and I really didn't think this problem had that few corners to gain leverage on when it wandered across your path. In fact, I was thinking 'this is what's going to happen sooner or later, let's make it a nice gentle introduction to the problem- with about five hundred armed men to back them up.'

Closer in numerical odds to less than a tenth- what came out of the cavern was about fifty knights and squires and four hundred or so fighting men, plus about two hundred followers and dependents; the elves would very probably lose, if they were mad enough to try.

Which, the problem is, they may be.

I can't remember if I said this on the internet, but I frequently do around the table- sometimes the best weapon you cn have is a properly primed and pointed NPC. This is the Baron's job, and Lisanna is getting carried away by a thought process that runs more or less "who, me? Right, what do I do, I don't have the faintest idea, this really is a problem, wait, that might just work, therefore it has to work" in suggesting that she can take care of it.

The one bunch of elves it didn't come to a fight with were that hunting team of the locals, who actually set out to bring down one of their own who had become a renegade and a danger. Another option, perhaps?

[Panzersharkcat]

Since that part was said out of character, Alfred says, "I'm not sure. I am not particularly good at deceit. If that's the only plan we have we may have to go with it. I don't like the odds, though."

[Simon_Jester]

OOC:

...This is the Baron's job, and Lisanna is getting carried away by a thought process that runs more or less "who, me? Right, what do I do, I don't have the faintest idea, this really is a problem, wait, that might just work, therefore it has to work" in suggesting that she can take care of it.

Oh, right! This is Lisanna we're talking about, not a regular people! How could I have forgotten?

Well, Larric was already the party's designated driver in most things, so...

IC:

Larric opens his mouth. Closes it. Opens it again, raises a finger in the air...

"Hang on there. Something's awry. Did we just talk past the part where we five get into bowshot of forty mad elves? I thought we had an army. Why not just keep the elf prisoner, in the middle of all the baron's troops, clear back to Qulan? If the elves want a fight, they're a bunch of bandits, that's what armies are for..."

[Panzersharkcat]

"And abandon the village to those elves? I don't believe we'd be able to station enough combat-effective men here, as we did eat a lot of the village's food and they'd still be fairly famished. I suppose if we took most of the main force back to Qulan and return with greater supplies. The village may also come under attack in the meantime."

(OOC: For some reason, I thought there were more elves, enough to make a fight between two armies likely. Unless that meant the 40 would fetch reinforcements from elsewhere.)

[Fiji_Fury]

"Could you appeal to the commander of this army to deal with the Elves? Either through combat or other means. 40 Elves and a small band holding one of them as prisoner is courting death. 40 Elves vs. hundreds of soldiers means the Elves either won't attack or will but face death themselves. The second option appeals more to myself, though I cannot speak for any of you."

Dale glances at the Elf in bonds.

"Is there any benefit from keeping this one prisoner? Releasing him beyond the edge of the town might go a long way toward encouraging the Elves out there to move on."

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

'Oh.' Lisanna says, as what she was about to commit to filters to the top of her conscious mind. 'I think I may have lost my sense of smell when it comes to probabilities. Assuming that only the drastic option, only something unlikely and convolutedly devious- anything that doesn't involve certain death would pass the smell test, and that's- dangerous. You're right.

Shall we do it the simple and straightforward way, then? Who votes for letting him go back to his people, who for keeping him prisoner, and who for subjecting him to the law and trying him for banditry and magical coercion?'

[Simon_Jester]

OOC:

(OOC: For some reason, I thought there were more elves, enough to make a fight between two armies likely. Unless that meant the 40 would fetch reinforcements from elsewhere.)

There are actually more like fifty, apparently. Larric's being rhetorical, or assuming that some of the elves are too young/sick/hungry/batshit to use a bow effectively. Not sure which, to tell the truth.

IC:

"If he's a prisoner, wouldn't dropping the law on him just be sense? And letting him go... hmm. He's so mad he might get the elf-bandits roaring after us, and smack into the baron's army. Better for the peasants, and less work for whoever has to catch them, to boot. I can't say I like it, but it might be for the best. I'll bet his lot are good at sneaking around making trouble without getting caught, otherwise."

OOC MK II:

There you have it, the Larric definition of guerilla warfare.

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

Spoiler

This bunch are, ah, the tip of the spear.

To give you some idea of the scale of the problem, the Spiral Forest (two, three days to the southwest of Auvaine) may contain somewhere upwards of twenty or thirty thousand elves- it uses the tracklessness of the deep woods to play tracks on the visitor's sense of time and space, and feeds back into using the confused visitors to play tricks on time and space; it is about ten, fifteen miles across on the outside, maybe a hundred on the inside.

Alavanirimire- the destroyed kingdom the bunch you're dealing with- had lost such wonders during the course of the wars, but there were still a fair few of them, and they are now scattering in all directions. The forty or fifty or so you have to deal with now are effectively pathfinders for all the rest- how you deal with them is going to colour how the rest, coming this way, probably a four digit number, deal with you.

See what I mean about peace of mind? This is going to happen anyway, incidentally- this is one of the tidal waves coming your way. One day at a time, one problem at a time, never give up.

'We can't let them go on the way they mean to.' Lisanna says. 'Not and survive ourselves- I have an idea. You may want to stop me.' She smiles a shy, selfconscious smile.
'I'd like to try to get in touch with some of the local elves, see what their approach to this is, try to convince them to take in some of their stray kin if at all possible, or at least not to side with them. Stand watch tonight, try the one we have in the morning if he's still here, and deal with it from there?'

[Simon_Jester]

Larric shrugs.

"Couldn't-" pause "Ah, sounds right, let's call it instead. Something like that half-worked for us, last time we had this trouble. Three days ago, and a good deal smaller, mind you."

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

To go back to where you actually are then; a village overflowing with the fighting nobility and their retinues and supporters.

For a social climber, the land of opportunity- especially as all their heads are not on entirely straight yet. Some are not entirely sane, although presumably they were at some point- there's one drunken idiot talking loudly about going back down there and giving the monster what for, and a couple of other people noisily telling him he's an idiot.

Some are considering what happens now; they've all got a rough version of the story of what happened above ground- from Aburon, mostly, and he almost certainly skewed the truth a little.

Several wakes, after a fashion, are being held- it is loud and noisy, and made more so by the people yelling at the loud ones to shut up.

Apart from the elvish problem- worry about the humans for a second. Alfred will have been summoned to the baron's presence, he's more or less holding court by the fire in the inn, with what few scraps of parchment the village can provide, drawing up a list of who is and who isn't dead, what has to be settled; for anyone with ambition, he might as well be holding square feet of diamond.

Randolf will be in contact with the high proportion of them who got in the way of something metal and ugly- there are a wide range of reactions, arrogance over survivor's guilt, simply relieved to be alive, frightened, self- deluding, name it.

What are you- all of you- doing and saying to them?

Oh, and just as a matter of interest, who's awake at about half past two in the morning?

[Simon_Jester]

OOC:

This is about as late as I can stay up safely in this line of work [hides protein depolarizer from future self].

IC:

Larric has no particular political ambition.

I don't know if Alfred does. Sir Julian (the alternate character I conceived of) would seriously consider giving his left nut to be at that fireside. He'd probably decide against anything that drastic. Probably.

I almost wish I were playing him; two characters at once might be a little much though. I never did shoot you that draft though, did I, ECR?

[Kaelan]

OOC
I'm back from the lands time forgot (honestly, you'd think after 2000+ years of road building and development, pillaging aside, the east coast of south England would have some road infrastructure and life......)
Anyhow, back to the game

IC
Dirt returns with a tray of food, drink, any maybe Rohal? along with a few minor would be bloodstains on the edges of his clothes.
“Spice?” he offers out a small pouch of herbs, placing it on the tray.

Looking over the bickering (politicking?) humans by the fire Dirt is starting to feel as though he’s back in the elf caverns again and groans, to Larric
“Dirt leave cave to get away from that” – indicating the intrigue underway.
The worst thing is that without the coloured scraps of cloth they ware Dirt can hardly tell them apart.

Back to elf problems then. Well, our prisoner is still alive at the moment, so I guess we’re not heading off to war just yet. If we’re going to involve other elves there are only two groups Dirt can think off.
“We sell elf to svarts’, or give to bush elf?”

Either way it’s a means to start a conversation with them. As for political ambition “Stormageddon, Lord of darkness, master of all he surveys” has a nice ring to it, but I suspect that certain people may object. When we find a nice town to settle down in Dirt may try to obtain the role of Sheriff and school teacher.

[Kaelan]

Unless of course we can find some one mad enough to make Dirt a knight. Mammoth jousing anybody?

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

The Twentieth did have part of it's artillery train pulled by pachyderms; at least two of which got the hang of it, and started working and serving (in the gunnery sense) the thaumaturgical engine they were supposed to be transporting. You'd have to find them and make them a better offer, though.

As a matter of interest- in fact, Tamarin is away talking for her lands and her future, she's round the fireside with the Baron, Lisanna will suggest 'Have you tried feeding the elf? If he's suffering from some sort of dietary deficiency that sets him on a vicious circle, weakens his wits, it's the obvious answer.'
She will try the spices, by the way. Relatively few airs and graces when she's hungry, incidentally; doesn't eat like a noblewoman.

Dirt's trying to stay out of the politics of it, Alfred is in the midst of it whether he likes it or not and I would appreciate a statement of intent, Rohal can sense something on the wind- is looking in the direction of the mountain.

Dale, Larric?

[Simon_Jester]

Larric nods mournfully at Dirt. "Aye. Good cause to leave."

He's not particularly hungry- looks closely at the food. If it looks like something that might plausibly come from a 'normal' village kitchen he'll nibble at it a bit. No spice- "I'm used to it bland, but thank you..."

"And, huh. Dirt'd know how to feed an elf right. What do you think he's missing?" [looking at the ogre]

[Kaelan]

"Taste. Elf taste more than human. Human food to bland or to spicy. Need lots of different food to create change. Stop mouth getting bored with food. Wake up body."

Dirt looks over the elf

"Most likely eating trail food too long"

With that Dirt will see what he can rustle up for the elf to bring him back on the track of sanity.

[Fiji_Fury]

Dale will gratefully accept some food from Dirt and attempt the spice that was offered as well. He eyes the Baron's court with some interest, but is drawn more to the mourners and wakes. He's not very impressed with the loud and drunken types but is willing to share a quiet word with any of those who are more subdued and seeming disturbed about the losses they suffered. Dale is also rather curious about what took place and how they suffered loss of lives. And how those present ultimately survived. His sense about them cheating death is intriguing, and he'd like to explore that.

He'll offer and share some prayers of consolation for those who are grieving (although he's not entirely certain where all the prayers and words come from), and try to reassure them that their dead have moved on to a different, and probably better place. The adventure of their spirits will continue, and one day, those who survived will go forth and join them. But not this day. Instead, they have more life yet to experience.

If only he could be in more than one place, Dale would also check in and speak with Rohal, who seems to keep glancing toward the mountain with some concern evident upon his face. He notices Rohal's separation from many of the people present and has a vague sense that Rohal is not exactly what he seems. This is another curiosity, although not one that disturbes Dale, but rather he is curious. First though attend to the matter of the mourners.

Finally (and this is along stretch, I know) if there is time, Dale will attempt to inspect the Elven prisoner, particularly trying to feel out a sense of how much life is left in him.

I'm prepared to play out or be interrupted in any of these steps as is appropriate. They merely reflect Dale's preferred activities should time and the flow of events permit.

[Fiji_Fury]

Addnedum to interactions with the mourners:

Should it seems prudent or the opportunity present itself, Dale will extract his wood flute from his possessions and play a few soothing and subdued songs. He seems to mostly know songs in minor key, but will pick out those which may be restive to the people he is interacting with.