Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

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Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Alyrium Denryle »

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/20 ... ivers.html
The Arizona Supreme Court issued a stunning and horrifying decision on Tuesday, interpreting a state law to criminalize any contact between an adult and a child’s genitals. According to the court, the law’s sweep encompasses wholly innocent conduct, such as changing a diaper or bathing a baby. As the stinging dissent notes, “parents and other caregivers” in the state are now considered to be “child molesters or sex abusers under Arizona law.” Those convicted under the statute may be imprisoned for five years.

How did this happen? A combination of bad legislating and terrible judging. Start with the legislature, which passed laws forbidding any person from “intentionally or knowingly … touching … any part of the genitals, anus or female breast” of a child “under fifteen years of age.” Notice something odd about that? Although the laws call such contact “child molestation” or “sexual abuse,” the statutes themselves do not require the “touching” to be sexual in nature. (No other state’s law excludes this element of improper sexual intent.) Indeed, read literally, the statutes would seem to prohibit parents from changing their child’s diaper. And the measures forbid both “direct and indirect touching,” meaning parents cannot even bathe their child without becoming sexual abusers under the law.

Arizona’s Supreme Court had an opportunity to remedy this glaring problem. A man convicted under these laws urged the justices to limit the statutes’ scope by interpreting the “touching” element to require some sexual intent. But by a 3-2 vote, the court refused and declared that the law criminalized the completely innocent touching of a child. The majority declined to “rewrite the statutes to require the state to prove sexual motivation, when the statutes clearly contain no such requirement.” Moreover, the court held that the laws posed no due process problem, because those prosecuted under the statute could still assert “lack of sexual motivation” as an “affirmative defense” at trial—one the defendant himself must prove to the jury “by a preponderance of the evidence.” As to the risk that the law criminalizes typical parental tasks, the majority shrugs that “prosecutors are unlikely to charge parents” engaged in innocent conduct. (This “just trust the prosecutors” dodge doesn’t always work out so well in Arizona.)

In a searing dissent, two justices pointed out the most obvious flaw of this logic: It renders the laws unconstitutional. “No one thinks that the legislature really intended to criminalize every knowing or intentional act of touching a child in the prohibited areas,” the dissent explains. “Reading the statutes as doing so creates a constitutional vagueness problem, as it would mean both that people do not have fair notice of what is actually prohibited and that the laws do not adequately constrain prosecutorial discretion”—a requirement under the Due Process Clause of the 14th Amendment.

The majority responds that any potential vagueness problem is remedied by the fact that defendants can attempt to prove their innocent state of mind as an affirmative defense. Not so, the dissent retorts: By requiring the defendant to prove his innocence (instead of requiring the state to prove his guilt), Arizona has “shifted to the accused the burden of proving the absence of the very fact—sexual motivation—that distinguishes criminal from innocent conduct.” That, too, runs afoul of due process by “criminalizing a broad swath of indisputably innocent conduct but assigning to defendants the burden of proving their conduct was not criminally motivated.”

Bizarrely, the majority insists that if prosecutors did charge parents for changing their child’s diaper, they could argue that they were exercising “their fundamental, constitutional right to manage and care for their children.” This alleged defense is cold comfort. As Matt Brown notes at Mimesis Law, Arizona’s sentencing laws are so stringent—and state courts are “so unwilling to dismiss sex charges based on as-applied constitutional challenges” before trial and conviction—that innocent parents will “sit in prison for quite some time” before a higher court vacates their sentence on constitutional grounds.

Equally puzzling is the majority’s assertion that parents can still present their innocence as an “affirmative defense” in court. Even if this strategy works, the Arizona laws will still have arguably intruded upon their fundamental right to “care for their children” without state interference. After all, as the dissent notes, such a defense “does not mean that a crime has not occurred, but instead that the miscreant may avoid ‘culpability’ by persuading the factfinder that the ‘criminal conduct’ should be excused.” And this relief would likely only come after a lengthy, expensive, and reputation-tarnishing trial.

As Fordham law professor John Pfaff explains, the majority’s logic has one final defect: It utterly ignores the reality of plea bargaining, which is how more than 90 percent of criminal cases in America are resolved. Given the immense expense and hassle of a trial, many defendants are pressured into striking a deal with a prosecutor, trading a lighter sentence for an admission of guilt. Arizona prosecutors can now dangle the threat of a probable child molestation conviction to coerce any parent of a young child into taking a plea deal on unrelated charges. With the state Supreme Court’s help, Arizona’s child molestation laws have been weaponized into a tool for prosecutorial harassment, allowing the state to target any parent or caregiver—out of spite or malice, or simply to boost their conviction rates. This terrible decision has gutted constitutional rights and turned many of the state’s residents into unknowing criminals. Barring intervention by the U.S. Supreme Court, due process has now been suspended for Arizona’s parents and caregivers.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Napoleon the Clown »

I am shocked, shocked I say, that the state that keeps allowing Joe Arpaio have a job, that passed laws that presume any person who looks vaguely Mexican is a probable illegal immigrant, that would favor Donald Trump in the Republican primaries, would not only pass a law this horribly idiotic, but proceed to interpret it in a grossly unconstitutional manner. It's simply unfathomable.

Fuck Arizona, and fuck the three judges that made this decision. It's gonna be a circus for the state legislature to get rid of the law and replace it with something that will actually protect children without making it criminal to bathe a child.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

Isn't this the state that reelected the woman with dementia after she stuck her finger in Obama's face (The optics and press would have been horrible, but I still wish the Secret Service had body slammed the old bag onto the tarmac) and during a debate just froze for 30 seconds?

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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Eternal_Freedom »

Damnit. I liked Arizona, I went there on a week long field trip in university and it was amazing. And then shit like this comes along.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Republicans gonna Republican.

But seriously, this is just fucking idiotic. And a violation of the rights of innocent people.

I'm just waiting for this to get appealed to the Supreme Court, and hoping the court isn't yet so broken for it to result in a four/four split. :banghead:
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by General Zod »

Eternal_Freedom wrote:Damnit. I liked Arizona, I went there on a week long field trip in university and it was amazing. And then shit like this comes along.
Arizona's basically the Florida of the west.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Dragon Angel »

I take it if you're actually charged under this law, it'll also record you under the forever-you-are-marked sex offender list?

So, even if it's repealed and criminal records are "cleaned", this would potentially stay permanent. :|
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by General Zod »

Dragon Angel wrote:I take it if you're actually charged under this law, it'll also record you under the forever-you-are-marked sex offender list?

So, even if it's repealed and criminal records are "cleaned", this would potentially stay permanent. :|
Pretty much. It's illegal to be a pediatrician or a parent in Arizona, now.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

On the other hand, it's a good excuse to get out of diaper changing duty. :roll:
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Terralthra »

Worth noting that the particular case here was a grandfather touching his eleven year-old granddaughter on the breasts, buttocks, and genitals. There wasn't a diaper involved here.

The law itself does definitely need to be amended to include intent.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

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The Romulan Republic wrote:Republicans gonna Republican.
While this seems to hold true in this particular incident, this is not really a partisan issue with the law. Such laws were used to bust people for indecent exposure involving children for stuff like having sex at the beach, even though the children weren't "near" and the offenders were behind closed doors, a tent shade, etc. The law was amended to force prosecutors to prove intent. This is also a reason why prosecutors have been throwing their hands up when it comes to Stand Your Ground.

"You murdered that guy, prove it was in self-defense." They relied on that kind of prosecution for so long, they were nearly unable to prosecute under laws where they hand to prove guilt, not rely on the citizen to prove innocence.

Laws of this type exist specifically for police, prosecutors, and judges to throw the book at people they don't like and to do whatever they can to easily pad conviction numbers through plea bargains. Or just fry the shit out of you if they don't particularly like you. Same thing with laws concerning X amount of drugs instantly assumes intent to sell or having X amount of cash on you assumes you are performing some type of illegal activity, so you have to justify whatever specific dollar amount you happen to have on you and the police find suspicious.

If you can't prove intent, then just write laws that either ignore it or assume it. You know, asshole lawmaking 101.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

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I'd be interested to read the dissenting opinion on this case since those two judges were completely and totally wrong on the law.

You read that right, this decision by the Arizona Supreme Court is the correct interpretation based on precedent and jurisprudence.

According to many, many previous rulings by everyone including the supreme court, there is no constitutional requirement for the government to follow "common sense"; and "due process" is apparently a worthless phrase that just means that previously established processes were followed.

Martin v. Ohio was a murder case in 1987 that finally killed the idea of "substantive due process", ie the concept that criminal acts as defined by the legislature should actually be crimes:
After being assaulted by her husband, the defendant killed him as he approached her. The trial court instructed the jury that it must find that the prosecution established, beyond a reasonable doubt, the following elements of aggravated murder in order to return a guilty verdict: with purpose and with prior calculation and design, causing the death of another. The jury was also instructed that although it could consider the defendant’s evidence of self-defense in determining the defendant’s guilt, she bore the burden of persuasion on proving to the jury, by a preponderance of the evidence, the defense of self-defense. The jury returned a verdict of guilty, which two state appellate courts affirmed.

Affirming the conviction, the Supreme Court ruled that since the jury could consider self-defense even if the defendant did not meet her burden of persuasion, and that proving self-defense did not disprove any of the elements of the offense, allocating the burden of persuasion to the defendant did not violate constitutional standards of due process.
Basically it threw "Mens Reas" or "intent" out the window. Now laws are free to criminalize whatever the fuck they want, and force the defendant to prove that they didn't intend to do anything criminal\morally wrong.

Which is obviously an impossible thing to prove in nearly any case.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Simon_Jester »

Could you expand a bit on how Martin v. Ohio generalizes from "you have to prove a self-defense claim in a murder case" to "defendant has to prove lack of criminal intent in all cases?"

Moreover, could you expand on how Martin v. Ohio makes it valid for states (or the federal government) to pass laws "criminaliz[ing] whatever the fuck they want?"
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

Simon_Jester wrote:Could you expand a bit on how Martin v. Ohio generalizes from "you have to prove a self-defense claim in a murder case" to "defendant has to prove lack of criminal intent in all cases?"

Moreover, could you expand on how Martin v. Ohio makes it valid for states (or the federal government) to pass laws "criminaliz[ing] whatever the fuck they want?"
Yeah, I don't get it either. Self Defense (along with insanity/ temporary insanity) is what's called an "affirmative defense", meaning the burden of proof falls on the defense to provide evidence of self defense/insanity.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Simon_Jester »

Well, I imagine DA's line of reasoning is that if self defense is an affirmative defense, that means "lack of criminal intent" must be an affirmative defense in ALL crimes. Or something like that.

But I'm not sure, and I don't want to go on following this line without knowing what DA is thinking. I'd be at risk of strawmanning if I tried to fill in all the blanks in his argument.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

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The way it was explained to me, if you claim you killed someone - an action almost always considered a very serious crime - in self defense you have, essentially, just confessed to killing someone and it is now on you to prove why this particular circumstance is an exception to the usual rule that killing someone is murder.

My understanding (subject to change with further information, of course) is that this Arizona law has changed the situation from prosecution having to prove that a crime occurred when someone touched a child to the current situation where the assumption is that a crime has occurred if a child is touched at all and it's on the accused to prove why this situation is NOT abuse.

This strikes me as a stupid situation, as anyone who has been responsible for a small child knows that infants and toddlers can't wipe their own ass, literally, and thus ordinary maintenance of such a child requires touching the child and thus Arizona has criminalized normal child care.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by InsaneTD »

Eh. Just phone in that you saw a prominent member of the Arizona government with a young (grand)child touching said child and then watch how fast the law changes.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

Broomstick wrote:The way it was explained to me, if you claim you killed someone - an action almost always considered a very serious crime - in self defense you have, essentially, just confessed to killing someone and it is now on you to prove why this particular circumstance is an exception to the usual rule that killing someone is murder.
That's basically the case if you're arrested and charged. The law varies from state to state, though. 9/10 of the time it's pretty clear cut where a stranger is in your house at 1am with burglary tools and brand new holes in them. You will still have to go to the station to make a statement, but the chances of being charged are nil. With the SYG laws though...
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

Overall, this is one of those laws that will almost certainly never be used against someone changing a babies diaper, it was just written by morons.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Dominus Atheos »

Flagg wrote:
Simon_Jester wrote:Could you expand a bit on how Martin v. Ohio generalizes from "you have to prove a self-defense claim in a murder case" to "defendant has to prove lack of criminal intent in all cases?"

Moreover, could you expand on how Martin v. Ohio makes it valid for states (or the federal government) to pass laws "criminaliz[ing] whatever the fuck they want?"
Yeah, I don't get it either. Self Defense (along with insanity/ temporary insanity) is what's called an "affirmative defense", meaning the burden of proof falls on the defense to provide evidence of self defense/insanity.
From the article:
Moreover, the court held that the laws posed no due process problem, because those prosecuted under the statute could still assert “lack of sexual motivation” as an “affirmative defense” at trial—one the defendant himself must prove to the jury “by a preponderance of the evidence.”
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

Dominus Atheos wrote:
Flagg wrote:
Simon_Jester wrote:Could you expand a bit on how Martin v. Ohio generalizes from "you have to prove a self-defense claim in a murder case" to "defendant has to prove lack of criminal intent in all cases?"

Moreover, could you expand on how Martin v. Ohio makes it valid for states (or the federal government) to pass laws "criminaliz[ing] whatever the fuck they want?"
Yeah, I don't get it either. Self Defense (along with insanity/ temporary insanity) is what's called an "affirmative defense", meaning the burden of proof falls on the defense to provide evidence of self defense/insanity.
From the article:
Moreover, the court held that the laws posed no due process problem, because those prosecuted under the statute could still assert “lack of sexual motivation” as an “affirmative defense” at trial—one the defendant himself must prove to the jury “by a preponderance of the evidence.”
Well that's just fucking unreasonably stupid. I doubt this will even make it to SCOTUS.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Simon_Jester »

Broomstick wrote:The way it was explained to me, if you claim you killed someone - an action almost always considered a very serious crime - in self defense you have, essentially, just confessed to killing someone and it is now on you to prove why this particular circumstance is an exception to the usual rule that killing someone is murder.
That's certainly the case when we talk about murder and killings in general.

Dominus seems to be arguing that the state of US constitutional law is such that this applies to all crimes- the state can "criminalize whatever... it wants" and then force you to prove in court that you had no criminal intent while carrying out the action it just made illegal. I'm asking him for clarification on that for obvious reasons.
My understanding (subject to change with further information, of course) is that this Arizona law has changed the situation from prosecution having to prove that a crime occurred when someone touched a child to the current situation where the assumption is that a crime has occurred if a child is touched at all and it's on the accused to prove why this situation is NOT abuse.

This strikes me as a stupid situation, as anyone who has been responsible for a small child knows that infants and toddlers can't wipe their own ass, literally, and thus ordinary maintenance of such a child requires touching the child and thus Arizona has criminalized normal child care.
Well yes- and my view is that it is for exactly this reason, the Arizona law is improper, and I suspect it is unconstitutional in addition to being improper.

DA seems to be arguing that while this law is clearly stupid, it is fully constitutional and proper by the standards of the US judicial system. And I'm asking him for clarification on that.
Flagg wrote:Overall, this is one of those laws that will almost certainly never be used against someone changing a babies diaper, it was just written by morons.
Yeah. The problem is that as written the law still provides grounds for the police to arrest people on suspicion of, well, changing diapers. Even if the prosecutor decides not to press charges, it is a very bad idea to have laws on the books banning basic normal things. It should not be up to prosecutorial discretion whether or not the average citizen can go about their daily lives without being arrested.
Dominus Atheos wrote:From the article:
Moreover, the court held that the laws posed no due process problem, because those prosecuted under the statute could still assert “lack of sexual motivation” as an “affirmative defense” at trial—one the defendant himself must prove to the jury “by a preponderance of the evidence.”
Well yes, the Arizona State Supreme Court is holding that a law that bans changing diapers is okay because the defendant can plead "changing diapers is not a sexual thing" as an affirmative defense.

That is not the same argument as the one you were making earlier, which is that under the (presumably flawed) standards of American jurisprudence, the Arizona courts were 'right' to make the ruling that they did.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Flagg »

Simon_Jester wrote:Yeah. The problem is that as written the law still provides grounds for the police to arrest people on suspicion of, well, changing diapers. Even if the prosecutor decides not to press charges, it is a very bad idea to have laws on the books banning basic normal things. It should not be up to prosecutorial discretion whether or not the average citizen can go about their daily lives without being arrested.
Oh I'm with you, and as it stands the law needs to be gutted like so much trout. I was just pointing out that the chances of it being enforced for diaper changes are pretty low. I mean pretty much every level of government in the US has unenforceable laws.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

Post by Dominus Atheos »

Dominus Atheos wrote:From the article:
Moreover, the court held that the laws posed no due process problem, because those prosecuted under the statute could still assert “lack of sexual motivation” as an “affirmative defense” at trial—one the defendant himself must prove to the jury “by a preponderance of the evidence.”
Well yes, the Arizona State Supreme Court is holding that a law that bans changing diapers is okay because the defendant can plead "changing diapers is not a sexual thing" as an affirmative defense.

That is not the same argument as the one you were making earlier, which is that under the (presumably flawed) standards of American jurisprudence, the Arizona courts were 'right' to make the ruling that they did.
What aren't you getting? SCOTUS has ruled that the burden of proof of intent can be shifted to the defendant, and laws can just criminalize actions ("elements of the crime").

This law does that exactly.
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Re: Changing a diaper is now child molestation in Arizona.

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Affirming the conviction, the Supreme Court ruled that since the jury could consider (lack of sexual motivation) even if the defendant did not meet her burden of persuasion, and that proving (lack of sexual motivation) did not disprove any of the elements of the offense, allocating the burden of persuasion to the defendant did not violate constitutional standards of due process
From Martin.
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