ISIS destroyed Jonah's tomb and other historical sites

[Borgholio]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/2 ... 20520.html

The militant group ISIS is continuing its rampage of holy places by destroying the tomb of Jonah, a place thought to be the burial site of the prophet believed by Abrahamic faiths to have been swallowed by a whale or fish.

Civil defense officials in Mosul, Iraq, told CNN that ISIS operatives planted explosives around the mosque containing the tomb then detonated it remotely on Thursday.

A video posted to YouTube, the authenticity of which has not yet been confirmed, shows the destruction of the Sunni Mosque of the Prophet Younis, which is the Arabic name for Jonah. Though ISIS claims to adhere to the Sunni branch of Islam, they have nonetheless targeted multiple Sunni shrines, blowing up or bulldozing any place they deem "unIslamic."

According to The Guardian, people living nearby the mosque told AP that ISIS members had declared that the holy site "had become a place for apostasy, not prayer." The Imam Aoun Bin al-Hassan mosque was also destroyed on Thursday.

The tomb of Daniel, a man revered by Muslims as a prophet though unlike Jonah, he is not mentioned in the Quran, has also been reportedly destroyed. Al-Arabiya reports that Zuhair al-Chalabi, a local Mosul official, told Al-Samaria News that “ISIS implanted explosives around Prophet Daniel’s tomb in Mosul and blasted it, leading to its destruction."

AFP reports that an anonymous official said, "Islamic State completely destroyed the shrine of Nabi Yunus after telling local families to stay away and closing the roads to a distance of 500 metres from the shrine."

The tomb of Jonah was a popular place of pilgrimage for people who would come from around the world to see it, before the arrival of ISIS in Mosul. At the end of the video showing the destruction of Jonah's tomb, a man can be heard saying,"No, no, no. Prophet Jonas is gone. God, these scoundrels," according to NPR.

This latest act by ISIS shows their disregard for holy places, even Muslim ones from the Sunni sect they claim to hail from. Sam Hardy, a professor at the American University of Rome, told The Washington Post that he believes this shows that ISIS is willing to destroy, "basically pretty much anything in the Bible." He added, “It indicates they are going for total eradication not just of their enemies but even of the possibility of people living together under their rule."

Leila Fadel of NPR believes that ISIS's destruction of shrines may be a big mistake when it comes to rallying other Muslim militant groups to its cause, especially considering that it previously declared an "Islamic caliphate." She said, "it may cause a deep rift in the uneasy alliances the Sunni extremist group has made with other Sunni fighting groups marginalized."

Please welcome Taliban Mk 2.

[Crossroads Inc.]

You know... I really wish I could get these people together in a room and ask them just what the FUCK. They hope to accomplish...
Are they doing this for "Allah" ?
Do they think history is going to "thank" them for this?
Do think it's existence has some how spread evil and wickedness?
I mean wtf !!!

[Borgholio]

Funny thing is that Jonah's tomb is a holy spot for all Abrahamic religions including Islam. So they're destroying their own cultural monuments because they don't like the people who come to worship at them.

[Starglider]

You know... I really wish I could get these people together in a room and ask them just what the FUCK. They hope to accomplish...

They would laugh, shoot you, and then post the smartphone video of you being shot to YouTube.

[Darmalus]

You know... I really wish I could get these people together in a room and ask them just what the FUCK. They hope to accomplish...

Removing anything that isn't them.

Do they think history is going to "thank" them for this?

History is their enemy. If historians are getting angry, to them that means they are doing it right.

[xerex]

Funny thing is that Jonah's tomb is a holy spot for all Abrahamic religions including Islam. So they're destroying their own cultural monuments because they don't like the people who come to worship at them.

Actually ISIS are iconoclasts. They intend to wipe out all shrines and monuments

They've even stated that they intend to destroy the Kaaba as it has now become an idol distracting from God.

[Borgholio]

They've even stated that they intend to destroy the Kaaba as it has now become an idol distracting from God.

Might be interesting if we were to let them. Get the Arab world to wipe them out for us.

[Thanas]

Saudi Arabia engages in a lot of archeological destruction as well, basically everything that speaks against the official history is destroyed or neglected (like the many very old christian churches that in some cases get bulldozed). Really, nobody really cares about history in that part of the world unless it can be used for politics. The only examples outside of that are Jordan and Israel (Egypt and surprisingly Iran to some degree as well). But that is about it, every other state doesn't really care.

[Grumman]

Actually ISIS are iconoclasts.

All of Sunni Islam has an iconoclastic streak to it. The Taliban, ISIS and the Wahhabi movement are all born from the branch of Islam which believes Muhammad should not be depicted.

[xerex]

Actually ISIS are iconoclasts.

All of Sunni Islam has an iconoclastic streak to it. The Taliban, ISIS and the Wahhabi movement are all born from the branch of Islam which believes Muhammad should not be depicted.

Iconclastic streak yes, but this is like comparing Presbyterianism with the Jehovah's Witnesses because both are Protestant.

The Taliban actually did not emerge from the Wahhabis which are Hanbali School , they emerged from the Deobandi who are Hanafi School.


Both are Sunni true,and Sunnis dont depict Muhammad, but then again Sunnis are 90% of all Muslims so they're less of a branch and more of a trunk.

[Highlord Laan]

You know... I really wish I could get these people together in a room and ask them just what the FUCK. They hope to accomplish...
Are they doing this for "Allah" ?
Do they think history is going to "thank" them for this?
Do think it's existence has some how spread evil and wickedness?
I mean wtf !!!

ISIS is a rampaging horde of what can best be called animals in human form. Conversing with them is pointless, as it'a debatable if they're even capable of the higher brain functions generally associated with being a human being. Would you ask a rabid dog why it bites people? The same situation, and the same response to it, apply here.

[Channel72]

It's really discouraging that the Iraqi military is having so much trouble with these idiots.

They have serious delusions of grandeur, with the goal of establishing a pan-Arab Islamic state/Caliphate, and ultimately... "taking over the world", beginning with Rome. Seriously.

I guess London and New York aren't good enough for them.

[xerex]

ISIS is a rampaging horde of what can best be called animals in human form. Conversing with them is pointless, as it'a debatable if they're even capable of the higher brain functions generally associated with being a human being. Would you ask a rabid dog why it bites people? The same situation, and the same response to it, apply here.

It's really discouraging that the Iraqi military is having so much trouble with these idiots.

They have serious delusions of grandeur, with the goal of establishing a pan-Arab Islamic state/Caliphate, and ultimately... "taking over the world", beginning with Rome. Seriously.

I guess London and New York aren't good enough for them.

A rampaging horde that has better command and control, mobility , initiative and morale than its current opponents. they are not idiots.

The Iraqi military's leadership is so corrupt , its war fighting capabilities have been gutted. Supply of food and water has been subcontracted to private companies who refuse to deliver to combat zones assuming they actually exist and the money hasnt gone straight into the generals pockets. About a third of the Iraqi Army doesnt actually exist, its just ghost names collecting paychecks which go into the generals pockets. And of course the officer corp is completely dominated by politically reliable incompetents.

Its the same story every time. Grunts are low on food and water, the officers abandon them , ISIS uses massive firepower and the army cracks and retreats.


The Syrian Army is better but as the loss of the 17th Division shows, ISIS is no slouch . They went straight for the operations centre, killed off the commanders, then hit the Division from all sides . they managed to integrate car bombs as actual military weapons now instead of terror tactics.

[PKRudeBoy]

ISIS is a rampaging horde of what can best be called animals in human form. Conversing with them is pointless, as it'a debatable if they're even capable of the higher brain functions generally associated with being a human being. Would you ask a rabid dog why it bites people? The same situation, and the same response to it, apply here.

It's really discouraging that the Iraqi military is having so much trouble with these idiots.

They have serious delusions of grandeur, with the goal of establishing a pan-Arab Islamic state/Caliphate, and ultimately... "taking over the world", beginning with Rome. Seriously.

I guess London and New York aren't good enough for them.

A rampaging horde that has better command and control, mobility , initiative and morale than its current opponents. they are not idiots.

The Iraqi military's leadership is so corrupt , its war fighting capabilities have been gutted. Supply of food and water has been subcontracted to private companies who refuse to deliver to combat zones assuming they actually exist and the money hasnt gone straight into the generals pockets. About a third of the Iraqi Army doesnt actually exist, its just ghost names collecting paychecks which go into the generals pockets. And of course the officer corp is completely dominated by politically reliable incompetents.

Its the same story every time. Grunts are low on food and water, the officers abandon them , ISIS uses massive firepower and the army cracks and retreats.


The Syrian Army is better but as the loss of the 17th Division shows, ISIS is no slouch . They went straight for the operations centre, killed off the commanders, then hit the Division from all sides . they managed to integrate car bombs as actual military weapons now instead of terror tactics.

I can't understand the mindset that would let this happen in the slightest. Not to say I approve of corrupt oligarchies, but if you're going to go down that path, you at least need to make sure the people keeping you in power can actually do it. What use is pocketing a division's pay if you end up killed in a revolt?

[Steve]

Saving up enough money to flee to Europe or somewhere else in general, one suspects.

[Thanas]

It's really discouraging that the Iraqi military is having so much trouble with these idiots.

They have serious delusions of grandeur, with the goal of establishing a pan-Arab Islamic state/Caliphate, and ultimately... "taking over the world", beginning with Rome. Seriously.

I guess London and New York aren't good enough for them.

That is because Rome has left a much larger impression as a religious and political center than New York or London ever will.

[Metahive]

ISIS is a rampaging horde of what can best be called animals in human form. Conversing with them is pointless, as it'a debatable if they're even capable of the higher brain functions generally associated with being a human being. Would you ask a rabid dog why it bites people? The same situation, and the same response to it, apply here.

No,they're fucking human beings who are doing what fucking human beings do in fucked up areas of the fucking world. They are not fucking aliens, they're not fucking demons and they're not fucking animals, they're fucking HUMANS! Just as you and me and everyone else on this board. FUCKING HUMANS, FUCKING ALL OF THEM, ARE CAPABLE OF DOING FUCKED UP SHIT, HAVE ALWAYS BEEN, WILL ALWAYS BE! Time to accept the fucking truth. Nazis, Stalinists, Maoists, rapists, murderers, ALL 100% EARTH-BRED HUMAN!

[Irbis]

Actually ISIS are iconoclasts.

All of Sunni Islam has an iconoclastic streak to it. The Taliban, ISIS and the Wahhabi movement are all born from the branch of Islam which believes Muhammad should not be depicted.

Yes. They are doing nothing that Saudis weren't for decades. Hell, Bible itself commands "thou shall make no images" so they are in agreement with more radical Christian sects, too.

The fact that West so cares about history is just cherry on top, they can kick the whole civilization of death club in the nuts from safety of their own territory

It's really discouraging that the Iraqi military is having so much trouble with these idiots.

That's what happens when you ignore, stomp on and marginalize more than half of your population. You need to really try to make people prefer ISIS from you...

[madd0ct0r]

I mentioned the Kaaba threat to one of the Iraqi's in my office.

"Ugh Daash [Middle east name] are complete idiots. In one place, there was a shrine and next to the shrine was a beautiful tall tree. They destroyed the shrine, but people still visited becuase it was a holy site. So they cut down the tree. Why? what had the tree done? it was nothing to do with it. These people are worthless."

He didn't seem that bothered by killings or explosions, but the tree broke something for him.

[Channel72]

I'm surprised Isis has so much funding and support. Their interests literally don't align with like, anybody. The Saudis certainly don't want these guys taking control, the Syrians don't either (the Syrian government is actually bombing them), Iran doesn't need this shit either. Even fucking Al-Qaeda disowned them. It's like, they have no friends, yet they seem to have enough funding and support to take over major cities. Where are they getting the manpower and funding from? Yeah, their goals certainly appeal to disillusioned radicals and desperate idiots with nothing to lose, but I'm surprised that's enough for a movement this large and organized.

[Thanas]

Manpower isn't that much of a problem, as for funding, there are enough crazy rich saudis to go around.

[Irbis]

I can't understand the mindset that would let this happen in the slightest. Not to say I approve of corrupt oligarchies, but if you're going to go down that path, you at least need to make sure the people keeping you in power can actually do it. What use is pocketing a division's pay if you end up killed in a revolt?

You are under illusion they think of Iraq like we think of our states. That is not so. Iraq isn't law abiding state hundreds of years old like western ones. It's less than century old arbitrary line on the map written by ignorant British cricket player who didn't gave a damn about religious or ethnical divides. No one thinks of it as their state outside of Baghdad.

Once USA went in and destroyed fragile supports that kept the whole thing together it wasn't one state, it was 3 big fragments with dozen smaller splinters. Frankly, putting your money on "I don't think there will be Iraq state in a decade" and making run for it to Switzerland or Bahamas or anywhere else where you will get status of rich refugee with no questions asked doesn't sound that insane.

There is also the fact that US imported elites that rule now were such refugees once, under Saddam, they probably already have connections and safe havens somewhere else so why not pad the safe nest while you're at it?

I'm surprised Isis has so much funding and support. Their interests literally don't align with like, anybody. The Saudis certainly don't want these guys taking control, the Syrians don't either (the Syrian government is actually bombing them), Iran doesn't need this shit either. Even fucking Al-Qaeda disowned them. It's like, they have no friends, yet they seem to have enough funding and support to take over major cities. Where are they getting the manpower and funding from? Yeah, their goals certainly appeal to disillusioned radicals and desperate idiots with nothing to lose, but I'm surprised that's enough for a movement this large and organized.

Again, they are Sunnis that rules Iraq under Saddam, then were stomped on by Shiite majority in 10 year long crawling war under USA. They see Iraq as alien state, and given choice between ISIS and Baghdad, they picked someone who isn't going to crusade them without pretext. That's how government loses despite 10:1 advantage in forces, they have no support among population and each retaliatory raid just produces more enemy recruits.

I'd say most of ISIS is simply revolting against Shiite Iraq, the religious fundamentalist part is minority and I wouldn't be surprised if the worst among them were foreigners or doing it only for fundamentalist money.

[Channel72]

Your lack of faith in Iraqi nationalism is debatable. Yeah, Iraq is ultimately an arbitrary British creation, but it's fostered a sense of solid nationalism in the intervening decades. Just look at how Iraqis reacted to their football team doing well during the summer Olympics. The association with ancient Mesopotamia and cosmopolitan Baghdad also helps create a sense of nationalistic pride. Anecdotally, most Iraqi nationals express affection for their country, before the US fucked it up via sanctions and war. And I'm not only talking about people who lived in Baghdad, but also people from Basra and Mosul.

[xerex]

I'm surprised Isis has so much funding and support. Their interests literally don't align with like, anybody.

1. You know how the German conservatives aligned with the Nazis because they thought they could control them ? Same deal here. ISIS picked up a lot of Sunni tribal and ex-Baathist support because they were proving the be the most durable Sunni rebel group. Their allies expected to be able to eliminate the "barbarian horde" once they achieved power. Unfortunately ISIS moved first and executed many of the ex-Baathist leadership after they took Mosul.

Similarly its seems that until this month ISIS and Assad had an understanding that they would focus on the other rebel groups first and fight each other last. To the point that ISIS was selling oil to the Syrian Regime from the fields they controlled. That ended this month when ISIS went on the offensive.

2. Their lack of petty corruption is actually a welcome change for some in the Arab world. Articles I ve read state that even with the imposition of religious taxes it's actually cheaper to live in ISIS territory now because the citizenry no longer have to pay bribes to every bureaucrat. Prices of basic good have actually fallen.

3. Success breeds success . The bandwagon effect.

[xerex]

one more point


4. In a perverse way ISIS is the most meritocratic Arab "state" currently. Familiy connections and bribes wont help you rise in their ranks . For an angry young Sunni man stymied by his govt that has to be attractive.