General Police Abuse Thread

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Gandalf » 2018-08-21 07:26pm

On the other hand, it's a great way of showing how the huge problem the US has with police abuses is seeping into more mainstream popular culture. It's no longer the domain of artists like Ice T or NWA.

So I'm all for the article here.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Rogue 9 » 2018-08-22 10:23pm

Kamakazie Sith wrote:
2018-08-21 06:37pm
No offense Rogue and I'm sure you mean well but is this thread really an appropriate place for an onion article?

This thread contains stories of unbelievable abuses and murders so it just seems out of place, you know?
Apart from breaking the tension a bit, Gandalf's point is what I was going for. I'm sorry if it bothers you.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-08-25 07:02am

Rogue 9 wrote:
2018-08-22 10:23pm
Apart from breaking the tension a bit, Gandalf's point is what I was going for. I'm sorry if it bothers you.
No need for an apology. You did not bother me or offend me but thank you for the consideration.

I thought it was pretty clear I was talking about the topic of the thread which is not satirical articles on police abuses and not my personal feelings. However, your explanation or rather Gandalf makes sense.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by TheFeniX » 2018-09-07 12:03pm

Normal Person:
1. Walk into apartment that isn't yours.
2. Shoot person living there.
3. Go to jail pending investigation.

American LEO:
1. Walk into apartment the isn't yours.
2. Shoot person living there.
3. Get placed on "administrative leave" pending investigation.

American citizens lucky enough not to be gunned down in own home:
1. Listen to police talk about how they AREN'T above the law.

EDIT: fucking seriously, what right do the police have to not release the name of an off-duty cop who murdered a man in his own home?/EDIT

How being a cop works:
DALLAS, Texas (KTRK) --
A Dallas police officer returning home from work shot and killed a neighbor after she said she mistook his apartment for her own, police said Friday.

The officer called dispatch to report that she had shot the man Thursday night, police said. She told responding officers that she believed the victim's apartment was her own when she entered it.

The responding officers administered first aid to the victim, whom the Dallas County medical examiner's office identified as 26-year-old Botham Jean. He was taken to a hospital and pronounced dead.

Police haven't released the name of the officer, who wasn't injured. She will be placed on administrative leave pending the outcome of the investigation, police said.

Authorities haven't said how the officer got into Jean's home, or whether his door was open or unlocked.

At a Friday morning news conference, Sgt. Warren Mitchell acknowledged there are many questions about what happened that he couldn't answer.

"We still have a lot to do in this investigation. So there's a lot of information I understand you guys want but this is all we can give you at this time," Mitchell said.

When asked if anyone else had witnessed the shooting, Warren replied, "We have not spoken to anyone else at this time."

Police said they are conducting a joint investigation with the Dallas County district attorney's office.

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-08 11:24pm

TheFeniX wrote:
2018-09-07 12:03pm
Normal Person:
1. Walk into apartment that isn't yours.
2. Shoot person living there.
3. Go to jail pending investigation.

American LEO:
1. Walk into apartment the isn't yours.
2. Shoot person living there.
3. Get placed on "administrative leave" pending investigation.
This incident is the most pronounced that I can remember and it shows just how right you are. Had this been any other person they would have been booked into jail and what's crazy to me is so far we haven't heard the standard "afraid for my life" line...though that's probably on its way.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by TheFeniX » 2018-09-08 11:35pm

Kamakazie Sith wrote:
2018-09-08 11:24pm
This incident is the most pronounced that I can remember and it shows just how right you are. Had this been any other person they would have been booked into jail and what's crazy to me is so far we haven't heard the standard "afraid for my life" line...though that's probably on its way.
To be fair to Dallas PD: she called it in as an "officer involved shooting." So they treated it as such at first. Within 8 hours or so, the department called it for what it was and issued a warrant for her arrest and went for manslaughter charges. While I still think it's shady they refuse to release the name (I don't feel cops should immediately release names of suspects, but they are MORE THAN WILLING to do so consistently) until the charges are filed, they seem to have been very up-front about the situation, even calling in Texas Rangers.

I'm at the point now to say this isn't so much a case of police abuse, but that Dallas PD got roped into protecting an officer of theirs because the wool was pulled over their eyes.

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-08 11:41pm

TheFeniX wrote:
2018-09-08 11:35pm
To be fair to Dallas PD: she called it in as an "officer involved shooting." So they treated it as such at first. Within 8 hours or so, the department called it for what it was and issued a warrant for her arrest and went for manslaughter charges. While I still think it's shady they refuse to release the name (I don't feel cops should immediately release names of suspects, but they are MORE THAN WILLING to do so consistently) until the charges are filed, they seem to have been very up-front about the situation, even calling in Texas Rangers.

I'm at the point now to say this isn't so much a case of police abuse, but that Dallas PD got roped into protecting an officer of theirs because the wool was pulled over their eyes.
Ah, I didn't know that. That improves my perception of Dallas PD significantly. I was pretty disappointed in them. Also, I agree with you regarding the names of suspects I see it as due process. The names should be with held for all suspects unless there is a public safety issue.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-09 12:18am

TheFeniX wrote:
2018-09-08 11:35pm
To be fair to Dallas PD: she called it in as an "officer involved shooting." So they treated it as such at first. Within 8 hours or so, the department called it for what it was and issued a warrant for her arrest and went for manslaughter charges. While I still think it's shady they refuse to release the name (I don't feel cops should immediately release names of suspects, but they are MORE THAN WILLING to do so consistently) until the charges are filed, they seem to have been very up-front about the situation, even calling in Texas Rangers.

I'm at the point now to say this isn't so much a case of police abuse, but that Dallas PD got roped into protecting an officer of theirs because the wool was pulled over their eyes.
There's been an update.

Source


I quoted the below because it is relevant to what we were discussing.
"Our policy is, and I want us to make sure we're as transparent as possible — we wouldn't release any other suspect's name until they are charged," Hall said.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Rogue 9 » 2018-09-09 11:40am

NPR reported yesterday that the manslaughter charges are on hold by request of the Texas Rangers until they finish their investigation. I don't know if that's still the case; I heard it on the radio in the car and haven't had time to follow up.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-10 02:20pm

She was booked on manslaughter charges and is now out on a $300,000 bail.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2018-09-17 02:32am

Kamakazie Sith wrote:
2018-09-10 02:20pm
She was booked on manslaughter charges and is now out on a $300,000 bail.
Where did she get three hundred thousand in bail money? I doubt most cops can afford that from their personal savings. Right-wing group crowdsourced funds to get her out or something?
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Ralin » 2018-09-17 02:50am

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2018-09-17 02:32am
Where did she get three hundred thousand in bail money? I doubt most cops can afford that from their personal savings. Right-wing group crowdsourced funds to get her out or something?
More likely she was released on bond and either KS or his source was being imprecise with their wording.

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by TheFeniX » 2018-09-17 11:50am

Dallas PD got a warrant to search the victims apartment. The article itself is about other things, but the interview with the family lawyer states (paraphrasing): "The warrant was specific to search the apartment for drug paraphernalia." They found ~10mg of marijuana. Information of which they were willing to release quickly to the public which is hard to see any something besides a smear campaign against the deceased victim.

Yet toxicology on both the victim and the shooter has yet to be completed/released which, sorry it doesn't take that long if you rush it, I don't THINK they should just release all this info to the public, but goddamn if they're going to release every little bit they can: Gimme gimme!

The Texas Rangers have since taken over the investigation.

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-17 02:05pm

TheFeniX wrote:
2018-09-17 11:50am
Dallas PD got a warrant to search the victims apartment. The article itself is about other things, but the interview with the family lawyer states (paraphrasing): "The warrant was specific to search the apartment for drug paraphernalia." They found ~10mg of marijuana. Information of which they were willing to release quickly to the public which is hard to see any something besides a smear campaign against the deceased victim.

Yet toxicology on both the victim and the shooter has yet to be completed/released which, sorry it doesn't take that long if you rush it, I don't THINK they should just release all this info to the public, but goddamn if they're going to release every little bit they can: Gimme gimme!

The Texas Rangers have since taken over the investigation.
The victims apartment is the crime scene and obtaining a warrant is matter of procedure when investigating major crimes in residences. The marijuana was on the kitchen counter and likely seen in plain view during the initial response. It's actually good investigative policy for them to request a search for further contraband because now we know that Botham Jean wasn't some hardcore drug dealer which if they had not done so a defense attorney could use to suggest doubt to a jury. The amount he had can only be resolved with a citation in Dallas (not the rest of Texas).

As for who released this information. Dallas PD is a possible source and so are those who work at the court house. However, warrants are a matter of public record in Texas unless sealed and at the time this warrant was not sealed. There have been some other warrants issued in this investigation and they have been sealed since. Certain media elements could have a source inside Dallas PD or inside the courts and they love releasing this kind of thing.
Ralin wrote:
2018-09-17 02:50am
The Romulan Republic wrote:
2018-09-17 02:32am
Where did she get three hundred thousand in bail money? I doubt most cops can afford that from their personal savings. Right-wing group crowdsourced funds to get her out or something?
More likely she was released on bond and either KS or his source was being imprecise with their wording.
It was a bond. Probably my mistake.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by TheFeniX » 2018-09-17 02:15pm

Kamakazie Sith wrote:
2018-09-17 02:05pm
The victims apartment is the crime scene and obtaining a warrant is matter of procedure when investigating major crimes in residences. The marijuana was on the kitchen counter and likely seen in plain view during the initial response. It's actually good investigative policy for them to request a search for further contraband because now we know that Botham Jean wasn't some hardcore drug dealer which if they had not done so a defense attorney could use to suggest doubt to a jury. The amount he had can only be resolved with a citation in Dallas (not the rest of Texas).
I thought the same, but the family lawyer is claiming the warrant had specific language to look for "drug paraphernalia." The only reason (I could come up with) they would do this legitimately would be to see if the officer planted drugs at the scene after the fact. But still, that's a long shot.

Why is the "owner" of the home having drugs pertinent to this case? They are (supposedly) already running toxicology. Even if he was drunk, there's nothing against the law about being hammered in your own home, especially when you were shot from 15 feet away.

EDIT: OK, I see your point now. If they did originally see the drugs, that would make more sense. I guess what doesn't make sense is them taking the other stuff. And I think that's bullshit. There's no point in ransacking the personal effects of someone obviously murdered in their own home.

Double edit: though it's also possible if they don't wreck up the place, the cop's lawyer can claim officers didn't do their due diligence.
As for who released this information. Dallas PD is a possible source and so are those who work at the court house. However, warrants are a matter of public record in Texas unless sealed and at the time this warrant was not sealed. There have been some other warrants issued in this investigation and they have been sealed since. Certain media elements could have a source inside Dallas PD or inside the courts and they love releasing this kind of thing.
I feel the results of the warrant should be kept confidential until trial though. I just get annoyed that police/prosecutors are extremely blase' about the "procedure" concerning release of information to the public. Information that slanders <not them> is seemingly ALWAYS available. While anything else is covered under layers of red tape.

Probably because dead civilians don't have a union to back them up. We should all unionize under the "don't murder me in my own place, bro" charter.

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-21 10:29pm

TheFeniX wrote:
2018-09-17 02:15pm
I thought the same, but the family lawyer is claiming the warrant had specific language to look for "drug paraphernalia." The only reason (I could come up with) they would do this legitimately would be to see if the officer planted drugs at the scene after the fact. But still, that's a long shot.

Why is the "owner" of the home having drugs pertinent to this case? They are (supposedly) already running toxicology. Even if he was drunk, there's nothing against the law about being hammered in your own home, especially when you were shot from 15 feet away.

EDIT: OK, I see your point now. If they did originally see the drugs, that would make more sense. I guess what doesn't make sense is them taking the other stuff. And I think that's bullshit. There's no point in ransacking the personal effects of someone obviously murdered in their own home.

Double edit: though it's also possible if they don't wreck up the place, the cop's lawyer can claim officers didn't do their due diligence.
This is a list of the stuff that was taken;
2 fired cartridge casings
1 laptop computer
1 black backpack with police equipment and paperwork
1 insulated lunch box
1 black ballistic vest with "police" markings
10.4 grams of marijuana in ziplock bags
1 metal marijuana grinder
2 RFID keys
2 used packages of medical aid

I'm thinking the laptop, obviously the black backpack, lunch box all belong to Amber Guyger.

Possibly the RFID keys as well. The used medical aid was likely materials left behind by EMS crews.

I feel the results of the warrant should be kept confidential until trial though. I just get annoyed that police/prosecutors are extremely blase' about the "procedure" concerning release of information to the public. Information that slanders <not them> is seemingly ALWAYS available. While anything else is covered under layers of red tape.

Probably because dead civilians don't have a union to back them up. We should all unionize under the "don't murder me in my own place, bro" charter.
I agree on the warrants. If past history and current activity do not matter then I don't see why an officers past disciplinary history matters. Don't get me wrong. I don't think it matters and it should not be released but like I said it seems this is behavior that both sides of this discussion engage in. I mean there's a photo going around of Amber Guyger with her arms around a group of people, one of which is a male that is throwing up some white power signs. Amber Guyger is not but you understand the implication.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Agent Fisher » 2018-09-22 02:53am

Kamakazie Sith wrote:
2018-09-21 10:29pm
I mean there's a photo going around of Amber Guyger with her arms around a group of people, one of which is a male that is throwing up some white power signs.

Actual white power signs or the circle game that 4Chan decided to make the main stream media believe is a white power symbol?

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-22 03:35pm

Agent Fisher wrote:
2018-09-22 02:53am
Kamakazie Sith wrote:
2018-09-21 10:29pm
I mean there's a photo going around of Amber Guyger with her arms around a group of people, one of which is a male that is throwing up some white power signs.
Actual white power signs or the circle game that 4Chan decided to make the main stream media believe is a white power symbol?
Well, I have it from a good source that circle game has been adopted by some white power groups as a symbol. I mean take the clothing line FUBU. It was adopted as clothing by the bloods and to them basically means "Fuck U Bloods Up". So, it shouldn't come to anyone surprise that they would take a circle game being represented as a white power symbol and actually make it one. Whether that is the intent of the male in the photograph is unknown but my point is it is irrelevant and is meant to imply that Guyger is a white supremacist.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by LadyTevar » 2018-09-22 06:07pm

....
You guys DO REALIZE the Circle Game has been around since the 1970s, yes? It was all the rage in my Jr. High by 1980, and all the guys played.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-09-23 01:15am

LadyTevar wrote:
2018-09-22 06:07pm
....
You guys DO REALIZE the Circle Game has been around since the 1970s, yes? It was all the rage in my Jr. High by 1980, and all the guys played.
Yes, we do. In fact in my previous post I explained what is going on. To reiterate some user on 4chan started the rumor that the circle game was a symbol for white power. At the time this was totally incorrect. However, since 4chan started this rumor actual white power gangs have adopted it because that's what gangs do. They adopt symbols that have other meanings so they can blend in hence the FUBU example.

My overall point is just because you see someone wearing certain clothing or displaying a symbol that alone is not enough to conclude that they belong to a gang.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by mr friendly guy » 2018-11-13 05:18am

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-13/ ... r/10493424
Security guard Jemel Roberson shot dead by police while holding suspect at Chicago bar

RELATED STORY: Doctors post blood-soaked photos after NRA tells them to pipe down over gun laws
A police officer shot and killed a security guard at a suburban Chicago bar on Sunday, and now the guard's mother is suing police, after witnesses said he had subdued a gunman who opened fire at the club.

Key points:
Four others were injured in the shooting
Jemel Roberson, who was black, was the only person killed
A civil rights lawsuit has been filed on behalf of Mr Roberson's mother
Jemel Roberson, 26, was pronounced dead shortly after being taken to a hospital following the shooting at Manny's Blue Room in Robbins, just south of Chicago.

Four others were shot and injured, including a man who police believe fired a gun before the police arrived, Cook County sheriff's spokeswoman Sophia Ansari said.

When police arrived at the scene, Mr Roberson was holding "somebody on the ground with his knee in his back, with his gun in his back," witness Adam Harris told local station WGN-TV.

"Everybody is screaming out, 'He's a security guard,'" Mr Harris said.

Mr Roberson, a father of a nine-month-old boy, was licensed to carry a firearm, Ms Ansari said.

Charges were pending against the man who investigators believe fired the initial shots during a dispute.

His name was yet to be released, and he remained hospitalised, Ms Ansari said.

Investigators said the initial gunfire was reported about 4:00am.

An officer responding from nearby Midlothian encountered and shot "a subject with a gun", Midlothian Police Chief Daniel Delaney said in a statement. The person was later identified as Mr Roberson.

No details have been released about the officer.

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Evidence technicians with state police taking pictures of shell casings in the parking lot of Manny’s Luxury Lounge in Robbins. @cbschicago

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Mr Roberson, who was black, was the only person killed.

The other four people who were shot suffered wounds that were not considered life-threatening, Ms Ansari said.

Attorney Gregory Kulis filed a civil rights lawsuit seeking more than $US1 million on behalf of Mr Roberson's mother, Beatrice Roberson. He said Mr Roberson was dressed in black but wearing a hat with the word "security" when he was shot.

Mr Kulis also echoed witness reports that Mr Roberson was holding down another man outside the bar when the officer arrived and shot him.

The Reverend Marvin Hunter said Mr Roberson was "an upstanding young man" and a promising keyboard player at his and several other area churches.

Mr Roberson was trying to "get enough money together for a deposit on a new apartment", said Reverend Hunter, the great uncle of Laquan McDonald, a black teenager fatally shot by a white Chicago police officer in a high-profile 2014 case.

Mr Roberson also had hopes of someday becoming a police officer, according to his son's mother.

"This was going to be my baby's first Christmas with his dad and now he's going to miss out on everything," Avontea Boose said.

Illinois State Police are handling the investigation into Mr Roberson's shooting.

The agency said it would not comment on the investigation until it was completed.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Kamakazie Sith » 2018-11-13 02:57pm

If the details I've read are accurate then this security guard was also in uniform which shifts this far into the category of unacceptable.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by Agent Fisher » 2018-11-13 08:02pm

The story reports he was in all black with a hat that said security. Here in California if you're gonna be armed, you have to be in a recognizable uniform with patches on the arm and a badge on the chest. Which if this was at night, all black and just a hat that says security is a pretty poor amount of identification, especially if he's carrying a firearm.

Also, holding his gun in his back? Like knee on his back, gun barrel against the guy's spine sort of deal?

So, I'd like a few more details, but yeah, soudns like poor target identification.

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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2018-11-14 02:55am

Well, either that or another case of cops killing someone for Living While Black.
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Re: General Police Abuse Thread

Post by mr friendly guy » 2018-12-01 04:21am

https://www.vox.com/identities/2018/11/ ... ent-dallas
Amber Guyger has been indicted for murder after the Botham Jean shooting
The indictment comes nearly three months after the former police officer shot and killed Jean in his own apartment.
By P.R. Lockhart Updated Nov 30, 2018, 5:23pm EST
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A grand jury has indicted Amber Guyger, the ex-Dallas police officer who fatally shot Botham Jean in his apartment in September, on a murder charge, Dallas District Attorney Faith Johnson announced Friday.

The Friday indictment comes nearly three months after the death of Jean, a 26-year-old accountant and St. Lucia native, who was killed on September 6 as he watched a football game in his apartment. Guyger was off-duty but still in her Dallas Police Department uniform when she shot her upstairs neighbor after entering what she said she thought was her own apartment, saying that she believed he was an intruder. Jean’s family has disputed this account, arguing that Guyger has offered contradicting information about the night of the shooting.

Guyger turned herself in to police on September 9 and was charged with manslaughter before being released on a $300,000 bond that same day. On September 24, after Dallas Police Chief U. Renee Hall previously argued that Guyger could not be fired from her job during the investigation, Guyger was terminated by the police department for engaging “in adverse conduct when she was arrested for manslaughter.”
You can read the rest of the article. Hopefully they convict, given that you know, its not disputed she shot Botham Jean in his own apartment.
Never apologise for being a geek, because they won't apologise to you for being an arsehole. John Barrowman - 22 June 2014 Perth Supernova.

Countries I have been to.
Australia, Canada, China, Denmark, Ecuador, Finland, Germany, Malaysia, Netherlands, Norway, Singapore, Sweden, USA.
Always on the lookout for more nice places to visit.

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