Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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From Yahoo News
— As lawmakers held their first public hearing on legalizing same-sex marriage, a previously undecided Democratic senator on Monday announced her support for the measure, all but ensuring that Washington will become the seventh state to allow gay and lesbian couples to get married.
The announcement by Sen. Mary Margaret Haugen, D-Camano Island, that she would cast the 25th and deciding vote in favor of the issue came as hundreds of people filled the Capitol to advocate for and against gay marriage.
'
In a written statement issued at the end of a Senate committee hearing on the bill, Haugen said she took her time making up her mind to "to reconcile my religious beliefs with my beliefs as an American, as a legislator, and as a wife and mother who cannot deny to others the joys and benefits I enjoy."

"This is the right vote and it is the vote I will cast when this measure comes to the floor," she said.

The state House is widely expected to have enough support to pass gay marriage, and Gov. Chris Gregoire publicly endorsed the proposal earlier this month. If a marriage bill is passed during this legislative session, gay and lesbian couples will be able to get married starting in June unless opponents file a referendum to challenge it. Opponents have already said they will.

A referendum can't be filed until after the bill is passed by the Legislature and signed into law by Gregoire. Opponents then must turn in 120,577 signatures by July 6.

Opponents and supporters packed a Senate committee hearing for the first public hearing of the most high-profile issue before the Legislature this session. The Senate set up three overflow areas for the public, including the public gallery on the Senate floor.

Gay marriage foes wore buttons that said "Marriage. One Man. One Woman." Others wore stickers that read "Washington United for Marriage," a group that announced in November that it was forming a coalition to support same-sex marriage legislation.

Democratic Sen. Ed Murray, a gay lawmaker from Seattle who has led the push for gay civil rights and domestic partnerships, testified before the Government Operations, Tribal Relations & Elections Committee with his longtime partner, Michael Shiosaki.

"I realize the issue of marriage for our families is emotional and divisive," said Murray, who is sponsoring the Senate bill. "It touches what each of us holds most dear, our families."

Others argued that the measure goes against traditional marriage and the Bible.

"You are saying as a committee and a Legislature that you know better than God," said Ken Hutcherson, pastor of Antioch Bible Church.
Committee chairman Craig Pridemore said that no action on the bill would be taken Monday, but that a committee vote would be taken Thursday morning.
The bill is expected to easily pass out of committee, since the four Democratic members, including Pridemore, have all said they would vote yes on the measure. The three Republicans on the committee have all said they will vote against gay marriage.

The House Judiciary Committee held a companion hearing in the afternoon.
Washington would join New York, Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Vermont and the District of Columbia in legalizing gay marriage. The state has had a domestic partnership law since 2007, and an "everything but marriage" law since 2009.

Murray said that upon learning the decisive vote had been secured, he felt "humbled."
"It's an emotional moment," he said. "I want to smile and cry at the same time."
The National Organization for Marriage, noting its involvement in ballot measures that overturned same-sex marriage in California and Maine, issued a statement Monday morning pledging a referendum campaign to fight any gay marriage law in Washington state. Last week, the group announced that it would spend $250,000 to help fund primary challenges to any Washington Republican who crosses party lines to vote for same-sex marriage. So far, two Republicans in the Senate and two in the House have said they would vote in support of gay marriage.

"I want to re-emphasize that we fully expect that this issue is going to end up on the ballot," said Rep. Jamie Pedersen, D-Seattle and sponsor of the House bill, said at a news conference following Haugen's announcement. "People should not be complacent."
Gay marriage has won the backing of several prominent Pacific Northwest businesses, including Microsoft Corp. and NIKE, Inc., and last week a conservative Democrat who once opposed same-sex marriage said he will now vote for it.

Jane Abbot Lighty, 75, and her partner of 35 years, 84-year-old Pete-e Petersen, celebrated the vote-count announcement after the hearing.

"We could have gone out of state and gotten married," said Lighty, of Seattle. "We want to be married in our home state."
In October, a University of Washington poll found that an increasing number of people in the state support same-sex marriage. About 43 percent of respondents said they support gay marriage, up from 30 percent in the same poll five years earlier. Another 22 percent said they support giving identical rights to gay couples but just not calling it marriage.

When asked how they would vote if a referendum challenging a gay marriage law was on the ballot, 55 percent said they would vote yes to uphold the law, with 47 percent of them characterized as "strongly" yes, and 38 percent responded "no," that they would vote to reject a gay marriage law.
Zach Silk, campaign manager for Washington United for Marriage said they were prepared for a tough campaign.
"This is just the first scrimmage into the long battle into November," he said.
____
The gay marriage bills are Senate Bill 6239 and House Bill 2516.

First off, if this passes GOOD ON for Wash!
Fairly large state, and if we can get Or, it will lock up the whole east coast of the nation.
As always with such things, the most amusing aspect is some of the comments involved.

I guess the fact that this is being decided by elected representatives someone means it doesn't count as being "the will of the people"
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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The real fight will be the voter referendum that will no doubt come to fruition when (not if) this legislation passes.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Good on Washington. Also, west coast.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Note: the "everything but marriage" law mentioned in the article WAS passed by referendum vote (or rather, there was a referendum to keep the law from passing, and it was shot down by popular vote.) Of course, even when The People decided it in a vote, the usual suspects were crying about the will of The People being denied anyway.

Also, here's a great thing that Washington does: anytime out-of-state money is used for a political campaign ad, the original source and source state must be listed in the ad. Example:

"GAY MARRIAGE WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING WITH BIG EVIL EVILNESS AND GOD WILL POOP ON YOU WITH FIRE!"
"This message paid for by Some Douchebags in Colorado Springs, Colorado."

This is awesome and should be adopted elsewhere.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Also, here's a great thing that Washington does: anytime out-of-state money is used for a political campaign ad, the original source and source state must be listed in the ad. Example:

"GAY MARRIAGE WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING WITH BIG EVIL EVILNESS AND GOD WILL POOP ON YOU WITH FIRE!"
"This message paid for by Some Douchebags in Colorado Springs, Colorado."
Indeed, especially because when we voted on the "everything but marriage" referendum there was a ton of Mormon money being poured into the state.
The real fight will be the voter referendum that will no doubt come to fruition when (not if) this legislation passes.
Which should be easier because it will be a presidential election year and so there should be more turnout in Seattle and the Puget Sound area in general.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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I'm not sure the referendum will be until 2013, it depends on when they pass the law and when they get enough signatures for the referendum. Some positive things, regardless:

1. That point of law that Amy mentioned; it was delicious during the DP referendum to hear "Focus on the Family of Colorado Springs, Colorado" at the end of every radio ad they paid for.

2. 3 years ago the Referendum 71 people (Lawrence Stickney and his douchebags in the rural town I grew up in--the guy lived within artillery range of my father's house) only got 1,250 more valid signatures than the absolute minimum required to get it on the ballot. The state has only gotten more progressive since then; it's actually possible they won't get enough signatures to qualify the referendum.

3. Worst case scenario, the legislature tries again the year after the referendum fails. Constitutional Amendments in Washington State sensibly have to be voted on by supermajorities of the state house and senate and then go to the people for a straight up or down vote. There can be no constitutional ban on gay marriage in Washington State. All the failure of the referendum can do is prevent the legislative bill from becoming law.

4. This means instead of voting against the measure to succeed, supporters of gay marriage vote in favour of the bill, as it essentially asks, "shall this bill of the legislature actually become law, yes/no?". There tends to be a donkey vote bias in favour of approving things.

5. Gay marriage is presently pseudorecognized in the state, insomuch that an out of state gay marriage like I have is legally considered to count as a domestic partnership, so I get all the rights and benefits of my Iowa marriage, call my spouse a spouse, can say we're married in court, etc. Just can't use the word "marriage". This means the opponents are stuck in the position of looking slightly ridiculous: Fighting the gay menace by forcing them to continue only using the words Married, Wife, Husband, Spouse, instead of adding Marriage to the list!

6. Washington State contains the only predominantly rural, non-major-university holding counties ever--Jefferson, Island, San Juan and Clallam--to vote in favour of gay rights.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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The Duchess of Zeon wrote:2. 3 years ago the Referendum 71 people (Lawrence Stickney and his douchebags in the rural town I grew up in--the guy lived within artillery range of my father's house) only got 1,250 more valid signatures than the absolute minimum required to get it on the ballot. The state has only gotten more progressive since then; it's actually possible they won't get enough signatures to qualify the referendum.
I'm unfortunately ignorant of how the signature gathering process works in Washington. In California, it almost never matters whether or not there is majority support for a proposed initiative. Whether something makes it on the ballot or not depends on how much money is behind it as it's the paid signature gathering business that actually qualifies these initiatives in California. If the system is similar in Washington, you can bet those assholes will magically come up with the signatures they need for the referendum.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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the guy lived within artillery range of my father's house
Please tell me you know this through practical experimentation and not just geography. :D

Anyway, been a long time coming. Hope the UK flips at some point, too, from its current separate-but-equal system of marriages for some and civil unions for the "others". I think there's a referendum on that soon. There were also three (I think) heterosexual couples fighting for civil unions for themselves, saying in effect "we won't get married unless we get the same rights the gays do" with the intention of drawing attention to the policy. I thought that was nice.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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The Duchess of Zeon wrote:5. Gay marriage is presently pseudorecognized in the state, insomuch that an out of state gay marriage like I have is legally considered to count as a domestic partnership, so I get all the rights and benefits of my Iowa marriage, call my spouse a spouse, can say we're married in court, etc. Just can't use the word "marriage". This means the opponents are stuck in the position of looking slightly ridiculous: Fighting the gay menace by forcing them to continue only using the words Married, Wife, Husband, Spouse, instead of adding Marriage to the list!
[Sniffs]

Now, that's just Washington state observing its constitutional obligations a la "full faith and credence..."

Not that opponents of the bill will care...
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Pint0 Xtreme:

You can only start gathering signatures when the legislature passes the law, and 120,577 signatures must be gathered (out of a state population of 7 million, but only around 5 million voters) and delivered 4 months before the election for the referendum to be on the ballot, in this case, July 6th. They only got about 121,786 valid signatures last time around, out of around 131,000 submitted, so they only barely got it on the ballot, and failed to get it defeated, so we won.

Ain't it deliciously complicated? You have to collect signatures to get a referendum on the ballot, and then try and get the referendum to fail, if you want to stop a bill of the legislature from becoming law.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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The Duchess of Zeon wrote:Pint0 Xtreme:

You can only start gathering signatures when the legislature passes the law, and 120,577 signatures must be gathered (out of a state population of 7 million, but only around 5 million voters) and delivered 4 months before the election for the referendum to be on the ballot, in this case, July 6th. They only got about 121,786 valid signatures last time around, out of around 131,000 submitted, so they only barely got it on the ballot, and failed to get it defeated, so we won.

Ain't it deliciously complicated? You have to collect signatures to get a referendum on the ballot, and then try and get the referendum to fail, if you want to stop a bill of the legislature from becoming law.
I understand that part. But my question is does Washington state allow people to pay signature gatherers to collect signatures?
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Sute wrote:Yes, it does.
In that case, expect the referendum to come to fruition. The anti-gay lobby will find the money to make the vote happen.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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They didn't even meet the reserve last time, so I'm not so pessimistic as you are. Regardless the vote is not very concerning; they didn't even bother holding one over the expansion of eligibility to DP rights made earlier this year which made my marriage recognized as one. It will have to be fought, but it's not going to be the end of the world even on the ballot, not here.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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"GAY MARRIAGE WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING WITH BIG EVIL EVILNESS AND GOD WILL POOP ON YOU WITH FIRE!"
"This message paid for by Some Douchebags in Colorado Springs, Colorado."
Not surprising. Slippery slope argument had been used by every half-qualified debaters and demagogues since the birth of Politics.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Any ways, I still can't believe the fact that they are even voting on the issue in Washington. The previous state to legalize gay marriage did it about less than a year ago, I think. It's all an indication that we are actually WINNING the fight for gay rights in America, if you ask me.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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The Duchess of Zeon wrote:They didn't even meet the reserve last time, so I'm not so pessimistic as you are. Regardless the vote is not very concerning; they didn't even bother holding one over the expansion of eligibility to DP rights made earlier this year which made my marriage recognized as one. It will have to be fought, but it's not going to be the end of the world even on the ballot, not here.
If this was any other gay-related law, I would agree with you. But this time, it is about marriage equality and, for all intent and purposes, the religious right tend to stake this very specific issue as their symbolic spiritual fight over what they perceive as a social, cultural and religious evil. The way I see it, the reason why the DP law had such an easy time with the anti-gay lobby was because there was a bigger, more symbolic fight in that same election - Maine's Question 1 over marriage equality.

This year, Maine and Washington are both poised to pass marriage equality. There is absolutely no way the anti-gay lobby is going to let any marriage equality fight go without a stab at the ballot box, which is why I'm realistically confident that if Washington state does have a signature gathering business (and it does), those assholes will find the funds to make it happen just as they did in California in 2008 and just as they did in Maine in 2009. In these situations, it's never the question of whether or not there are enough signatures to qualify the referendum. It's about whether they've got enough paid signature gatherers to get the signatures at a rate fast enough to hit their mark.

But I'm not all gloom and doom. There are reasons you haven't mentioned that also will help us win this fight. For one, it's 2012 and it will be a major election year. The higher the turnout, the greater in percentage that the younger voters will vote increasing our chances at winning. Also, the enemy is going to have to spread their resources across six states this year - Washington, Maine, Maryland, New Jersey, North Carolina and Minnesota. Four of them are likely to see ballot box style fights. And thirdly, while we're still not at a point where we know how to definitively beat them, we've gotten a lot better at this game over the past few years. Expect to see a flurry of television ads using kids to justify bigotry this year. It is going to be one hell of a ride once again.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Also, California recently passed a law requiring state public schools to mention LGBT-specific contributions in their curriculum. No doubt, this caused a great deal of religious bigots to boil in anger. Remember that they framed marriage equality in California as a way for us gay perverts to target kids in schools. That was their ruse to pass proposition 8 in 2008. This law specifically targets kids! (In a good way, of course) Yet, they FAILED to acquire the signatures to reverse this legislation. And the reason for that is not because of the lack of populist anger but because of the lack of funds. It's not a marriage equality issue and the typical would-be funders (Focus on the Family, NOM, LDS Church) did not fund the effort for the initiative. Like I said before, if it was any other gay-related issue, I would have agreed with you. But in Washington, this is a marriage equality law we're talking about. For better or for worse, it's where the big anti-gay dogs come out to play.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Pint0 Xtreme wrote:Also, California recently passed a law requiring state public schools to mention LGBT-specific contributions in their curriculum. No doubt, this caused a great deal of religious bigots to boil in anger. Remember that they framed marriage equality in California as a way for us gay perverts to target kids in schools. That was their ruse to pass proposition 8 in 2008. This law specifically targets kids! (In a good way, of course) Yet, they FAILED to acquire the signatures to reverse this legislation. And the reason for that is not because of the lack of populist anger but because of the lack of funds. It's not a marriage equality issue and the typical would-be funders (Focus on the Family, NOM, LDS Church) did not fund the effort for the initiative. Like I said before, if it was any other gay-related issue, I would have agreed with you. But in Washington, this is a marriage equality law we're talking about. For better or for worse, it's where the big anti-gay dogs come out to play.

Well, let them come on. We don't like foreigners around here. The ultimate underlying protestantism is Scandinavian lutheran, since that's the origin of most of the population, and relatively laid back. Most importantly, this is, by the claims of the evangelicals themselves, the "least churched" state in the country with the rock-bottom lowest church attendance of any US State. And there's no constitutional amendment in the cards. If the legislature has played tit-for-tat "you passed a referendum, we re-pass the law" over Tim Eyman and car licensing tabs in this state for the past 15 years, why not over gay marriage?*


* = Tim Eyman is a lolbertarian who has, since the mid-1990s, done nothing but run his own PAC called "Permanent Offense" which does nothing but use paid signature gatherers to put endless tax-cutting and fee-removing measures on the ballot, which the legislature then passes a new law reinstating; Eyman gets pissed, says they're overriding the will of the voters, puts it on the ballot again, etc, etc. This means your car licensing fee may randomly be either 30 dollars or 80 depending on where on the cycle you are when you register your car. Anyway the legislature has gradually found a variety of tricks to render him less effective, and managed to outright defeat some of his initiatives like the one banning HOV/High Occupancy Vehicle lanes. Since the legislature can re-pass the law a year after the referendum fails, this means that if NOM wants to play in Washington, they better be prepared for attrition warfare like Eyman.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Tim Eyman arriving at the State House in 2006 with his petition signatures for a referendum to overturn LGBT anti-discrimination legislation. No, this is not a joke; yes, he actually did that. Other anti-gay foes in the state are the aforementioned retired logger Lawrence Stickney and a former NFL player turned flamboyant evangelical minister in the Seattle area (Ken Hutcherson).
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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I did not know about the relatively low levels of religiosity in Washington. That will definitely help as the three largest predictors in support for marriage equality is age, ideology and religiosity. And it definitely helps that the referendum will be over enacted legislation rather than over a discriminatory constitutional amendment. That's exactly how Maine passed their LGBT rights bill; they enacted it three times in the legislature before it finally passed the referendum hurdle. Though in Maine, instead of passing another marriage equality bill in their legislature, they're just going straight to the people this time around. Like Washington, Maine is also a relatively non-religious state and I think the LGBT rights advocates there feel they have a good shot at winning this year at a high profile election. I really hope both states stick it to those bigots this year and take away their precious "the people always reject marriage equality" argument. That's a combo-breaker I've been waiting for since 2004.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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SpaceMarine93 wrote:
"GAY MARRIAGE WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING WITH BIG EVIL EVILNESS AND GOD WILL POOP ON YOU WITH FIRE!"
"This message paid for by Some Douchebags in Colorado Springs, Colorado."
Not surprising. Slippery slope argument had been used by every half-qualified debaters and demagogues since the birth of Politics.
Dude, did you even read...or figure out...this is not literally what they said but my...goddamnit you idiot, I really was hoping when you said that melodramatic "I'll never post in N&P again" you somehow meant it.
SpaceMarine93 wrote:Any ways, I still can't believe the fact that they are even voting on the issue in Washington. The previous state to legalize gay marriage did it about less than a year ago, I think. It's all an indication that we are actually WINNING the fight for gay rights in America, if you ask me.
You can't believe that a state that had a vote on it two years ago, and then the popular vote confirmed to keep the "all but marriage law" that the legislature passed, is now taking the final step? Do you ever think about anything you read or do you never go beyond surface thoughts?

I can understand Pinto's worries because he was involved in California's votes and saw how badly those went despite his and many others' best efforts. You? Take a chill pill.


ANYWAY
Actually Vermont is now considered the least religious state, which made me tempted to go run into a church in Washington and yell, "CHOP CHOP! We're slacking off and the northeasterners are beating us! Leave this place and never return so we may reclaim our rightful place!" But yes, Washington is still very non-religious.

And how did I miss the Darth Vader getup? I didn't know about that before. What the hell was that supposed to prove, anyway? That he does believe himself to be the Pacific Northwest's physical incarnation of evil? How is that supposed to promote his cause? I guess the only answer is, "Well, we already knew he was crazy."


Oh hey, Marina, what if the out-of-state lobbyist groups figure out about the ad disclaimers and try to pour money into in-state groups so they can put out ads in proxy without having the "some out-of-state jerk paid for this" message at the end? Just saying hypothetically if they thought they'd get around the law.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

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Mayabird wrote:And how did I miss the Darth Vader getup? I didn't know about that before. What the hell was that supposed to prove, anyway? That he does believe himself to be the Pacific Northwest's physical incarnation of evil? How is that supposed to promote his cause? I guess the only answer is, "Well, we already knew he was crazy."
As I recall, he said it was a joke about how his opponents portrayed him.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

Post by The Duchess of Zeon »

ANYWAY
Actually Vermont is now considered the least religious state, which made me tempted to go run into a church in Washington and yell, "CHOP CHOP! We're slacking off and the northeasterners are beating us! Leave this place and never return so we may reclaim our rightful place!" But yes, Washington is still very non-religious.
Vermont is beating us? Arrgh.

Anyway, I'm not sure, Amy, how exactly the law would handle that, though a lawsuit to impound the money while it's hammered out would certainly be in order, and quite possibly would be more effective than forcing them to say where the money is from, since then they couldn't use it at all until they ruled on whether or not it still required the disclaimer.

In other news:

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Larry Stickney with his homemade MAN + WIFE buttons battles against the evil homos trying to stick it in his unemployed "pooper"! And:

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A superbowl ring clearly makes me qualified to be a conservative evangelical minister!


These are the triumvirate of foes of LGBT rights in Washington State (with Darth Eyman), and so far they've been more comic opera villains than anything else; it'll be interesting to see what the influx of foreign, err, out of state money and attention does.
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Re: Wash may become 7th to pass Gay Marriage

Post by Pint0 Xtreme »

It looks like your "esteemed" ex-NFL bigot showed up at the state hearing on the bill, spouting the usual bullshit along with some of the other anti-gay assholes in the state. Comic opera villains, indeed!
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