Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban

[[R_H]]

ABC News

The Obama administration will seek to reinstate the assault weapons ban that expired in 2004 during the Bush administration, Attorney General Eric Holder said today."As President Obama indicated during the campaign, there are just a few gun-related changes that we would like to make, and among them would be to reinstitute the ban on the sale of assault weapons," Holder told reporters.

Holder said that putting the ban back in place would not only be a positive move by the United States, it would help cut down on the flow of guns going across the border into Mexico, which is struggling with heavy violence among drug cartels along the border.

"I think that will have a positive impact in Mexico, at a minimum." Holder said at a news conference on the arrest of more than 700 people in a drug enforcement crackdown on Mexican drug cartels operating in the U.S. Mexican government officials have complained that the availability of sophisticated guns from the United States have emboldened drug traffickers to fight over access routes into the U.S.

A State Department travel warning issued Feb. 20, 2009, reflected government concerns about the violence.

"Some recent Mexican army and police confrontations with drug cartels have resembled small-unit combat, with cartels employing automatic weapons and grenades," the warning said. "Large firefights have taken place in many towns and cities across Mexico, but most recently in northern Mexico, including Tijuana, Chihuahua City and Ciudad Juarez." At the news conference today, Holder described his discussions with his Mexican counterpart about the recent spike in violence.

"I met yesterday with Attorney General Medina Mora of Mexico, and we discussed the unprecedented levels of violence his country is facing because of their enforcement efforts," he said.

Holder declined to offer any time frame for the reimplementation of the assault weapons ban, however.

"It's something, as I said, that the president talked about during the campaign," he said. "There are obviously a number of things that are -- that have been taking up a substantial amount of his time, and so, I'm not sure exactly what the sequencing will be."

In a brief interview with ABC News, Wayne LaPierre, president of the National Rifle Association, said, "I think there are a lot of Democrats on Capitol Hill cringing at Eric Holder's comments right now."

During his confirmation hearing, Holder told the Senate Judiciary Committee about other gun control measures the Obama administration may consider. "I think closing the gun show loophole, the banning of cop-killer bullets and I also think that making the assault weapons ban permanent, would be something that would be permitted under Heller," Holder said, referring to the Supreme Court ruling in Washington, D.C. v. Heller, which asserted the Second Amendment as an individual's right to own a weapon.

The Assault Weapons Ban signed into law by President Clinton in 1994 banned 19 types of semi-automatic military-style guns and ammunition clips with more than 10 rounds.

"A semi-automatic is a quintessential self-defense firearm owned by American citizens in this country," LaPierre said. "I think it is clearly covered under Heller and it's clearly, I think, protected by the Constitution."

What exactly are "cop killer bullets"? How are they defined, or is it a term that gets thrown around?

[Atlan]

What exactly are "cop killer bullets"? How are they defined, or is it a term that gets thrown around?

It's a bullshit term. It refers to a brand of teflon coated solid bronze bullets that were marketed in the late sixties, early seventies. They were meant for hard barrier penetration (think windshield and car door).
The green teflon coating was only there to reduce wear on the barrel, but politicians and pundits picked up on them, and said that the teflon made it easyer to shoot through a bullet resistant vest, and called the bullets copkillers. Of course, even before they were banned no police officer had ever been shot with one, and none ever has.

[Terralthra]

What exactly are "cop killer bullets"? How are they defined, or is it a term that gets thrown around?

It's a bullshit term. It refers to a brand of teflon coated solid bronze bullets that were marketed in the late sixties, early seventies. They were meant for hard barrier penetration (think windshield and car door).
The green teflon coating was only there to reduce wear on the barrel, but politicians and pundits picked up on them, and said that the teflon made it easyer to shoot through a bullet resistant vest, and called the bullets copkillers. Of course, even before they were banned no police officer had ever been shot with one, and none ever has.

The federal ban on armor-piercing bullets has nothing to do with teflon coating, only core composition.

(A) The term “ammunition” means ammunition or cartridge cases, primers, bullets, or propellent powder designed for use in any firearm.
(B) The term “armor piercing ammunition” means—

• (i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or
  (ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile.

(C) The term “armor piercing ammunition” does not include shotgun shot required by Federal or State environmental or game regulations for hunting purposes, a frangible projectile designed for target shooting, a projectile which the Attorney General finds is primarily intended to be used for sporting purposes, or any other projectile or projectile core which the Attorney General finds is intended to be used for industrial purposes, including a charge used in an oil and gas well perforating device.

[Zixinus]

Oh no, Obama's Co is doing this wrong.

The very least, he has to start the idea fresh. The Assoult Weapons Ban was nothing less than retarded (hint: it didn't actually ban weapons, just some of their semi-cosmetic features).

If Obama wants to close several regulatory loopholes in the USA regarding firearms, than more power to him, but bringing back the AWB?

What exactly are "cop killer bullets"? How are they defined, or is it a term that gets thrown around?

The only "cop-killer" bullets I can think of is AP bullets. Banning that for civilians is actually reasonable.

[His Divine Shadow]

Why would he burn his political capital like this? It makes no sense, doesn't he want to get re-elected?

[The Spartan]

Why would he burn his political capital like this? It makes no sense, doesn't he want to get re-elected?

I'd be more concerned, at this point, about using up his political capital to get the programs we need pushed through.

[Coyote]

This is the biggest flaw in the Democratic Party: they cling to "gun control" like a heroin addict. I knew he was open to some gun control, but I figured that the overall problems with the economy and global relations was more important than that single issue... but if he pushes this, chances are we'll see the Republicans start to reverse their losses and come back swinging.

Especially since the article basically implies that gun control in America would be passed because of Mexican violence. To many Americans, that'd be like lowering the speed limit to 50 miles an hour because a guy in Canada got hit by a speeder (I know it's not an apt comparison, but the idea that "we suffer because another country has problems" will be the lens through which it is viewed).

Trotting out old arguments that have been defeated, like "cop-killer bullets" ( ) will give the Republicans perfect propaganda that the Obama does not bring "change" but "more of the same tired, socialist, big-government policies of his predecessors" --and that will resonate, like it or not. Be prepared for some challenges in 2010 in the House and Senate if he insists on pushing this.

[Atlan]

What exactly are "cop killer bullets"? How are they defined, or is it a term that gets thrown around?

It's a bullshit term. It refers to a brand of teflon coated solid bronze bullets that were marketed in the late sixties, early seventies. They were meant for hard barrier penetration (think windshield and car door).
The green teflon coating was only there to reduce wear on the barrel, but politicians and pundits picked up on them, and said that the teflon made it easyer to shoot through a bullet resistant vest, and called the bullets copkillers. Of course, even before they were banned no police officer had ever been shot with one, and none ever has.

The federal ban on armor-piercing bullets has nothing to do with teflon coating, only core composition.

I know, but the term "Cop-killer bullets" was coined specifically with the KTW (i.e. Teflon coated) bullets in mind.

[Samuel]

This is the biggest flaw in the Democratic Party: they cling to "gun control" like a heroin addict. I knew he was open to some gun control, but I figured that the overall problems with the economy and global relations was more important than that single issue... but if he pushes this, chances are we'll see the Republicans start to reverse their losses and come back swinging.

Especially since the article basically implies that gun control in America would be passed because of Mexican violence. To many Americans, that'd be like lowering the speed limit to 50 miles an hour because a guy in Canada got hit by a speeder (I know it's not an apt comparison, but the idea that "we suffer because another country has problems" will be the lens through which it is viewed).

Trotting out old arguments that have been defeated, like "cop-killer bullets" ( ) will give the Republicans perfect propaganda that the Obama does not bring "change" but "more of the same tired, socialist, big-government policies of his predecessors" --and that will resonate, like it or not. Be prepared for some challenges in 2010 in the House and Senate if he insists on pushing this.

Mexico imports guns from the US so it would actually help if we cracked down on certain kinds of guns.

Why is this a wedge issue again? I never got that.

[Coyote]

Mexico imports guns from the US so it would actually help if we cracked down on certain kinds of guns.

Why is this a wedge issue again? I never got that.

The importation of guns to Mexico from the US is already illegal, and I believe a lot of the guns being brought in are illegal in the US to begin with (such as automatic capable) or have been modified (illegally) from semi-automatic to automatic. So in other words, it is more the result of piss-poor border control standrads and enforcement, the ultra-corrupt state of the Mexican police, and the unwillingness to pony up taxes or whatever is needed in the US to cover broad expanses of border territory that are unguarded.

It's like losing your keys near the door, but searching by the sidewalk because the light's better. They've proven inept at tackling the real problem, so they shift the blame to something they can do something about (Americans who own guns). It also dovetails with a stupid gun control program they've always wanted to institute nationwide but never had sufficient excuses to push through. Now, by tying American gun ownership to Mexican drug cartels and border violence, they're going to try to saddle up this hobby-horse again-- even if it means risking handing the government right back to the Republicans, with the first steps taken in 2010 and culminating in a serious challenge in 2012.

Very short sighted and stupid. Gun control is the cyanide pill of American politics, and the Democratic Party just can't stop popping it.

[[R_H]]

Mexico imports guns from the US so it would actually help if we cracked down on certain kinds of guns.

Why is this a wedge issue again? I never got that.

Instead of banning guns, what about just going after gun smugglers? Besides, if the ban even did put a dent in the amount of shootings in Mexico, do you think the cartels are just going to give up having firearms? They could buy them elsewhere, steal them from the authorities (or even buy them) or worst come to worst, they could build their own (they have the resources).

[Coyote]

The real problem is something that the US Adminsitration (Republican or Democrat) can never say out loud, politically speaking: that the Mexican government is too weak and corrupt to be of any use in this issue at all. The Mexican Federal government runs the central districts and that's about it; up north the government is almost entirely supplanted by the narco-cartels, who have effectively become the governments of many towns in the northern desert and border states.

If you're a policeman in a place like Juarez, you're either paid for by the narcos, or you're a headless torso in the desert. Those are your choices. The actual government no longer really runs things or has any real control or authority up there, but you can't just call your closest neighbor and NAFTA partner a failed state that's got vast swathes of territory that are just on this side of Sudan in government effectiveness.

In a perverse way, this is a nest of rattlesnakes we made for ourselves. The war on the drug cartels in places like Colombia have been so brutally effective that the Mexicans-- who used to just be the middlemen and delivery agents-- have now stepped in to fill the void. Now we have Medellin cartel-level violence right on our vast, unguarded border. The law of unintended consequences has come to bite us in the ass.

[MKSheppard]

Holder proves himself to be a moron.

You CAN own a gun in Mexico, but it can't be in a caliber used by a military around the world; which eliminated just about everything except some really oddball calibers.

Hence, his proposed AWB wouldn't do anything to stem the flow of black market guns to Mexico, since a big part of the demand is that people want to have a 9mm or .45 (they're banned)

[General Zod]

Mexico imports guns from the US so it would actually help if we cracked down on certain kinds of guns.

Why is this a wedge issue again? I never got that.

It's a wedge issue in that if you can ban one type of gun, you can use the precedent to expand it to more and more types of guns. It's kind of like the way anti-gay bigots use attempting to get marriage defined as being between "one man and one woman" so they can use it to attempt and eventually ban gay marriage.

Personally I'd like to have tighter gun control laws, but limp-dicked bills like this are utterly worthless and ineffective at actually addressing the issues.

[His Divine Shadow]

There is a fifth dimension, beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call the Twilight Zone.

Pelosi to the rescue!!!

The Hill.com posted:

Pelosi tosses cold water on assault-weapon ban

By Mike Soraghan
Posted: 02/26/09 11:59 AM [ET]

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi tossed cold water on the prospect of reinstating the assault weapons ban, highlighting Democrats’ reluctance to take on gun issues.

Attorney General Eric Holder raised the prospect Wednesday that the administration would push to bring back the ban. But Pelosi (D-Calif.) indicated on Thursday that he never talked to her. The Speaker gave a flat “no” when asked if she had talked to administration officials about the ban.

“On that score, I think we need to enforce the laws we have right now,” Pelosi said at her weekly news conference. “I think it's clear the Bush administration didn’t do that.” Outside of the dig at the recent Republican president, that phrase is the stock line of those who don’t want to pass new gun control laws, such as the National Rifle Association.

The White House declined to comment on Holder's remarks, referring reporters to the Department of Justice. The DoJ did not respond to The Hill's request for comment.

Welcome to the Twilight Zone people.

[General Zod]

There is a fifth dimension, beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call the Twilight Zone.

Pelosi to the rescue!!!

The Hill.com posted:

Pelosi tosses cold water on assault-weapon ban

By Mike Soraghan
Posted: 02/26/09 11:59 AM [ET]

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi tossed cold water on the prospect of reinstating the assault weapons ban, highlighting Democrats’ reluctance to take on gun issues.

Attorney General Eric Holder raised the prospect Wednesday that the administration would push to bring back the ban. But Pelosi (D-Calif.) indicated on Thursday that he never talked to her. The Speaker gave a flat “no” when asked if she had talked to administration officials about the ban.

“On that score, I think we need to enforce the laws we have right now,” Pelosi said at her weekly news conference. “I think it's clear the Bush administration didn’t do that.” Outside of the dig at the recent Republican president, that phrase is the stock line of those who don’t want to pass new gun control laws, such as the National Rifle Association.

The White House declined to comment on Holder's remarks, referring reporters to the Department of Justice. The DoJ did not respond to The Hill's request for comment.

Welcome to the Twilight Zone people.

Pelosi's not acting like a useless cheerleader for once? Holy shit. Is she due up for a performance review sometime soon or something?

[aerius]

Pelosi? Of all people? Saying not only no, but "fuck no"? Either I've OD'd on Tylenol 3's and am currently hallucinating or the world is coming to an end as prophisised. I think this calls for another drink.

[apocolypse]

I too am actually rather surprised to hear this from Pelosi of all people. Maybe she gets just how big of an issue this could be, and how much it can be spun.

[Coyote]

It's so cute when the puppies finally open their eyes.

Wow, Pelosi. I knew there was a reason why I liked her.

[Kitsune]

Takes a deep breath...Several Democrats ran on the platform that they would not try to pass any "new" gun laws including Webb locally.

[Alyeska]

The Democrats might have a majority, but they are not united on every cause. Blue Dogs would defect and join the Republicans on this issue. And it seems that Nancy realizes that this law destroys their political gains.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

There is a fifth dimension, beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call the Twilight Zone.

Pelosi to the rescue!!!

I think my brain just experienced a BSOD . . .

Though to comment on the OP: I'm not exactly sure how reinstating the AWB is going to put a dent on gun running into Mexico, as the AWB was a hilariously broken piece of legislation that mostly banned certain cosmetic features on guns.

Though, who would suffer if the administration tried to push anti-gun legislation through Congress? The "Blue Dog" Democrats, certainly. Back anti-gun legislation, and the pro-gun moderate part of their electorates may stay home come the midterm elections. Obama himself? Well, it seems unlikely the rump party the GOP is becoming is going to put forward a Presidential candidate that anyone but the party faithful can take seriously. Sure, some of the recently-Republican Obama supporters might stay home in 2012, but Obama would likely win reelection anyway. Will it give the GOP more ammo to use against him? Sure, but anything Obama does that doesn't pander to the right wing, and the mindless middle, is going to be pounced upon. If anything, it may reassure progressive and left-leaning voters that Obama does have progressive street-cred, and isn't just a shameless whore to the mindless middle.

Would it hurt his ability to get other, more important, legislation through Congress? Questionable: The GOP representatives in the House haven't exactly gone out of their way to be anything but a pain in the ass, so no major loss there. The GOP Senators who vote with Obama tend to be moderates with center to left-of-center constituencies. Anti-gun legislation probably won't seriously inconvenience him in the Senate either.

[K. A. Pital]

Assault weapons ban? That's as worthless as anything. Assault weapons are a tiny minority of murder weapons.

The handgun is the deadliest firearm. Going after assault weapons because they look more powerful regardless of the statistical insignificance of assault weapon murders is plain hypocrisy.

I hope people concentrate more on the handgun issue.

[erik_t]

Stas, honest question. What's the ratio of "assault"-weapons-per-murder compared to handguns per murder? Obviously the overall rate of crimes for each class is less relevant than crimes-per-weapon_in_class. I assume there are many less "assault"-weapons than handguns.

[Glocksman]

The Democrats might have a majority, but they are not united on every cause. Blue Dogs would defect and join the Republicans on this issue. And it seems that Nancy realizes that this law destroys their political gains.

Bingo!

She remembers that the real lesson of 2000 wasn't Florida.
If Gore had won either West Virginia or his home state of Tennessee, he'd have become President even if Bush had carried Florida by a million votes.
Too bad his literal embrace of Sarah Brady and the Brady Campaign cost him both states.

Frankly I believe the last issues Pelosi and Reid would like to see brought up are 'culture war' issues like gun control and abortion because they are divisive.

Especially Reid, because Nevada is not a state that favors gun control and if he is seen as supporting an AWB, he could be in for a tough fight.