Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Gandalf »

Broomstick wrote: 2017-09-30 10:45am Speaking of Trump and Twitter - his recent digs at the mayor of San Juan make me want to puke. I guess toeing the line on maintaining the YUUUUGEEE GREATNESS!!! of the Trump Brand(TM) is more important than the suffering of 3.5 million fellow citizens.
Well... yeah? Brand management at the potential expense of a few million people unlikely to help (re)election is pretty much standard.

If Puerto Rico had electoral votes, especially ones that could swing GOP, help would be there by now.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Napoleon the Clown »

Gandalf wrote: 2017-09-30 01:11pm
Broomstick wrote: 2017-09-30 10:45am Speaking of Trump and Twitter - his recent digs at the mayor of San Juan make me want to puke. I guess toeing the line on maintaining the YUUUUGEEE GREATNESS!!! of the Trump Brand(TM) is more important than the suffering of 3.5 million fellow citizens.
Well... yeah? Brand management at the potential expense of a few million people unlikely to help (re)election is pretty much standard.

If Puerto Rico had electoral votes, especially ones that could swing GOP, help would be there by now.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Thanas »

Never thought I would read something like this in the most powerful country in the 21st century
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Broomstick »

Sad to say, I've been expecting it since Katrina.

How DARE a brown woman NOT toe the line on how great the PotUS is? How DARE a brown woman criticize in any way the efforts of his administration?

Nope - this sort of bigotry has always existed in the US, and right now it's driving the car. The segment of America willing to throw 3.5 million people under the bus is in charge.

I'd gone on in more detail, but I have to get ready for work.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

I do think that while a lot of Trump's behaviour with regard to Puerto Rico can likely be explained by shear incompetence and narcissism, the shear extent of the mishandling of this disaster, to the point of basically letting Americans suffer and die while he rants and whines because one of them didn't stroke his ego enough, definitely has a component of racism.

They are letting Puerto Ricans die because they're heavily racial minorities, and effectively a colony, which is to this day denied full voting rights and Congressional representation on the basis of antiquated, racist laws.

What was the slogan of our vaunted American Revolution again? "No taxation without representation"? Well, we see here why that's a good principle- because without representation, their is every chance that the government will bleed you dry and then not help you when you need it.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by SAMAS »

Take heart, Americans!

Donald Trump, our Dear Leader, has opened his heart to the people of Puerto Rico, Texas, and Louisiana...

...and given us a golf trophy.

Just... WOW.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

How about he takes that trophy and shoves it up his ass?
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Dominus Atheos »

So this happened at the BET Hip Hop Awards:



Just thought I'd share.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by FaxModem1 »

ABC 15
Trump threatens to pull FEMA from Puerto Rico
CNN
2:07 PM, Oct 10, 2017
1 hour ago

U.S. National Guard
SHOW CAPTION
President Donald Trump suggested Thursday that Puerto Rico is going to have to shoulder more responsibility for recovery efforts from Hurricane Maria, saying the federal government's emergency responders can't stay there "forever."

His comments -- in which he also blamed the beleaguered island for a financial crisis "largely of their own making" and infrastructure that was a "disaster" before the hurricane -- come as Puerto Rico still reels from a lack of electricity, public health access and a rising death toll.



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"Puerto Rico survived the Hurricanes, now a financial crisis looms largely of their own making." says Sharyl Attkisson. A total lack of.....
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Trump's tweets come nearly three weeks after the hurricane, as the vast majority of the island remains without power and the death toll from the storm has risen to 45, authorities said.

At least 113 people remain unaccounted for, according to Karixia Ortiz, a spokeswoman for Puerto Rico's Department of Public Safety.

The recovery has moved slowly since Maria struck the US territory on September 20, leaving most of the island without basic services such as power and running water, according to residents, relief workers and local elected officials.

Acting Department of Homeland Security Elaine Duke will make her second trip to the island on Thursday, DHS spokesman David Lapan said Wednesday.

The visit comes as hospitals throughout the cash-strapped island of 3.4 million people have been running low on medicine and fuel. Some residents and local elected officials have said they expect the death toll to rise.

House Speaker Paul Ryan will lead a bipartisan delegation visiting Puerto Rico on Friday, according to the speaker's office.

Ryan will travel to the island with House Appropriations Chairman Rodney Frelinghuysen of New Jersey and Rep. Nita Lowey of New York, the top Democrat on the panel. Puerto Rico's sole representative in Congress, Jenniffer Gonzalez-Colon, and House GOP Conference Chairwoman Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers also will be part of the congressional delegation.

The House will vote Thursday on a disaster relief bill following a series of devastating hurricanes and massive wildfires that have ravished parts of the United States.

While the Trump administration requested $29 billion in supplemental spending last week, it asked for additional resources Tuesday night, including $4.9 billion to specifically to fund a loan program that Puerto Rico can use to address basic functions like infrastructure needs.

The bill stood at $36.5 billion as of Wednesday afternoon.

This story is developing and will be updated.
I'm not sure exactly what Trump expects Puerto Rico to achieve.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Simon_Jester »

You know, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Donald Trump manages to singlehandedly build a pro-independence majority in Puerto Rico.

Which really would put him down with James Buchanan in presidential competence, as the kind of president who, when handed a country, doesn't give it back in the same number of pieces it was given to him in.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by houser2112 »

Simon_Jester wrote: 2017-10-12 02:30pm You know, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Donald Trump manages to singlehandedly build a pro-independence majority in Puerto Rico.
I don't think his base would be all that upset if that were to happen, and if he had made it a plank in his platform, he might've attracted even more voters.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Simon_Jester »

What, "lose an American territory by convincing its inhabitants we're such callous incompetent fuckups that all their tax money and loyal membership in our armed forces was for literally nothing?"

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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by houser2112 »

I was thinking more along the lines of "we don't want an island of brown people to have American citizenship and we spend more on them than we take in via taxes anyway".
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Flagg »

houser2112 wrote: 2017-10-12 04:04pm I was thinking more along the lines of "we don't want an island of brown people to have American citizenship and we spend more on them than we take in via taxes anyway".
Yeah, I’m sure his base (people with swastika tattoos on their face who blame not getting employed on “affirmative action” :mrgreen: ) really wouldn’t take issue with that. In fact they would likely celebrate by randomly murdering Americans with Puerto Rican flag stickers on their cars.

(That “murder part” is humor/hyperbole. The rest is accurate enough for me! :lol: )
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Elheru Aran »

To add to the Puerto Rico drama:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/ ... tract.html

A tiny, 2-year-old energy company from a small town in Montana won a $300 million contract to fix Puerto Rico’s hurricane-ravaged power grid, raising concerns about the decision-making behind the lucrative deal and the company’s ties to people connected to the Trump administration, as well as the company’s ability to fully meet Puerto Rico’s recovery needs.

Whitefish Energy, which at the time of the Hurricane Maria’s landfall had only two full-time employees, now has by far the largest contract of any company involved in Puerto Rico’s recovery, and, according to reporting from the Daily Beast, is primarily financed by a firm run by a major Trump donor who has connections to several members of his administration.

The contract has also raised eyebrows because the company is based in Whitefish, Montana, the hometown of Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke (population: 7,436). Zinke’s office told the Washington Post that Zinke knows the company’s CEO because the town is a place where “everybody knows everybody” but that Zinke had no role in the deal. A member of the Puerto Rico House of Representatives, Luis Vega Ramos, told the Daily Beast that connections to Zinke and Puerto Rico Gov. Ricardo Rosselló were Whitefish’s “most important expertise and assets.” Vega Ramos accused Whitefish of being a “glorified middleman” that crafted a “cozy sweetheart deal” to make money off subcontracting.

Whitefish Energy, which says it now has 280 workers in Puerto Rico and is growing by 10 to 20 subcontractors a day, has taken on the Herculean task of restoring power to an island where the vast majority of citizens are still without electricity more than a month after the hurricane. The cash-strapped territory will spend $490 million on the initial phase of the power grid repairs, according to Rosselló.

The $300 million Whitefish contract sets hourly rates at $330 for site supervisors and $227 for journeyman linemen, with rates even higher for subcontractors: $462 per hour for supervisors and $319 for linemen. It also includes $332 nightly fees for each worker and $80 a day for food.

The territory is expected to run out of funds soon, and even if the House’s $4.9 billion aid package passes, it may still need more funds as soon as three months after, according to the Post.

The executive director of Puerto Rico’s power authority said Whitefish was hired because it was the first company “available to arrive” and the first to accept the power authority’s terms and conditions. According to the Post, however, the deal—reached through private discussions rather than a formal bidding process—was agreed upon six days after Maria. In contrast, when Hurricane Irma threatened Florida in September, the state’s power authority took advantage of a type of procedure normally used in emergencies requiring utility companies to help restore services, and it requested that aid before the hurricane even hit. As a result, nearly 20,000 restoration workers deployed immediately after the storm.

The executive director of Puerto Rico’s power authority blamed the scrutiny and criticism of the Whitefish contract on jealousy from other companies.

The U.S. House Committee on Natural Resources is examining the company’s role in the recovery, a committee spokesman told reporters.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Puerto Rico is pretty much the only piece of American territory right now that would actually have a degree of sympathy from me if they tried to secede. I'd still oppose it on pragmatic grounds, but I could at least understand it.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Elheru Aran »

Meh, I don't think they could even afford to do that right now.

I'm just more appalled by how frank the corruption has become. I won't comment on how high the pay is (though it does seem remarkable to me), but a company in MONTANA, that somehow gets a contract in Puerto Rico of all places, and yet has the gall to claim it's not connected to Zinke at all even though he's buddy-buddy with the CEO?

If it was in Florida or Alabama, that'd be an entirely different matter. That's practically next door. Granted a lot of local companies were probably dealing with the messes in Florida, but still. It's just absurd how this happened and stinks of meddling from on high.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Elheru Aran wrote: 2017-10-25 04:01pm Meh, I don't think they could even afford to do that right now.
One of the many reasons for the "Oppose on pragmatic grounds" qualifier.
I'm just more appalled by how frank the corruption has become. I won't comment on how high the pay is (though it does seem remarkable to me), but a company in MONTANA, that somehow gets a contract in Puerto Rico of all places, and yet has the gall to claim it's not connected to Zinke at all even though he's buddy-buddy with the CEO?

If it was in Florida or Alabama, that'd be an entirely different matter. That's practically next door. Granted a lot of local companies were probably dealing with the messes in Florida, but still. It's just absurd how this happened and stinks of meddling from on high.
Pretty much. But what did people expect when they voted for Donald fucking Trump?

Oh, who am I kidding? The base expected someone who would reassert the dominance of straight white men, the "anti-establishment" fanatics expected someone who would break everything, Putin expected someone who would undermine America, and all those groups got what they wanted, at least to an extent. Unfortunately.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Simon_Jester »

What makes me go "fuuuu-" the most about this kind of thing is the fear that it will become "the new normal." Because at first glance this is right up there with Teapot Dome, if not worse... and it's going to be a considerable span of time before we have a realistic hope of sorting out just who is responsible for the corruption.

If the Trump administration just goes down in history as a massive corrupt shitshow that ended in half a dozen senior administration officials going to jail and the first successful move to impeach a president ever, that's one thing.

But what worries me is if it doesn't, if it just craps along until 2020 and is voted out of office in an undramatic way.

Because every administration afterwards will on some level be thinking "you know, we could get that fucking rich and just maybe, no one would stop us."
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Gandalf »

This sort of thing only stops with proper consequences. If Bush (and team) couldn't get done for literal war crimes, what sort of crony capitalism would Trump (and team) have to do to get impeached?
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

At this point, pretty much my only hope of the kind of real, lasting consequences needed to make the point (short of Trump starting World War III or a civil war) is that Mueller will turn up absolutely incontrovertible proof of electoral fraud and/or espionage against the United States.

If that can't do it, I don't think anything will. Unless Trump tries to follow up on his "I could shoot someone and not loose a single vote" boast.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Simon_Jester »

Gandalf wrote: 2017-10-26 01:37amThis sort of thing only stops with proper consequences. If Bush (and team) couldn't get done for literal war crimes, what sort of crony capitalism would Trump (and team) have to do to get impeached?
I can actually see crony capitalism doing it where the war crimes that can be pinned on Bush wouldn't.

Bush took considerable trouble to cover his ass legally, and much of what he was doing has (blech) significant popular support among (blech) a large fraction of his countrymen. People stuck up for him because of genuinely believing (blech) that what he was doing wasn't wrong.

Trump's crony capitalism is NOT showing signs of being legally covered under anything more than the vaguest level, probably because Trump doesn't understand checks and balances and is narcissistic enough to believe nothing bad can ever happen to him. And by and large, even the people who supported Trump don't actually WANT him funneling billions of dollars to random bozo cronies. No one's going to stick up for him, least of all members of Congress, if they think they can get away with not sticking up for him.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by The Romulan Republic »

So, CNN reporting that the first charges are being filed in the Mueller investigation. No word yet on who.

Still...

Can I get a FUCK YEAH! :D

Edit: Link: http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/27/politics/ ... index.html

From the article:
A federal grand jury in Washington, DC, on Friday approved the first charges in the investigation led by special counsel Robert Mueller, according to sources briefed on the matter

The charges are still sealed under orders from a federal judge. Plans were prepared Friday for anyone charged to be taken into custody as soon as Monday, the sources said. It is unclear what the charges are.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Civil War Man »

If I were a betting man, I'd say the the charges are against Manafort. There were a few rumblings not too long ago that Mueller's team informed Manafort that he was going to be indicted, which is apparently done within a month or two of the official indictment so the impending defendant knows to keep their schedule clear or something.
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Re: Trump Dump: Internal Policy (Thread I)

Post by Korto »

ALERT! ALERT!
Twitter storm incoming!
Expect wild accusations of deep state fix-ups, evil Hillary, and secret uranium deals! And more!

I'll just be over here with my popcorn, enjoying the hilarity. Maybe I'm not a very nice person for this, but this whole presidency has been fucking brilliant. :lol:
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