War Whores vs. Royal Navy -FIGHT!

[Surlethe]

Here's another asshole:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42ACKzW_GQ8

Looks like someone watched 300 a few too many times.

[Flagg]

So I guess the crew of that recon plane that was damaged and landed in China, allowing the Chinese government to get sensitive information and reverse engineer the aircraft are all traitors who should have made a nosedive into the Pacific?

Yeah, they should have ditched the plane. In fact, it's kinda something they are instructed to do.

I feel the same way about the crew of the Pueblo, incidentally. (And that's something personal. Check my AIM handle and the name of the Pueblo's CO and see if you can connect the dots)

I dunno, I would have done the same thing if I had been the pilot of that plane. I don;t think they are by any stretch of the imagionation 'heros' as some tried to make them out to be, but whatever. My point was that no one was calling them traitors for not all dying for no fucking reason whatsoever.

[MKSheppard]

I've read many of these articles and seen an interview or two condemning the 15 and what I'd like to know is if these idiots think the Brits could have actually fought their way out. It seems almost surreal reading the articles. Do they think 15 people on two small boats could magically fight off 8 Iranian boats that were armed with heavy machine guns and RPG's?

It's happened in the past to USN boat units.

The Senior Chief tells it quite colorfully

Now comes the Board of Inquiry and then, who knows a green cloth covered table for someone. I just hope that that someone is the moron who put those kids in such an untennable situation.

No one will ever be able to tell me whoever made the decision to surrender will have a single guilt free night as long as he lives. that si IF he is any kind of a sailorman.

A really good shipmate of mine, CDR Al Nix, when jiust an Ensign, was in a roughly similar situation in Lebanon back in the 80's. He was boat officer of a PL. He refused to allow his boat to be boarded, even when threatened with overwhelming force. That time, the PLO bastards came close but his drawn .45 ACP, the iron determination in his ugly face backed up by a wrench wielding FN, a boat hook brandishing SA and his BM3 coxswain made them think twice.

To this day, Al does not know if it was luck or the fact Ronald Reagan had let the USN recently clobber Lybia but the bastards backed off. It could have gone real wrong and we could have had four dead Blue Jackets who did their duty because Al took his oath seriously and he is one tough and stubborn SOB, God Bless him.

One thing is sure, Al denied the ragheads the humiliating propaganda victory over the vaunted RN that they have now. No matter how you cut it when the ragheads humiliate, and that is what it is utter humilaition in the eyes of the raghead world, a major western power all us are shamed and put at far greater risk.

Before you start telling me I was not there and how could I know what I would do. When my boat was sunk off Hue in '68 my gunner and I made it ashore; two of the crew did not. We were surrounded by NVA with only two .45 ACP and four mags of ammo between us. We did not surrender but three NVA never saw the sun set that day. Since I have walked in their mocassins I have the right to comment.

Sorry if this offends any of our UK cousins but that is how I see it.

[Stark]

So you're agreeing that having a pistol and being ugly would have prevented the British sailors being taken prisoner, because some racist guy said so?

[MKSheppard]

So you're agreeing that having a pistol and being ugly would have prevented the British sailors being taken prisoner, because some racist guy said so?

I'm just wondering if they could have bluffed their way out of it like Nix and his crew did off Lebanon in the 1980s, I really don't think the Iranians actually had a plan ready or had anything in case things went south of what they were expecting.

Okay so, the British are refusing to go with you. Do you have a plan for that? What do you do? Do you escalate it and open fire on the british since they won't do what you say, ending up with you in a bigger shit storm than simply releasing them 15 days later alive?

[Stark]

I agree it'd be pretty out there if the Iranians were really prepared to blow them up, but my understanding is that by the time the British realised the situation they were in they were already boarded and outnumbered - it's too late to scare them off with shows of bravado then: they'd just clonk them on the head and drag them off anyway.

[Wicked Pilot]

Surrendering is a choice. When you are in a position where further fighting will result in no significant damage to the enemy, but will result in meaningless loss of life for your forces, you have no choice, you are captured.

Moreover, and this cannot be stressed enough, Britain and Iran are not and where not at war. As if what you see in John Wayne and Arnold Swarchenegger movies wasn't inaccurate enough, it is absolutely not what you do in these situations.

[Elfdart]

So you're agreeing that having a pistol and being ugly would have prevented the British sailors being taken prisoner, because some racist guy said so?

I'm just wondering if they could have bluffed their way out of it like Nix and his crew did off Lebanon in the 1980s, I really don't think the Iranians actually had a plan ready or had anything in case things went south of what they were expecting.

Okay so, the British are refusing to go with you. Do you have a plan for that? What do you do? Do you escalate it and open fire on the british since they won't do what you say, ending up with you in a bigger shit storm than simply releasing them 15 days later alive?

Or they could have simply killed the sailors, destroyed their boats and gone home, and denied they were ever there.

As for your "heard from a friend who heard from his friend who sounds like a total fucktard" story: interesting tall tale -if it ever happened, which I doubt.

[Darth Wong]

I've read many of these articles and seen an interview or two condemning the 15 and what I'd like to know is if these idiots think the Brits could have actually fought their way out. It seems almost surreal reading the articles. Do they think 15 people on two small boats could magically fight off 8 Iranian boats that were armed with heavy machine guns and RPG's?

It's happened in the past to USN boat units.

The Senior Chief tells it quite colorfully

Now comes the Board of Inquiry and then, who knows a green cloth covered table for someone. I just hope that that someone is the moron who put those kids in such an untennable situation.

No one will ever be able to tell me whoever made the decision to surrender will have a single guilt free night as long as he lives. that si IF he is any kind of a sailorman.

A really good shipmate of mine, CDR Al Nix, when jiust an Ensign, was in a roughly similar situation in Lebanon back in the 80's. He was boat officer of a PL. He refused to allow his boat to be boarded, even when threatened with overwhelming force. That time, the PLO bastards came close but his drawn .45 ACP, the iron determination in his ugly face backed up by a wrench wielding FN, a boat hook brandishing SA and his BM3 coxswain made them think twice.

To this day, Al does not know if it was luck or the fact Ronald Reagan had let the USN recently clobber Lybia but the bastards backed off. It could have gone real wrong and we could have had four dead Blue Jackets who did their duty because Al took his oath seriously and he is one tough and stubborn SOB, God Bless him.

One thing is sure, Al denied the ragheads the humiliating propaganda victory over the vaunted RN that they have now. No matter how you cut it when the ragheads humiliate, and that is what it is utter humilaition in the eyes of the raghead world, a major western power all us are shamed and put at far greater risk.

Before you start telling me I was not there and how could I know what I would do. When my boat was sunk off Hue in '68 my gunner and I made it ashore; two of the crew did not. We were surrounded by NVA with only two .45 ACP and four mags of ammo between us. We did not surrender but three NVA never saw the sun set that day. Since I have walked in their mocassins I have the right to comment.

Sorry if this offends any of our UK cousins but that is how I see it.

Oh yeah, that sounds like an objective report of what happened.

[Elfdart]

After thinking about this tall tale, I call bullshit on this story.

The PLO was kicked out of Lebanon completely by 1983. So this asshole couldn't be referring to the attack of Libya in 1986 or the incident where F-14s shot down Libyan MiGs in 1989. In fact the USN helped evacuate the PLO from Lebanon as part of the mulit-national force that acted as a buffer between the IDF and PLO. The idea of (a) the PLO having the means to threaten any Navy vessel and (b) doing so when the Navy is essentially covering their getaway is horseshit.


Maybe this "Al Nix" (sounds like a name for a comic book character) or his buttboy relating the tale could give some dates as to when and where this happened. On second thought, I think I know already. Where? In his semen-crusted fantasies. When? Every time he touches himself in an unclean manner.

[Wicked Pilot]

Even if that happened it doesn't remotely compare with this incident. If we want to compare what happened to these guys to every other real or imaginary irrelevant historical event then we're going to be posting in this thread for quite a while to come.


You know on the Tantive IV the Rebels fought to the death against Darth Vader's Stormtroopers. British cowards!

[Elfdart]

Even if that happened it doesn't remotely compare with this incident. If we want to compare what happened to these guys to every other real or imaginary irrelevant historical event then we're going to be posting in this thread for quite a while to come.


You know on the Tantive IV the Rebels fought to the death against Darth Vader's Stormtroopers. British cowards!

Actually, a bunch of them surrendered. Pussies.

[Wicked Pilot]

Actually, a bunch of them surrendered. Pussies.

I would have spit in Darth Vader's face and been like 'yeah, what'ch ya gonna do now bitch!'

[Stark]

They could have kept them off the ship if one of the rebels had been ugly enough - the Stormies would never have had the balls to assault through the doorway against that!

[Patrick Degan]

Basically, we're seeing the usual reaction from those types who are brave enough to fight a war to the last drop of everybody else's blood but their own.

[Wicked Pilot]

Basically, we're seeing the usual reaction from those types who are brave enough to fight a war to the last drop of everybody else's blood but their own.

Of all the people in my squadron, of which almost everyone has attended SERE, not a single person has expressed any criticism of those sailors actions. No one, not once.



And unlike some people of dubious existence I am in the military, and have a war to go fight, so at this time I bid you all good night. If I don't return promise to avenge my death.

[Elfdart]

Here's Zev's story from the Battle of Hoth:

Befoe you start telling me I was never on the Tantive IV and how could I know what I would have done, let me tell you this:

When my speeder was shot down on Hoth my gunner and I made it out of the wreckage. Dack didn't make it out of Skywalker's snowspeeder, though. We were surrounded by snowtroopers with only a blaster pistol between us. We didn't surrender like those cowards on Princess Leia's ship, but three of those snowtroopers never saw the twin suns of Tattooine set again. Since I have walked in their crampon-shod snow boots I have the right to comment.

Sorry if this offends our cousins from Alderaan but that's how I see it.

Zev's story probably has more basis in reality.

[Flagg]

Basically, we're seeing the usual reaction from those types who are brave enough to fight a war to the last drop of everybody else's blood but their own.

Of all the people in my squadron, of which almost everyone has attended SERE, not a single person has expressed any criticism of those sailors actions. No one, not once.



And unlike some people of dubious existence I am in the military, and have a war to go fight, so at this time I bid you all good night. If I don't return promise to avenge my death.

As long as avenging your death involves sending nasty emails, I'll do my best.

[Elfdart]

Basically, we're seeing the usual reaction from those types who are brave enough to fight a war to the last drop of everybody else's blood but their own.

Of all the people in my squadron, of which almost everyone has attended SERE, not a single person has expressed any criticism of those sailors actions. No one, not once.



And unlike some people of dubious existence I am in the military, and have a war to go fight, so at this time I bid you all good night. If I don't return promise to avenge my death.

Don't worry: All you need is a wrench, a boat hook and menacing stare and the "ragheads" will turn tail every time.

[Flagg]

Basically, we're seeing the usual reaction from those types who are brave enough to fight a war to the last drop of everybody else's blood but their own.

Of all the people in my squadron, of which almost everyone has attended SERE, not a single person has expressed any criticism of those sailors actions. No one, not once.



And unlike some people of dubious existence I am in the military, and have a war to go fight, so at this time I bid you all good night. If I don't return promise to avenge my death.

Don't worry: All you need is a wrench, a boat hook and menacing stare and the "ragheads" will turn tail every time.

Well yeah, the ragheads will run every time, but what about the cameljockies, sandniggers, and dune coons?

[Big Orange]

Here's some more vitriol (and an article) from our keyboard and coffee warriors over at Little Green Footballs. They're bitching about the former RN hostages selling their accounts of their ordeal to the accursed MSM.

Here's the article itself:

This is very, very clever. But it also represents the very nadir of a loathsome government which is more interested in spin and its own survival than it is the welfare of the nation and the safety of its own troops.

According to the BBC, the “frightened fifteen” are to be allowed to sell their stories to the media and keep the money.

The Ministry of Defence has said their experiences amounted to “exceptional circumstances” that allowed its usual ban on such payments to be lifted. We are told that the MoD has said: “Serving personnel are not allowed to enter financial arrangements with media organisations. However, in exceptional circumstances such as the awarding of a Victoria Cross or events such as those in recent days, permission can be granted by commanding officers and the MoD.”

What a disgusting parallel this is – to equate the action of these people with the winners of Victoria Crosses. But how deviously clever it is of a totally unprincipled MoD. Instead of seeking “closure” as I first thought, the spin meisters have evidently sussed the continued public interest in this issue.
By thus opening the gates to the “human interest” dimensions, it will feed the soap opera aspects of the Iranian hostage incident, drowning out the substantive issues in a torrent of irrelevant detail. And you can be assured that the stories will be very carefully vetted to exclude operational detail, in the interested of “national security”, to ensure that nothing embarrassing leaks out.

The media, of course, will fall in with this ploy.

Accompanied by the usual BS from the regulars:

My victimhood started at a very early age, and reached its nadir when the oppressed Iranians asked me aboard their rowboat...
Ah, woe is me...

(Did the $80,000 hit the bank yet?)

I think this is the most disgusting bit of military behavior (and I use the term loosely) that I have ever ever witnessed. Why are they not appalled by themselves? How do they look at themselves in the mirror?

For shame.

For several centuries the British Navy has been one of the most respected and feared military organizations on the planet.

Now, Iran has made them a pathetic shell. What a difference a couple decades makes. How long before they are on Jerry Springer? (is he still on the air, BTW?)

I must admit I am getting more and more worried that Britain will completely fall under Islamofascist control very soon. And here I thought France was more in danger. Now, I'm not so sure! It is so sad to see this once-great, former empire collapsing in upon itself without so much as firing a single shot in its own defense...

Utterly astounding. HAte to say it but the Brits have gone the way of the French and the Germans. There is no Europe only the calaphate union... Let's dismantle NATO so we dont flush any more money down that hole...

Followed up by a few surprisingly insightful comments:

I haven't read more than a few comments, but I am wondering if I'm the only one who doesn't think it's such a big deal. Let these guys make a few extra bucks. Let them tell their stories, as long as it makes Iran look bad.

I do not begrudge anyone who has served from publishing his memoirs. My bookshelf contains a few of these, for instance, two by generals from the 1st gulf war, one by a peacekeeper who was in Rwanda, and quite a few by WWII vets (including POW's held by the Germans at Colditz) - all of whom were paid, i hope. I really don't see a huge difference between the hostages and those soldiers.

Really...is it that big a deal?

I'm not judging them for being captured, that wasn't their fault.

I'm not judging them for making video statements or admitting guilt. I don't know what drove them to do it or what circumstances they were in at the time.
I am judging them on their conduct in the video I saw last night. They were told that they were going to be released and they were happy. That's fine, I would have been happy too. But their display of emotion was way out of bounds. Slapping each other on the back, giving each other noogies...it was all disgusting.

For domestic consumption inside Iran, it showed that westerners are a bunch of sissies that can't handle a tough situation.

For international consumption, it showed the world that Ahmadinejad is a humane, benevolent leader with altruistic intent.

It was all propaganda!

Those sailors should have known better than to act the way they did. That whole display had very important political implications.

For you to say that you don't expect those sailors to act the same way as a US Marine shows me moral relativism. For some reason you don't think that the sailors have the same responsibility as other members of the armed forces, and that disturbs me.

[thejester]

Yeah, I don't care about LGF. Link it next time, FFS.

[PeZook]

You know, "war whores" fits these people perfectly. It's like they whack off to the thought of bombs going off and patriotic soldiers fighting to their last breath for no reason whatsoever.

[Darth Raptor]

Hey now, they're doing their part in the ZOMG War on WTF Terror. Not everyone can be frontline infantry. That position is just for poor people and convincts anyway. Don't anyone doubt for a minute that they're buying gasoline, voting Republican and posting on the internet.

[SirNitram]

Hey now, they're doing their part in the ZOMG War on WTF Terror. Not everyone can be frontline infantry. That position is just for poor people and convincts anyway. Don't anyone doubt for a minute that they're buying gasoline, voting Republican and posting on the internet.

These are people who refer to their pens and computers as weapons in the Great War Of Civilizations.