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Post by Duckie »

Durandal wrote:Holy crap, Palin may actually be the grandmother of her child with Down's Syndrome. There are a lot of fishy circumstances (like her flying from Dallas to Alaska after her water broke, her daughter disappearing from school for several months because she "had mono" and a couple other things), but honestly, the biggest red flag is this picture.

In Februrary of this year, she was supposedly 6 months pregnant. I've never seen a woman so thin going into her third trimester.
Oh man, seriously? McCain really knows how to pick them, if this has even a nugget of truth in it. He picked a walking scandal with a vagina.

If this turns out not to just be hot air, then McCain really should have picked Lieberman or Pawlenty.

Interestingly, it appears that McCain was going to pick Pawlenty up until Obama's speech, although his heart was really set on Lieberman. Palin actually was a last minute pick, which makes sense considering she had only spoken to McCain twice in her life until then.
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Post by TithonusSyndrome »

Durandal wrote:In Februrary of this year, she was supposedly 6 months pregnant. I've never seen a woman so thin going into her third trimester.
I have, at my last job. She was a crackhead.

Perhaps that's too much scandal to expect, however...
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Post by Durandal »

From the details I've been reading, this doesn't look good for Palin. Either she was covering up for her daughter's pregnancy or she was being extraordinarily negligent. She got on a plane and flew to Alaska (with a stop in Seattle) while leaking amniotic fluid, a month before her due date. She was potentially going into premature labor, and she kept going about her day, giving a speech and flying around.

And at 8 months, she shouldn't have even been allowed on an airplane. And she flew back to her home town of Wasilla, whose medical center was not equipped for premature birth care, much less a baby with Down's. And after giving birth, she was apparently back to work in three days. After having a child with Down's Syndrome ... prematurely! I don't know much about this stuff, but don't Down's babies have a very difficult time bonding, which means mothers have to spend a lot of time right off the bat with them to get them to bond? I almost hope it's not her baby, because the sheer negligence of her actions if it was is just astounding.
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Post by Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi »

Given the GOP's knack for taking the strengths of opposing candidates and turning it against them, I'm expecting them to try and turn Palin's lack of experience around and say "But she's not that much less experienced than Obama, and he's running for president! It's hypocritical for Democrats to attack her for lacking experience!"
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Post by SirNitram »

I'm gonna weigh in on the whole 'pregnancy' gossip, and just point out the probabilities of Down's syndrome spike with age.. Specifically, from .1% chance for her daughter's age, to 3.6% at Palin's age. I'm just crunching the numbers here, it seems pretty likely it's just gossip. Though Durandal is right: Jeez.
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Post by Gandalf »

Durandal wrote:I almost hope it's not her baby, because the sheer negligence of her actions if it was is just astounding.
You think that this would be the kind thing that would come up in the vetting process. The party machine can't be so silly as to field someone who has no real redeeming qualities, as well as this in their past.
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Post by Duckie »

Still, either way she ends up looking terrible. One- that it's her daughter's- is bad for politics but is probably for the best, since the other is that she's just a terrible mother who was too busy with politics to care about pregnancy or having a baby.

I'll third it: Jeez. Either way that's pretty bad.

And who knows? Palin was picked after only a few hours of thinking "We need a minority" after ditching Pawlenty on Thursday night, so it's not like they carefully considered it. Perhaps it just wasn't in the file they were looking at.
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Post by Ender »

Gandalf wrote:
Durandal wrote:I almost hope it's not her baby, because the sheer negligence of her actions if it was is just astounding.
You think that this would be the kind thing that would come up in the vetting process. The party machine can't be so silly as to field someone who has no real redeeming qualities, as well as this in their past.
Apparently the McCain vetting process was pretty fucked. Though blaming him for that may be unfair as it predates that quite a bit, Cheney was in charge of vetting people for Bush and ended up selecting himself.
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Post by Metatwaddle »

SirNitram wrote:I'm gonna weigh in on the whole 'pregnancy' gossip, and just point out the probabilities of Down's syndrome spike with age.. Specifically, from .1% chance for her daughter's age, to 3.6% at Palin's age. I'm just crunching the numbers here, it seems pretty likely it's just gossip. Though Durandal is right: Jeez.
That's true. On the other hand, the majority of Down's Syndrome children (80%) are born to mothers under 35, just because young mothers constitute the vast majority of births.
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Post by Mr Bean »

Cafferty:Mcain wants the Eskimo Vote
Cafferty wrote: All we have heard from John McCain for months is, "Barack Obama is too young. Barack Obama is too inexperienced to be commander-in-chief. Who do you want answering the phone in the White House at three a.m.? Blah, blah, blah."

So what does McCain do? He picks someone to be his running mate who is even younger than Barack Obama and has less experience.

Sara Palin is 44 -- Obama is 47. Sara Palin is in her first term as governor of Alaska, a state that has 13 people and some caribou. Obama is a member of the United States Senate from Illinois.

It's not a big deal, except for this: If McCain wins, he will be the oldest person ever inaugurated for a first term at 72. He has a history of health problems that include bouts of melanoma, a potentially deadly form of skin cancer. It is reasonable to consider that McCain's running mate could be called upon to be our president.

Meanwhile, some may see this as a move for McCain to attract disaffected women who voted for Hillary Clinton and aren't yet behind Obama. But that might not work for a few reasons: Palin, like McCain, is pro-life. Also, she might be a woman, but she's no Hillary Clinton -- when it comes to her experience or her ideology.

At some point, voters will have to ask themselves who they would want running the country if it ever became necessary: Joe Biden or Sarah Palin.

Here's my question to you: Does John McCain undercut his own message by naming someone even younger and more inexperienced than Barack Obama to be his running mate?
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Post by Kodiak »

Don't public officials generally have to release their medical records to the public? Doesn't seem like this would be something that could be easily hidden after a routine medical checkup was done.
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Post by Elfdart »

They don't have to, but it's considered a bad sign if they don't.
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Post by Phil Skayhan »

Are we seriously entertaining this tripe about Palin's pregnancy and her daughter? Do we have anything close to resembling a reputable source for this? Or are we no better than Dem. Underground or RedState?

I thought that we're above tabloid scandal in dissecting political creatures. Christ, it's not as though there aren't enough ideological reasons to disagree with and tear into.
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Post by Ender »

Palin booed at rally for mentioning Clinton

Me thinks this "grab the Hillary voters" plan isn't working too well.
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Post by Glocksman »

Ender wrote:Palin booed at rally for mentioning Clinton

Me thinks this "grab the Hillary voters" plan isn't working too well.
I don't think it ever was about 'grabbing the Hillary voters' so much as it was about both generating media coverage and nailing down the knuckledragging fundie base.

Palin's certainly generated intense media coverage (thus moving discussion of the Democratic Convention out of the limelight) and is pro-life and 'pro-family' enough to generate a lot of excitement among the social cons who were unenthusiastic about McCain himself.

If Palin gets the fundies excited enough to do the GOTV work they did for Dubya, she's served her purpose.
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Post by Durandal »

Phil Skayhan wrote:Are we seriously entertaining this tripe about Palin's pregnancy and her daughter? Do we have anything close to resembling a reputable source for this? Or are we no better than Dem. Underground or RedState?

I thought that we're above tabloid scandal in dissecting political creatures. Christ, it's not as though there aren't enough ideological reasons to disagree with and tear into.
It's not so much the rumor but the things which the rumor uncovers about the truth. At best, she's incredibly negligent. At worst, she's a hypocrite who covered up her teenage daughter's pregnancy after yammering about how the state should stick its nose into women's vaginas.
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Post by Pablo Sanchez »

Glocksman wrote:If Palin gets the fundies excited enough to do the GOTV work they did for Dubya, she's served her purpose.
I'm pretty sure Palin is going to fade away by the end of next week and be forgotten until the VP debate. Biden is a known Washington fixture with real political skills and clout, and Obama is almost certainly going to be leaning on him for the campaign. Palin is an unknown even among governors: a freshman executive of the fourth least populous state of the union (and one which bears little resemblance to the lower 48). Even if McCain wanted her to play a prominent role in the campaign, I don't think she could handle it, or keep the press's interest.
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Post by Guardsman Bass »

Phil Skayhan wrote:Are we seriously entertaining this tripe about Palin's pregnancy and her daughter? Do we have anything close to resembling a reputable source for this? Or are we no better than Dem. Underground or RedState?

I thought that we're above tabloid scandal in dissecting political creatures. Christ, it's not as though there aren't enough ideological reasons to disagree with and tear into.
Well, we've been talking about the potential scandal with the firing of a commissioner, which touches on Palin family issues. I do agree, though, that we really need some kind of credible source on this - it's possible that she's just unusually thin in that pregnancy and bizarre in terms of pre-birth behavior.
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Post by Spin Echo »

Durandal wrote:
Phil Skayhan wrote:Are we seriously entertaining this tripe about Palin's pregnancy and her daughter? Do we have anything close to resembling a reputable source for this? Or are we no better than Dem. Underground or RedState?

I thought that we're above tabloid scandal in dissecting political creatures. Christ, it's not as though there aren't enough ideological reasons to disagree with and tear into.
It's not so much the rumor but the things which the rumor uncovers about the truth. At best, she's incredibly negligent. At worst, she's a hypocrite who covered up her teenage daughter's pregnancy after yammering about how the state should stick its nose into women's vaginas.
While I imagine this is probably conspiracy nonsense, it does strike me as rather odd. Typically the women that don't show they are pregnant until late are the heavier ones, not the rather fit ones in the case of Palin.

That being said, I think it would almost reflect better upon her if it were true. At least it could be spun in some sort of mother trying to do what's best for her teenage daughter. As it stands, it looks as if she has no regard as to the safety of her child. She's flying with a high risk case baby at 8 months when doctors recommend women with normal pregnancies don't fly after 7 months. She then goes into labour prematurely and instead of going to a hospital in Texas to be looked after, she gives a speech and then flys back to Alaska. Nevermind that a premie down syndrome baby is a high risk case. And then once in Alaska, she drives out to bumfuck Alaska to give birth as opposed to going to the best equiped hospitals in the state.

I'd like to see someone make an ad calling her on her judgement of how she takes care of those things supposedly most dear to her. She clearly put her career above the health and safety of her unborn child. IS this the person you want a heartbeat away from the presidency?
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Post by Surlethe »

I didn't see this mentioned when I skimmed the thread: as MRDOD points out, the poll numbers show that Palin appeals to conservative white males (surprise!). Not only is McCain trying to nail down the fundie vote, I think he's trying to appeal to Clinton's base: not women, but white, working-class men. That is, not only is Palin a racist dog whistle, McCain's goal is to appeal to the disaffected white men who voted for Clinton. That appeal is probably subliminally sexual, on some level.
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Post by Broomstick »

MRDOD wrote:Women appear to have a 6-point gap on thinking Palin was a good choice compared to men, and a 3-point lead on thinking she was a bad choice, for a total of 9% difference.
Summary?: Men appear to think Palin was a better choice than Women by a good margin.


....snip....

So, the polls show that apparantly Palin might be winning among young conservative males, not democratic women.
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Post by CaptJodan »

Broomstick wrote:
MRDOD wrote:Women appear to have a 6-point gap on thinking Palin was a good choice compared to men, and a 3-point lead on thinking she was a bad choice, for a total of 9% difference.
Summary?: Men appear to think Palin was a better choice than Women by a good margin.


....snip....

So, the polls show that apparantly Palin might be winning among young conservative males, not democratic women.
Ah, the awesome power of BOOBIES!

Seriously, other than the appeal of tits, what could explain this?
Perhaps the "look, we're progressive too" feeling? "We're not guilty of voting for just old white men." or something similar?
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Post by Broomstick »

Spin Echo wrote:
Durandal wrote:
Phil Skayhan wrote:Are we seriously entertaining this tripe about Palin's pregnancy and her daughter? Do we have anything close to resembling a reputable source for this? Or are we no better than Dem. Underground or RedState?

I thought that we're above tabloid scandal in dissecting political creatures. Christ, it's not as though there aren't enough ideological reasons to disagree with and tear into.
It's not so much the rumor but the things which the rumor uncovers about the truth. At best, she's incredibly negligent. At worst, she's a hypocrite who covered up her teenage daughter's pregnancy after yammering about how the state should stick its nose into women's vaginas.
While I imagine this is probably conspiracy nonsense, it does strike me as rather odd. Typically the women that don't show they are pregnant until late are the heavier ones, not the rather fit ones in the case of Palin.

That being said, I think it would almost reflect better upon her if it were true. At least it could be spun in some sort of mother trying to do what's best for her teenage daughter. As it stands, it looks as if she has no regard as to the safety of her child. She's flying with a high risk case baby at 8 months when doctors recommend women with normal pregnancies don't fly after 7 months.
Actually, one of my sisters had clearance to fly on commercial planes through her ninth month. The main concern is premature labor/emergency at 30,000 with no medical personal and minimum of a 30-45 wait just to get on the ground, much less to a hospital. There is no reason a healthy woman with a normal pregnancy can't step onto an airplane at 8 months for a brief flight. I'm sure it's quite common in Alaska, many parts of which your options for travel are either airplane or dogsled (well, snowmobile these days). Granted, with Downs in the picture things aren't quite normal but that doesn't mean the mother is having problems.

Knowing that, I was willing to cut her some slack when I first heard this but the flight she boarded was a six hour flight and that IS long enough to cause some concern during pregnancy.
She then goes into labour prematurely and instead of going to a hospital in Texas to be looked after, she gives a speech and then flys back to Alaska. Nevermind that a premie down syndrome baby is a high risk case. And then once in Alaska, she drives out to bumfuck Alaska to give birth as opposed to going to the best equiped hospitals in the state.
Ya, this is also funny-weird. Didn't her water supposedly break? That's considered an emergency and even if it doesn't prompt immediate labor all sorts of risk factors go up with it. So, um, her water breaks BUT she doesn't go to a doctor, she stands up to give a speech, then boards an airplane for a 6 hour flight to Alaska supposedly while in labor - granted, labor usually does take hours, but sometimes the baby pops out very quickly - going away from advanced medical care instead of towards it....? WTF?

Oh, and I agree - in the recent pictures posted around here her daughter looks more pregnant than she does.
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Post by SirNitram »

Broomstick wrote:
MRDOD wrote:Women appear to have a 6-point gap on thinking Palin was a good choice compared to men, and a 3-point lead on thinking she was a bad choice, for a total of 9% difference.
Summary?: Men appear to think Palin was a better choice than Women by a good margin.


....snip....

So, the polls show that apparantly Palin might be winning among young conservative males, not democratic women.
Ah, the awesome power of BOOBIES!

Seriously, other than the appeal of tits, what could explain this?
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Post by Fingolfin_Noldor »

Aren't many of Hillary's supporters the feminist pro-choice type? How are they going to bite Palin then?
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