Introduction and Battle Artical

[Zithpith]

Let me introduce myself as a fan of this site and a new user, and a big fan of many of the articles posted here.

However I did have something I wanted to say about an article, specifically the Battle Article. I’ll assume everyone knows what I am writing about (forgive me if I assumed wrong) and get strait to the point. Basically I had a disagreement with two of the battle simulations, namely the Battle of Cardassia Prime, and the Battle of Endor.

The Battle of Cardassia Prime in particularly the section for the Empire’s replacement of the Dominion was somewhat irritating. Specifically the two things that bothered me was the size and strength of the Dominion/Empire forces, and completely ignoring the Cardassians truing sides. First the size and strength of the fleet, yes the Dominion did bring virtually every ship they had in the Alpha Quadrant to the fight, but there was no mention of any super weapons even remotely comparable to the Death Star. On the flip side as the Allies, again the Death Star is brought in when the Allied fleet hand no planet destroying abilities. As far as I understood the rules of the article, the Empire taking the place of the Dominion meant being in the same situation and having the same numbers (ie. For each capital ship a star destoryer ect.), and if this is so then the Death Star has no place in this battle. Second, the article completely ignored the Cardassians switching sides which was a major turning point for the Allies and the final nail in the coffin for the Dominion, however it is completely ignored. Should this be taken into consideration, then the Empire’s chances of wining are greatly lessened, although admittedly still not impossible.

In the second battle, the Battle of Endor, I found it hard to understand why it would be included if the Star War’s forces would be ineligible for half of the battle, namely the lack of any weapon resembling the Death Star. However there is a Death Star like weapon that could be used in this situation. In the Enterprise series, a race called the Xindi made a weapon with the purpose of destroying Earth, http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Xindi_superweapon. That weapon could be used in place of the Death Star, although a smaller version of it, it could likely still fill the same role, while the shield protecting it could be a field of automated turrets with the power supply in a secret base on Endor.

[Sela]

You're missing the point of the battle-simulations. Wong isn't trying to find what could equalize power levels - if you do that you should get equal results each time. Instead he's saying given the same requirements and situation how could each side cope?

If the empires' resources are greater than the dominion's, it stands to reason they'd bring them to bear on the battle (as needed). Thus the death star is totally valid. Let's put it this way - say that in addition to capships, the Dominion also owned a superweapon! Wouldn't they bring it into the battle? Well, they don't own one, so they didn't. The empire *DOES* own one, so it does. Fits a definition of 'fair'.

Now make no mistake, it's not an even fight at all; but that's the whole point of the article - Federation vs. SW isn't a fair matchup. . . it's a one-sided massacre.

[Sela]

The same argument applies to your second disagreement, btw, just in reverse order.

Sure there exist weapons in star-trek technology that fulfill superweapon/planet-destroying functions. That said, the federation does not own one and have access to it. Thus they could not field such a weapon and use it in battle, and the Empire couldn't eliminate what's not there.

[Zithpith]

The same argument applies to your second disagreement, btw, just in reverse order.

Sure there exist weapons in star-trek technology that fulfill superweapon/planet-destroying functions. That said, the federation does not own one and have access to it. Thus they could not field such a weapon and use it in battle, and the Empire couldn't eliminate what's not there.

Then why not use the xindi, the makers of said weapon, in place of the empire/rebels if the Federation would not qualify for half of the scenario.

[Purple]

Because it is not a Xindi vs Empire scenario?

That and the fact that the Xindi are even more backward in terms of other tech than the Federation and so it would be even more of a massacre?

[KhyronTheBackstabber]

Then why not use the xindi, the makers of said weapon, in place of the empire/rebels if the Federation would not qualify for half of the scenario.

Probably because when Mike wrote these, Enterprise didn't exist yet.

[Adam Reynolds]

Then why not use the xindi, the makers of said weapon, in place of the empire/rebels if the Federation would not qualify for half of the scenario.

The reason for only using the Federation in those scenarios is because that is fundamentally what the debate is about, the Empire versus the Federation. Using other factions is a distraction from the fact that the Federation is completely screwed in this match up.

[Ted C]

The Battle of Cardassia Prime in particularly the section for the Empire’s replacement of the Dominion was somewhat irritating. Specifically the two things that bothered me was the size and strength of the Dominion/Empire forces, and completely ignoring the Cardassians truing sides. First the size and strength of the fleet, yes the Dominion did bring virtually every ship they had in the Alpha Quadrant to the fight, but there was no mention of any super weapons even remotely comparable to the Death Star. On the flip side as the Allies, again the Death Star is brought in when the Allied fleet hand no planet destroying abilities. As far as I understood the rules of the article, the Empire taking the place of the Dominion meant being in the same situation and having the same numbers (ie. For each capital ship a star destoryer ect.), and if this is so then the Death Star has no place in this battle. Second, the article completely ignored the Cardassians switching sides which was a major turning point for the Allies and the final nail in the coffin for the Dominion, however it is completely ignored. Should this be taken into consideration, then the Empire’s chances of wining are greatly lessened, although admittedly still not impossible.

I can see how the presence of the Death Star might bother you. It is sort of a unique asset, so it may be inappropriate in situations where the Death Star wasn't originally part of the scenario.

The side-switching of the Cardassian fleet seems to be less of an issue. The Empire would probably never trust the Cardassians, so they probably wouldn't ever be on the Imperial side. Consequently, the switch would never occur.

With the Empire as the Dominion, the situation would remain much as Mike describes it. The Imperial base planet would be safe enough with planetary shields, surface weapons, and a token fleet; the main fleet would attack the under-defended Federation-Alliance homeworlds and force the Alliance to surrender.

With the Empire as the Federation, there would be more of a direct confrontation, since the Dominion has no other assets to protect. The Empire would simply have to rely on the greater numbers and firepower of its fleet to overwhelm the Dominion instead of a single superlaser blast.

In the second battle, the Battle of Endor, I found it hard to understand why it would be included if the Star War’s forces would be ineligible for half of the battle, namely the lack of any weapon resembling the Death Star. However there is a Death Star like weapon that could be used in this situation. In the Enterprise series, a race called the Xindi made a weapon with the purpose of destroying Earth, http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Xindi_superweapon. That weapon could be used in place of the Death Star, although a smaller version of it, it could likely still fill the same role, while the shield protecting it could be a field of automated turrets with the power supply in a secret base on Endor.

The Federation has nothing resembling the Death Star (the Xindi weapon is apparently a lost technology, since no one remembers it in the 23rd-24th centuries), nor does it have the kind of global shielding used at Endor, so there really is no way for the Federation to take the "defensive" role there.