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I think a Vulcan/Betazoid mixed crew would be a disaster waiting to happen you got 2 telepathic race one who is highly logical and suppresses emotion and the other (based on the few examples we've seen) high expressive about emotions

Evilchumlee wrote: ↑2023-05-25 04:11pm

Solauren wrote: ↑2023-05-24 07:52pm One also can not over look species psychological make-up.

I can imagine a Vulcan (logical and detached) being on a ship full of super expressive and emotional beings difficult and challenging.

We need only look at the snippet we get of life on a Vulcan ship to show this.

Even a Vulcan who was ever so slightly more prone to "outbursts" was considered a major disruption to the ship. And such outbursts were... suggesting they study something of interest in more depth...

Well for Vulcans such "chemical imbalances" usually come around once every seven years

Yeah, and that's not unique to Vulcans. In one Voyager episode, a Vulcan going through Pon Far decided he had the hots for Bellana, and through telepathic connection to her, triggered the Klingon equivalent... which sucked for everyone else, because Klingons get even more aggressive than usual when this happens. Lower Decks also has a plot centered around the Caitian doctor going through her once yearly cycle, which for once doesn't involve aggression or necessarily require getting intimate as a solution (like the audience and even the Lower Deckers expect). But it is something she wanted to keep discreet, implying its a point of embarrassment to let humans and other species know what's going on. Considering the Cerritos has "Pon Far night" as an event (weird), I think it comes back to social conditions more so than environmental ones. On a Caitian ship, she probably wouldn't need to be so secretive when sending a couple of ensigns to fetch her stuff. Heck, there would probably just be a standing order from the Captain that once a year everyone just gets shore leave on their home planet or a colony so they can sort this out. No need to bullshit to the captain about having the flu like Tuvok does when everyone instinctively knows what's going on.

Formless wrote: ↑2023-06-02 04:08pm Considering the Cerritos has "Pon Far night" as an event (weird), I think it comes back to social conditions more so than environmental ones.

There's probably a good helping of both. Hell, it's implied NX-01 had a few issues with their integrated crew of humans... the mixing of different cultures can lead to issues.

"Ponn Farr" night is an interesting one and almost certainly a human thing poking fun at Vulcans.

I will say though, Ponn Farr time on a Vulcan ship has to be absolutely wild. They wouldn't feel the need to be so secretive... it's a thing that happens... and there's plenty of Vulcans around. It's weird to think about, but I would wager Vulcan ships take Ponn Farr schedule into account when assigning crews... get them "in sync" so to speak.

On a total side note, Ponn Farr is... awkward. I feel like it's implied Vulcan males go through it every 7 years. Has to be a shitty time to be a Vulcan female, although then again, I suppose they tend to want to go home for it so in most cases, they probably just take a quick leave back to Vulcan and take care of it.

Evilchumlee wrote: ↑2023-06-19 10:53am On a total side note, Ponn Farr is... awkward. I feel like it's implied Vulcan males go through it every 7 years.

Implied? No, outright explicitly stated that it's the males who have it, all the way back to "Amok Time" in the original series. It's a guy thing with Vulcans.

Evilchumlee wrote: ↑2023-06-19 10:53amHas to be a shitty time to be a Vulcan female, although then again, I suppose they tend to want to go home for it so in most cases, they probably just take a quick leave back to Vulcan and take care of it.

First of all, there seems to be less of a difference in physical capability between males and females in the Vulcan species. I suspect any Vulcan male attempting to rape a Vulcan female is taking his life in his hands.

Second, a bonded female would be aware of the ponn farr of her mate and would probably want to help him out with that, between the telepathic link and probably cultural expectations and customs.

Third, there is a LOT of ritual around that sort of male rut that probably functions to keep things from spinning out of control and getting ugly.

Actually, Broomstick, in The Cloud Minders, Spock confirms that all Vulcans experience Pon Farr, not just males. It wasn't until Enterprise that they showed a female (T'Pol) experience it, however. In that case it was triggered by a microbial infection, so we don't know whether the female period is also 7 years (but the Enterprise episode taking place in the Mirror Universe suggests that they are on a cycle too). Yes, this is contradictory with what Spock says in the original episode and what is reiterated in Star Trek III, but the apparent contradiction could be explained, e.g. by Vulcan customs of not talking about it, or perhaps the condition is transferred psychically the way it happened in the Voyager episode where Vorik psychically transfers the mating impulse to Bellana when he was going through it. But either way, it is canonically not just a thing male Vulcans experience.

Formless wrote: ↑2023-06-19 07:29pm Yes, this is contradictory with what Spock says in the original episode and what is reiterated in Star Trek III, but the apparent contradiction could be explained, e.g. by Vulcan customs of not talking about it, or perhaps the condition is transferred psychically the way it happened in the Voyager episode where Vorik psychically transfers the mating impulse to Bellana when he was going through it. But either way, it is canonically not just a thing male Vulcans experience.

I think an easy way to reconcile this is that Vulcan females ALSO experience Ponn Farr, but they experience it differently for the most part so we focus on the males. Vulcan Males get aggressive, violent and out of control. Vulcan females may just naturally have a better hold on it, or act a bit more like a female animal in heat... rather than being aggressive, angry and violent they're... um... open?

It's a general observation here, not exactly canon but just an observational guess that Vulcan females in general are just... better at their emotional control. The Vulcan "clergy" so to speak as we've seen tend to have females in the higher ranks. We only ever see Vulcan males "lose it", T'Pol only ever had real emotional issues through outside triggers, infections, mind meld AIDS, etc. Vulcan men seem to have a higher tendency towards losing their emotional control. We have a fairly limited data set here, but that's my observation. Spock shouldn't really count given he's half-human, but he's also kind of an oddball in that his entire physiology seems to be Vulcan.

Stepping away from the Ponn Farr thing, just look at Tuvok at how difficult it is for Vulcans to be on non-Vulcan crews. Tuvok seems like he's annoyed-at-best most of the time. Toss someone like Neelix in and Tuvok gets almost downright emotional. It has to be... taxing on them to deal with these people all the time. That's where the social issues come in... Tuvok is still a great example. How often on Voyager is Tuvok "forced" to partake in some kind of dumb human or otherwise event that he's clearly uncomfortable with but feels like he has to? Or Spock, who is subject to like, constant light-racism from McCoy.

Related tidbit from the latest strange new worlds episode:
Spoiler

Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2023-07-15 06:50am Related tidbit from the latest strange new worlds episode:
Spoiler

many vulcans take nasal inhibitors to deal with human odours while in starfleet.

Not gonna spoiler my response, shouldn't spoil anything. I am glad that was addressed. We knew about it, but never actually knew what kind of solution they came up with. Now we do.

It's another reason why Vulcans might just be less comfortable on non-Vulcan crewed ships.

There's really nothing wrong with that. It's not some weird racial segregation thing, it's just practical. Different aliens have different needs. Some are more ok with making the accommodations necessary and dealing with the discomfort of working with a mixed crew, some aren't.

I could see Ferengi having trouble with a mixed crew. Everyone/thing is so damn loud! Although they do seem to be able to handle it fairly well.

Sometimes it might just be straight cultural. Tellarites could be problematic, because... they're assholes. Like, that's their culture. That could become a real issue on a mixed crew. Toss a few just absolute dickheads in the mix, with the inability to "correct" their behavior because there's nothing to correct...

I was in another group somewhere and someone said something that made me have something of an epiphany, mildly related to the last bit there. Someone said something along the lines of "I hope the crew encourages Spock to become more human." That made me think... that's... actually really racist, and something that we have seen several Vulcans just have to endure. Tuvok is consistently harassed... if we step back to get a different perspective, it's like having one black person in a big group of white people, and white people are just like "Hey, stop being so black!" That's kinda messed up.

On a lighter note, I can't help but find the humor in a Tellarite on a mostly human ship. People lodging complaints, and the response just kind of being
"What are we supposed to do? He's Tellarite. We can't tell him to stop being so Tellarite."
"He insulted my grandmother!"
"That's a common Tellarite cultural practice."
"He literally called me fat."
"Tellarites are known for their honesty, they would be doing you and themselves a disservice by not voice their opinion."
"He called me a pig! I fired back saying that's really ironic for a Tellarite, and then he got angry!"
"Well, don't you think you were being a bit culturally insensitive?"

Wasn't there a Trek novel where a Starfleet ship crewed exclusively by Horta of all species played a major role in the plot?

No, I don't know how that would work either.

The closest to that I'm aware of was the TOS book "My Enemy, My Ally" which had a Horta as a member of the Enterprise's crew, whose ability to eat metal came in handy to help the crew get past an obstacle.