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We do hear a little about how the output from the engines has to be carefully balanced, or the cloak is compromised (Face of the Enemy), so it has to be more than a simple over-lay of "insert star-field here". I could invent something about how it's actually an alternate warp-field technology, that instead of making a bubble that contracts space in front and stretches it behind, it folds it on itself. But they'd be blind (like TOS Balance of Terror) if that were the case. Huh.SpottedKitty wrote:Come to think of it, do we have any canon info on how the Romulan tech works? Could it actually be some form of hologram setup, and the Romulans just got a lucky R&D break ahead of most other warp-capable civilizations in the Alpha Quadrant?
That was holographic, I thought? Because it doesn't just go invisible, a new rock face is there in its place.Khaat wrote:I would have to conclude that the Treaty of Algernon covers Federation employment of cloaks in war or on starships. The Federation still uses them for science (the duckblind in Who Watches the Watchers.)
We also saw a Romulan Warbird that cloaked in season 1 or 2 - they definitely had cloaks even by then.Lord Revan wrote:we probably saw an early stage of the Romulan cloak with the Probes in ENT while they couldn't "disapear" they could mask themselves as another ship, so I suspect the development from there was how to go from "another ship" to "empty space".
True, but the effect was the same: disguise obvious installation with "more of the normal stuff around it", in this case: more rock face. If the Federation was "prohibited from being sneaky and/or deceptive (with cloaking tech)", this would include circumstances like the duckblind.Prometheus Unbound wrote:That was holographic, I thought? Because it doesn't just go invisible, a new rock face is there in its place.Khaat wrote:I would have to conclude that the Treaty of Algernon covers Federation employment of cloaks in war or on starships. The Federation still uses them for science (the duckblind in Who Watches the Watchers.)
Edit: more stuff, things.Memory Alpha wrote:On at least one occasion Starfleet created self-replicating mines with cloaking ability, with no mention of Romulan complaints. It is possible that the treaty ban only related to the use of cloaking devices on space-faring vessels. Alternatively, the cloaking devices in the mines may have been Klingon in origin. (DS9: "Call to Arms")
An exception to the treaty in 2371 allowed for the limited supervised use of at least one cloaking device on loan from the Romulans. Operation of the cloaking device was to be limited to the Gamma Quadrant. In return, the Romulans would receive all information the Federation obtained on the USS Defiant's voyages into the Gamma Quadrant, most importantly any information concerning the Dominion. As such, the Defiant was the only Federation ship to be permanently equipped with a cloaking device. (DS9: "The Search, Part I", "Visionary") However, Captain Benjamin Sisko and his crew violated this amendment on several occasions by using the cloaking device in the Alpha Quadrant. (DS9: "The Way of the Warrior", et al)
According to Sisko, a Romulan officer (T'Rul) was supposed to join the Defiant crew to operate the cloaking device and ensure its safekeeping. However, no Romulan liaison officers were seen aboard the Defiant after DS9: "The Search, Part II".
The cloaking device aboard the Federation holoship in Star Trek: Insurrection was apparently in violation of the treaty.
that one is possibly an anomaly (probably cause by the Temporal Cold War) as it's simply way too powerful to be predesessor to the TOS cloak (it was invisible even to Daniels' tech from the future meant to detect cloaked objects)Prometheus Unbound wrote:We also saw a Romulan Warbird that cloaked in season 1 or 2 - they definitely had cloaks even by then.Lord Revan wrote:we probably saw an early stage of the Romulan cloak with the Probes in ENT while they couldn't "disapear" they could mask themselves as another ship, so I suspect the development from there was how to go from "another ship" to "empty space".
that looks like it's from the episode minefield, that I stated is anomalous when you compare it to TOS or TNG as not even future technology (from the 31st century IIRC) designed to peirce cloaks could pierce the cloaks of those BoPs. so either both the RSE and the crew of NX-01 were utter morons, RSE for installing much, much weaker cloaks in future ships and the crew of the NX-01 not reporting about this as cloaks were considered theoretical in 2260s by starfleet or this single instace was a temporal anomaly that got erased from the timeline when the Temporal Cold War ended after Stormfront and in canon romulans didn't have cloaks before "Balance of Terror" and those cloaks were for a long time less then perfect and a observant crew could follow a cloaked ship thru the cloak but it was harder to do so.Prometheus Unbound wrote:So this isn't 2 romulan warbirds decloaking ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LreyR100sgE
No it's two birds-of-prey decloaking ;PPrometheus Unbound wrote:So this isn't 2 romulan warbirds decloaking ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LreyR100sgE
Honestly I'm happy to write off Balance of Terror's continuity. Those two sentences ("Simple impulse power" and not knowing what a cloak is) have hampered Trek since then and caused all sorts of problems with Enterprise.Crazedwraith wrote: IT doesn't make much sense in regard to Spock and Kirk's response to the cloak in Balance Of Terror though.
Early first season weirdness, maybe? I don't know where Balance of Terror came in the actual production schedule, but it was always pretty clear in hindsight that not all the early-episode technobabble matched up properly with what ended up in later episodes.Prometheus Unbound wrote:Honestly I'm happy to write off Balance of Terror's continuity. Those two sentences ("Simple impulse power" and not knowing what a cloak is) have hampered Trek since then and caused all sorts of problems with Enterprise.
if you want to be that anal about it's 2 T'varo-class light warbirds decloaking but while the strength doesn't match the later cloaks (it's too powerful) it's easy to write it off as a temporal cold war "glitch" and the "real" event involved lesser disguises.Crazedwraith wrote:No it's two birds-of-prey decloaking ;PPrometheus Unbound wrote:So this isn't 2 romulan warbirds decloaking ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LreyR100sgE
I think ENT tried to handwave continuity by saying it wasn't a proper cloak but some lesser disguise. In a similar way that Ferengi and Borg don't count because they never said their name.
IT doesn't make much sense in regard to Spock and Kirk's response to the cloak in Balance Of Terror though.
Yes I was being 'anal' and not you know. Joking.Lord Revan wrote:if you want to be that anal about it's 2 T'varo-class light warbirds decloaking but while the strength doesn't match the later cloaks (it's too powerful) it's easy to write it off as a temporal cold war "glitch" and the "real" event involved lesser disguises.
I'd rather write off Enterprise than TOS.Prometheus Unbound wrote:Honestly I'm happy to write off Balance of Terror's continuity. Those two sentences ("Simple impulse power" and not knowing what a cloak is) have hampered Trek since then and caused all sorts of problems with Enterprise.Crazedwraith wrote: IT doesn't make much sense in regard to Spock and Kirk's response to the cloak in Balance Of Terror though.
There's too much evidence these days that Spock was just... wrong. He acts like Starfleet have never encountered the idea of a cloaking device on an actual ship. But we know the Klingons had it in Enterprise, the Romulans had it in Enterprise, the Suliban...
Knife wrote:I'd rather write off Enterprise than TOS.Prometheus Unbound wrote:Honestly I'm happy to write off Balance of Terror's continuity. Those two sentences ("Simple impulse power" and not knowing what a cloak is) have hampered Trek since then and caused all sorts of problems with Enterprise.Crazedwraith wrote: IT doesn't make much sense in regard to Spock and Kirk's response to the cloak in Balance Of Terror though.
There's too much evidence these days that Spock was just... wrong. He acts like Starfleet have never encountered the idea of a cloaking device on an actual ship. But we know the Klingons had it in Enterprise, the Romulans had it in Enterprise, the Suliban...
That's the explanation (the non-canon) Star Fleet Battles came up with for Rom Warbirds and other "early years" designs.Knife wrote:Still rather keep the TOS bits and ditch the Ent stuff. It jumped the rails pretty early and it was the one that violated shit.
The cloak is one thing, but the 'simple impulse' is ok. In my head cannon I just interpret that as no M/AM power plant and just runs off a fusion engine for warp and what not. But yeah, that's just me.
My thoughts:Star Trek: Discovery creator and executive producer Bryan Fuller dropped more hints about the upcoming series on Wednesday during an interview session with journalists attending the Television Critics Association Summer Tour. Among the revelations:Responding to specific questions, Fuller also divulged the following:
- The show will be set 10 years before Star Trek: The Original Series.
- The main character will be a woman, but not a captain. "We've seen six characters from the captain's point of view," Fuller said. “In order to understand something that is so completely alien from her, she must first understand herself. That's part of our journey on this planet, to get along, and that's part of our journey in this first season.”
- The first season will consist of 13 episodes, with the show as a whole serialized and playing out like a novel, “with each episode being a chapter of that novel,” Fuller revealed. “And within that chapter there's a beginning, middle and end. We will have episodes that exist by themselves, but are a part of a much bigger story."
- Casting for Discovery is underway.
- Fans, Fuller noted, can expect a diverse cast and crew, as well as a full range of alien species the crew will encounter. "Star Trek started with a wonderful expression of diversity in its cast," Fuller said. "We're absolutely continuing that tradition."
- And, yes, he confirmed, there will feature a gay regular character.
- "The thing that makes Star Trek such a lasting, vital part of pop culture is that it's us, and where we're going," he said, and that it offers hope that "we're going to make it through."
- As for the non-human characters, Fuller, answering a writer’s question, revealed that there will be robots on Discovery. And, in terms of aliens, the show will feature "more aliens than you normally do in a Star Trek show. We're going to have new, exciting aliens and also re-imaginings of existing aliens."
Star Trek: Discovery is coming to CBS All Access in January 2017, following the premiere on the CBS Television Network, and will be distributed concurrently on Netflix in 188 countries and through Bell Media in Canada.
- “There's an incident, an event, in the history of Starfleet that has been talked about (in previous Star Trek shows), but never fully explored."
- Section 31 is not directly involved in that incident/event, “but that's not to say that might not have some marble through the meat of our season.”
- The Discovery ship design is still a work in progress, he said, but it will feature elements of illustrator Ralph McQuarrie’s Star Trek: Phase II designs, along with those of 1970s-era race cars, Lamborghinis and James Bond vehicles.
- "She's not a central part of the show,” Fuller said of Amanda Grayson, Spock’s human mother, “but we love that character."
- It’s conceivable that Discovery could feature bridge crew characters from TOS, but for the moment he’s “digging” what he’s go with the new characters and not thinking that far ahead.
- See more at: http://www.startrek.com/article/bryan-f ... OymLY.dpuf
Any guesses as to which incident ?“There's an incident, an event, in the history of Starfleet that has been talked about (in previous Star Trek shows), but never fully explored."